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A Point in Hail Mary

RDKirk

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I just watched the movie Hail Mary. It's a pretty good feel-good movie. Frankly, I anticipated a good deal of tediousness that never came. It rolled along pretty well.

But having been a military intelligence analyst, there was a point I noted that I've not seen mentioned or discussed anywhere.

This is not a spoiler. You should know from the trailers that the human Grace meets an extra-terrestrial he names Rocky while both of them are on a mission to save their respective home worlds from the same threat.

But Rocky's first meaningful communication with this new, strange being is essentially:

"Here is my star. This is where I come from."

From a human strategic perspective, that is staggering information to volunteer.

Grace doesn't have to ask. He doesn't have to bargain for it. There is no reciprocal exchange of strategic information. Rocky doesn't first establish Grace's intentions, military capability, political organization, or even whether Grace represents his species legitimately. Rocky has just revealed the location of his entire civilization to an unknown technological species. He has provided Grace with the one piece of targeting information that can never be withdrawn.

And the important thing is that Rocky is not stupid. He is an exceptionally capable engineer. His species built an interstellar spacecraft and sent a scientific expedition to Tau Ceti; the story establishes that Erid is the Eridian homeworld around 40 Eridani A. So this isn't intellectual naïveté.

It suggests something much deeper about Eridian social psychology.

I suspect the implication is that deception, strategic concealment, and adversarial information management are simply not central to Eridian cognition in the way they are to ours. Rocky sees another person standing in front of him. That person clearly came from somewhere. Rocky came from somewhere. The obvious first step in communication is therefore:

“Hello. This is where my family lives.”

A human would think: What can this creature do with that information?

Rocky thinks: This is information necessary for us to understand one another.

And it fits Rocky's subsequent behavior beautifully. He doesn't merely trust Grace. He seems largely innocent of the elaborate process by which humans decide whether someone is trustworthy. Grace becomes his friend because Grace behaves as his friend. Rocky doesn't appear to maintain a second analytical track asking, But what is Grace's real motive?

His first substantive act is to give away the location of everyone he loves.

From Rocky's perspective, the disclosure may not even be trust. Trust requires recognition of a possible betrayal. It may be pure guilelessness. Rocky may simply lack the human strategic reflex that says, Before communicating, determine which information must be withheld. That act of pure guilelessness may tell us more about Rocky than almost anything he subsequently says.

And I would go one step further: Grace never recognizes the enormity of that gesture because Grace is himself unusually guileless by human standards.
 
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Bradskii

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I just watched the movie Hail Mary. It's a pretty good feel-good movie. Frankly, I anticipated a good deal of tediousness that never came. It rolled along pretty well.

But having been a military intelligence analyst, there was a point I noted that I've not seen mentioned or discussed anywhere.

This is not a spoiler. You should know from the trailers that the human Grace meets an extra-terrestrial he names Rocky while both of them are on a mission to save their respective home worlds from the same threat.

But Rocky's first meaningful communication with this new, strange being is essentially:

"Here is my star. This is where I come from."

From a human strategic perspective, that is staggering information to volunteer.
I read The Martian (also by Andy Weir) before I saw the film. And I read Hail Mary a few months back - yet to see the film.

In the book, Grace and Rocky have had some stilted conversations via a computer app before they start to get familiar enough with each other's language to hold a basic conversation. It's then that Grace tells Rocky why he's there and Rocky confirms that he's on the same type of mission. It's a little later when Rocky must have given the location of his home planet (the dialogue isn't reported) because a couple of chapters later Grace lists some of the info he has garnered and it includes where Eridian is.

I'm not sure if the film made a point of Rocky guilelessly giving the info right upfront as an indication that he didn't consider Grace or earth a threat. When the capabilities of each civilisation is mentioned, discussing their craft for example, I was under the impression that the Eridians were a lot more advanced than we were.

