Adam & Eve Lineage

Hi,

This is my first post so hi. I'm interested in religion in general but have a question re Adam and Eve, when modern humans are currently believed to have been on the Earth and how people may reconcile the two.

1) If you believe in Adam and Eve and their lineage they should be the first humans at most 12,000 years ago.

2) If you believe that the current dating of modern human remains & bladelets is correct then the earliest modern human fossils were about 190k years ago and the earliest use of bladelets was about 70k years ago.

What I'm interested in is that:

(a) If you do believe point (1) do you also believe point (2) is wrong?

(b) Are there Christians that believe both and, if so, how do you reconcile the two points?

(c) Can you be a Christian and not believe in Adam and Eve?

(d) Can you be a Christian and not believe in the lineage?

I hope these questions aren't stupid and I'm not meaning to cause an argument but more interest in people's opinions.

I believe that currently the best way of dating an object has a verifiable accuracy at or around 5000 years.

I also believe that because there is no direct record past that point, it take the same measure of faith to believe either account.. It all depends on how or who you want your peers to be.

Thank you drich0150.

So in your opinion, if you are an informed Christian then you should believe in Adam and Eve and their lineage from the Bible and that the evidence for the dating of the first modern humans (if accurate) would be in line with this.

I'm just trying to get an understanding of what possible views on this topic would be in line with the Christian faith. Do you feel that the one you mentioned is the only one or do you think there are other possible views?

Thanks.

So in your opinion, if you are an informed Christian then you should believe in Adam and Eve and their lineage from the Bible and that the evidence for the dating of the first modern humans (if accurate) would be in line with this.

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You seem to be looking for an answer i do not have. Again we can only prove (through our best efforts in dating anything with any verifiable accuracy to about 5000 years.) So to say that things happened one way or another will take the exact same measure of faith to believe either way. (Science or the Bible)

Why Must the world hinge on absolutes when we have none to offer? We have the account of Adam and Eve, and we Have the scientific account. Why is this not enough? What if both were right? what if both were wrong? How could any of it be proved in this life? The fact that it can't How does that change anything?

It doesn't. Although like you, we have people who also want to believe in absolutes. rather they want to believe what they hold close to be 100% true. I have a feeling that neither accounts gives a complete record of the events in question. What if you knew for certain what happened In the beginning? What could you do with that knowledge?

I'm just trying to get an understanding of what possible views on this topic would be in line with the Christian faith. Do you feel that the one you mentioned is the only one or do you think there are other possible views?

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In this post and in the Last I basically said "I don't know what happened." All we have is the story of Adam and Eve from the Bible and a theory based technology that can only be verified to 1/64th of the time your theory encompasses. It would be foolish to think these two versions of origins tell the complete story of how we came into being.

What other possible views were you speaking of? even if there are "other possible views" Do you not think it would take the same measure of Faith to believe these versions of Origins as well?

If no matter what you believe takes "faith" then what does it matter what you believe? You are ultimately believing what it is you want your life to be about. If you want to live for self there are endless philosophies one can adopt. If you wish to live in the light of academia then follow the path of science and history. If you seek God then follow His recorded accounts..

The point is none shall ever know the complete truth while living in this life. Our beliefs only reflect who it is we wish to be. That is why I said:

It all depends on how or who you want your peers to be.

drich0150 said:

You seem to be looking for an answer i do not have. Again we can only prove (through our best efforts in dating anything with any verifiable accuracy to about 5000 years.) So to say that things happened one way or another will take the exact same measure of faith to believe either way. (Science or the Bible)

Click to expand...

I didn't mean for my post to imply to ask for an answer. I was hoping to clarify your initial post. I appreciate your posts.

Why Must the world hinge on absolutes when we have none to offer? We have the account of Adam and Eve, and we Have the scientific account. Why is this not enough? What if both were right? what if both were wrong? How could any of it be proved in this life? The fact that it can't How does that change anything?

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I wasn't after absolutes. I was just asking how Christians reconcile the difference between some scientific estimates of human dates (which I thank you for telling me other scientific estimates that are inline with the dates of Adam and Eve, which I'll look into) and the dates for Adam and Eve.

