Advice for a Closet Case

[BeachedEinstein]

So, I don't know if this belongs in the E&M section, but oh well....I guess I can move it. And this is where most of the threads on homosexuality are anyways.


I am a 19-year old gay man attending Houghton College in NY. For the past few years, I have been struggling in the closet about my sexuality. I was raised Christian (specifically Wesleyan), so I knew how most Christians felt about the issue. My sexuality has caused a lot of pain, guilt and self-loathing in my life, and attending a Christian college just made it on the top of my mind all of the time.

It was in February of this year that I finally came out to my parents. It was by far the worst day of my life. Now, I know my parents love me very much; there is no doubt in my mind about that. But I will not deny that they said some very hurtful things. They basically told me to stay in the closet, get counselling, and change yourself. They think it is simply a phase, and that I am confused. And now, after that day, we never talk about it at all, and if homosexuality is brought up, it is handled in the most objective of terms. This infuriates me.

I guess I just need some advice on how to handle this. I want to make this clear; I love my family and I am nothing without their love. It breaks my heart, this anxiety of not knowing how to be honest with them. It's somewhat easier to talk to my sister about this, but she can be just as objective, and I am still relatively afraid of bringing it up in front of her.

I need help. I need to know how to initiate dialogue about this without condemning one another. If any other gays/lesibians read this, could you give me some experiential advice? Thanks!

With Love

 

[b&wpac4]

I cannot offer you much advice, but I hope that things work out for you. Having family unhappy with you can be very hard to face.

 

[Aianna]

I can't say I've gone through such a situation as neither of my parents are the type to be worried about my bisexuality one way or another.

The only thing I can think of is to make it obvious to them that you're still the same person you've always been but you want to be able to have open discussion with them about every aspect of your life precisely because you love them so much.

 

[nolongerhome]

Don't jews openly embrase homosexuals and promote it's lifestyle? I know they defile the streets of Jerusalem with "gay pride" parades and other depravities.

Gay Pride parades are not depravaties and they occur in basically all western/developed countries.

To the OP - Good luck! I really mean that, it is going to be tough, but you are who you are, there are people who will accept that and who won't demand that you change or deny it, and those people are going to be the ones that are important to you for the rest of your life.

You have done nothing wrong. You have done nothing to warrant your family not sharing their love with you. I think these things generally will fix themselves with time - it took you some time to work out how you felt about this, it will take them some time too. They might not ever like it, but I think most parents do come around to accept it. From their perspective they are upset because they love you, which isn't much consolation, but it means that there is a base from which a good relationship can be reconstructed, one that doesn't force you to deny who you are.

The fundamental thing to remember is that trying to deny something like this that you know to be fundamental to your true self is not a path that is going to lead to happiness for you, and you have every right to lead the life that will give you satisfaction. There will be a time, hopefully soon, when you can be with people that won't try to force you to lie to yourself. For now, I guess all you can do is try not to be more antagonistic to those close to you than is utterly avoidable, don't bring it up if it doesn't need to be brought up, but don't allow yourself to be walked all over either. Remember that your family means well, even if they don't really act like it at all. There are millions of people around the world that have had to go through this just like you, so don't ever feel like you are alone in your situation. There are many people that are out there that understand what you are going through and who can support you through it.

 

[b&wpac4]

Don't jews openly embrase homosexuals and promote it's lifestyle? I know they defile the streets of Jerusalem with "gay pride" parades and other depravities.

This is similar to asking "Aren't all Arabs terrorists?". Not like I think accepting there are homosexuals and not wanting to bash them with a rock is the same as being a terrorist, but I hope you get my message.

I would view the country of Israel allowing people to hold parades and events to celebrate, peacefully, whatever they wish to be a good thing and a reinforcement of freedom. I actually don't think Israel does enough to support freedom in many ways as the ultra-orthodox community holds far too much sway over many aspects of life instead of allowing elected officials to hold that power.

 

[Steezie]

I can relate somewhat to your situation. I am polyamorous and had to break it to my friends. Most of them were very understanding.

My family would probably not be so understanding so I havent told them and I dont plan to.

 

[Beanieboy]

Hi, BeachedEinstein, from one out man to another.

