Have there been subsequent studies that support this conclusion? I'm not aware of any, but I have not looked. I know my youtube feed had a bunch of debunking videos about 6 months ago.
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Hegseth requires testosterone deficiency screening for service members over 30
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I think giving the troops hormone injections sounds woke, but who knows? It might be nice sharing a foxhole or bunker with a bunch of testosterone fueled cleanshaven men. This ain't your grandpa's war department.
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Which part?, the stuff I mentioned in post #6 discussing the declining T levels? Those links cite the studies.
Or are you referring to the concept of whether the more "alpha" (for lack of of a better way of putting it -- bigger, stronger, more dominant) had better survival odds and better odds of reproducing and passing on their genes throughout human evolution?
A meta-analysis pulling together 46 studies across 33 nonindustrial societies and found a positive correlation between status and reproductive success, regardless of subsistence mode or how status was measured.
Why do good hunters have higher reproductive success? - Human Nature
Anecdotal evidence from many hunter-gatherer societies suggests that successful hunters experience higher prestige and greater reproductive success. Detailed quantitative data on these patterns are now available for five widely dispersed cases (Ache, Hadza, !Kung, Lamalera, and Meriam) and...
link.springer.com
This looked at five populations (the Ache, Hadza, Kung, Lamalera, and Meriam) and found consistent positive correlations between hunting ability and multiple measures of reproductive success. Effective hunters weren't just admired, they had measurably more surviving offspring.
But I don't think there's anything even questionable or controversial about that assertion. Throughout human evolution in hunter gatherer societies (prior to the modern convenience and modern medicine we have to day), common sense would dictate that the guy who's lean, strong, and can run fast and skilled at hunting is going to have better survival and mating odds than a guy who gets winded walking 100 steps or the guy who's so weak that he can only throw sharpened stick a few feet.
How does that old joke go about the two guys trying to outrun a bear:
Guy 1: "Do you really think we can outrun this bear?"
Guy 2: "I don't have to outrun the bear, I just have to outrun you"
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Hmmm...
If our grandpas' war department had men with 600–700 ng/dL, and current men of that age today have 400–450 ng/dL, then supplementing to get them back up to our grandpas' levels sounds like it is, in fact, an effort to make it "our grandpa's war department"
Or, I guess, people can go in the other direction and continue to make indirectly implied "people want men in the military to be strong and fit?, that sounds kinda gay... let's make a flimsy implied loose comparison to gender affirming hormone use to really drive the point home" type jokes that directly cut against their own purported "political correctness rules" when it comes to discussing such matters.
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Hans Blaster
Your turn, Atlanta!
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I didn't say "YouTube is wrong". I think you might misunderstand how YouTube works. YouTube is full of user submitted content and unverified advertisements. People get their mind cooked watching YouTube's algorithm fed stream of health and nutrition grifters interspersed with related ads for exploitative ads for suplements and quack cures. These morons often sell the notion that every man would "perform" better (whatever that nebulous notion means) if they had "higher T" (even if their isn't actually low. (Basically, anyone would be better informed if they never watched any ad or health-related videos on YT. It's that bad.)
Lower testosterone is primarily an issue for men who are aging out of being soldiers in the first place. Young men don't need more unless they have a real syndrome.
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Hans Blaster
Your turn, Atlanta!
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Oh what that "philosophy" has wrought. It created so many mush-brained "leaders".
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Too bad we aren't fighting our grandparents wars, or even my first few.
I remember watching not too long ago a big, burly, Russian soldier get blown to tiny bits and mist by a Ukrainian drone piloted by a petit teenage Ukrainian girl.
At least the comrade died big and buff.
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On one hand, I wanna stay woke. OTOH, I want to make jokes about how homoerotic that all sounds.
This must be the duality of man than Private Joker mentioned.
The Foxhole is obviously a gay bar. Bunker Buster could be their signature cocktail or the name of their Drag Queen MC.
This seems like a good time to recommend Generation Kill on HBO, because the openly gay guy in the platoon was also the one guy who was completely ripped.
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Pommer
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Thinking is harder than it appears.
We all do it…but some of us are talented at it, and some of us aren’t; dems da breaks.
Anybody who thinks that their own thoughts is pure gold and other people should oughta cotton to them (the fantastic concepts we all share, not the human being behind them), is somewhat delusional.
What keeps each one of us far away from doing violence to our fellow H. sapiens will be different and/or missing.
Being successful at this philanthropic-endeavor doesn’t necessarily transfer to other thought-pots, and yet, still, it’s fun to haggle over.
Douglas Adams was a staunch atheist, (though quieter about it than Hitchens or Dawkins), but his single most important contribution to philosophy was
DON’T PANIC!
Watching other people begin to disregard this sage wisdom is an odd and not thoroughly unenjoyable experience…I’ll bet.
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Yeah, I was asking about the alpha thing. I'm sure there is positive correlation between status and reproductive success, but that does not align with the idea of alpha and beta. At least not the easy I understand it.Which part?, the stuff I mentioned in post #6 discussing the declining T levels? Those links cite the studies.
Or are you referring to the concept of whether the more "alpha" (for lack of of a better way of putting it -- bigger, stronger, more dominant) had better survival odds and better odds of reproducing and passing on their genes throughout human evolution?
A meta-analysis pulling together 46 studies across 33 nonindustrial societies and found a positive correlation between status and reproductive success, regardless of subsistence mode or how status was measured.
Why do good hunters have higher reproductive success? - Human Nature
Anecdotal evidence from many hunter-gatherer societies suggests that successful hunters experience higher prestige and greater reproductive success. Detailed quantitative data on these patterns are now available for five widely dispersed cases (Ache, Hadza, !Kung, Lamalera, and Meriam) and...