Hugely enjoyed both books and I've enjoyed listening to Weir discussing them. He's very keen on getting the science exactly right (cue the Matt Damon character: 'I'm going to science the s.... out of this'). To the point where he was frustrated at the start of The Martian when Ridley Scott decided to have a major storm threaten to blow over their rocket. Which, as Weir frustratingly kept pointing out, couldn't happen because of the thin atmosphere (about 2% of Earth's). A major storm would be like a gentle breath of air. But Scott wanted something dramatic right up front, so Weir had to concede that one.

Looking forward to watching the film. Having Ryan Gosling as Rocky's opposite number was absolutely perfect casting.
 
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RDKirk

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I'm not sure if the film made a point of Rocky guilelessly giving the info right upfront as an indication that he didn't consider Grace or earth a threat. When the capabilities of each civilisation is mentioned, discussing their craft for example, I was under the impression that the Eridians were a lot more advanced than we were.
The film does not make a specific point of it. It's just that Rocky initiates the first communication between them with the location of his home world before Rocky knows anything at all about who might be in that strange little vessel without a thought that the information could be used against them.

My impression (and I haven't read the book) is that the Eridians are more advanced in some ways, less advanced in others because of their physiology. They cannot naturally sense radiation (such as light) so the very concept of radiation is unknown to them. Yet, they are still susceptible to ionizing radiation. That's just a whole area of physics they have almost zero knowledge about. I think the book must go more into how, not being able to sense radiation such as light, they even know that other stars even exist.
 

Bradskii

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The film does not make a specific point of it. It's just that Rocky initiates the first communication between them with the location of his home world before Rocky knows anything at all about who might be in that strange little vessel without a thought that the information could be used against them.

My impression (and I haven't read the book) is that the Eridians are more advanced in some ways, less advanced in others because of their physiology. They cannot naturally sense radiation (such as light) so the very concept of radiation is unknown to them. Yet, they are still susceptible to ionizing radiation. That's just a whole area of physics they have almost zero knowledge about. I think the book must go more into how, not being able to sense radiation such as light, they even know that other stars even exist.
The book is quite science heavy. And I much prefer hard sci fi. Drives me nuts when bookstores put the sci fi in the same section as the fantasy. So you get Hail Mary on the same shelf as 'Book 13 of the Dragon Lair of Elfland'. Aaaarg!
 
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Bob Crowley

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I've got no idea what the movie "Hail Mary" is about. The only "Hail Mary" I'm familiar with is our Catholic prayer!

That said, I used to be a bit of a SF fan way back in the days of Isaac Asimov, Robert Heinlein and Philip K. Dick, but I haven't read any for years.

If as RD Kirk claims, "... Rocky is not stupid. He is an exceptionally capable engineer. His species built an interstellar spacecraft and sent a scientific expedition to Tau Ceti; the story establishes that Erid is the Eridian homeworld around 40 Eridani A. So this isn't intellectual naïveté...", then Rocky would have no illusions about the human race, but would have decided to take the risk anyway.

CS Lewis made a point years ago about the possibility of alien races in his essay "Religion and Rocketry"

"We know what our race does to strangers. Man destroys or enslaves every species he can. Civilised man murders, enslaves, cheats and corrupts savage man. Even inanimate nature he turns into dust bowls and slag heaps. There are individuals who don't. But they are not the sort who are likely to be our pioneers in space. Our ambassadors to new worlds will be the needy and greedy adventurer or the ruthless technical expert. They will do as their kind has always done. What that will be if they meet things weaker than themselves, the black man and the red man can tell. If they meet things stronger, they will be, very properly, destroyed.

It is interesting to wonder how things would go if they met an unfallen race. At first, to be sure, they'd have a grand time jeering at, duping, and exploiting its innocence: but I doubt if our half animal cunning would long be a match for godlike wisdom, selfless valour and perfect unanimity".

It would appear Rocky falls into the category of both being stonger and possibly unfallen. He wouldn't regard us as a threat, since he would know full well what his own race would do if it became necessary.

But I say that without having seen the movie.
 
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