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Opinion - My family lived through socialism. Most Democrats are frighteningly wrong about it.

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ViaCrucis

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So you think sticking the word “democratic” in front of it changes anything?

Sticking the word "National" in front of it certainly changes a lot.

That's because, and I know this is crazy to say, words mean things in context.

Or does the People's Democratic Republic of Korea not change the meaning of "democratic" and "republic"?
 
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ViaCrucis

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I've never been so bold as to call myself a Socialist.

But I am quite happy to admit that I am an anti-Capitalist. Capitalism is, at least in the practice of the United States, quite evil.

Want me to go further? Capitalism = Social Darwinism.
 
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A2SG

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Why do you doubt the experiences of those people who previously lived under socialist and communist regimes who came here to escape them and now see the same thing happening here?
Yeah, we can see the same kind of authoritarian regime forming here in the US under Trump.

If you think it’s just one person making a mountain out of a molehill, you need to think twice. There are MANY people who have written and said the same thing as this author about what is happening here under the leftist administrations who have embraced and started putting socialist programs in place.
Can you name even one "leftist" administration, or a single socialist program, that has shown any movement toward an authoritarian regime? And please, be specific.

-- A2SG, 'cuz these kinds of arguments ALWAYS leave out the specifics......
 
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Hans Blaster

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Why do you doubt the experiences of those people who previously lived under socialist and communist regimes who came here to escape them and now see the same thing happening here? If you think it’s just one person making a mountain out of a molehill, you need to think twice. There are MANY people who have written and said the same thing as this author about what is happening here under the leftist administrations who have embraced and started putting socialist programs in place.
They are irrelevant. No one is proposing that here.
 
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Bradskii

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Why do you doubt the experiences of those people who previously lived under socialist and communist regimes who came here to escape them and now see the same thing happening here?
Please stop. There's only so much irony a man can take in one day. Have pity.
 
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Matt5

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Once you go equal, you can never come back.

Too bad stories like this will convince no one.

Ayn Rand argues that the difference between communism and socialism is the difference between homicide and suicide. One is forced on you and the other is voluntary.

Denmark is the current go-to country for socialists. Is it really a socialist country?


Grok AI:
No, Denmark does not claim to be a socialist country. On the contrary, Danish officials have repeatedly and explicitly rejected the label.

In 2015, then-Prime Minister Lars Løkke Rasmussen stated in a speech at Harvard’s Kennedy School of Government:

“I know that some people in the US associate the Nordic model with some sort of socialism. Therefore, I would like to make one thing clear. Denmark is far from a socialist planned economy. Denmark is a market economy.
He described the Nordic model as “an expanded welfare state which provides a high level of security to its citizens, but it is also a successful market economy with much freedom to pursue your dreams and live your life as you wish.”

This position aligns with Denmark’s self-description and economic reality:

  • Denmark operates a capitalist market economy with private ownership of businesses, strong property rights, free trade, and high economic freedom (often ranking in the global top 10–20 on indices like the Heritage Foundation’s Index of Economic Freedom, comparable to or ahead of the US in many areas).
  • It funds a generous welfare state (universal healthcare, education, paid leave, etc.) through high taxes, not central planning or state ownership of production—the core of socialism.
  • Danish think tanks like CEPOS and government-aligned reports have pushed back against American politicians (e.g., Bernie Sanders) portraying Denmark as socialist, emphasizing it as a free-market system with welfare elements.

Political Context​

Denmark’s dominant center-left party, the Social Democrats (currently led by Prime Minister Mette Frederiksen), is a social democratic party, not a socialist one. Social democracy supports regulated capitalism and welfare, while democratic socialist or explicitly socialist parties (like the Green Left/Socialist People’s Party or Red-Green Alliance) are smaller coalition partners or opposition groups.

Denmark did experiment with significantly expanded government in the 1970s–1990s, but faced economic problems (high unemployment, inflation) and reversed course with reforms emphasizing fiscal restraint and market policies.

In short, Denmark proudly presents itself as a successful welfare-state capitalist country, not a socialist one. Official statements from its leaders make this clear.
 
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comana

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So you think sticking the word “democratic” in front of it changes anything?
Yes. But more importantly the lack of a desire to implement an authoritarian regime. Though we only have to look at our own Conservative Party to see the beginnings of that.
 