This looked at five populations (the Ache, Hadza, Kung, Lamalera, and Meriam) and found consistent positive correlations between hunting ability and multiple measures of reproductive success. Effective hunters weren't just admired, they had measurably more surviving offspring.
But I don't think there's anything even questionable or controversial about that assertion. Throughout human evolution in hunter gatherer societies (prior to the modern convenience and modern medicine we have to day), common sense would dictate that the guy who's lean, strong, and can run fast and skilled at hunting is going to have better survival and mating odds than a guy who gets winded walking 100 steps or the guy who's so weak that he can only throw sharpened stick a few feet.
How does that old joke go about the two guys trying to outrun a bear:
Guy 1: "Do you really think we can outrun this bear?"
Guy 2: "I don't have to outrun the bear, I just have to outrun you"
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That's where I mentioned that the dynamic exists, but just not to the strict binary that's observed in parts of the animal kingdom.
I'm assuming when you were referring to the pop psyche aspect, you were referring to the people who did the wolf studies in the 1970s, and tried to apply that to humans. (correct me if it was something else you were referring to?).
In the case of humans, it's some of the same concepts, just more on a hierarchy spectrum rather than the rigid order that a wolf pack would follow.
And over time we've also created multiple avenues of achieving "status" that aren't as purely anchored to physical capabilities as they once were.
But it's all still power dynamics in a sense (meaning, striving for "I'm above these other guys, in whatever it is I happen to do")
Back in the times of early man, "prestige" was probably linked to almost all purely physical stuff...whereas now, a person can attain that through things like being a really good lawyer who makes millions and drives a sports car. (even if their physical capabilities are lacking)
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Tropical Wilds
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Certainly you're not suggesting that
"I'm a male that's in my 30s-40s, and my testosterone levels are clinically low, so I need to see a doctor about getting supplemented so I can get my energy & sex drive back and improve my recovery time"
...should be considered as being part of the same conversation (or even remotely in the same realm) as...
"I'm a person who thinks that I was born in the wrong body and want to present as the opposite gender, so I want to take cross-sex hormones"
As far as being pro/anti stem cell... there's not really a conflict there. While there are objections to fetal stem cell research (due to perceived links with abortion), in actual clinical use, the most common are adult (somatic) stem cells. These come from bone marrow and peripheral blood.
And in terms of the research aspect. Much of it uses iPSCs created by reprogramming adult cells (often skin cells) back into a stem-cell-like state. This technique won a nobel, in no small part, due to the fact that it sidestepped the need for embryonic or fetal sources, thereby opening up treatment/research options for people who otherwise had ideological objections to it. A large share of current research uses iPSCs.
Summarized: Most stem cell research today, and virtually all current stem cell treatment uses adult stem cells or iPSCs, neither of which involves fetal tissue.
So there's no conflict in a person being part of a "pro-life" administration, and being an advocate of stem cell treatments.
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Laodicean60
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True that! A few years ago i thought I had testosterone issues, but all my tests were in range, so I reasoned I was just plain lazy.
The kids today weren't alphas @Belk lol, like boomers were in the 90s.
I copied this from AI
Researchers think several factors may contribute, including:
- Increasing rates of obesity (one of the strongest known contributors).
- Lower levels of physical activity.
- Poorer sleep.
- Higher rates of chronic illnesses such as type 2 diabetes.
- Some evidence suggests exposure to certain endocrine-disrupting chemicals may play a role, but this is still an active area of research and hasn't been established as the primary cause. <---- Agree
- Changes in smoking patterns, diet, medications, and other lifestyle factors may also contribute.
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The wolf studies aren't bunk just because people use them to try to apply wolf behavior to human psychology. They're also bunk because the wolves that were being studied weren't actual packs - they were wolves in zoos and wildlife sanctuaries tossed together and forced to coexist. Not only are the behaviors documented in the study not really applicable to humans because humans are humans and wolves are wolves, but they're also not representative of natural wolf behavior either.
Is the Alpha Wolf Idea a Myth?
The idea that wolf packs are led by a merciless dictator, or alpha wolf, comes from old studies of captive wolves. In the wild, wolf packs are simply families
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I think they diet angle is probably the most promising.
Obviously they've found links with obesity and T levels, but even that one is sort of a "chicken or the egg" situation where "are their T levels low because they're obese? or did they become obese because T levels were low". (unless the person has been tracking their T levels regularly for an extended period over time)
Either way, diet would address both if that was the case.
I'm curious as to the one on smoking patterns, because smoking rates have actually dropped significantly. In the "days of our parents and grandparents" (when the T levels were higher), seemed like everyone was ripping cigs.
Perhaps they actually meant nicotine use? Because while not nearly as many people are puffing on the cancer sticks these days, the nicotine replacement products have been shooting up in terms of usage (there s lot of young people vaping, and now it seems like 1 out of every 4 guys I know are into those Zyn pouches or something similar, and seems like they have one in their upper lip 24/7)
It mentioned medications, and that's one area I'm actually pretty curious about. When would people "guestimate" the huge uptick in statin drugs took place? Cholesterol is the precursor for most steroid hormones in the body, and some of those cholesterol meds drop cholesterol levels by massive amounts.
I remember when they put my uncle on those. His original cholesterol was pretty high (the recommend a total score is <200, he was around 350), when on the statins, it dropped it down to around a total score of 90 which is a crazy reduction. It seems like when they put people on those, they're not just targeting getting people back into the normal reference range, but rather, way way below it.
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