Meditation

fide · Oct 29, 2025

FaithT said:
Forgive me if I’ve asked this before. My OCD is better but it’s still there. I’m just really high strung most of the time. I know meditating can be wrong, but what about relaxation exercises and emptying the mind of thoughts, you know, quieting the mind? Is that ok?

Meditation has become a very confused word in the West, including Catholics. Eastern mediation frequently means "emptying the mind" - a very foolish thing to attempt, wise teachers would say. The evil one loves an empty mind to move into.
In the Catholic Faith "meditation" traditionally means - or meant - what is now more specifically and technically called "discursive meditation" to clarify that no, do not think of emptying your minds, Catholics! Many do anyway. Post Vat II many Eastern religious ideas were brought into Catholic parishes.

I'll quote something from a book I've recommended here before - an introductory book to traditional Catholic spirituality grounded in Thomas Aquinas and John of the Cross, The Ordinary Path to Holiness (3rd edition)sold thru Amazon:

Discursive meditation is defined as the application of reason to some spiritual truth in order to engage its meaning, to penetrate its meaning, and to integrate the truth into one’s life. Mental activity and attention are clearly required, and the first goal is the enlightenment of the mind with the truth. It is important to realize that Christian meditation is not achieved with the simple presence in the mind of some truth; the ultimate goal is the integration of that truth into one’s life.

(R. Thomas Richard, PhD. The Ordinary Path to Holiness (Third Edition) (p. 123). (Function). Kindle Edition. )

Thus one seeks the fullness of truth in true meditation, the opposite of emptying the mind. Meditation is crucially important to growth in the interior life - because Truth is crucially important, to know, to believe and to live.

fide · Oct 29, 2025

The path to holiness proceeds through stages. Christian meditation should rightfully begin in the first stage (called the Purgative Stage, or Stage of the Beginner) of this journey. What is formed in the soul by virtue of Christian (discursive) meditation establishes a crucial part of the foundation upon which and from which can emerge in the second stage, infused contemplation. The prayer of quiet (mentioned by JimR above) is a "substage" of the broader and general category of (infused) contemplation which is to be found in the second stage - a stage which is called the Illuminative Stage (or Stage of the Proficient) - it is here that the supernatural is experienced - and if given, is "infused", certainly not earned or developed by any natural works of the pilgrim.

I'm trying to say that the terms "meditation" and "contemplation" are mangled and abused beyond usefulness, and when used as they typically are, only confuse an understanding that is good to possess, in the journey of prayer. We can do meditation. God alone can give infused contemplation.

Forgive me please for dropping all these terms upon you, if they are new to you, but there is much misunderstanding of exactly how the interior life grows and matures. Labels and terms can sound and can be cold, academic, and far from the delicate and mystical Spirit who is at work within, in holy Love. Maturation in prayer IS maturation in divine Love and is most beautiful, an embrace of God within the soul. It ought - and deserves - to be sought with one's whole heart. And the seeking can be greatly aided by learning from the saints, and from the God-appointed witnesses and teachers of the journey.

JimR-OCDS · Oct 30, 2025

fide said:
Meditation has become a very confused word in the West, including Catholics. Eastern mediation frequently means "emptying the mind" - a very foolish thing to attempt, wise teachers would say. The evil one loves an empty mind to move into.
In the Catholic Faith "meditation" traditionally means - or meant - what is now more specifically and technically called "discursive meditation" to clarify that no, do not think of emptying your minds, Catholics! Many do anyway. Post Vat II many Eastern religious ideas were brought into Catholic parishes.

St John of the Cross wrote in "The Dark Night of the Soul" that discursive meditation is what beginners experience in the dark night of sense.
However, as the soul advances in prayer and moves into the dark night of the spirit, they receive the gift of "contemplation," which
means that the soul empties herself of anything not of God. St John of the Cross teaches in his writings that detachment from what
he calls, "appetites," which include erroneous thoughts, is part of growing spiritually.

Just because those in Eastern religions do the similar, doesn't make it wrong. They also use rosary beads, and because they do, should we
stop praying the rosary?

Who we are focused on in prayer is what makes our meditation different.

FaithT · Oct 30, 2025

JimR-OCDS said:
St John of the Cross wrote in "The Dark Night of the Soul" that discursive meditation is what beginners experience in the dark night of sense.
However, as the soul advances in prayer and moves into the dark night of the spirit, they receive the gift of "contemplation," which
means that the soul empties herself of anything not of God. St John of the Cross teaches in his writings that detachment from what
he calls, "appetites," which include erroneous thoughts, is part of growing spiritually.

Just because those in Eastern religions do the similar, doesn't make it wrong. They also use rosary beads, and because they do, should we
stop praying the rosary?

Who we are focused on in prayer is what makes our meditation different.

