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1 Cor 16:2 can't be made to say "the main worship day for the NT church was always the first day of the week"

Studyman

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You made two excellent points.

1. Paul was a professed servant of the LORD Rom1:1

A servant of the LORD serves the LORD the way the LORD asks, not how we want, which defeats the purpose of serving.

This is how the LORD invited everyone to serve Him



2. Paul was a servant of doing God's righteousness



Doing God's righteousness never changes its the foundation of God's Throne



Why keeping the Sabbath continues thus saith the LORD for all eternity



But notice the opposite of what the LORD spoke about those who do not keep the Sabbath- He claims its doing evil. Isa56:1-2 Neh13:17 the opposite of doing what He claims as doing righteousness.

Does doing evil ever turn into doing righteousness and doing what God deems as doing righteousness turn into evil?

Not according to God it stays that way and our decisions sealed if we do not head His voice today Heb3:7-19 Eze20:13 Eze20:15-16 and change our direction



God just wants to spend time with us on the day He blessed and set aside holy time (sanctified) made for us Mar2:27


Happy Sabbath all!:heartpulse:

Remember though, the Jews claimed the Sabbath of God as their Sabbath too. But the Jews had created their own Sabbath Traditions. They had created a huge religious business, basically selling salvation by selling goats and turtle doves for atonement. Their religious business, keeping the sacrifices fed, watered and clean required servants to work 24/7 taking care of their investments. They had money changers and all matter of folks who were required to do servile work on the Sabbath Days to take care of their investments. As it is written: "For they bind heavy burdens and grievous to be borne, and lay them on men's shoulders; but they themselves will not move them with one of their fingers. "

Just be careful of religions who use parts of God's Law to justify or create a religious business. There are massive religious businesses that exist in the world God placed us in, who call Jesus Lord, Lord. They invest in healthcare, education, finance. Some even trade on the Stock Market, "In Christ's Name".

It is a powerful and prominent tradition to pick a religion to support and promote. But Jesus tells His People to "Come out of these religions" of this world God placed us in.

Just be careful SB.
 
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Studyman

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It seems that the early Christian move away from the sabbath is part of what Paul is covering in Colossians 2 ( Colossians 2:16-23 in focus) & probably Romans 14:5-6.

It seems, according to what Paul actually wrote, that HE was promoting God's Commandments, Statutes and Judgments in Col. 2. Wasn't he speaking to those who had been circumcised of the heart?

I also believe Ezekiel 43:27 was probably understood by many as a prophecy of fulfillment of what is written in Ezekiel 43:1-27.

26 Seven days shall they purge the altar and purify it; and they shall consecrate themselves. (This would be the life of a believer being cleansed by the High Priest, Yes?)

27 And when these days are expired, it shall be, that upon the eighth day, and so forward, the priests shall make your burnt offerings upon the altar, and your peace offerings; and I will accept you, saith the Lord GOD.

This would be the "Last Great Day", the 8th Day of the Feast of Tabernacles. A Shadow of a Great Day "yet to come".
 
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SabbathBlessings

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Remember though, the Jews claimed the Sabbath of God as their Sabbath too. But the Jews had created their own Sabbath Traditions. They had created a huge religious business, basically selling salvation by selling goats and turtle doves for atonement. Their religious business, keeping the sacrifices fed, watered and clean required servants to work 24/7 taking care of their investments. They had money changers and all matter of folks who were required to do servile work on the Sabbath Days to take care of their investments. As it is written: "For they bind heavy burdens and grievous to be borne, and lay them on men's shoulders; but they themselves will not move them with one of their fingers. "

Just be careful of religions who use parts of God's Law to justify or create a religious business. There are massive religious businesses that exist in the world God placed us in, who call Jesus Lord, Lord. They invest in healthcare, education, finance. Some even trade on the Stock Market, "In Christ's Name".

It is a powerful and prominent tradition to pick a religion to support and promote. But Jesus tells His People to "Come out of these religions" of this world God placed us in.

Just be careful SB.
Of course, I never claimed the Jews kept God’s Sabbath I have always stated otherwise, so not sure where you’re getting that from what I posted. They were very much like what we see today, man has turned God’s Sabbath into their own sunday sabbath, not written in our Bibles and will sadly just like the Jews, make laws around their sabbath and persecute God’s people for wanting to keep God’s Sabbath. I am sorry you think all churches are corrupt, the Bible does not teach this, but has a faithful remnant church who keep God’s commandments until the very end. Rev12:17 Rev14:12 and the Sabbath is a holy convocation according the LORD Lev23:3 which we see in the NT Acts 13:42 Acts 13:44 Acts 15:21 Acts 18:4 and forevermore Isa66:23 Thanksfully we have a righteousness Judge that knows every secret Ecc 12:13-14 so we do not need to Judge strangers we do not know.

My aplogies for budding it, I will not do that again.