Also, it changes quite a lot if it was 'proved' that it was 190k years ago since it doesn't seem to agree with Adam and Eve's timeline (although I made this post to see if it could be reconciled, if such a thing did happen).

What other possible views were you speaking of? even if there are "other possible views" Do you not think it would take the same measure of Faith to believe these versions of Origins as well?

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Just trying to get an idea of the type of views regarding this topic that would be in line with Christian teachings if there was 'proof' of humans 190k years ago, way before the estimated date for Adam and Eve.

For example, as mentioned in my original post, I wasn't sure if not believing in Adam and Eve could be part of an informed Christian view or if not believing in lineage could be. Or if that was a dumb question :S

I wasn't expected you to know the answer and didn't mean for my post to come across that way. I just wasn't sure if you knew different Christian viewpoints on this as you seem to be an active poster here

Thanks for your posts.

Also, it changes quite a lot if it was 'proved' that it was 190k years ago since it doesn't seem to agree with Adam and Eve's time line (although I made this post to see if it could be reconciled, if such a thing did happen).

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I wasn't after absolutes. I was just asking how Christians reconcile the difference between some scientific estimates of human dates (which I thank you for telling me other scientific estimates that are in line with the dates of Adam and Eve, which I'll look into) and the dates for Adam and Eve.

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I believe the only real change will come in the way of new theories for those who believe in a set time and date for the events of Adam and Eve. For all of those who Believe in the story of Adam and Even, but do not place it in a time Line (As the Bible does not place Adam and Eve in a time line) Nothing will change. What does it matter if these events happened 1000, 10,000 Or a billion years ago? If they happened, they Happened.

The bible only records the events, we(some of us), placed them in a specific time frame.

For example, as mentioned in my original post, I wasn't sure if not believing in Adam and Eve could be part of an informed Christian view or if not believing in lineage could be.

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Belief is one thing, applying that belief to all aspects of scrutiny, especially when dealing with details the story simply does not cover is another matter completely.

For example there are stories and reports telling of allied Soldiers liberating all manner of Art and treasure from the Nazis during, and after the war. Now just because we can not trace these liberated works of art back to the indivisual soldiers (in all cases) Who seized them, how long they were in captivity, and subsequently liberated these items, It doesn't mean the events surrounding the item are untrue.

We have the art, and sometimes we get a story. We are not always privy to all of the details. So, How long the art was in captivity is of little consequence. Unless you are one who believes the time line is paramount to the truth in this story. As I said this would be a foolish belief especially if the story itself does not include a time line, and one was simply added after the fact. As in the case of Adam and Eve.

So, again if one has separated the story from the oral time line someone in the church placed it in, what does it matter when humans first appeared?

Optimistic1212 said:

Hi,

This is my first post so hi. I'm interested in religion in general but have a question re Adam and Eve, when modern humans are currently believed to have been on the Earth and how people may reconcile the two.

1) If you believe in Adam and Eve and their lineage they should be the first humans at most 12,000 years ago.

2) If you believe that the current dating of modern human remains & bladelets is correct then the earliest modern human fossils were about 190k years ago and the earliest use of bladelets was about 70k years ago.

What I'm interested in is that:

(a) If you do believe point (1) do you also believe point (2) is wrong?

(b) Are there Christians that believe both and, if so, how do you reconcile the two points?

(c) Can you be a Christian and not believe in Adam and Eve?

(d) Can you be a Christian and not believe in the lineage?

I hope these questions aren't stupid and I'm not meaning to cause an argument but more interest in people's opinions.

Click to expand...

Genesis 1-11 (roughly) makes up the prologue to the bible. The main story of the bible is what God is doing in and through his people to sort out what is wrong with the world, and that begins with the call of Abraham. What Genesis 1-11 does is explain the nature of the problem, and it does so through a series of stories and connecting geneaologies. It's not history, but an explanation of what creation should be like, why it isn't, what the consequences are, and why God can't fix that by a show of force.