I believe that ALL who ever lived will be in God’s Kingdom

timothyu · Jul 14, 2026

No one but the Son goes to Heaven. The Kingdom comes down to us. The first shall be last and the last first

BelieveItOarKnot · Jul 15, 2026

timothyu said:
But they do establish allegiance.

The evil present in no one is allegiant to God

timothyu · Jul 15, 2026

BelieveItOarKnot said:
The evil present in no one is allegiant to God

Of course not. But even the imperfect can realize their backwardness and reject/repent of the self-serving ways of mankind in favour of the will of God.

Minister Monardo · Jul 15, 2026

Beth77 said:
I believe these scriptures are clear about that. Am I misunderstanding?

Malachi 2:17
You have wearied the LORD with your words;
Yet you say,
“In what way have we wearied Him?”
In that you say,
“Everyone who does evil
Is good in the sight of the LORD,
And He delights in them,”
Or, “Where is the God of justice?”

This prophetic word addresses this notion directly.
Can this belief be reconciled with everything the scriptures
indicate in regards to the righteous judgment of God?
Particularly what is said about wicked oppressors vs. their victims.
How is justice for the oppressed attained, if the oppressors
are accepted?
This reminds me of a cartoon I watched as a child. There is
a sheepdog with hair covering his eyes, and he seems oblivious
to the wolf that is trying to snag a sheep. But then at the last minute,
the dog snags the wolf by the throat and punches him out.
Then at the end of the day, they both clock out and say goodnight.
'Night Ralph'
See ya tomorrow, Ed.

JulieB67 · Jul 15, 2026

BelieveItOarKnot said:
Well, if and when you bring the enemy into your theological pictures the pictures change considerably

And being truthful about that is a vital part of honesty. Otherwise your just kidding yourself with the typical one sided incomplete picture, which is quite natural

You can't even answer with a simple yes or no.

typical one sided incomplete picture,

Which is your complete MO. You don't even acknowledge other verses. Others have many times stated that, yes, no one is sinless or perfect in the flesh. But that doesn't mean you don't strive to put the spirit over the flesh. We are told to do so. But you refuse to even acknowledge that we are told to resist the devil and he will flee, acknowledge that we are to deny ourselves, renew our minds and so on. Not even one word that yes, that's what we are to do. You act as if Christ/his ministry and the disciples/apostles spreading his ministry is a waste of time. So who is one sided?? You.

You'd rather hold to your continued cherry picking of verses and blot out the rest. So much for your belief in "every verse" applies to everyone...

BelieveItOarKnot · Jul 18, 2026

JulieB67 said:
You can't even answer with a simple yes or no.

If you ever got around to understanding the basic parties involved you'd actually be able to discuss it. But alas...

JulieB67 said:
Which is your complete MO. You don't even acknowledge other verses.

You only understand the typical one sided accounts that sooth your flesh and completely ignore applying personally, the realities of scripture. So what else is new?

The really odd part is you actually admit the other party influnces in you, but yet refuse to bear down on that matter. And I'd suggest you can't because of the reality of it. Mark 4:15 applies to everyone who has ever lived at all times.

JulieB67 said:
Others have many times stated that, yes, no one is sinless or perfect in the flesh.

Doi is the only observation required in the face of the openly obvious

JulieB67 said:
But that doesn't mean you don't strive to put the spirit over the flesh.

The flesh with influencers intact is not about to change it's stripes, REGARDLESS of what "you do" because it's not "you" doing it. Romans 7:17-21 also applies to everyone

JulieB67 said:
We are told to do so. But you refuse to even acknowledge that we are told to resist the devil

cough, cough, because it's THERE to resist. Triple cough. You only serve to make the obvious case while simultaneously trying to deny it's the case. Funny and sad you can't see the obvious, trying futily to extricate yourself from what you admit having to resist. Quite entirely ODD, even irrational behavior.