Be well.
 
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SabbathBlessings

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This seems evident in the 15th chapter of the early post apostolic letter( about 100 AD) of Barnabas ( not Paul’s fellow preacher). There is no indication that this Barnabas was being an impostor; the letter is highly scriptural, faithful & somewhat eccentric.

More the fulfillment of this prophecy Dan7:25

Isa 8:20 To the law and to the testimony! If they do not speak according to this word, it is because there[a] is no light in them.
 
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Lukaris

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More the fulfillment of this prophecy Dan7:25
This is a misapplication of Daniel in relation to the Sabbath worship. Many of the early Christians were under severe persecution and this letter seems to be directed to such communities. The 4th chapter of the Barnabas letter reflects this & quotes from Daniel 7 to believers who believed the second coming was near. There is no pride or deception in this letter.
 
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Lukaris

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More the fulfillment of this prophecy Dan7:25

Isa 8:20 To the law and to the testimony! If they do not speak according to this word, it is because there[a] is no light in them.
This absolutist sabbath argument fails though because there is indication that early Christian communities understood what Paul was saying in Colossians ( & most likely Romans) about the 8th day resurrection ( Sunday) worship taken already mentioned that 1 Corinthians 16:1-4 is in line with the previous chapter ( 15) which is the most concentrated scripture on the resurrection. The origin of this understanding goes back to Isaiah 1:1-20
( verse 13 in particular). You quote Isaiah, Paul did in Colossians, & an early Christian community reflected that.

As I have said, the Sabbath day is defensible but not absolute. It is not a one size fits all free pass.
 
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HIM

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This absolutist sabbath argument fails though because there is indication that early Christian communities understood what Paul was saying in Colossians
By writings preserved and not destroyed by whom?

The Catholic church?

Zealous Catholics?
 
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Jan001

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I think you're conflating two different things.

God made a preparation day for the Sabbath, no doubt but that's not the purpose of the Sabbath,

This is God speaking and writing

Exo 20:8 “Remember the Sabbath day, to keep it holy. 9 Six days you shall labor and do all your work, 10 but the seventh day is the Sabbath of the Lord your God. In it you shall do no work: you, nor your son, nor your daughter, nor your male servant, nor your female servant, nor your cattle, nor your stranger who is within your gates. 11 For in six days the Lord made the heavens and the earth, the sea, and all that is in them, and rested the seventh day. Therefore the Lord blessed the Sabbath day and hallowed it.

Nothing about food and drink offerings in the 4th commandment, what Paul is quoting a different law. The purpose of the Sabbath is to keep the Sabbath day holy, so food prep should be done on the preparation day as well as everything else that needs to get done so we can keep the day holy focusing on our Creator, Redeemer, and Sanctifier.

God speaking directly again

Isa 58:13 “If you turn away your foot from the Sabbath,
From doing your pleasure on My holy day,
And call the Sabbath a delight,
The holy day of the Lord honorable,
And shall honor Him, not doing your own ways,
Nor finding your own pleasure,
Nor speaking your own words,


That's how important the Sabbath is to God, He made a day to prepare for it.

Paul is not countermanding what Jesus told mankind to live by- every word that proceeds out of the mouth of God. What you mostly quoted did not come from the word of God.

Paul is quoting something very specific that sadly no one ever looks at what he is quoting and applies it to something he is not quoting or ever practiced himself and countermands what Jesus said who is God.



Col 2:14 KJV Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to His cross.

Col 2:14 NASB having canceled the certificate of debt consisting of decrees against us, which was hostile to us; and He has taken it out of the way, having nailed it to the cross.

Greek word for handwriting: χειρόγραφον (cheirographon)
Literally: “something written by hand

Ordinances
τοῖς δόγμασιν (tois dogmasin)
Meaning: “decrees,” “regulations,” “legal demands”

It is a legal document that condemns sinners why Paul used the word “against us” and “contrary to us”. The law does not condemn the righteous, it condemns the sinners.

Just from this context that Paul gave we can eliminate the Ten Commandments, but lets let Scripture interpret Scripture.

Who wrote the handwritten ordinances?

2 Chron 33:8 and I will not again remove the foot of Israel from the land which I have appointed for your fathers—only if they are careful to do all that I have commanded them, according to the whole law and the statutes and the ordinances by the hand of Moses.

What law is the law that was contrary and against?

Deut 31:24-26 So it was, when Moses had completed writing the words of this law in a book, when they were finished, 25 that Moses commanded the Levites, who bore the ark of the covenant of the Lord, saying: 26 “Take this Book of the Law, and put it beside the ark of the covenant of the Lord your God, that it may be there as a witness against you;


It appears from the text that this is not referring to the Sabbath in the Ten Commandments that was written by God Himself by His finger Exo31:18 placed inside the ark of the covenant, not besides like the annual sabbath(s) connected to animal sacrifices.


