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DHS: More Than 250,000 Noncitizens Are Registered To Vote In Four States

Valletta

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Without the SAVE America Act, the mechanisms available that could be used to check for citizenship status aren’t reliable.
For the future of our country we need to pass the SAVE America Act.
 
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Richard T

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Should we believe the DHS on their figure?

"Pennsylvania Secretary of the Commonwealth Al Schmidt, a Republican, said in a statement that the state follows all laws and requires voters to take steps to verify their identity before casting a ballot, adding that “all evidence has shown that noncitizen voting is extremely rare across the country, including in Pennsylvania.”

“We welcome DHS sharing their methodology and list of potential ineligible voters so we can carefully review the validity of their claims,” Schmidt said." So what is that methodology.

The Federal Government has a poor track record on any kind of numbers, (especially budgeting) so lets verify the numbers before creating a roadblock to voting for some right before an election.

Quote source: ‘Zero new facts’: Teased as a bombshell, Trump election speech underwhelms election officials
 
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Valletta

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Should we believe the DHS on their figure?

"Pennsylvania Secretary of the Commonwealth Al Schmidt, a Republican, said in a statement that the state follows all laws and requires voters to take steps to verify their identity before casting a ballot, adding that “all evidence has shown that noncitizen voting is extremely rare across the country, including in Pennsylvania.”

“We welcome DHS sharing their methodology and list of potential ineligible voters so we can carefully review the validity of their claims,” Schmidt said." So what is that methodology.

The Federal Government has a poor track record on any kind of numbers, (especially budgeting) so lets verify the numbers before creating a roadblock to voting for some right before an election.

Quote source: ‘Zero new facts’: Teased as a bombshell, Trump election speech underwhelms election officials
Initial checks are pretty easy, hopefully Pennsylvania will respond by July 24th as asked. All they need to do is provide a contact where the federal government can send the Social Security numbers and other data.
 
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Yarddog

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Without the SAVE America Act, the mechanisms available that could be used to check for citizenship status aren’t reliable.
For the future of our country we need to pass the SAVE America Act.
No non-citizen is allowed to vote in Federal elections. There are safe guards in states that allow non-citizens to vote in local elections, to ensure they don't vote in Federal elections.
 
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Akita Suggagaki

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Without the SAVE America Act, the mechanisms available that could be used to check for citizenship status aren’t reliable.
For the future of our country we need to pass the SAVE America Act.
The Federalist?

 
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Valletta

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No non-citizen is allowed to vote in Federal elections. There are safe guards in states that allow non-citizens to vote in local elections, to ensure they don't vote in Federal elections.
You've just found out that approximately a quarter of a million illegals are potentially registered to vote in four states, states that have not implemented the basic safeguard of checking against the federal database.
 
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Valletta

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Akita Suggagaki

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Yarddog

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You've just found out that approximately a quarter of a million illegals are registered to vote in four states, states that have not implemented the basic safeguard of checking against the federal database.
No, I haven't. You've claimed it have not proven anything. Several states allow non-citizens to vote in local elections but not in Federal elections.
 
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Valletta

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No, I haven't. You've claimed it have not proven anything. Several states allow non-citizens to vote in local elections but not in Federal elections.
There are that many potentially, let's see how quickly the states check out it. Or do they care?
 
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Yarddog

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Without the SAVE America Act, the mechanisms available that could be used to check for citizenship status aren’t reliable.
For the future of our country we need to pass the SAVE America Act.
 
