• Starting today August 7th, 2024, in order to post in the Married Couples, Courting Couples, or Singles forums, you will not be allowed to post if you have your Marital status designated as private. Announcements will be made in the respective forums as well but please note that if yours is currently listed as Private, you will need to submit a ticket in the Support Area to have yours changed.

  • CF has always been a site that welcomes people from different backgrounds and beliefs to participate in discussion and even debate. That is the nature of its ministry. In view of recent events emotions are running very high. We need to remind people of some basic principles in debating on this site. We need to be civil when we express differences in opinion. No personal attacks. Avoid you, your statements. Don't characterize an entire political party with comparisons to Fascism or Communism or other extreme movements that committed atrocities. CF is not the place for broad brush or blanket statements about groups and political parties. Put the broad brushes and blankets away when you come to CF, better yet, put them in the incinerator. Debate had no place for them. We need to remember that people that commit acts of violence represent themselves or a small extreme faction.

FEARING THAT TRADITIONIS CUSTODIS IS COMING FOR FIDUCIA SUPPLICANS, FATHER JAMES MARTIN, SJ SPINS POPE LEO…

Michie

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
Feb 5, 2002
190,635
70,631
Woods
✟6,600,718.00
Country
United States
Gender
Female
Faith
Catholic
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Others

…AND IT SHOWS THAT FIDUCIA SUPPLICAN ADMIRERS ARE FEARING, LIKE SUMMORUM PONTIFICUM LOVERS, THE WORST! DOES THAT MAKE SENSE, MY TITLE, THAT IS?​


This is what Fr. James Martin, SJ writes on his Facebook page, the second of two posts.You should read the comments. Commenters are inviting LGBTQ++++ Catholics to join the Judgement Free Zone of the Anglican/Episcopal Communion, in other words to go into schism, similar to the Sedevacantists!

Here’s his post (with my most humble, powerfully astute, comments embedded in RED):

To answer questions I've been getting about the Holy Father's comments on blessing same-sex couples today, in a press conference on his way back to Rome: First, we should trust the discernment of the Holy Father in this, as in all things. In addition to his teaching role as the Vicar of Christ, Pope Leo XIV is a kind, wise, thoughtful and prayerful man. And what he says, even in a press conference, needs to be seen in light of this, and appreciating his knowledge of the needs of the universal church. (Absolutely, but I would caution the pope, any pope, to avoid off-the-cuff remarks on such important subjects and never pose answers with the preface, “I think, I believe, In my opinion—just don’t do it—popes should always speak authoritatively and off-the-cuff remarks are dissected to death—but even the opinionated type language points to the fact that the pope is Catholic and it isn’t his opinion about this, that or the other that counts, but the Deposit of Faith and Morals of the Church and all who are invited into the Church but also repent! Repent! Repent! Conversion must take place even in something as intimate and personal as one’s sexual identity and expressions!)

In terms of his comments, it seems, at least to me, that Pope Leo is not abrogating "Fiducia Supplicans," the Vatican document from 2023 that allows priests, under certain conditions, to bless “same-sex couples.” (That’s the language used.) (Nice try and like Pope Leo, Martin says, “It seems, at least to me, that Pope Leo is not abrogating “Fiducia Supplicans.” That is their fear and they should fear it as Pope Francis initiated canceling one pope’s documents in favor of his own reversal documents. Why should Pope Leo be any different in canceling Fiducia Supplicans? )

One of the many conditions was that these blessings would not be formalized, that is, as a kind of planned liturgy. To that end, the German bishops' proposal would be, as I read it, to formalize these blessings more, a move that flows out of the German bishops' sincere desire to listen to the voices of German Catholics raised during their synodal processes. But the Vatican (and the Holy Father) oppose this move, as the Pope said today. Overall, though, "FS," even though it has proven controversial in some parts of the world (while warmly welcomed in others), still stands. (I think Cardinal Marx should be disciplined similar to what appears will happen to the FSPPX priests who will soon be illicitly ordained bishops. What is good for the goose is good for the gander! Cardinal Marx must be disciplined! No?)

The Holy Father's larger point is that to move beyond "FS" would be to risk unity in the church, and he is correct. One of the things that was hammered home for me in the Synod was how things that can seem tepid in the West ("What's the big deal about blessing same-sex couples?," as I heard often) are white-hot in other parts of the church ("Fiducia Supplicans is blessing sin," as I heard just as often). (Fiducia Supplicans as written does permit the blessing of sin, but Pope Francis, after all the push back he received, moderated that position and said no, individuals are being blessed, not the couple or their relationship—but we know what has transpired and Fr. Martin is being a bit duplicitous here, because almost immediately he blessed a homosexual couple and their relationship and put it on his Facebook page, almost gloating over Pope Francis opening the door to change the anthropology and dogmas of both marriage and Holy Orders—hypocrisy anyone? )

One of Pope Leo's overall desires for the church is for unity, which he restated again today. (Remember that his papal motto is "In the One, we are one.") (Our unity is not in amoral or immoral ideologies or opinions, but in the “Splendor of Truth” which of course is Jesus Christ and His call for conversion from our sins to His Holiness, His Perfections!)

Continued below.