This is the law that was taken away at the Cross.

Col 2:16 let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days:

This is the exact language referring to the annual sabbath(s) that were handwritten by Moses, placed besides the ark that refer to annual feasts days, sacrifices and offerings that some were also called sabbath(s)

Eze 45:17 and it shall be the prince's part to give burnt offerings, and meat offerings, and drink offerings, in the feasts, and in the new moons, and in the sabbaths, in all solemnities of the house of Israel: he shall prepare the sin offering, and the meat offering, and the burnt offering, and the peace offerings, to make reconciliation for the house of Israel.


What did Jesus say He would come to put an end to? (compared to magnifying another law- by placing it in our hearts Isa42:21 Heb8:10)


Dan 9:27 Then he shall confirm a covenant with many for one week;
But in the middle of the week
He shall bring an end to sacrifice and offering.


Col 2:17 which are a shadow of things to come, but the substance is of Christ

What are the shadows laws? Lets let the Scriptures define what they are

Heb 10:1 For the law, having a shadow of the good things to come, and not the very image of the things, can never with these same sacrifices, which they offer continually year by year, make those who approach perfect. 2 For then would they not have ceased to be offered? For the worshipers, once []purified, would have had no more consciousness of sins. 3 But in those sacrifices there is a reminder of sins every year. 4 For it is not possible that the blood of bulls and goats could take away sins.

5 Therefore
, when He came into the world, He said:

“Sacrifice and offering You did not desire,
But a body You have prepared for Me.
6 In burnt offerings and sacrifices for sin
You had no pleasure.
7 Then I said, ‘Behold, I have come—
In the volume of the book it is written of Me—
To do Your will, O God.’ ”

8 Previously saying, “Sacrifice and offering, burnt offerings, and offerings for sin You did not desire, nor had pleasure in them” (which are offered according to the law), 9 then He said, “Behold, I have come to do Your will, []O God.” He takes away the first that He may establish the second. 10 By that will we have been []sanctified through the offering of the body of Jesus Christ once for all

This fits the context of this passage perfectly and makes the Bible harmonize because we see Sabbath-keeping (every Sabbath) 30+ years after the Cross just as Jesus Himself indicated Isa 56:6-7 Acts 13:42, Acts 13:44 Acts 15:21 Acts 18:4 and up to His Second Coming Mat24:20-30 and forever Isa66:22-23


Paul specifically explains to the Gentiles that the sabbaths of the Jews were nailed to the cross and made obsolete, along with their food and drink laws, festival laws, and new moon laws. Therefore, don't let anyone persuade you to keep them.


Colossians 2:16
Therefore do not let anyone condemn you in matters of food and drink or of observing festivals, new moons, or sabbaths.



We know what the OT states:

Sabbaths were for Israelites/Jews and the Gentiles who converted to Judaism. Exodus 31:13



We know what the NT states:

Sabbaths are not commanded for Gentile converts to Christianity
, nor are the Jews' dietary laws, new moon laws, or festival laws. Colossians 2:16

:)
 
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Jan001

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18 Let no man "beguile you of your reward" in a voluntary humility and worshipping of angels, intruding into those things which he hath not seen, vainly puffed up by his fleshly mind,

Humility in what? What is Paul telling those who have been circumcised of heart, not to let men judge them of and beguile them of? Voluntary humility in what? " in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days".

These verses has been hijacked by this world's religious system and completely twisted to teach others that the Word of God is not worthy of our honor and respect, but their images of God created after the likeness of man and world's high days created in worship of their image of God, that the entire world has adopted, is worthy of our honor and respect.

Jesus Christ triumphed over the first covenant's sabbath, food and drink, festival, and new moon laws by nailing them to his cross, thereby making them obsolete.


1 Colossians 2:8-
8 See to it that no one takes you captive through philosophy and empty deceit, according to human tradition, according to the elemental spirits of the universe, and not according to Christ. 9 For in him the whole fullness of deity dwells bodily, 10 and you have come to fullness in him, who is the head of every ruler and authority. 11 In him also you were circumcised with a spiritual circumcision, by putting off the body of the flesh in the circumcision of Christ; 12 when you were buried with him in baptism, you were also raised with him through faith in the power of God, who raised him from the dead. 13 And when you were dead in trespasses and the uncircumcision of your flesh, God made you alive together with him, when he forgave us all our trespasses, 14 erasing the record that stood against us with its legal demands. He set this aside, nailing it to the cross. 15 He disarmed the rulers and authorities and made a public example of them, triumphing over them in it. 16 Therefore do not let anyone condemn you in matters of food and drink or of observing festivals, new moons, or sabbaths. 17 These are only a shadow of what is to come, but the substance belongs to Christ. 18 Do not let anyone disqualify you, insisting on self-abasement and worship of angels, dwelling on visions, puffed up without cause by a human way of thinking, 19 and not holding fast to the head, from whom the whole body, nourished and held together by its ligaments and sinews, grows with a growth that is from God.
20 If with Christ you died to the elemental spirits of the universe, why do you live as if you still belonged to the world? Why do you submit to regulations, 21 “Do not handle, Do not taste, Do not touch”? 22 All these regulations refer to things that perish with use; they are simply human commands and teachings. 23 These have indeed an appearance of wisdom in promoting self-imposed piety, humility, and severe treatment of the body, but they are of no value in checking self-indulgence.