I wish I could tell you that this is going to be easy, but it isn't.
I'm 46. I came out to my friends around 20, and my parents around 25. It took until my 40s for my parents to even deal with it or talk about it at all, or acknowledge my boyfriends or my partner. Each month, I teach a new class of students, and each month, I have to decide if or when I am going to mention my partner, or be silent. Were I married to a woman, or even a live in girlfriend, I could talk about her all I wanted to, but having Saudi Arabian students who execute gays or having students suddenly looking at you in condemnation, it really interferes with me just trying to do my job of teaching them English.

I went to TheologyOnline, and the "Christians" there were extremely vulgar, condemning, and verbally and emotionally abusive. One would quote Romans 12:9, and say that she is called to hate me (hate what is evil.) Read Romans 12. See if you could possibly get that out of the Chapter. However, I thanked God. The Christians were allowed by the moderators to be a vulgar as they liked, because they claimed that it was helping me out of my homosexual lifestyle. I could not return the curse with a curse, so I was given an opportunity to return curse with blessing, to bless those who said such hateful things, to use gentle words when being berated and insulted, and I learned to type out my anger, then hit "delete."

I would suggest these things to start off with:
Many churches are gay-affirming. You can find out if there are any in your area. However, I would recommend looked for a MCC church, All God's Children. Metro Community Church/All God's Children was founded in the 80s when churches decided to demand that any gay member be removed from the church membership. Being Christian, but no longer able to attend their church, many gay Christians felt lost, and still wanted to worship with a body of believers. MCC was then created, welcoming gay people, and anyone else, to come and worship God, and to acknowledge that you are loved by God. Anyone who tells you that you are hated of God does not know God, nor serves God.

As for books, I recommend Stealing Jesus, which looks at how conservatives has unjustly created the definition of Christian, and what you can do to take Jesus back.

A FANTASTIC book is called "Bulletproof Faith." It is by the lesbian pastor of the website Whosoever: An Online Magazine for GLBT Christians. The book is great because it tells you how to learn to defend your faith, and how to become more secure in your salvation.

Check out the website, because it talks a lot about the passages used/misused to condemn homosexuality. It also is very encouraging and inspiring.

Checkout Soulforce : Freedom for Lesbian, Gay, Bisexual, and Transgender People. It is also very good about pointing out injustices done to homosexuals, offers strong points and insight, and shows you that you don't have to fight this alone. There are a lot of us out there.

And finally, I would spend a lot of time in prayer and conversation with God about the issue, and to ask him to fill you will his Spirit, and give you knowledge, wisdom, and understanding about this issue. You will need it, going through it first hand, and being a walking target for Worldly and Christian people alike.

But, give thanks in all things. Thank him for making you this way, and ask him to show you why, and how you can serve him in this way.

For years, I called myself a Buddhist. I didn't belong to a group, or go to a temple. I meditated, and I read a lot about it, but I continued praying and talking to God all the time as I usually do.

I choose to identify as Buddhist because I tired of having every conversation a confrontation where others demanded that I justify how I can be gay and Christian. I even began to doubt Christianity, seeing such much contempt, anger, self-righteousness everywhere when the subject of homosexuality arose. However, a poster here asked me to take the issue of being gay to God, and thinking that I was praying to a false God, asked that I pray specifically to God the Father, Jesus Christ his Son, and the Holy Spirit. I asked the believe to do the same, to go to the Father in prayer, and ask if there were right, if they were helping God, to ask to have the truth revealed, since the issue was of so much concern to them. They never gave me a straight answer, answering more like, "Why? Why should I have to?"

So, I said, "God, the Father, Jesus Christ, his Son, and Holy Spirit. I come to you to ask if I have left you, or turned away from you, and am being misled. I come to you asking forgiveness of all of my sin."

I did this at night, and suddenly drifted off into a dream. God was in the dream, and said, "You have never left me, and have always stayed with me. I know you, and you know me. I have know you since infancy, and I call you My Child. It is you that has to have the courage to take up the title, and wear it. You ask for forgiveness, but I simply stand here, not demanding forgiveness, but simply asking your to receive my loved. You have been fooled to believe that I do not love you, fear that you may be an abomination to me, but here I am, arms outstretched. You simply have to accept it, receive it."

