Doctrine of Unconditional Election

Brightfame52 · May 21, 2026

Its crystal clear that the scriptures teach election, even unconditional election in salvation. Most people will agree that election is taught in scripture, but very few agree that its unconditional, and totally by grace and Gods sovereign good pleasure, not outside of Himself. Even the OT scripture indicates Gods sovereign prerogative in election and having mercy on whomever He will Ex 33:19

And he said, I will make all my goodness pass before thee, and I will proclaim the name of the Lord before thee; and will be gracious to whom I will be gracious, and will shew mercy on whom I will shew mercy. In this discriminatory fashion God exhibits His Glory

Now Paul alludes to this scripture in his treatise on unconditional election in Rom 9:11-16

11 (For the children being not yet born, neither having done any good or evil, that the purpose of God according to election might stand, not of works, but of him that calleth)

12 It was said unto her, The elder shall serve the younger.

13 As it is written, Jacob have I loved, but Esau have I hated.

14 What shall we say then? Is there unrighteousness with God? God forbid.

15 For he saith to Moses, I will have mercy on whom I will have mercy, and I will have compassion on whom I will have compassion.

16 So then it is not of him that willeth, nor of him that runneth, but of God that sheweth mercy.

We learn that there is what Paul terms "the purpose of God according to election" This is a salvaic purpose,. its answering the seeming dilema as to why so many jews in national israel are being lost Rom 9:1-6

I say the truth in Christ, I lie not, my conscience also bearing me witness in the Holy Ghost,

2 That I have great heaviness and continual sorrow in my heart.

3 For I could wish that myself were accursed from Christ for my brethren, my kinsmen according to the flesh:

4 Who are Israelites; to whom pertaineth the adoption, and the glory, and the covenants, and the giving of the law, and the service of God, and the promises;

5 Whose are the fathers, and of whom as concerning the flesh Christ came, who is over all, God blessed for ever. Amen.

6 Not as though the word of God hath taken none effect. For they are not all Israel, which are of Israel:

Its from this background that Paul develops his treatise on the doctirne of unconditional election, or "the purpose of God according to election"

Now let us look at what Rom 9 tells us: By writer of godsonlygospel.com "election is just not fair.

Speaking of Jacob and Esau, the sons of Isaac and Rebecca, Paul the apostle states: "For the children being not yet born, neither having done any good or evil, THAT THE PURPOSE OF GOD ACCORDING TO ELECTION MIGHT STAND, not of works but of Him that calleth; It was said unto her, The elder shall serve the younger. As it is written, Jacob have I loved, but Esau have I hated" (Rom. 9:11-13). What a passage to confound the free willer! No wonder the Arminian minister prefers to conveniently shy away from this chapter in Romans and hide these things from his listeners. These verses show clearly that God made choice between Jacob and Esau before they were even born! God made choice between them as to which He would love and which He would hate. This was done, the Scriptures say, so that the purpose of God according to election might stand, an election which obviously could not have been based on any deeds, actual or foreseen, good or bad, that man had done or would do. The saved are those who are elected by grace through faith, not by anything they have done, that none should boast. The good works they do were appointed, or prepared, for them to do and they were not elected because of any good works they were foreseen would do:

I do differ with the author regarding his statement "The saved are those who are elected by grace through faith, "

I believe the saved are those who are elected by Grace, minus the faith, but Faith being the consequent of election by grace.

However the main point is, the elect are not elected based upon any foreseen actions or deeds , good or bad, that man has done or will do, because the election of grace was made before they were born to do any actions whatsoever, thats the Apostles point.

This treatise by Paul should forever eliminate the false idea that election is based upon anything foreseen in or of the sinner. Its totally unconditional ! Its totally of Sovereign prerogative !

Delvianna · May 21, 2026

It's not unconditional because like any contract, it requires both people to agree. If it were unconditional, that would mean people who don't even want to follow God, accept him or be anywhere near him, would be "chosen", which scripture doesn't teach.

David Lamb · May 22, 2026

Delvianna said:
It's not unconditional because like any contract, it requires both people to agree. If it were unconditional, that would mean people who don't even want to follow God, accept him or be anywhere near him, would be "chosen", which scripture doesn't teach.

I would say that Scripture does indeed teach that. Writing to the Christians in Ephesus, Paul reminds them that before they became Christians they had been dead in trespasses and sins, nothing even suggesting that they had wanted to follow God. :God took the initiative:

(Eph 2:1) And you He made alive, who were dead in trespasses and sins,
(Eph 2:2) in which you once walked according to the course of this world, according to the prince of the power of the air, the spirit who now works in the sons of disobedience,
(Eph 2:3) among whom also we all once conducted ourselves in the lusts of our flesh, fulfilling the desires of the flesh and of the mind, and were by nature children of wrath, just as the others.
(Eph 2:4) But God, who is rich in mercy, because of His great love with which He loved us,
(Eph 2:5) even when we were dead in trespasses, made us alive together with Christ (by grace you have been saved),
(Eph 2:6) and raised us up together, and made us sit together in the heavenly places in Christ Jesus,
(Eph 2:7) that in the ages to come He might show the exceeding riches of His grace in His kindness toward us in Christ Jesus.
(Eph 2:8) For by grace you have been saved through faith, and that not of yourselves; it is the gift of God,
(Eph 2:9) not of works, lest anyone should boast.
(Eph 2:10) For we are His workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand that we should walk in them.