JulieB67 said:
and he will flee,

The "flee" is understanding YOU are not IT

Doesn't mean you extricated yourself from the battles. No one does.

JulieB67 said:
acknowledge that we are to deny ourselves, renew our minds and so on.

Being honest is part of the processing. You might arrive at honesty at some point. Coverups and futile extrication attempts don't work, for anyone. No matter how fancy the coverups get.

JulieB67 said:
Not even one word that yes, that's what we are to do.

But YOU are not the only party involved. You are also carrying very particular things to ultimate adverse judgements, unavoidable. Everyone is in this service and it is in fact from God.

JulieB67 said:
You act as if Christ/his ministry and the disciples/apostles spreading his ministry is a waste of time. So who is one sided?? You.

Spin it however you please. The facts remain to stare us all in the face. We all have, present tense, sin, and sin is of the devil. This isn't going away for you or anyone else. Deal with the "facts" please. Be honest. Yes, your sin exists and IS of our adversary. Satan is NOT getting off the judgement hook in anyone. Contrary to your pleas to have it otherwise.

JulieB67 said:
You'd rather hold to your continued cherry picking of verses and blot out the rest.

Matt. 4:4, Luke 4:4, Deut. 8:3 is the GOLD STANDARD in the face of all who DENY God's Words applying to themselves.

I didn't state it. Jesus did.

JulieB67 said:
So much for your belief in "every verse" applies to everyone...

See the obvious above. I won't be buying one sided stories anytime soon, which is what you're led to peddle. They're not good

JulieB67 · Sunday at 6:12 AM

BelieveItOarKnot said:
, which is what you're led to peddle

Romans 12:2 "And be not conformed to this world: but be ye transformed by the renewing of your mind, that ye may prove what is that good, and acceptable, and perfect, will of God."

Mark 4:15 applies to everyone who has ever lived at all times.

Mark 4:14 "The sower soweth the word."

Mark 4:15 "And these are they by the way side, where the word is sown; but when they have heard, Satan cometh immediately, and taketh away the word that was sown in their hearts."

Mark 4:16 "And these are they likewise which are sown on stony ground; who, when they have heard the word, immediately receive it with gladness

Mark 4:17 "And have no root in themselves, and so endure but for a time: afterword, when affliction or persecution ariseth for the word's sake, immediately they are offended."

Mark 4:18 "And these are they which are sown among thorns; such as hear the word,"

Mark 4:19 "And the cares of this world, and the deceitfulness of riches, and the lusts of other things entering in, choke the word, and it becometh unfruitful."

Mark 4:20 "And these are they which are sown on good ground; such as hear the word, and receive it, and bring forth fruit, some thirty fold, some sixty, and some an hundred."

BelieveItOarKnot · Monday at 7:46 AM

JulieB67 said:
Romans 12:2 "And be not conformed to this world: but be ye transformed by the renewing of your mind, that ye may prove what is that good, and acceptable, and perfect, will of God."

Mark 4:14 "The sower soweth the word."

Mark 4:15 "And these are they by the way side, where the word is sown; but when they have heard, Satan cometh immediately, and taketh away the word that was sown in their hearts."

Mark 4:16 "And these are they likewise which are sown on stony ground; who, when they have heard the word, immediately receive it with gladness

Mark 4:17 "And have no root in themselves, and so endure but for a time: afterword, when affliction or persecution ariseth for the word's sake, immediately they are offended."

Mark 4:18 "And these are they which are sown among thorns; such as hear the word,"

Mark 4:19 "And the cares of this world, and the deceitfulness of riches, and the lusts of other things entering in, choke the word, and it becometh unfruitful."

Mark 4:20 "And these are they which are sown on good ground; such as hear the word, and receive it, and bring forth fruit, some thirty fold, some sixty, and some an hundred."

Hopefully you understand that "and these are they" "and these are they likewise" are continuations. Not new groups.