If the sabbath of the Jews were required for Gentile Christians, the apostles would have included it in their letter to these Gentile converts to Christianity. They did not include it:

Acts 15:24-30
Since we have heard that certain persons who have gone out from us, though with no instructions from us, have said things to disturb you and have unsettled your minds, 25 we have decided unanimously to choose representatives and send them to you, along with our beloved Barnabas and Paul, 26 who have risked their lives for the sake of our Lord Jesus Christ. 27 We have therefore sent Judas and Silas, who themselves will tell you the same things by word of mouth. 28 For it has seemed good to the Holy Spirit and to us to impose on you no further burden than these essentials: 29 that you abstain from what has been sacrificed to idols and from blood and from what is strangled and from fornication. If you keep yourselves from these, you will do well. Farewell.”
30 So they were sent off and went down to Antioch. When they gathered the congregation together, they delivered the letter.
 
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Lukaris

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These early writings are witness and have nothing to do with later persecutions etc. How many writings were actually destroyed or just lost seems debatable. The early Christians like Irenaeus of Lyons ( late 2nd c.) exposes non Biblical writings as false ( Like the Gospel of Judas) and is a valuable early witness to much of the Bible as we know it. He never called for destroying any writings just discerned the true from the false.




Irenaeus On the Apostolic Preaching is one of the earliest preserved accounts of the Old Testament commonly held & preached on. Evangelical Christians acknowledge this:



Reply to post 107. There are ongoing tech problems with the reply function in CF. Not a complaint, it is just an unfortunate circumstance.
 
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HIM

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We are under Jesus Christ's new covenant:

Yes God's Law in the Heart. Now It isn't a question of do and don't but will and won't.
Do we need to keep the food and drink laws of the first covenant Jews? No.

As pertaining to the sanctuary service no. That is the context. But if you are still eating swine's flesh and the abominable thing that is a problem
Do we need to keep the festival laws of these Jews? No.

No they have been fulfilled in Christ.
Do we need to keep the new moon laws of these Jews? No.

No
Why did Paul command that we Christians disregard the sabbath laws, new moon laws, food and drink laws, and religious festival laws of the first covenant Jews?


Colossians 2:16
So let no one judge you in food or in drink, or regarding a festival or a new moon or sabbaths,

Paul commanded that we disregard all of these first covenant laws, including their sabbath laws, because they separated the Jews from the Gentiles. Now, we are all under the new covenant Law of Christ.


Colossians 2:14-14
having wiped out the handwriting of requirements (first covenant Laws) that was against us, which was contrary to us. And He has taken it out of the way, having nailed it to the cross.



Sabbaths not the Sabbath of the Decalogue.

Our sins have been put, cut off from us by the circumcision of Christ that the body of sin be destroyed so that we do not serve sin. For he that is dead is freed from sin because we are risen with him through faith and the operation of God. Quickened together with Him having forgiven us all trespasses.
Blotting out the handwriting to the ordinances that were against us because the wages of sin is death but we have been forgiven all trespasses so the handwriting to the ordinances he has taken away nailing them to the cross. It is the handwriting to the ordinances or of the ordinances. Not the ordinances them selves and certainly not the Commandments contained in the Decalogue. The writings pertaining to the sanctuary service and festivals because of our sin, this is the context.


Col 2:11 In whom also ye are circumcised with the circumcision made without hands, in putting off the body of the sins of the flesh by the circumcision of Christ:
Col 2:12 Buried with him in baptism, wherein also ye are risen with him through the faith of the operation of God, who hath raised him from the dead.
Col 2:13 And you, being dead in your sins and the uncircumcision of your flesh, hath he quickened together with him, having forgiven you all trespasses;
Col 2:14 Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross;

Galatians 3:28
There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither slave nor free, there is neither male nor female; for you are all one in Christ Jesus.
Amen
 
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Studyman

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Paul specifically explains to the Gentiles that the sabbaths of the Jews were nailed to the cross and made obsolete,

This is true. The Sabbath promoted by the Pharisees AKA "Jews" was not the Sabbath of God. It was one of the many commandments of men, not God, that Jesus said the Jews taught for doctrines. Another of the "many" traditions of men they promoted and kept that caused them to, as the Christ of the Bible explains, " Full well reject the commandment of God". Of course not all "Jews" adopted and promoted these commandments and traditions of men. Zacharias, Simeon, Anna, John the Baptist, the Wise men, these people had Faith in God. Not the man-made commandments contained in ordinances that were against the Church of God that Jesus exposed, made a show of openly and Triumphed over, even after being surrounded by their influence for over 30 years.