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FreeinChrist

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David Becker, executive director of the Center for Election Innovation & Research, said on Friday that he was told at a White House briefing this week that the “250,000 noncitizens” figure was based on a comparison with commercial data, which is less detailed than voter records and can lead to errors.​
“That 250,000 number is an irresponsible number to share given the opaque methodology that they claimed here,” Becker said, according to Democracy Docket, a voting rights nonprofit founded by Democratic Party lawyer Marc Elias.​
Among the known issues with using federal immigration data revealed in the past is that naturalized citizens, who previously lived in the US as noncitizens, can still be listed in older records as ineligible to vote.​

Is that number legitimate? Mullin presented it as a certainty, but voting experts urged caution.​
First, databases are subject to errors, mistaken identities and outdated citizenship information; historically, states have found that the actual number of noncitizens registered to vote drops significantly once a large-sounding number is vetted for accuracy.​
Second, the DHS data does not answer whether registered noncitizens ever cast a ballot — much less had a decisive impact on any election results. Trump and Mullin’s rhetoric gives the unsupported impression that they did.​
While Trump has spotlighted allegations of noncitizen voters for more than a decade, it is illegal for noncitizens to cast a ballot in federal races. Violations are "routinely investigated and prosecuted," but there is "no evidence that noncitizen voting has ever been significant enough to impact an election’s outcome," the Bipartisan Policy Center concluded in February.​

In the past, when government officials have announced initial numbers of noncitizens on voter rolls, those figures have dropped dramatically after months of vetting by state and local officials and the media.​
In 2012, then-Florida Gov. Rick Scott ordered state officials to clear the rolls of noncitizen voters ahead of the election.​
Florida initially assembled a list of about 180,000 potential noncitizens. With more scrutiny, however, officials whittled the count to about 2,600 names, then 198, then 85. The initial list was rife with errors, even flagging a Brooklyn-born World War II veteran.........​
Neither Mullin nor his department said how many of the 250,000 noncitizens voted and over what period.​
State reviews in recent years have found that few noncitizens actually cast ballots even if they’re registered.​
 
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FreeinChrist

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Data from the Nevada secretary of state’s office produced on Thursday showed that out of its 2.1 million active voters, only 138 voters did not provide a state driver’s license or Social Security number when registering to vote. That data would make finding any potential noncitizens swift and easy, and Nevada officials have found no widespread registration of noncitizens on its rolls. Those 138 voters may have registered with other acceptable forms of identification, including tribal IDs.​
The D.H.S. document also said that all four states “have been notified of this serious threat to national security.” Cisco Aguilar, the Democratic secretary of state in Nevada, said he had received no notifications from D.H.S. on the issue recently.....​
“Pennsylvania follows all state and federal laws when it comes to our elections, and our voter rolls are properly maintained and updated,” Mr. Schmidt said. He added: “All evidence has shown that noncitizen voting is extremely rare across the country, including in Pennsylvania. While the Department has made clear that we cannot share Pennsylvanians’ private, personal information, we welcome D.H.S. sharing their methodology and list of potential ineligible voters so we can carefully review the validity of their claims.”......​
In the past, Republican state officials eager to claim that noncitizen voters are prevalent in elections have repeatedly put out inflated numbers, only to later revise those numbers sharply downward.​
The SAVE system has also mistakenly flagged U.S. citizens as noncitizens in several states that use it to examine voter rolls.​
Trump sure seems desperate to get federal control over elections despite the Constitution.
 
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stevevw

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No non-citizen is allowed to vote in Federal elections. There are safe guards in states that allow non-citizens to vote in local elections, to ensure they don't vote in Federal elections.
Did you just admit that non citizens vote in elections ?
 
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stevevw

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Yes. Local elections in places that have passed laws allowing it.
OK. So is that more or less legalising illegal voting. It use to be that only citizens could vote. Someone could stack the votes by bringing in illegals. That does not seem like a very good system.
 
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Yarddog

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OK. So is that more or less legalising illegal voting.
No it isn't. There has to be a law making something illegal before it is illegal. Several states make it illegal but several states don't. That allows cities to pass ordinances allowing non-citizens to vote in local elections.
It use to be that only citizens could vote.
Incorrect.
Someone could stack the votes by bringing in illegals. That does not seem like a very good system.
I said non-citizens. I'm not sure about illegal immigrants. That aren't the same.
 
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stevevw

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No it isn't. There has to be a law making something illegal before it is illegal. Several states make it illegal but several states don't. That allows cities to pass ordinances allowing non-citizens to vote in local elections.
When you say non-citizens what does this mean ?. Is this people who came illegally without applying. Part of the millions that have come in over the last 10 or so years.