JulieB67 · Monday at 9:20 AM

BelieveItOarKnot said:
Not new groups

Mark 4:15 "And these are they by the way side, where the word is sown; but when they have heard, Satan cometh immediately, and taketh away the word that was sown in their hearts."

Mark 4:16 "And these are they likewise which are sown on stony ground; who, when they have heard the word, immediately receive it with gladness

Mark 4:17 "And have no root in themselves, and so endure but for a time: afterword, when affliction or persecution ariseth for the word's sake, immediately they are offended."

Mark 4:18 "And these are they which are sown among thorns; such as hear the word,"

Mark 4:19 "And the cares of this world, and the deceitfulness of riches, and the lusts of other things entering in, choke the word, and it becometh unfruitful."

Mark 4:20 "And these are they which are sown on good ground; such as hear the word, and receive it, and bring forth fruit, some thirty fold, some sixty, and some an hundred."

You are incorrect. The entire parable is about what type of ground each group of people receives the word on. They are not the same group of people.

One receives it by the wayside- Satan steals the word
One receives it on stony ground- affliction and persecution arises, they are offended
One receives among thorns.- cares of this world choke the word
One receives it on good ground. They hear it, receive and produce fruit.

And it would then be impossible for Christ to state this-

"but when they have heard, Satan cometh immediately, and taketh away the word"

And then this-

" immediately receive it with gladness"

Why are you fighting so hard against scripture?

And you are again, omitting the most important group-

Mark 4:20 "And these are they which are sown on good ground; such as hear the word, and receive it, and bring forth fruit, some thirty fold, some sixty, and some an hundred."

Here is the same parable in Matthew 13 proving these are not the same receiving the word-

Matthew 13:19 "When any one heareth the word of the kingdom, and understandeth it not, then cometh the wicked one, and catcheth away that which was sown in his heart. This is he which received seed by the way side

Matthew 13:20 "But he that received the seed into stony places, the same is he that heareth the word, and anon with joy receiveth it;"

Matthew 13:21 "Yet hath he not root in himself, but dureth for a while: for when tribulation or persecution ariseth because of the word, by and by he is offended."

This person likewise heard the same word and received it with joy. So it's completely different than the one that understood it not and Satan was able to immediately steal it. This person did endureth for a while.

Matthew 13:22 "He also that received seed among the thorns is he that heareth the word; and the care of this world, and the deceitfulness of riches, choke the word, and he becometh unfruitful

Matthew 13:23 "But he that received seed into the good ground is he that heareth the word, and understandeth it; which also beareth fruit, and bringeth forth, some an hundredfold, some sixty, some thirty."

You have the first and last group both not understanding the word and understanding the word because you believe they are the same. And Christ is specifically talking about different types of people and how they receive the Word.

Again, we have Luke 8 so we can further get the complete picture-

Luke 8:12 "Those by the way side are they that hear; then cometh the devil, and taketh away the word out of their hearts, lest they should believe and be saved."

This person doesn't even believe because Satan took the word away.

Luke 8:13 "They on the rock are they, which, when they hear, receive the word with joy; and these have no root, which for a while believe, and in time of temptation fall away."

This person believed for a while.

Luke 8:14 "And that which fell among thorns are they, which, when they have heard, go forth, and are choked with cares and riches and pleasures of this life, and bring no fruit to perfection."

This one brings forth no fruit because they are too caught up in the world.

Luke 8:15 "But that on the good ground are they, which in an honest and good heart, having heard the word, keep it, and bring forth fruit with patience."

Satan did not steal the word from the last group. It's the very opposite. They in an honest and good heart- heard the word and understood it, kept it and brought forth fruit because of it. If they kept it, it wasn't stolen. Which should bring another verse to mind which you continue to ignore-

Ephesians 2:10 "For we are His workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them."

We will never be perfect But there's a difference between someone receiving the Word and then not believing, someone not caring after awhile and falling back into the world and someone who's in the Word every day (keeping that Word in their heart) and producing fruit because of it.

And of course people can always overcome their situation with true repentance.