These commandments and handwriting of ordinances of men were against the Church of God, causing those who adopted them to "Persecute" the Church of God", as both Paul and David declare. Paul explains in Eph 2:11,12, that the Jews/Pharisees, AKA "The Circumcision", called the faithful Gentiles, who were "Circumcised in the heart", "Uncircumcised", like those Paul is speaking to in Col. 2, and judged them as being "without Christ, being aliens from the commonwealth of Israel, and strangers from the covenants of promise, having no hope, and without God in the world". Of course this has never been the Truth of God, not for the servants of Abraham, not for the mixed multitude that came out of Egypt with the Israelites, not of Rehab whose name God has glorified even to this day. And God's Own Words expose their commandments of men.

Is. 56: 4 For thus saith the LORD unto the eunuchs that keep my sabbaths, and choose the things that please me, and take hold of my covenant;

5 Even unto them will I give in mine house and within my walls a place and a name better than of sons and of daughters: I will give them an everlasting name, that shall not be cut off.

6 Also the sons of the stranger (Non-Jews), that join themselves to the LORD, to serve him, and to love the name of the LORD, to be his servants, every one that keepeth the sabbath from polluting it, and taketh hold of my covenant;

7 Even them will I bring to my holy mountain, and make them joyful in my house of prayer: their burnt offerings and their sacrifices shall be accepted upon mine altar; for mine house shall be called an house of prayer for all people.

along with their food and drink laws,

Yes, 21 (Touch not; taste not; handle not; 22 Which all are to perish with the using;) after the commandments and doctrines "of men"?

Jesus points these commandments of men contained in ordinances the rebellious Jews promoted.

Mark 7: 7 Howbeit in vain do they worship me, teaching for doctrines the commandments "of men". Not God and "many" who come in Christ's Name falsely preach.

8 For laying aside the commandment of God, ye hold the tradition of men, (Not commandments of God) as the washing of pots and cups: and many other such like things ye do.
festival laws, and new moon laws.
Yes, their Sabbaths and high days were not God's Sabbaths and Holy Feasts, as Paul and Jesus clearly teach. As the Spirit in Christ teaches us through Ezekiel.

Ez. 20: 10 Wherefore I caused them to go forth out of the land of Egypt, and brought them into the wilderness.

11 And I gave them my statutes, and shewed them my judgments, which if a man do, he shall even live in them. (Jesus teaches the exact same thing in Matt. 4)

12 Moreover also I gave them my sabbaths, to be a sign between me and them, that they might know that I am the LORD "that sanctify them".

13 But the house of Israel rebelled against me in the wilderness: they "walked not" in my statutes, and they despised my judgments, which if a man do, he shall even live in them; and my sabbaths they greatly polluted: then I said, I would pour out my fury upon them in the wilderness, to consume them.
Therefore, don't let anyone persuade you to keep them.

Absolutely, we must "Come out of " this world's religions with their image of God created in the likeness of a handsome, long haired man. And stop partaking of their high days they created in worship of this image, that are shadows of nothing. Yes, the entire world has rejected God's Holy Feasts and Sabbaths and they have adopted instead, as Prophesied by Christ Himself, the popular man-made high days that creates untold wealth and riches for the merchants of this world.

Jesus exposed these commandments contained in ordinances, that were against the Church of God for centuries, where there is no Jew or Gentile and never was.

Colossians 2:16
Therefore do not let anyone condemn you in matters of food and drink or of observing festivals, new moons, or sabbaths.
Yes, the "You" here being "In whom also ye are circumcised with the circumcision made without hands, in putting off the body of the sins of the flesh by the circumcision of Christ: 12 Buried with him in baptism, wherein also ye are risen with him through the faith "of the operation of God", (Not man) who hath raised him from the dead.


We know what the OT states:
There are deceivers who promote the insidious falsehood that the "Jews/Pharisees" were promoting God's Statutes, Commandments and Judgments to the Gentiles.

Anyone who believes this doesn't know what the OT or the NT states.

Sabbaths were for Israelites/Jews and the Gentiles who converted to Judaism. Exodus 31:13

I hear this word tossed around a lot, "Judaism". So what is a Judaizer? It is a JEW who promoted for doctrines the Commandments of Men? Or was it a Faithful man like Jesus, who walked in all the Commandments and Statutes of God, Blameless, and promoted that His Followers should strive for the same?https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Exodus 31:13&version=NRSVCE
We know what the NT states:

Sabbaths are not commanded for Gentile converts to Christianity
, nor are the Jews' dietary laws, new moon laws, or festival laws. Colossians 2:16

Again, There is no Jew or Gentile in the Church of God, there was in the Jews religion that persecuted the Church of God, but not in God's Church. And Jesus said God's Sabbath was made for man. Of course HE doesn't divide men by the DNA they were born with, because there is no Jew or Gentile in God's Church.