He doesn't say, "And you He has made alive, who were wanting to follow God."

Brightfame52 · May 22, 2026

Mans portion is determined by the will of God, thus Paul says, " The purpose of God according to election might stand, not of works, but of Him that calleth," ( Romans 9:11 ). Election is not based on any thing foreseen in the creature, but of the will of the God exclusively, and for His pleasure. Rev 4:11

11 Thou art worthy, O Lord, to receive glory and honour and power: for thou hast created all things, and for thy pleasure they are and were created.

Unconditional Election of some was for His Pleasure !

Brightfame52 · May 22, 2026

Delvianna said:
It's not unconditional because like any contract, it requires both people to agree. If it were unconditional, that would mean people who don't even want to follow God, accept him or be anywhere near him, would be "chosen", which scripture doesn't teach.

Completely irrelevent

Delvianna · May 22, 2026

You're isolating verses about election while ignoring the many scriptures that make salvation conditional upon faith, repentance, obedience, and perseverance.

Romans 9 does teach God's sovereignty, but it does not teach that people are saved regardless of whether they respond to God.

Scripture repeatedly says people can resist, reject, fall away, or refuse salvation:

“Whosoever believeth in him should not perish” — John 3:16
“God so loved the world” — John 3:16
“Whosoever will, let him take the water of life freely” — Revelation 22:17
God “is not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance” — 2 Peter 3:9
God “will have all men to be saved” — 1 Timothy 2:4
Jesus said, “Ye will not come to me, that ye might have life” — John 5:40
Jesus wept over Jerusalem saying, “How often would I have gathered thy children together... and ye would not!” — Matthew 23:37

Those verses make no sense if election is unconditional in the Calvinistic sense.

Even Romans 9 itself does not say people are saved apart from faith. In the same section Paul says:

“What shall we say then? That the Gentiles, which followed not after righteousness, have attained to righteousness... by faith” — Romans 9:30
“Israel... attained it not... because they sought it not by faith” — Romans 9:31-32

So Paul himself explains the distinction in terms of faith versus unbelief.

Also, election in scripture is often corporate or purpose-based, not automatically individual salvation. Israel was elect, yet many Israelites perished in unbelief (1 Corinthians 10:1-12). Judas was chosen as an apostle yet still fell.

Ephesians 1 says believers are chosen “in Christ” (Ephesians 1:4). The condition is union with Christ, and scripture consistently says we enter Christ through faith.

If election were truly unconditional in the absolute sense you're arguing, then warnings against falling away, resisting God, hardening your heart, or failing to endure would be meaningless:

Hebrews 3:15 — “Harden not your hearts”
Hebrews 10:26-29
2 Peter 2:20-21
Romans 11:20-22 — “Be not highminded, but fear... otherwise thou also shalt be cut off.”

God absolutely initiates salvation and deserves all glory, but scripture never presents humans as robots forced into salvation apart from willing faith and repentance.

Maria Billingsley · May 22, 2026

Brightfame52 said:
Its crystal clear that the scriptures teach election, even unconditional election in salvation. Most people will agree that election is taught in scripture, but very few agree that its unconditional, and totally by grace and Gods sovereign good pleasure, not outside of Himself. Even the OT scripture indicates Gods sovereign prerogative in election and having mercy on whomever He will Ex 33:19

And he said, I will make all my goodness pass before thee, and I will proclaim the name of the Lord before thee; and will be gracious to whom I will be gracious, and will shew mercy on whom I will shew mercy. In this discriminatory fashion God exhibits His Glory

Now Paul alludes to this scripture in his treatise on unconditional election in Rom 9:11-16

11 (For the children being not yet born, neither having done any good or evil, that the purpose of God according to election might stand, not of works, but of him that calleth)

12 It was said unto her, The elder shall serve the younger.

13 As it is written, Jacob have I loved, but Esau have I hated.

14 What shall we say then? Is there unrighteousness with God? God forbid.

15 For he saith to Moses, I will have mercy on whom I will have mercy, and I will have compassion on whom I will have compassion.

