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9/11 Meeting Erupts in Chaos; "News" Networks Cut Away (Except CSPAN3)
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<blockquote data-quote="Existential1" data-source="post: 7998123" data-attributes="member: 22146"><p>I would want to come back on that one opus_dei and burrow_owl, you followers of the order of _.</p><p></p><p>There is an element of what could become hypocrisy in the stand I take on this: but, I think, for me at least, it is the wise and fullest stance; where if I abandon this stance, I weaken my potential cleaving to God.</p><p></p><p>Burrow_owl speaks my kind of speak when he talks of cult of experience, epistemic priority. We could add owner of ethical franchise, and victim centredness, whatever.</p><p></p><p>We live in a time of ethical and sensory fragmentation, crucially driven and sustained by media prodcution. I too am deeply suspicious of victim centred perspective, and victim driven justice.</p><p></p><p>But, the former takes priority, for me. We are challenged in retaining human experience, and taking human measure: where in each moment we might strive for this, we stand in danger of being sucked back into the mechanics of the present. This parallels to struggle to take stand with God and with Jesus, while embedded in a worldly nexus: a necessary nexus, if we are to retain humanity, as we aspire to God.</p><p></p><p>The death of innocents, and however much we might qualify the innocence of those who died on 9/11/01, has a centrality which transcends all. Most cultures make massive accomodation of and for this: but, in our society, and despite what other formal steps of accomodation are taken; this grieving for the innocent is massively qualified by the media busy nature of our occurrence mileau. Grief is dessicated by whatever else goes on in our civil dispensation.</p><p></p><p>I believe this gives those who grieve for innocents lost, certain overriding rights: certain "terrorist" rights, in relation to the decorum and protocol, that sees us just going on getting on. Those who grieve can stop the world, as far as I am concerned: it is their right, their duty; it is what they bring to us, in forcing us to more fully share their grief.</p><p></p><p>There is a poster on this forum, who bravely advocates for Israel: tooth and nail, breath in breath out. Intellectually, and in terms of evryhting I believe to be true about the manner and necessity of reconciliation: every cell of my body screams out that I rise up and crush the intolerance of the posts; yet I must never, ever do that. In these posts is grief for loss, grief for loss yet to come: there is righteous anger at innocence murdered; there is a calling down of G_d to protect his people. What do I know of that loss, what can I learn of that loss: unless I am humbled to a listening silence, by the grief expression; what right have I to do otherwise.</p><p>If there is something for reconciliation, that might pass through me as agent: then only if I am so silenced, that I let God's voice speak and move me; can that be so.</p><p></p><p>We never stopped to wait for God over 9/11. The media noise filled our ears, and we went to war.</p><p>We never supported, not unto God's truth, those who lost and came to grieve.</p><p>If some few of those who so lost, feel now compelled, perhaps in the the confusion of that loss, to disrupt our proceedings: then, I believe, we owe them, at the least, that God hearing silence of reception, that we denied them in origonal events.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Existential1, post: 7998123, member: 22146"] I would want to come back on that one opus_dei and burrow_owl, you followers of the order of _. There is an element of what could become hypocrisy in the stand I take on this: but, I think, for me at least, it is the wise and fullest stance; where if I abandon this stance, I weaken my potential cleaving to God. Burrow_owl speaks my kind of speak when he talks of cult of experience, epistemic priority. We could add owner of ethical franchise, and victim centredness, whatever. We live in a time of ethical and sensory fragmentation, crucially driven and sustained by media prodcution. I too am deeply suspicious of victim centred perspective, and victim driven justice. But, the former takes priority, for me. We are challenged in retaining human experience, and taking human measure: where in each moment we might strive for this, we stand in danger of being sucked back into the mechanics of the present. This parallels to struggle to take stand with God and with Jesus, while embedded in a worldly nexus: a necessary nexus, if we are to retain humanity, as we aspire to God. The death of innocents, and however much we might qualify the innocence of those who died on 9/11/01, has a centrality which transcends all. Most cultures make massive accomodation of and for this: but, in our society, and despite what other formal steps of accomodation are taken; this grieving for the innocent is massively qualified by the media busy nature of our occurrence mileau. Grief is dessicated by whatever else goes on in our civil dispensation. I believe this gives those who grieve for innocents lost, certain overriding rights: certain "terrorist" rights, in relation to the decorum and protocol, that sees us just going on getting on. Those who grieve can stop the world, as far as I am concerned: it is their right, their duty; it is what they bring to us, in forcing us to more fully share their grief. There is a poster on this forum, who bravely advocates for Israel: tooth and nail, breath in breath out. Intellectually, and in terms of evryhting I believe to be true about the manner and necessity of reconciliation: every cell of my body screams out that I rise up and crush the intolerance of the posts; yet I must never, ever do that. In these posts is grief for loss, grief for loss yet to come: there is righteous anger at innocence murdered; there is a calling down of G_d to protect his people. What do I know of that loss, what can I learn of that loss: unless I am humbled to a listening silence, by the grief expression; what right have I to do otherwise. If there is something for reconciliation, that might pass through me as agent: then only if I am so silenced, that I let God's voice speak and move me; can that be so. We never stopped to wait for God over 9/11. The media noise filled our ears, and we went to war. We never supported, not unto God's truth, those who lost and came to grieve. If some few of those who so lost, feel now compelled, perhaps in the the confusion of that loss, to disrupt our proceedings: then, I believe, we owe them, at the least, that God hearing silence of reception, that we denied them in origonal events. [/QUOTE]
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