But you are right to separate between God's Laws, Statutes and Holy Feasts and Sabbaths, and the Jews religious traditions of men and the Commandment of Men they taught for doctrines. Paul does not teach to "Yield oneself", "Humble oneself", Submit oneself to man-made high days, traditions and commandments of men contained in ordinances. Paul peaches to "yield oneself" to God, not man-made religions. Jesus exposed them on the Cross, as HE refused to submit to this world's religious philosophies, traditions and Sabbaths, choosing instead "being found in fashion as a man, he humbled himself, and became obedient unto death, even the death of the cross". Paul teaches me to have the Same Mind. I can show you the Scripture if you don't know where it is.

There are deceivers who "Come in Christ's Name. preaching that Jesus is truly the Christ, that teach it wasn't the "commandments and traditions of man the Jews taught for doctrines", that was against the Church of God. They actually preach that it was Jesus' Father's OWN Laws, Statutes and Feasts that HE created for His People to walk in, that it might be well with them.

That when Paul says Jesus, And having spoiled principalities and powers, they preach Jesus is talking about His Father here.

he made a shew of them openly, they preach Jesus exposed His Father and made a show of His Commandments openly.

triumphing over them in it. they preach Jesus triumphed over His Own Father's Commandments on the Cross.

I would not advocate such a wicked judgment against Jesus, who would never make such a judgment against His Father. And I know from study that Paul is not making the same claim as "many" who call Jesus Lord, Lord are making.

I hope you might study for yourself, and consider "Every Word that proceeds from the moth of God, as Jesus instructs.
 
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SabbathBlessings

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This absolutist sabbath argument fails though because there is indication that early Christian communities understood what Paul was saying in Colossians ( & most likely Romans) about the 8th day resurrection ( Sunday) worship taken already mentioned that 1 Corinthians 16:1-4 is in line with the previous chapter ( 15) which is the most concentrated scripture on the resurrection. The origin of this understanding goes back to Isaiah 1:1-20
( verse 13 in particular). You quote Isaiah, Paul did in Colossians, & an early Christian community reflected that.

As I have said, the Sabbath day is defensible but not absolute. It is not a one size fits all free pass.
God’s word is absolute for me, Jesus said when we place traditions of man over the commandment of God quoting directly from the Ten Commandments, God’s personally written and spoken Testimony Exo31:18 that includes the 4th commandment Exo20:1-17 Exo20:6, it makes the word of God void. Jesus who is God used the commandment of God and the word of God interchangeable. Mat15:3-14 Mark7:7-13 If someone wishes to place what man says over what Jesus told us to live by Mat4:4 I guess life is about choices, and our choices is what leads us on which direction we are heading Rom6:16

We probably will not agree, but I wish you well.
 
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Studyman

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Jesus Christ triumphed over the first covenant's sabbath, food and drink, festival, and new moon laws by nailing them to his cross, thereby making them obsolete.

This is not true according the Scriptures. And the teaching that God's Judgments, Statutes and Holy Feasts were "Against Paul and the Church of God", but the man-made traditions and commandments of men the Jews taught for doctrines was not against "Paul and the church of God" is just foolishness.

Consider what you are promoting here, that Jesus triumphed over God's Judgments, Statutes and Commandments He walked in, and instructed others to walk in, nailed them to the cross because you preach they were somehow "Against men".

But creating and promoting images of God in the likeness of men and creating man-made high days in worship of this image, and rejecting God's Judgments concerning what is clean, Holy and Righteous, and going about instead, establishing your own righteousness, your own judgments concerning what is clean, Holy and Righteous, is not against men?

The Spirit of Christ warns of this very thing in the Words HE instructed us to Live By.

Jer. 23: 16 Thus saith the LORD of hosts, Hearken not unto the words of the prophets that prophesy unto you: they make you vain: they speak a vision of their own heart, and not out of the mouth of the LORD.

17 They say still unto them that despise me, The LORD hath said, Ye shall have peace; and they say unto every one "that walketh after the imagination of his own heart", No evil shall come upon you.


1 Colossians 2:8-
8 See to it that no one takes you captive through philosophy and empty deceit,
"according to human tradition", according to the elemental spirits of the universe, and "not according to Christ".

Jann01, who created all things, was it not this Same Christ? Did HE not tell us to "Live by" Every Word of His Father and my Father?

I'm not going to argue with the promoters of this world's religious philosophies and traditions to much, as disputes about God's Laws can lead to unfruitfulness. But I would try and make the point about the difference between "Traditions and commandments "of men", VS. the Commandments, Judgments and Statutes "of God" that Jesus and Paul promoted and walked in.