And suddenly, I understood. We are loved by God simply because we exist. We don't earn God's love. God simply loves us now. We only have to accept it, and acknowledge that we are loved for deeply by God, and be filled with that love. And because we do not earn it, we also cannot lose it because of anything we will ever do.

We can never be separated from God's love. Never.

And I felt like in thanksgiving to God, I wanted to love others first, rather than demanding that they earn it. I wanted to forgive before an apology was offered, in thanksgiving to God's mercy.

A poster here, after I changed my icon, went into a fit. He said, "You are not a real Christian!" I said, "You say that, and yet, I still am." He said, "You are not a Child of God!" I said, "and yet, God Himself says I am, so your words hold no importance."

Bulletproof.

And anyone that is really set on telling you that you are not a Christian, that you don't love God, that God doesn't love you, and that you are going to hell because Jesus' Salvation is null and void if you are gay, is not a person that is working for God, but a person that is working for Satan, because all he can do now is make you doubt God's love, make you doubt your Salvation, but no one can take it away.

And when you realize that, you will smile and type, "and yet, I'm still Christian. Still love God. Still love others because of it. And he still loves me."

 

[Robbie_James_Francis]

My parents and family weren't bothered at all when I came out, so I'm afraid I can't give you any properly personal advice. I would say that if your parents' reaction isn't seriously threatening your safety, security or freedom (i.e. they're going to disown you; force you to get "therapy" etc.) maybe the best thing is not to confront them, but gradually show them that you're the same person and help them understand that people can have vastly conflicting views and not let it become a problem from the point of view of damaging their relationship.

Don't jews...

Not sure why I even carried on reading your post after this; I certainly regret it now.

 

[BeachedEinstein]

Thanks for the responses, everyone (well, mostly everyone)....it helps a lot.

 

[Autumnleaf]

Why would you choose to be a member of a religion where one of its deeply held beliefs is that homosexuality is wrong? The Bible is not ambiguous on the subject in both the old and new testament. All the dreams in the world won't change the nature of Christianity as God defined it in the Bible.

 

[nolongerhome]

Why would you choose to be a member of a religion where one of its deeply held beliefs is that homosexuality is wrong? The Bible is not ambiguous on the subject in both the old and new testament. All the dreams in the world won't change the nature of Christianity as God defined it in the Bible.

Why would anyone chose a religion whose teachings make everyone a sinner?

 

[BeachedEinstein]

Why would anyone chose a religion whose teachings make everyone a sinner?

Why would anyone choose a religion at all? Life is confusing enough without an invisible Man Behind the Curtain.

 

[Beanieboy]

Why would you choose to be a member of a religion where one of its deeply held beliefs is that homosexuality is wrong? The Bible is not ambiguous on the subject in both the old and new testament. All the dreams in the world won't change the nature of Christianity as God defined it in the Bible.

Why would someone who is Christian believe that "one of its held beliefs is that homosexuality is wrong"?

a) it isn't a deeply held belief, and wasn't even discussed until the 1970s.
b) It isn't discussed by Christ at all
c) It is a fact that Christian theologians are split on the issue
d) translation and looking at context doesn't "clearly" show anything except that people have changed the translation to apply to their current situation
e) a frightening number of Christians that I have spoken to on this site, when I keep stressing the importance of loving one's neighbor as themselves, have said that love isn't that important, alhthough that is the cruxt of what Christ commanded. It wasn't a suggestion.
One even said, "Why should I?" Why should you follow on of THE commandments that Christ said were the most important?
I was speechless.
I told another that Christ said that all men will know that you are his disciples by the love we have for one another. A Christian poster said, "What do I care what a nonChristian thinks of me?"

Basically, that is how he was responding to Christ, which he said at the Last Supper.

So, the issue of homosexuality is the LAST of the Church's problems right now, wouldn't you say???

 

[Laetetia]

So, I said, "God, the Father, Jesus Christ, his Son, and Holy Spirit. I come to you to ask if I have left you, or turned away from you, and am being misled. I come to you asking forgiveness of all of my sin."