Pieces256 · Monday at 10:34 AM

(staff edit of a quote wrongly attributed to a member.)

d taylor said:
A person has to be born again to enter.

BelieveItOarKnot · Monday at 6:41 PM

JulieB67 said:
You are incorrect. The entire parable is about what type of ground

Your flesh is no better than anyone else's

We ALL see only in part, courtesy of the thief, Satan. Unless you want to claim perfect sight and perfect understanding, just for laughs

JulieB67 · Wednesday at 9:10 AM

BelieveItOarKnot said:
Your flesh is no better than anyone else's

Galatians 5:16 "This I say then, Walk in the Spirit, and ye shall not fulfil the lust of the flesh."

BelieveItOarKnot · Wednesday at 11:08 AM

You quite simply and again fail to see the fact the flesh/spirit of disobedience is always at odds with the Spirit. It won't be otherwise for anyone at any time.

Dominion over it doesn't exist without recognizing the contention, and being honest about it, as opposed to denying that tension, covering it up, lying about it, trying to usher into acceptance, being hypocritical about it, ALL hallmarks of the resistor being in control. It's not a people problem. It's what is in people that is, as Paul stated, "no longer I that DOES IT"

Emphasis-does, present tense

JulieB67 · Wednesday at 5:06 PM

BelieveItOarKnot said:
is always at odds with the Spirit

Galatians 5:16 "This I say then, Walk in the Spirit, and ye shall not fulfil the lust of the flesh."

TruthInLight · Wednesday at 11:05 PM

BelieveItOarKnot said:
It's not a people problem. It's what is in people that is, as Paul stated, "no longer I that DOES IT"

There's this part.

Romans 7:18
For I know that in me (that is, in my flesh,) dwelleth no good thing: for to will is present with me; but how to perform that which is good I find not.

Psalm 39:5
Behold, Thou hast made my days as a handbreadth, and mine age is as nothing before Thee; verily every man in his best state is altogether vanity. Selah

JulieB67 · Thursday at 8:25 AM

Yes, there is always going to be a war between the Spirit and the flesh but after repentance one should want to put the Spirit over the flesh. That's the difference between someone who has found true repentance (to think differently) and someone who hasn't. I've stated that many times before. Will we still fall short at times? Yes, in the flesh we always will continue to do so. I've stated that many times as well although certain people have claimed otherwise and state that I deny that fact which is a lie.
But that change of mind and heart has to be there. Thankfully God is the heart knower.

And Paul continues this subject in his letter-

Romans 8:1 "There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit."

And still goes further in chapter 8 on being carnally minded and spiritually minded.

We have to take the bible as a whole.

sir.dante.esq · Thursday at 10:21 AM

Beth77 said:
I believe these scriptures are clear about that. Am I misunderstanding?

1 John 4:14 14 And we have seen and testify that the Father has sent his Son to be the Savior of the world.

1 Timothy 4:10 For to this end we toil and strive, because we have our hope set on the living God, who is the Savior of all people, especially of those who believe.

Lamentations 3:31 For the Lord will not cast off forever

Romans 5:18 Therefore, as one trespass led to condemnation for all men, so one act of righteousness leads to justification and life for all men.

1 Corinthians 15:22 For as in Adam all die, so also in Christ shall all be made alive.

Romans 11:32 For God has consigned all to disobedience, that he may have mercy on all.

John 12:32 And I, when I am lifted up from the earth, will draw ALL people to myself.”

Revelation 21:5 And he who was seated on the throne said, “Behold, I am making all things new.” Also he said, “Write this down, for these words are trustworthy and true.”

2 Corinthians 5:19 that is, in Christ God was reconciling the world to himself, not counting their trespasses against them, and entrusting to us the message of reconciliation.

John 6:51
I am the living bread that came down from heaven. If anyone eats of this bread, he will live forever. And the bread that I will give for the life of the world is my flesh.”