We need forgiveness, not because we transgressed the traditions, commandments or philosophies of men. (Like the Jews Law) But because we transgressed God's Commandments, Statutes and Judgments. Paul is not talking about rejecting God's Laws, he is talking about rejecting the traditions of men and rudiments of this world.

If you cannot discern the difference between the rudiments of the world, why, as though living in the world, are ye subject to ordinances, 21 (Touch not; taste not; handle not; 22 Which all are to perish with the using; after the commandments and doctrines "of men"?

Why do you imply in your religion that Passover, Pentecost, God's Holy Sabbath, God's instruction to His Children as to what is Food, and what is not Food, are "Traditions of Men" and not Statutes, Judgments and Commandments of God?
 
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Studyman

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Yes God's Law in the Heart. Now It isn't a question of do and don't but will and won't.

What a great way to look at this. We have the Oracles of God in our own home, in our own heart, the only thing that matters now is do we "Yield ourselves" to the "Word of God" or not.
As pertaining to the sanctuary service no. That is the context. But if you are still eating swine's flesh and the abominable thing that is a problem.

It is an interesting phenomenon in my view. Every father in the world demands the right, excepts the right, clearly desires the right to teach their little boys and girls what is food and what is not food. My young daughter would eat a dog turd she found in the yard as a toddler. It is the duty of all fathers to teach their children what is food and what is not food. They will learn and Love you more for it, when they get older, even though they might pitch a little fit when you take the dog turn away from her the first time. (LOL) Although the Kingdom of God is more than food and drink, we still need food and drink. Jesus said for me not to worry about these things because HE, of course" knows we need food and drink and Jesus said to SEEK first the Kingdom of God and His Righteousness, and all these things will be shown, or as Jesus said, "Added" to us. And anyone who Seeks the Righteousness of God will find in the Oracles of God we are been allowed to have in our own homes, a very detailed definition God had written for His Children, defining for us what is food and what is not food.

And yet, we are surrounded by religions of this world who come in Christ's Name, and claim His Father as their Father, and yet they deny the right of the God and Father of all to define for them, what is Food and what is not food. Probably one of the most basic, easy to understand judgments God created for the well being of His Children. This rebellion comes from within, and is founded in unbelief, in my view.

And the benefit of God's instruction here is amazing. The knowledge of God comes into my mind every time I eat, every time I cook, every time I shop for food and read ingredients, when I get up for breakfast, when I eat lunch, and supper before bed.

Surely God knows what HE is doing, and I am very thankful for His Instruction in Righteousness.

Like you said, once a man hears the Word of God, "It isn't a question of do and don't but will and won't."

Very true. Thank you for that.
 
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Jan001

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As pertaining to the sanctuary service no. That is the context. But if you are still eating swine's flesh and the abominable thing that is a problem

Eating swine's flesh is not a problem for Christians.

Mark 7:18-19
And he said to them, “Then are you also without understanding? Do you not see that whatever goes into a man from outside cannot defile him, since it enters, not his heart but his stomach, and so passes on?” (Thus he declared all foods clean.)
 
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Jan001

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I hear this word tossed around a lot, "Judaism". So what is a Judaizer? It is a JEW who promoted for doctrines the Commandments of Men?
A Judaizer is a Jewish believer, usually from the party of the Pharisees, who insists that non-Jewish believers become Jews and keep the Law of Moses: its circumcision, dietary, festival, and Sabbath laws.

Acts 15:5
But some believers who belonged to the party of the Pharisees rose up, and said, “It is necessary to circumcise them, and to charge them to keep the law of Moses.”



What was the apostles' response to these Judaizers' claims?

Acts 15:24-29
Since we have heard that some persons from us have troubled you with words, unsettling your minds, although we gave them no instructions, 25 it has seemed good to us, having come to one accord, to choose men and send them to you with our beloved Barnabas and Paul, 26 men who have risked their lives for the sake of our Lord Jesus Christ. 27 We have therefore sent Judas and Silas, who themselves will tell you the same things by word of mouth. 28 For it has seemed good to the Holy Spirit and to us to lay upon you no greater burden than these necessary things: 29 that you abstain from what has been sacrificed to idols and from blood and from what is strangled and from unchastity. If you keep yourselves from these, you will do well. Farewell.”


Did the apostles command the Gentile Christians to keep the Sabbath day of the first covenant Jews?

The apostles told the Gentile Christians that the only first covenant laws they needed to keep were the following:

  1. Abstain from what has been sacrificed to idols, from blood, and from what is strangled.
  2. Abstain from unchastity.

Gentile Christians were never commanded or expected to keep the Saturday Sabbath of the first covenant Jews. The new covenant Christians had their assigned day of the week to keep holy: the Lord's Day, which was Sunday, the first day of the week.

