A simple question to creationists...

[Arikay]

Nope its not a trick or something, just curious for an answer, even though its often hard to get my questions answered by creationists.

Why do whales and dolphins have fingers?

In whales and dolphins the bones that are the same as our wrist bone is fussed and the flippers act as one single flipper and aren't articulated.

I want an answer beyond "the fall" or something vague like that. If whales have always been whales, why do they have hands? Did God just decide to give them bones for a hand for no other reason than he wanted too?

If whales have always been whales, how does creationism explain hand bone structure that is similar to all mammals?

 

[HRE]

Duh! God made them that way! We don't know why, but who are we to guess at God's higher plan?

 

[Bushido216]

The Sound of a Pin Dropping.

 

[JohnR7]

Why do whales and dolphins have fingers?

Umm, let me take a guess at this. Because they are both mammals, and so they have things in common with the other mammals.

 

[Aron-Ra]

Why do whales and dolphins have fingers?

Umm, let me take a guess at this. Because they are both mammals, and so they have things in common with the other mammals.

WHY do they have things in common with other mammals?

 

[Bushido216]

The point, John, is why are two structures that serve wildy different purposes and have wildly different appearances so structurally similar?

 

[challenger]

Umm, let me take a guess at this. Because they are both mammals, and so they have things in common with the other mammals.

What possible reason is there for it though, why is it necessary to have a hand like skeletal structure for something which is clearly not a hand?

 

[Philosoft]

Umm, let me take a guess at this. Because they are both mammals, and so they have things in common with the other mammals.

Yeah, except specialized hand and wrist bones are not among the defining characteristics of Class Mammalia.

 

[ONE WHO REMAINS]

Okay so they have bones in there flippers, that meens nothing. We both have penis', we both have eyes. Oh and they can swim and so can we. Comparing the two is like saying roller skates have wheels and so do cars, and they look allot alike. Well they both came from the same creator, us. As we and the whales came from GOD. Now think about how big there flippers are and tell me how you would create a bone stucture that could support the skin at 2000 psi. If it didnt have a bone structure like that they'd flop around and do nothing. Shorter answer: GOD made them that way. And I dont know why GOD does what he does, and I dont think you do either.

 

[HRE]

One, a fins like your standard fish's are much more efficient for swimming, especially a vertical tail as opposed to a horizontal fluke.

Just might note, I said (mockingly) in the beginning of this thread:

Duh! God made them that way! We don't know why, but who are we to guess at God's higher plan?

I hardly expected to hear that echoed (seriously, this time) not six posts later:

Shorter answer: GOD made them that way. And I dont know why GOD does what he does, and I dont think you do either.

 

[pureone]

. Comparing the two is like saying roller skates have wheels and so do cars, and they look allot alike.

Argument for design. Assumes that what isbeing discussed is designed, so therfore must be designed.

Now think about how big there flippers are and tell me how you would create a bone stucture that could support the skin at 2000 psi.

I wouldn't. I'd leave it up to natural selection, which has done it's work.

Shorter answer: GOD made them that way. And I dont know why GOD does what he does, and I dont think you do either.

Which one of us said God didn't create them? I'm sure the Christians here never said that. Are you equating atheism with evolution? That is a lie. Don't you know bearing false witness is a sin?

 

[Arikay]

1) they don't just have bones in their flippers, they have a bone structure that is very similar to All mammals.

2) Sharks have cartilage fin structures that are single pieces shapped like their fins, simple and effective.

3) Ok, so according to you, creationism can't explain why Whales have a complicated fin bone structure similar to land mammals even though a simpler and just as effective solution exists in other sea creatures such as sharks, beyond "God did it."

Okay so they have bones in there flippers, that meens nothing. We both have penis', we both have eyes. Oh and they can swim and so can we. Comparing the two is like saying roller skates have wheels and so do cars, and they look allot alike. Well they both came from the same creator, us. As we and the whales came from GOD. Now think about how big there flippers are and tell me how you would create a bone stucture that could support the skin at 2000 psi. If it didnt have a bone structure like that they'd flop around and do nothing. Shorter answer: GOD made them that way. And I dont know why GOD does what he does, and I dont think you do either.

 

[Bushido216]

Okay so they have bones in there flippers, that meens nothing. We both have penis', we both have eyes. Oh and they can swim and so can we. Comparing the two is like saying roller skates have wheels and so do cars, and they look allot alike. Well they both came from the same creator, us. As we and the whales came from GOD. Now think about how big there flippers are and tell me how you would create a bone stucture that could support the skin at 2000 psi. If it didnt have a bone structure like that they'd flop around and do nothing. Shorter answer: GOD made them that way. And I dont know why GOD does what he does, and I dont think you do either.