If that is the case then there is a law that makes this illegal. Section 275 of the Immigration and Nationality Act (INA), which is codified as 8 U.S.C. § 1325. This statute makes it a federal crime for a non-citizen to enter or attempt to enter the country at any time or place other than designated ports of entry. [1, 2]

My nation has similar laws. A person just can't walk into another nation without the proper process. But besides all that it seems strange that a person from another nation who is yet to be a citizen can vote as a citizen. Does that mean someone who has never lived in the US can vote the day after they arrive with the same rights as someone that has lived there all their life. Seems unfair.
Incorrect.

I said non-citizens. I'm not sure about illegal immigrants. That aren't the same.
As far as I understand you have to be a citizen. there are exceptions such as in local elections. But you still have to be a citizen even if deployed or living somewhere else.

Who can vote?
You can vote in U.S. federal, state, and local elections if you:
  • Are a U.S. citizen(some areas allow non-citizens to vote in local elections only), including:
    • U.S. citizens living outside of the United States. Learn more from the U.S. Department of State about voting as a U.S. citizen abroad.
    • U.S. citizens who were born abroad and have never lived in the United States. Your eligibility to vote is based on the state where your parents last lived or were registered to vote. Find out what states may permit you to vote absentee.
    • Dual citizens living in the United States or abroad
In all cases they have to have citizenship.

Who cannot vote?
  • Non-citizens, including permanent legal residents, cannot vote in federal, state, and most local elections.

The point of the OP is that non-citizens who are not eligible to vote are still floating around on some election rolls. This points to a slack system of checks and balances. It opens up the system to fraud.
 
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Yarddog

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When you say non-citizens what does this mean ?.
Someone has is not a citizen.
Is this people who came illegally without applying. Part of the millions that have come in over the last 10 or so years.
A non-citizen may have come in legally or illegally.
If that is the case then there is a law that makes this illegal. Section 275 of the Immigration and Nationality Act (INA), which is codified as 8 U.S.C. § 1325. This statute makes it a federal crime for a non-citizen to enter or attempt to enter the country at any time or place other than designated ports of entry. [1, 2]
Yes, but coming illegally is treated as a misdemeanor and if someone comes in illegally and turns themselves in to Immigration and asks for asylum, they are then protected by US law and must go before an Immigration Court to rule on their status. This process may take several years and these people are under the protection of our laws.
My nation has similar laws. A person just can't walk into another nation without the proper process. But besides all that it seems strange that a person from another nation who is yet to be a citizen can vote as a citizen. Does that mean someone who has never lived in the US can vote the day after they arrive with the same rights as someone that has lived there all their life. Seems unfair.
Which non-citizens are allowed to vote in local elections is set by those cities. Their laws are the business of residents of those cities and not the Federal government. The States can make it illegal but that is the business of that state.
As far as I understand you have to be a citizen. there are exceptions such as in local elections. But you still have to be a citizen even if deployed or living somewhere else.

Who can vote?
You can vote in U.S. federal, state, and local elections if you:
  • Are a U.S. citizen(some areas allow non-citizens to vote in local elections only), including:
    • U.S. citizens living outside of the United States. Learn more from the U.S. Department of State about voting as a U.S. citizen abroad.
    • U.S. citizens who were born abroad and have never lived in the United States. Your eligibility to vote is based on the state where your parents last lived or were registered to vote. Find out what states may permit you to vote absentee.
    • Dual citizens living in the United States or abroad
In all cases they have to have citizenship.

Who cannot vote?
  • Non-citizens, including permanent legal residents, cannot vote in federal, state, and most local elections.
As your post says, " most local elections".
The point of the OP is that non-citizens who are not eligible to vote are still floating around on some election rolls. This points to a slack system of checks and balances. It opens up the system to fraud.
Most of the numbers in the OP are not based on final analysis. They start with a number of suspected non-citizens on voter rolls and then investigate to ensure the person is not who they are suspected to be. Most suspects are found to actually be US citizens and the number drops dramatically.
 
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