I did this at night, and suddenly drifted off into a dream. God was in the dream, and said, "You have never left me, and have always stayed with me. I know you, and you know me. I have know you since infancy, and I call you My Child. It is you that has to have the courage to take up the title, and wear it. You ask for forgiveness, but I simply stand here, not demanding forgiveness, but simply asking your to receive my loved. You have been fooled to believe that I do not love you, fear that you may be an abomination to me, but here I am, arms outstretched. You simply have to accept it, receive it."

And suddenly, I understood. We are loved by God simply because we exist. We don't earn God's love. God simply loves us now. We only have to accept it, and acknowledge that we are loved for deeply by God, and be filled with that love. And because we do not earn it, we also cannot lose it because of anything we will ever do.

Sorry, I feel compelled to bring this up,
"Dear friends, do not believe every spirit, but test the spirits to see whether they are from God, ... This is how you can recognize the Spirit of God: Every spirit that acknowledges that Jesus Christ has come in the flesh is from God, but every spirit that does not acknowledge Jesus is not from God. " (1 John 4:1-3)
Where was the cross in this dream? The bible says that wasn't a spirit from God. I am worried for you. Please consider it carefully.

Why would anyone chose a religion whose teachings make everyone a sinner?

Because it also provides the way of forgiveness, by the power of the cross. Jesus Christ was crucified for our sins, so that in Him we might be forgiven of them, because He has already paid the price for us.
"God made him who had no sin to be sin for us, so that in him we might become the righteousness of God." (2 Corinthians 5:21)

 

[Archer93]

Sorry, I feel compelled to bring this up,
"Dear friends, do not believe every spirit, but test the spirits to see whether they are from God, ... This is how you can recognize the Spirit of God: Every spirit that acknowledges that Jesus Christ has come in the flesh is from God, but every spirit that does not acknowledge Jesus is not from God. " (1 John 4:1-3)
Where was the cross in this dream? The bible says that wasn't a spirit from God. I am worried for you. Please consider it carefully.

Because it also provides the way of forgiveness, by the power of the cross. Jesus Christ was crucified for our sins, so that in Him we might be forgiven of them, because He has already paid the price for us.
"God made him who had no sin to be sin for us, so that in him we might become the righteousness of God." (2 Corinthians 5:21)

It wasn't a spirit from God in Beanieboy's dream, it was God itself, apparently.
And why would the presence or otherwise of a cross be indicative either way?

Forgiveness is only necessary once the idea of sin is accepted.
If I do something wrong, and I'm sorry, the forgiveness that matters to me is from the person I've hurt. I may have an ego the size of a planet at times, but the idea that I could hurt something as powerful and eternal as 'God' is a bit beyond me.

 

[Jazmyn]

I think she meant where was the mention of Jesus' atonement for sin so we might obtain forgiveness, not just forgiveness just 'happening'. Spirit of God might put it better.

God is also a personal God, God does say that "'I tell you the truth, whatever you did for one of the least of these brothers of mine, you did for me.'" (Matthew 25:40) and ""Whoever welcomes one of these little children in my name welcomes me; and whoever welcomes me does not welcome me but the one who sent me." (Mark 9:37) So our actions towards others do affect Him, that's why He made commandments against murder and disrespecting one's parents. And also why the second greatest commandment is to love one's neighbour as oneself. (Mark 12:31) So one can hurt God, one can also please Him, and talk to Him, and have a personal relationship with Him, it's what He wants us to have. It's why He sent His Son, so we can be reconciled to Him through Christ's death on the cross.
"For if, when we were God's enemies, we were reconciled to him through the death of his Son, how much more, having been reconciled, shall we be saved through his life!"

 

[Autumnleaf]

Why would someone who is Christian believe that "one of its held beliefs is that homosexuality is wrong"?

a) it isn't a deeply held belief, and wasn't even discussed until the 1970s.
b) It isn't discussed by Christ at all
c) It is a fact that Christian theologians are split on the issue
d) translation and looking at context doesn't "clearly" show anything except that people have changed the translation to apply to their current situation
e) a frightening number of Christians that I have spoken to on this site, when I keep stressing the importance of loving one's neighbor as themselves, have said that love isn't that important, alhthough that is the cruxt of what Christ commanded. It wasn't a suggestion.
One even said, "Why should I?" Why should you follow on of THE commandments that Christ said were the most important?
I was speechless.
I told another that Christ said that all men will know that you are his disciples by the love we have for one another. A Christian poster said, "What do I care what a nonChristian thinks of me?"