The point isn't that we can both swim. The point is that a whale is vastly different morphologically, and the two structures serve vastly different purposes, yet the flippers on them and the hands on have the same bone structure.

 

[Aron-Ra]

Just might note, I said (mockingly) in the beginning of this thread:

Duh! God made them that way! We don't know why, but who are we to guess at God's higher plan?

I hardly expected to hear that echoed (seriously, this time) not six posts later:

Shorter answer: GOD made them that way. And I dont know why GOD does what he does, and I dont think you do either.

Classic. What surprises me though is that somehow this surprised you. Does your irony meter still work after all this time? These guys are all about prophesy, so they do all they can to be predictable.

 

[HeDied4Me]

Nope its not a trick or something, just curious for an answer, even though its often hard to get my questions answered by creationists.

Why do whales and dolphins have fingers?

In whales and dolphins the bones that are the same as our wrist bone is fussed and the flippers act as one single flipper and aren't articulated.

I want an answer beyond "the fall" or something vague like that. If whales have always been whales, why do they have hands? Did God just decide to give them bones for a hand for no other reason than he wanted too?

If whales have always been whales, how does creationism explain hand bone structure that is similar to all mammals?

Because mammals, in general, have certain characteristics, and reptiles have certain characteristics, and fish have certain characteristics, etc..

Just because they're similar doesn't need to mean they evolved. From a Creationist perspective, I can answer that God created the Earth with order; that's why we can taxonomically divide it into classifications. We believe that God is a God of order, so it makes sense that He would create animals in a way that we could classify them, rather than just creating every animal entirely differently, with no similar characteristics.

 

[Arikay]

But having hand bones are not a requirement for being a mammal and isn't used to classify an animal as a mammal. Yet pretty much all mammals share the same forelimb bone structure.

Does it make sense that this god of order would give a sea creature a complicated but useless bone structure that is organized the same way land creatures hand bones are, but then design other sea creatures, like the shark, without this complicated bone structure?

Because mammals, in general, have certain characteristics, and reptiles have certain characteristics, and fish have certain characteristics, etc..

Just because they're similar doesn't need to mean they evolved. From a Creationist perspective, I can answer that God created the Earth with order; that's why we can taxonomically divide it into classifications. We believe that God is a God of order, so it makes sense that He would create animals in a way that we could classify them, rather than just creating every animal entirely differently, with no similar characteristics.

 

[JohnR7]

The point, John, is why are two structures that serve wildy different purposes and have wildly different appearances so structurally similar?

Don't tell Buckminster-Fuller that, he always insisted that the design had to follow the structure.
In what way do you feel the structure is not appropriate for the design?

 

[Jet Black]

Because mammals, in general, have certain characteristics, and reptiles have certain characteristics, and fish have certain characteristics, etc..

what about those that have characteristics of both, i.e. a mammalian and a reptilian jaw? It is also not a good argument in terms of design. modern cars don't have reins to hold a horse just because carriages used to. the bones in whe whales flippers are equivalent to this.

 

[pureone]

Because mammals, in general, have certain characteristics, and reptiles have certain characteristics, and fish have certain characteristics, etc..

Just because they're similar doesn't need to mean they evolved. From a Creationist perspective, I can answer that God created the Earth with order; that's why we can taxonomically divide it into classifications. We believe that God is a God of order, so it makes sense that He would create animals in a way that we could classify them, rather than just creating every animal entirely differently, with no similar characteristics.

Uh, then why bother with the extra digits and bones? Poor design then, because it would be possible to create the same appendege with better engineering.

Why bother with giving horses residual toes?

 

[HeDied4Me]

Uh, then why bother with the extra digits and bones? Poor design then, because it would be possible to create the same appendege with better engineering.

Why bother with giving horses residual toes?

I don't know... There are a lot of things we don't understand. By the same token, I could ask "why did the appendix evolve?" We don't know the function of the appendix, but that doesn't mean it's useless.

The existence of things we don't yet understand doesn't disprove Creationism; in fact, there are many parts of the animals anatomy for which we don't know the purpose (such as the appendix), and some of them could be used just as well as an argument against evolution (like the question about the appendix).

Remember, also, that some Creationists do believe in Theistic Evolution.