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Hentenza

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So how about the capitalist lies we have been sold?
Have the capitalist lies destroyed a society, separated families, jailed “dissidents”, brain washed the population, and destroyed civil rights among many other atrocities?
because a lot of people are discovering, or perhaps rediscovering that wild west capitalism isn't a good system.
And yet they come in droves from all over the world.
It is how we ended up with people like Lenin, Stalin and Hitler.
You hit Godwin early. Lol Lenin n particular sold an impossible ideology to the people and the logical failure was spectacular. Capitalism had nothing to do with these dictators.
They were a direct response the failings of capitalism and monarchism.
Monarchism yes, capitalism no.
Ever wonder why so many socialists in the USSR were so gung ho? Because Stalin was still an upgrade to the monarchs, as awful as he was.
Ask the millions that they killed or sent to gulags to maintain power. Mmmm….
We took a different (and frankly better) path with Social democracy, but the GOP seems determined to fully dumpster this system. Some of them are ignorant of how this will bring about the socialist boogeyman they keep harping about, others want it, because they are counting on it bringing about fascism instead.
I’m not GOP but I am an immigrant from Cuba. I know the damage that socialism brings including the erosion of civil rights. The system sounds beautiful on paper but the reality is much, much different. Look, I’m not saying that capitalism is perfect in any way but anyone that wants to get ahead financially or socially is able to. This is the reason why so many immigrants want to come to the US. Just about every interview of immigrants that I have seen or read asking them why they wanted to come to the US says to have a better life. You should learn from them.
 

Hentenza

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I've never been so bold as to call myself a Socialist.

But I am quite happy to admit that I am an anti-Capitalist. Capitalism is, at least in the practice of the United States, quite evil.

Want me to go further? Capitalism = Social Darwinism.
Nonsense. Take the silver spoon out of your mouth and go live in a socialist country like Cuba or Venezuela.
 

Tropical Wilds

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Indeed, many don't see or understand the tyranny of socialism.
This just in, person with opinion conflates dictatorship and tyranny with socialism, to the delight of other people who don't know what socialism is.
 
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Maria Billingsley

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Indeed, many don't see or understand the tyranny of socialism.
Critics of Democratic socialism and proponents of Democratic socialism are using the exact same word ( socialism) to describe two entirely different concepts. When progressives use the term, they are referring to a social democracy model, similar to the systems found in Nordic countries like Sweden, Denmark, or Norway not an Authoritarian Dictatorship under a Stalin type leader!
The basic principles of Democratic Socialism remains strictly capitalist with a free market, but it is accompanied by a robust social safety net, heavy regulation, and government-funded programs like universal healthcare and tuition-free higher education. This article is sorely misguided.


Thanks for sharing.
 
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iluvatar5150

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Have the capitalist lies destroyed a society, separated families, jailed “dissidents”, brain washed the population, and destroyed civil rights among many other atrocities?

When left unchecked, yes. One need merely look at the actions of the robber barons and southern plantation owners before them to see what happens when powerful capitalists are left to their own devices.

Regarding brainwashing, we don't even have to go back that far - we can observe what the American right-wing media ecosystem has been doing for the last 40 years and what algorithmic media has been doing for the last 10+.


You hit Godwin early. Lol Lenin n particular sold an impossible ideology to the people and the logical failure was spectacular. Capitalism had nothing to do with these dictators.

The piece in the OP is about Russian secret police kidnapping families in the middle of the night. We were almost there to begin with.

I’m not GOP but I am an immigrant from Cuba. I know the damage that socialism brings including the erosion of civil rights.

You're making the same error as the author of the OP. "Socialism" is not synonymous with oppression.
 
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Bradskii

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Have the capitalist lies destroyed a society, separated families, jailed “dissidents”, brain washed the population, and destroyed civil rights among many other atrocities?
Did you say 'separated families'? And 'jailed dissidents'? I can't believe that you mentioned 'brain washed the population' either. And no...surely not. Not 'destroyed civil rights' as well.

Is Irony Week always the first week in June? Why wasn't I told?
 
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Bradskii

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Nonsense. Take the silver spoon out of your mouth and go live in a socialist country like Cuba or Venezuela.
Why aren't you describing them as Democratic Socialist countries? Is it that maybe there's a difference? Well, let me think. I've been to Cuba, which is definitely socialist and have just got back from Denmark, Sweden and Finland which are the standard bearers for democratic socialism. And...yes, the first one was quite different from the other three. Apart from the music and the give-away price of Mojitos I would definitely choose the Scandinavian countries over Cuba.

So yeah, they're not the same. Phew, I'm glad we sorted that out.
 
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Vylo

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Have the capitalist lies destroyed a society, separated families, jailed “dissidents”, brain washed the population, and destroyed civil rights among many other atrocities?

Yes, we literally live on the corpses of several of the societies it killed.

And yet they come in droves from all over the world.
1. part of the reason they come is from above. We destroy their countries and so they leave.

2. people are starting to not come as much. our net migration is now negative for the first time in over half a century.