Basically, that is how he was responding to Christ, which he said at the Last Supper.

So, the issue of homosexuality is the LAST of the Church's problems right now, wouldn't you say???

a) It was taken for granted as wrong so it was assumed no discussion was needed.
b) It is specifically discussed in the Old Testament and the New Testament by Jesus' disciples.
c) Some judges ignore the Constitution when they make their rulings. There will always be flies in the ointment.
d) The opposite is true. People used to take God's stand against homosexuality much more seriously than they do now.
e) Every parent knows love is not being permissive of bad/irresponsible/dangerous behavior. Otherwise most children would get run over in the streets before the age of 5.
f) Acceptance of homosexuality is one of the main problems the church is facing. God destroyed cities for tolerance of such behavior in the Old Testament and some say he is allowing America to be destroyed now because of our tolerance for it, and other sins.

 

[BeachedEinstein]

a) It was taken for granted as wrong so it was assumed no discussion was needed.
b) It is specifically discussed in the Old Testament and the New Testament by Jesus' disciples.
c) Some judges ignore the Constitution when they make their rulings. There will always be flies in the ointment.
d) The opposite is true. People used to take God's stand against homosexuality much more seriously than they do now.
e) Every parent knows love is not being permissive of bad/irresponsible/dangerous behavior. Otherwise most children would get run over in the streets before the age of 5.
f) Acceptance of homosexuality is one of the main problems the church is facing. God destroyed cities for tolerance of such behavior in the Old Testament and some say he is allowing America to be destroyed now because of our tolerance for it, and other sins.

Yeah, because homosexuality is just as simple as staying out of the road.....

f) We are a long way from the Old Testament. That God is not in the world anymore. The Holy Spirit is. But that's besides the point because Sodom and Gomorrah (I'm assuming those are the cities you are referring to) were destroyed for being inhospitable and downright lascivious, not for sexual orientation. I know many loving homosexuals and many lascivious heterosexuals. You know what your post sounded like? Fred Phelps; you know, the Westboro Babtist guy..."F*gs DOOM NATIONS!!!"......yikes!

Oh, and I find it amusing that you feel the way you do about these issues and yet you quote Byron under your posts. Do you know anything about the man? I think if you did, you wouldn't be so ready to quote him.

 

[Steezie]

b) It is specifically discussed in the Old Testament and the New Testament by Jesus' disciples.

I was under the impression you didnt have to follow the OT unless you were Jewish.

c) Some judges ignore the Constitution when they make their rulings. There will always be flies in the ointment.

The Constitution does not say anything against homosexuality. In fact it doesnt mention it at all.

d) The opposite is true. People used to take God's stand against homosexuality much more seriously than they do now.

Yeah, but then again it used to be a lot easier to kill someone and get away with it.

e) Every parent knows love is not being permissive of bad/irresponsible/dangerous behavior. Otherwise most children would get run over in the streets before the age of 5.

If homosexuality was bad/irresponsible/dangerous then you might actually have a point there.

As it stands, I see no justification for calling being gay bad or good. It simply IS. You may SEE it as a bad thing, but perception does not equate to reality.

f) Acceptance of homosexuality is one of the main problems the church is facing. God destroyed cities for tolerance of such behavior in the Old Testament and some say he is allowing America to be destroyed now because of our tolerance for it, and other sins.

So God cares more about two people of the same gender making out than world hunger and disease?

No offense but that seems like he's getting hung up on the little stuff.

 

[b&wpac4]

f) Acceptance of homosexuality is one of the main problems the church is facing. God destroyed cities for tolerance of such behavior in the Old Testament and some say he is allowing America to be destroyed now because of our tolerance for it, and other sins.

Let's play a game. You quote me where it says God destroyed the cities becuase of HOMOSEXUALITY, and I'll agree with you. okay? kay.