The new covenant Christians who understand the new testament scriptures cannot be persuaded to keep the first covenant's Sabbath or dietary laws.
 
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Jan001

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Consider what you are promoting here, that Jesus triumphed over God's Judgments, Statutes and Commandments He walked in, and instructed others to walk in, nailed them to the cross because you preach they were somehow "Against men".

The first covenant's Sabbath, circumcision, dietary, festival, and new moon laws were to be valid only until Jesus Christ mediated his new covenant by his sacrificial death on the cross.

Galatians 3:19-27
Why then the law? It was added because of transgressions, till the offspring should come to whom the promise had been made; and it was ordained by angels through an intermediary. 20 Now an intermediary implies more than one; but God is one.
21 Is the law then against the promises of God? Certainly not; for if a law had been given which could make alive, then righteousness would indeed be by the law. 22 But the scripture consigned all things to sin, that what was promised to faith in Jesus Christ might be given to those who believe.
23Now before faith came, we were confined under the law, kept under restraint until faith should be revealed. 24 So that the law was our custodian until Christ came, that we might be justified by faith. 25 But now that faith has come, we are no longer under a custodian; 26 for in Christ Jesus you are all sons of God, through faith. 27 For as many of you as were baptized into Christ have put on Christ.
 
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SabbathBlessings

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The first covenant's Sabbath, circumcision, dietary, festival, and new moon laws were to be valid only until Jesus Christ mediated his new covenant by his sacrificial death on the cross.

Galatians 3:19-27
Why then the law? It was added because of transgressions, till the offspring should come to whom the promise had been made; and it was ordained by angels through an intermediary. 20 Now an intermediary implies more than one; but God is one.
21 Is the law then against the promises of God? Certainly not; for if a law had been given which could make alive, then righteousness would indeed be by the law. 22 But the scripture consigned all things to sin, that what was promised to faith in Jesus Christ might be given to those who believe.
23Now before faith came, we were confined under the law, kept under restraint until faith should be revealed. 24 So that the law was our custodian until Christ came, that we might be justified by faith. 25 But now that faith has come, we are no longer under a custodian; 26 for in Christ Jesus you are all sons of God, through faith. 27 For as many of you as were baptized into Christ have put on Christ.
So is it your view that sin started at Creation on the seventh day when God made the Sabbath for mankind? Its not what the Bible states. Man did fall, but not the day after He created man in the image of God. Obviously the context you are trying to make Paul say, does not fit with God's own personally spoken and written Testimony Exo31:18 Exo20:11 that the Sabbath started before sin at Creation when God made everything according to His will, so cannot be the law that was added because of sin. Paul provided the context to the law he speaks of in this passage, but just like we see with other similar passages people apply it to the law they want it to be and not the law being spoken of.
 
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Jan001

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So is it your view that sin started at Creation on the seventh day when God made the Sabbath for mankind? Its not what the Bible states. Man did fall, but not the day after He created them in the image of God. Obviously the context you are trying to make Paul say, does not fit with God's own personally spoken and written Testimony Exo31:18 Exo20:11

Genesis 2:1-3
Thus the heavens and the earth were finished, and all their multitude. 2 And on the seventh day God finished the work that he had done, and he rested on the seventh day from all the work that he had done. 3 So God blessed the seventh day and hallowed it, because on it God rested from all the work that he had done in creation.


I don't know the day of the week Adam and Eve sinned.

God chose to "bless and hallow" Saturday, the seventh day of the week, because he had finished his work of creation the previous six days.

God's first covenant with the Israelites required them, his chosen people, to keep holy the seventh day also.


Jesus Christ chose to "bless and hallow" Sunday, the first day of the week, because he had finished his work of redemption by rising from the dead on that day.

Jesus Christ's new covenant with his disciples from all nations requires them, his chosen people, to keep holy the first day of the week.
Revelation 1:10

I think it is unwise to ignore the apostles' plain teaching: Gentile Christians do not need to keep the seventh-day Sabbath law of the Israelites/Jews.


The apostles' teaching to the Gentiles concerning the Law of Moses and its Sabbath, festival, dietary, and new moon laws:

Acts 15:24-29
Since we have heard that some persons from us have troubled you with words, unsettling your minds, although we gave them no instructions, 25 it has seemed good to us, having come to one accord, to choose men and send them to you with our beloved Barnabas and Paul, 26 men who have risked their lives for the sake of our Lord Jesus Christ. 27 We have therefore sent Judas and Silas, who themselves will tell you the same things by word of mouth. 28 For it has seemed good to the Holy Spirit and to us to lay upon you no greater burden than these necessary things: 29 that you abstain from what has been sacrificed to idols and from blood and from what is strangled and from unchastity. If you keep yourselves from these, you will do well. Farewell.”
 
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