2 Corinthians 5:14-15 For the love of Christ controls us, because we have concluded this: that one has died for all, therefore all have died; 15 and he died for all, that those who live might no longer live for themselves but for him who for their sake died and was raised.

Colossians 1:20 and through him to reconcile to himself all things, whether on earth or in heaven, making peace by the blood of his cross.

John 3:17 For God did not send his Son into the world to condemn the world, but in order that the world might be saved through him.

Luke 3:6 and all flesh shall see the salvation of God

Philippians 2:10-11 so that at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, in heaven and on earth and under the earth, 11 and every tongue confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father.

Romans 10:9 because, if you confess with your mouth that Jesus is Lord and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved.

2 Samuel 14:14 We must all die; we are like water spilled on the ground, which cannot be gathered up again. But God will not take away life, and he devises means so that the banished one will not remain an outcast.

Ephesians 1:10 As a plan for the fullness of time, to unite all things in Him, things in heaven and things on earth.

John 1:29 The next day he saw Jesus coming toward him, and said, “Behold, the Lamb of God, who takes away the sin of the world!"

1 Corinthians 15:22-28
22 For as in Adam all die, so also in Christ shall all be made alive. 23 But each in his own order: Christ the firstfruits, then at his coming those who belong to Christ. 24 Then comes the end, when he delivers the kingdom to God the Father after destroying every rule and every authority and power. 25 For he must reign until he has put all his enemies under his feet. 26 The last enemy to be destroyed is death. 27 For “God[c] has put all things in subjection under his feet.” But when it says, “all things are put in subjection,” it is plain that he is excepted who put all things in subjection under him. 28 When all things are subjected to him, then the Son himself will also be subjected to him who put all things in subjection under him, that God may be all in all.

Hide trimmed content

What about the "unpardonable sin,"? Can anyone who is guilty of this sin be part of the All you speak of being let into Heaven?

The "unpardonable sin," or blasphemy against the Holy Spirit, It specifically refers to the act of willfully attributing the undeniable, miraculous works of God to Satan. this sin not as an accidental slip of the tongue, but as a hard-hearted, continuous rejection of God's truth until death.

“Wherefore I say unto you, All manner of sin and blasphemy shall be forgiven unto men: but the blasphemy against the Holy Ghost shall not be forgiven unto men,” (Matthew 12:31-32)

“But he that shall blaspheme against the Holy Ghost hath never forgiveness, but is in danger of eternal damnation: Because they said, He hath an unclean spirit,” (Mark 3:28-30)

BelieveItOarKnot · 2026-07-25T05:40:55-0500

JulieB67 said:
Yes, there is always going to be a war between the Spirit and the flesh but after repentance one should want to put the Spirit over the flesh. That's the difference between someone who has found true repentance (to think differently) and someone who hasn't. I've stated that many times before. Will we still fall short at times? Yes, in the flesh we always will continue to do so. I've stated that many times as well although certain people have claimed otherwise and state that I deny that fact which is a lie.
But that change of mind and heart has to be there. Thankfully God is the heart knower.

And Paul continues this subject in his letter-

Romans 8:1 "There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit."

And still goes further in chapter 8 on being carnally minded and spiritually minded.

We have to take the bible as a whole.

'The very simple fact will remain that God is against the devils in everyone.

It's never and only been just a rosy picture gobbed with, "Oh, God loves you soooooo much", Commonly known as a half truth or a lie

I believe that ALL who ever lived will be in God’s Kingdom

Well-Known Member

Rom 11:32-God bound everyone to disobedience so...

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Rom 11:32-God bound everyone to disobedience so...

Well-Known Member

Rom 11:32-God bound everyone to disobedience so...

Well-Known Member

New Member

Rom 11:32-God bound everyone to disobedience so...

Well-Known Member

Rom 11:32-God bound everyone to disobedience so...

Well-Known Member

Active Member

Well-Known Member

Crusader Rabbit

Rom 11:32-God bound everyone to disobedience so...

Similar threads