This quote I find helpful ....
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Theologians believe that the following 3 verses (11-13) were probably used in the Primitive Church either as a Creed or as a Spiritual song. Be that as it may, they were recognized as part of the canon of Scripture and so we do acknowledge them as words from God. [/font]
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"The point of this quotation is that Christians should be motivated to endure hardship and remain faithful to the Lord in view of what Christ has done and will do." Constable, Dr. Thomas,Class notes on 2 Timothy.[/font]
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So, what we have here are 4 things that the Lord will do depending on your spiritual state as a Christian or Non-Christian. We could also say that they are 4 promises that the Lord pronounces to us. [/font]
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A) He Promises to Eternally Live With Those Who Come To Him.[/font]
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"If we died with him, We will also live with him." [/font]
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Turn to Romans 6:1-8[/font]
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"I have been crucified with Christ and I no longer live, but Christ lives in me. The life I live in the body, I live by faith in the Son of God, who loved me and gave himself for me." Gal. 2.20[/font]
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If you've truly given your life to Christ, you can be sure of one thing: Christ lives in you today, tomorrow and forever, Amen. He will never leave you, ever.[/font]
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B) He Promises That True Believers Will Reign With Him In His Kingdom.[/font]
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"If we endure, we will also reign with him."[/font]
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The original here is literally "If we keep on enduring." Endurance in the faith is characteristic of all truly born again believers. It's what theologians call the "perseverance of the Saints." Now, does this mean, true Christians never fail or fall? Absolutely not! But, the difference between a True and a False Believer is that the true believer falls and gets backup. While the False Believer falls and cops out. Example: David (Ps 51).[/font]
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"The seed that fell among thorns stands for those who hear, but as they go on their way they are choked by life's worries, riches and pleasures, and they do not mature. But, the seed on good soil stands for those with a noble and good heart, who hear the word, retain it, and by persevering produce a crop." Luke 8.14-15[/font]
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True Believers are promised to share in Christ's reign in the Millennium and throughout Eternity, "Blessed and holy are those who are part in the first resurrection. The second death has no power over them, but they will be priests of God and of Christ and will reign with him for a thousand years." Rev. 20.6 Differing "degrees" of reigning. Luke 19 "10 cities", "5 cities". Rev. 2.26 "nations".[/font]
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C) He Promises To Deny Those Who Deny Him.[/font]
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"If we (disown) deny him, he will also (disown) deny us."[/font]
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The "denial" here is a permanent one, total and definite Apostasy from all that Christ is and teaches. Now, I believe, it's important to acknowledge the difference between "momentary" denial and "total" denial. Examples: Peter and Judas[/font]
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"Anyone who
does not abide in the teaching of Christ, does not have God." 2 Jn. 9[/font]
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"Whoever acknowledges me before men, I will also acknowledge him before my Father in Heaven, But whoever disowns me before men, I will disown him before my Father in Heaven." Mt. 10.33[/font]
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The author of Foxes Book of Martyrs states that in Paul's day 5 million Christians were martyred because of their faith in Christ. You think "these" were true believers? No doubt, they were![/font]
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D) He Promises To Keep His Word Both To False And True Believers.[/font]
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"If we are faithless, he will remain faithful, for he cannot disown himself."[/font]
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"Faithless" (Apistos) means "unbelieving, having no true faith". Again, Paul is talking about a fake Christian here. One who "says" he has faith but lacks true Christian faith like James speaks of when he says: "As a body without the spirit is dead, so faith without deeds is dead
You believe that there is a God. Good! Even the demons believe that- and shudder." 2.19,26[/font]
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So, when you see so-called "Christians" leaving the faith and going into a life of all-out sin, don't forget: Just because they are "faithless", the Lord "will remain faithful, for he cannot disown himself." He said he'll condemn unbelievers, and he will greatly reward believers and, count on it, he will. [/font]
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"May the words of my mouth and the meditation of my heart be pleasing in your sight, O Lord, my Rock and my Redeemer." Psalm 19:14[/font]
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Amen and God Bless You All.[/font]
http://members.tripod.com/sebzacmom/id28.htm
. Anyway what I don't get, is that the we in verse 11, 12, and 13 are the same. So the we that could deny Him, are the we that died with Him. Also, denying Christ would be considered unfaithful, and if we are unfaithful, Christ remains faithful. But 12 says that he will deny us. So yeah i am confused, i feel so confused that i can't even explain my confusion. So if you understand this, could ya clear it up for me, thanks.