16 So then it is not of him that willeth, nor of him that runneth, but of God that sheweth mercy.

We learn that there is what Paul terms "the purpose of God according to election" This is a salvaic purpose,. its answering the seeming dilema as to why so many jews in national israel are being lost Rom 9:1-6

Its from this background that Paul develops his treatise on the doctirne of unconditional election, or "the purpose of God according to election"

Now let us look at what Rom 9 tells us: By writer of godsonlygospel.com "election is just not fair.

I do differ with the author regarding his statement "The saved are those who are elected by grace through faith, "

I believe the saved are those who are elected by Grace, minus the faith, but Faith being the consequent of election by grace.

However the main point is, the elect are not elected based upon any foreseen actions or deeds , good or bad, that man has done or will do, because the election of grace was made before they were born to do any actions whatsoever, thats the Apostles point.

This treatise by Paul should forever eliminate the false idea that election is based upon anything foreseen in or of the sinner. Its totally unconditional ! Its totally of Sovereign prerogative !

"For you, brethren, have been called to liberty; only do not use liberty as an opportunity for the flesh, but through love serve one another."

Paul recognized that human nature is prone to hijacking divine grace to justify a flesh-driven agenda. Augustine suffered a theological overcorrection which resulted in this " unconditional election ". Ever been in a fight and say things you really didn't mean? That is what happened during the massive debate between Augustine and Pelagious.

In Augustine's earlier writings, he maintained a much more balanced view of human free will but, as the controversy dragged on his positions became incredibly rigid. He began interpreting Paul's letters through an uncompromising, absolute lens that pushed past the actual text of Scripture. Augustine arrived at conclusions that shocked many believers in his own day. For instance, he concluded that because of original sin, infants who died without being baptized were automatically condemned to hell. Absolutely not in scripture.

Christians can continue on this path however it would be wise to consider alternative interpretations because the logical conclusion is, absolute insecurity.

Be blessed.

Brightfame52 · May 22, 2026

Maria Billingsley said:
"For you, brethren, have been called to liberty; only do not use liberty as an opportunity for the flesh, but through love serve one another."

Paul recognized that human nature is prone to hijacking divine grace to justify a flesh-driven agenda. Augustine suffered a theological overcorrection which resulted in this " unconditional election ". Ever been in a fight and say things you really didn't mean? That is what happened during the massive debate between Augustine and Pelagious.

In Augustine's earlier writings, he maintained a much more balanced view of human free will but, as the controversy dragged on his positions became incredibly rigid. He began interpreting Paul's letters through an uncompromising, absolute lens that pushed past the actual text of Scripture. Augustine arrived at conclusions that shocked many believers in his own day. For instance, he concluded that because of original sin, infants who died without being baptized were automatically condemned to hell. Absolutely not in scripture.

Christians can continue on this path however it would be wise to consider alternative interpretations because the logical conclusion is, absolute insecurity.

Be blessed.

This isn't about Augustine and Pelagius

Brightfame52 · May 22, 2026

Delvianna said:
You're isolating verses about election while ignoring the many scriptures that make salvation conditional upon faith, repentance, obedience, and perseverance.

Romans 9 does teach God's sovereignty, but it does not teach that people are saved regardless of whether they respond to God.

Scripture repeatedly says people can resist, reject, fall away, or refuse salvation:

“Whosoever believeth in him should not perish” — John 3:16

“God so loved the world” — John 3:16

“Whosoever will, let him take the water of life freely” — Revelation 22:17

God “is not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance” — 2 Peter 3:9

God “will have all men to be saved” — 1 Timothy 2:4

Jesus said, “Ye will not come to me, that ye might have life” — John 5:40

Jesus wept over Jerusalem saying, “How often would I have gathered thy children together... and ye would not!” — Matthew 23:37

Those verses make no sense if election is unconditional in the Calvinistic sense.

Even Romans 9 itself does not say people are saved apart from faith. In the same section Paul says:

“What shall we say then? That the Gentiles, which followed not after righteousness, have attained to righteousness... by faith” — Romans 9:30

“Israel... attained it not... because they sought it not by faith” — Romans 9:31-32

So Paul himself explains the distinction in terms of faith versus unbelief.

Also, election in scripture is often corporate or purpose-based, not automatically individual salvation. Israel was elect, yet many Israelites perished in unbelief (1 Corinthians 10:1-12). Judas was chosen as an apostle yet still fell.

Ephesians 1 says believers are chosen “in Christ” (Ephesians 1:4). The condition is union with Christ, and scripture consistently says we enter Christ through faith.

If election were truly unconditional in the absolute sense you're arguing, then warnings against falling away, resisting God, hardening your heart, or failing to endure would be meaningless:

Hebrews 3:15 — “Harden not your hearts”

Hebrews 10:26-29

2 Peter 2:20-21

Romans 11:20-22 — “Be not highminded, but fear... otherwise thou also shalt be cut off.”

God absolutely initiates salvation and deserves all glory, but scripture never presents humans as robots forced into salvation apart from willing faith and repentance.