You hit Godwin early. Lol Lenin n particular sold an impossible ideology to the people and the logical failure was spectacular. Capitalism had nothing to do with these dictators.

Godwin is just an observation of lengthy internet discourse, it does not win nor lose an argument in anyway.

Capitalism played a MASSIVE part in them. Have you heard of the great depression? Socialism and fascism were responses to the failure of those systems. If it was just monarchism, why were there hundreds of thousands of registered fascists in America? why did 40,000 of them rally in NYC?

Ask the millions that they killed or sent to gulags to maintain power. Mmmm….

That's sadly a step up from being trampled to death for a pretzel under the Tsar.

I’m not GOP but I am an immigrant from Cuba. I know the damage that socialism brings including the erosion of civil rights. The system sounds beautiful on paper but the reality is much, much different. Look, I’m not saying that capitalism is perfect in any way but anyone that wants to get ahead financially or socially is able to. This is the reason why so many immigrants want to come to the US. Just about every interview of immigrants that I have seen or read asking them why they wanted to come to the US says to have a better life. You should learn from them.

No, not everyone can get ahead. If hard, honest work was all it took, every day laborer would be rich and Trump would be living in a gutter.
Many of those immigrants want a better life because of what we did to them, the damage we did, the resources we exploited from them.

It isn't so much that capitalism is bad, its that it is like radioactive material. You control it and it can produce wonders. You let it runaway and it burns things to the ground and salts the earth beneath it.
 
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Hentenza

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Why aren't you describing them as Democratic Socialist countries? Is it that maybe there's a difference? Well, let me think. I've been to Cuba, which is definitely socialist and have just got back from Denmark, Sweden and Finland which are the standard bearers for democratic socialism. And...yes, the first one was quite different from the other three. Apart from the music and the give-away price of Mojitos I would definitely choose the Scandinavian countries over Cuba.

So yeah, they're not the same. Phew, I'm glad we sorted that out.
The Nordic countries are not democratic socialist countries but social democracies under the Nordic system. They have a free market capitalist economy with a robust welfare system. I am actually not opposed to that provided that the free market capitalist economy continues rather than an anti business attitude like it is happening in parts of California.
 

Bradskii

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The Nordic countries are not democratic socialist countries...
From here: https://people.howstuffworks.com/democratic-socialist-countries.htm

'While there is no perfect mold, many capitalist countries integrate democratic socialism into their government policies. Political scientists distinguish these nations from traditional socialist states by their support for social programs within a democratic framework, rather than authoritarian governance. The goal is to create a society based on fairness, social cohesion, and collective power.'

Top democratic socialist countries?

Norway
Sweden
Denmark
Finland

I appreciate that there are different views on this as to what constitutes democratic socialism (versus those that are social democracies). I'm going with the reasonable definition in the link I gave. That 'nations blend capitalist economies with socialist goals, guided by democratic means. Their political systems prioritize public services, social welfare, and equal access without sacrificing individual freedom or private ownership'.

But I think that we can agree that neither applies to countries like Cuba and definitely does not apply to post war Russia. Comparing Cuba with the Scandinavian countries is nonsensical. And comparing the latter to the US (as per the op) is not just incorrect. It's so idiotic that it's not even wrong.
 
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A New Dawn

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Sticking the word "National" in front of it certainly changes a lot.

That's because, and I know this is crazy to say, words mean things in context.

Or does the People's Democratic Republic of Korea not change the meaning of "democratic" and "republic"?
I know this is crazy to say, but the socialists/communists who put the regimes in place in places like Venezuela and Russia said the EXACT SAME THINGS that are being said now. Just because someone might say something with good intentions in their heart doesn’t mean that that is what ends up happening. I fail to see why you, and all those like you, ignore that. This is just history repeating itself.

So as much as you like to prop up the thought that “words have meanings”, history shows just the opposite.
 

iluvatar5150

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I know this is crazy to say, but the socialists/communists who put the regimes in place in places like Venezuela and Russia said the EXACT SAME THINGS that are being said now.

They did? When?
 
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A New Dawn

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Yes. But more importantly the lack of a desire to implement an authoritarian regime. Though we only have to look at our own Conservative Party to see the beginnings of that.
LOL. You just can’t see that what’s happening now is the necessary response to the Biden’s lawless, irresponsible, reckless, and, frankly, hateful behavior (hateful for anyone and anything that tried to bring order and normality back to the country (and more importantly, the citizens of this country who pay the taxes. Ended to keep the country running.) He was a weak pathetic loser/puppet that couldn’t stand up to the minority of his own party who did nothing but hate on America. My opinion is, if you hate something so much, just leave and don’t let the door hit you on the way out.
 
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