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Then gaze at the kid after he throws up all over the back of the car and screams bloody murder the whole way home. Then take a gander at the medical bill for the "wellness check" and worry about how much it'd cost if the child actually wasn't well. Then take a wander down aisle 7 at the grocery store and prepare to be shocked at the cost of diapers, wipes, formula, bottles, clothing, powder, soaps, food... Then think about what it'll be like going to sleep tonight at 9, then waking up at 12, 2, and 5 for feedings. Then picture yourself writing a check for daycare so you can work to afford to put the kid in daycare. Then imagine doing all of that on an income that can't support you, much less you and another person.
Gazing into the eyes of a child is the "Disney movie" answer, but it has nothing to do with real life. Gazing into the eyes of a child doesn't make it easier to put food on the table or care for him or her.
Jerusha_Girl said:I am not biologically dependant on the world to survive. I will grow, function, and live regardless of what my mother is doing. If my mother were to die tomorrow, I wouldn't die with her. However, if my mother was pregnant and she died, I wouldn't have continued to develop. Unless she had reached the point of viability in the pregnancy, I wouldn't have continued to function biologically.
i'm sure you know this, but there's a big difference between being dependant on the world to give you a place to go grocery shopping, and dependant on a specific person to keep your heart beating, blood flowing, and otherwise functional.
LittleNipper said:My proof is simply this, how many children were murdered in public schools before 1963. How many were murdered while in school after 1963? The proof is in the numbers. You only want to apply numbers where it suits your philosophy. The removal of GOD's logic can NEVER be a good thing. You have the truth. ONLY the TRUTH will set you free. Remove the TRUTH and you end freedom. Where is the freedom in public education today? Another proof it would seem.... So I have provided you with 2-----not that it matters.
It only appears that way to you because it seems you need to have everything spelled out for you.Jerusha_Girl said:"You're wrong because I say so."
]Fa||eN[ said:It only appears that way to you because it seems you need to have everything spelled out for you.
Please refer to post #96 for the context and meaning of the posters wording "world".
"I am not biologically dependant on the world to survive." Really? So that what do you have lungs for?
Im not emotional. Its an observation based on written data, the analysing of the reasoning and logic in her posts.Archivist said:Jump ball! This is getting personal. I would prefer to not see this thread closed. This is the biggest problem with this topic--it is difficult to discuss without getting emotional.
Jerusha_Girl said:I am not biologically dependant on society to survive. I will grow, function, and live regardless of what my mother is doing. If my mother were to die tomorrow, I wouldn't die with her. However, if my mother was pregnant and she died, I wouldn't have continued to develop. Unless she had reached the point of viability in the pregnancy, I wouldn't have continued to function biologically.
i'm sure you know this, but there's a big difference between being dependant on society to give you a place to go grocery shopping, and dependant on a specific person to keep your heart beating, blood flowing, and otherwise functional.
If 'Mother Earth' decided to not nuture you, woiuld that be murder? I don't see how. 'Mother Earth' did not choose for you to be a parasite on her just like women with unwanted pregnancies did not choose for the embryo to be a parasite on her. If you argue that the women shouldn't have had sex if she didn't want to get pregnant, then you should also argue that 'Mother Earth' should've had different laws of nature.You are biologically dependaent on Mother Earth, she nurtures you and she doesn't turn you away. To refuse to nurture another human and cause it's death, when you can do it, when you get the nurturing you need from Mother Earth is somewhat hypocritical.
Cheli said:If 'Mother Earth' decided to not nuture you, woiuld that be murder? I don't see how. 'Mother Earth' did not choose for you to be a parasite on her just like women with unwanted pregnancies did not choose for the embryo to be a parasite on her. .
Cheli said:All analogies fall at some point, there is no perfect analogy, which is why, I believe, your argument is pointless.
In A Perfect World said:So it's ok for animals to have sex, regarded as a sin, just because they're animals?
Why couldn't god have made it so that people only acquired sexual desires AFTER marriage if that was his plan?
truth_restorer said:I do not see any material difference. You use up her resources and deplete her, do you not?
Archivist said:Not entirely true.
We exhile carbon dioxide which is then ued by plants. Our droppings and decaying bodies enrich the soil. Our relationshipis not one way as you have stated. The relationship between the fetus and the mother is, on the other hand, one way.
truth_restorer said:You are again drawing immaterial distictions that do not go to the heart of the issue. You are biologically dependaent on Mother Earth, she nurtures you and she doesn't turn you away. To refuse to nurture another human and cause it's death, when you can do it, when you get the nurturing you need from Mother Earth is somewhat hypocritical.
Seeking... said:I don't understand the point of this argument. Human beings are dependent on Mother Earth, but that dependency isn't analagous to a mother and child. Mother Earth is not a sentient being as far as I know. Were Mother Earth to be sentient and not want the various lifeforms on and within her to survive - she would be within her rights to remove each and every lifeform. But you can't even prove that the Earth has consciousness and "feels" anything in response to life on Earth. You can't discern Mother Earth's will at all. Explain to me exactly how Mother Earth has desires that might be thwarted by our presence and I'll reconsider your idea...
truth_restorer said:Those differences are immaterial because the argument is made to counter the contention that adults are not as dependent as an unborn child is, whereas, they most certainly are as dependent, if not moreso and to a worse and a more harmful degree.
While Mother Earth herself may not be sentient, all the rest of who live on her are sentient. And if you take from her, then you take from the commons, and hence, you take from us. Yet, we do not kill you for the deprivation we suffer on your account. Do we?
Seeking... said:You cannot suggest that they are taking from a "common", because no adult has a right to that environment (just as the fetus doesn't). There is no "common", you get what you can manage to scrape up - and what Mother Earth allows you to have. Mother Earth actually seems to weed out some areas periodically with famine, drought and pestilense (sp?). As to your last point - despite that fact that none of us have a right to anything - men have killed each other throughout all of time based on the fact of their deprivation and another's resources...
truth_restorer said:That depends on where you think the "commons" came from. If the "commons" is Divinely ordained, the divine ordination might (if fact, most likely would) have equitable stipulations attached its use;the terms of allocation among those sharing it, possibly, but not exclusively, decreed along some utilitarian line of thought.
Seeking... said:There is no commons. Resources have not been equitably allocated to human beings based on some divine ordination - it is an interesting idea that has no basis in anything that can be backed up, proved in any way.
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