No you just dont wanna deal with the truth of election

Delvianna · May 22, 2026

Brightfame52 said:
No you just dont wanna deal with the truth of election

And you just like ignoring scripture.

Maria Billingsley · May 22, 2026

Brightfame52 said:
This isn't about Augustine and Pelagius

I see. This is your personal doctrine.

Thanks for sharing.
Blessings.

Brightfame52 · May 22, 2026

Delvianna said:
And you just like ignoring scripture.

You are because election is all through scripture

Brightfame52 · May 22, 2026

Maria Billingsley said:
I see. This is your personal doctrine.

Thanks for sharing.
Blessings.

Its Gods Doctrine I just a steward of it

Delvianna · May 22, 2026

Brightfame52 said:
You are because election is all through scripture

This is unproductive. If you arent going to actually engage with the scripture I gave, then theres no point in responding.

God bless.

Brightfame52 · May 22, 2026

Delvianna said:
This is unproductive. If you arent going to actually engage with the scripture I gave, then theres no point in responding.

God bless.

Take care

Carl Emerson · May 23, 2026

Delvianna said:
It's not unconditional because like any contract, it requires both people to agree. If it were unconditional, that would mean people who don't even want to follow God, accept him or be anywhere near him, would be "chosen", which scripture doesn't teach.

It is not a Contract.

Brightfame52 · May 23, 2026

Gods Glory is manifested in Unconditional Sovereign Election and Reprobation. Election is a Matter of absolute Mercy Rom 9:11-15

11 (For the children being not yet born, neither having done any good or evil, that the purpose of God according to election might stand, not of works, but of him that calleth)

12 It was said unto her, The elder shall serve the younger.

13 As it is written, Jacob have I loved, but Esau have I hated.

14 What shall we say then? Is there unrighteousness with God? God forbid.

15 For he saith to Moses, I will have mercy on whom I will have mercy, and I will have compassion on whom I will have compassion.

God is not obligated to have mercy on any one of us, He would have been just to punish eternally everyone for their sins against Him.

However He purposed for His own Glory to have Mercy on only some, a remnant of mankind. Moses had asked God to show him His Glory, and the Lord answered Ex 33:18,19

18 And he said, I beseech thee, shew me thy glory.

19 And he said, I will make all my goodness pass before thee, and I will proclaim the name of the Lord before thee; and will be gracious to whom I will be gracious, and will shew mercy on whom I will shew mercy.

See that, God in responding to Moses said He will proclaim HIS NAME ! And in that proclamation we have the sacred words " and will be gracious to whom I will be gracious, and will shew mercy on whom I will shew mercy."

The Glory of the Lord is bound up in His Sovereign Prerogative to be merciful and gracious to whomever He pleases understanding that He can withhold the same to whomever He pleases.

Ps 115:3

3 But our God is in the heavens: he hath done whatsoever he hath pleased.

Delvianna · May 23, 2026

Carl Emerson said:
It is not a Contract.

How is it not? The scripture i showed proves we have stuff to do on our end. Then theres the 10 commandments which we are supposed to follow. How is that not a contract? Specially with what happened with Abraham walking the coals. A covenant is literally a contract.

Carl Emerson · May 23, 2026

Delvianna said:
How is it not? The scripture i showed proves we have stuff to do on our end. Then theres the 10 commandments which we are supposed to follow. How is that not a contract? Specially with what happened with Abraham walking the coals. A covenant is literally a contract.

Because it occurs before we are born as Paul says.

Even Jesus said it...

John 15:16
You did not choose Me but I chose you, and appointed you that you would go and bear fruit, and that your fruit would remain, so that whatever you ask of the Father in My name He may give to you.

And John 1
11 He came to His own, and those who were His own did not receive Him. 12 But as many as received Him, to them He gave the right to become children of God, even to those who believe in His name, 13 who were born, not of blood nor of the will of the flesh nor of the will of man, but of God.

Faith is not a mindset that we maintain by our own will - it is a gift from Him that saves us.

Delvianna · May 23, 2026

Carl Emerson said:
Because it occurs before we are born as Paul says.

Even Jesus said it...

John 15:16
You did not choose Me but I chose you, and appointed you that you would go and bear fruit, and that your fruit would remain, so that whatever you ask of the Father in My name He may give to you.

And John 1
11 He came to His own, and those who were His own did not receive Him. 12 But as many as received Him, to them He gave the right to become children of God, even to those who believe in His name, 13 who were born, not of blood nor of the will of the flesh nor of the will of man, but of God.

Faith is not a mindset that we maintain by our own will - it is a gift from Him that saves us.

But you're not addressing, just like OP, the verses that cause problems with this belief that I gave. Because I'm saying, your view is narrow-minded.

Doctrine of Unconditional Election

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