Well, those in Eastern religions don’t use rosary beads they use prayer beads.

fide · Oct 30, 2025

JimR-OCDS said:
St John of the Cross wrote in "The Dark Night of the Soul" that discursive meditation is what beginners experience in the dark night of sense.
However, as the soul advances in prayer and moves into the dark night of the spirit, they receive the gift of "contemplation," which
means that the soul empties herself of anything not of God. St John of the Cross teaches in his writings that detachment from what
he calls, "appetites," which include erroneous thoughts, is part of growing spiritually.

Just because those in Eastern religions do the similar, doesn't make it wrong. They also use rosary beads, and because they do, should we
stop praying the rosary?

Who we are focused on in prayer is what makes our meditation different.

Hi JimR - our studies of the spiritual life have led to many different understandings. This is very sad and troubling to me, as I see so many missing so much that is crucial: There is only one Truth.

JimR-OCDS · Oct 31, 2025

FaithT said:
Well, those in Eastern religions don’t use rosary beads they use prayer beads.

Correct, but they are similar in that they keep the mind focused on prayer.

The Rosary we pray is no different. The Hail Mary prayers help keep you focused on meditating
over the mysteries.

JimR-OCDS · Oct 31, 2025

fide said:
Hi JimR - our studies of the spiritual life have led to many different understandings. This is very sad and troubling to me, as I see so many missing so much that is crucial: There is only one Truth.

I believe this is because there are different spiritualities in the Church.

Franciscans have a different tradition than the Carmelites, and Trappists have a different tradition than Assumptionists.
Their spiritualities are the also different, while the focus of their intention, Christ, is the same.

Years ago, I read the book, "Who We Are Is How We Pray, Matching Spirituality and Personality." by Fr Charles Keating.

The book helped me understand why there are so many different spiritualities and what draws one person to a quiet prayer
life and another to a more charismatic active prayer life. Personality types have much to do with it. I found it ironic
that people who are generally extroverts, are drawn to quiet prayer, while people who are generally introverted are
often drawn to a more active type of prayer life like Pentecostals. It's not a hard fast rule, but it made sense to me.
In the end. Christ is the center of their lives and the one they are drawn to.

fide · Oct 31, 2025

JimR-OCDS said:
I believe this is because there are different spiritualities in the Church.

Franciscans have a different tradition than the Carmelites, and Trappists have a different tradition than Assumptionists.
Their spiritualities are the also different, while the focus of their intention, Christ, is the same.

Years ago, I read the book, "Who We Are Is How We Pray, Matching Spirituality and Personality." by Fr Charles Keating.

The book helped me understand why there are so many different spiritualities and what draws one person to a quiet prayer
life and another to a more charismatic active prayer life. Personality types have much to do with it. I found it ironic
that people who are generally extroverts, are drawn to quiet prayer, while people who are generally introverted are
often drawn to a more active type of prayer life like Pentecostals. It's not a hard fast rule, but it made sense to me.
In the end. Christ is the center of their lives and the one they are drawn to.

Akita Suggagaki · Wednesday at 8:50 PM

JimR-OCDS said:
St John of the Cross wrote in "The Dark Night of the Soul" that discursive meditation is what beginners experience in the dark night of sense.
However, as the soul advances in prayer and moves into the dark night of the spirit, they receive the gift of "contemplation," which
means that the soul empties herself of anything not of God. St John of the Cross teaches in his writings that detachment from what
he calls, "appetites," which include erroneous thoughts, is part of growing spiritually.

Just because those in Eastern religions do the similar, doesn't make it wrong. They also use rosary beads, and because they do, should we
stop praying the rosary?

Who we are focused on in prayer is what makes our meditation different.

Zen has a purity. But it is impersonal and thus for me empty in a way that John of the Cross would reject. John’s emptiness was really a fullness. Maybe Buddhists say that also somehow. I need a Being other than myself alone.

Eastern traditions of meditation were once pretty popular here in the West. I think they have waned a bit. Still some Buddhist Mindfulness and a little Zen and remember TM?

As Christians we recognize that if we empty the ego we discover Christ dwelling there all the time. But the ego is so tricky. “Look at how good I can empty myself. Oops”. And we also know the power of grace working in us.

Meditation/contemplation is on ( or two) of my favorite subjects. I have also noticed that it helps with my tinnitus. One would think that sitting in silence would be the worse. But somehow it helps.

Bob Crowley · 2026-02-26T06:31:55-0600

RileyG said:
Do you have a spiritual director? Some like centering prayer AKA contemplative prayer is where you empty your mind and focus on a single word. I've known some Benedictine priests and sisters who regularly practice it.

Some years ago when I was still a new Catholic and looking around, I went to a Catholic meditation group.

They used the word "Maranatha" as their centre. It's original meaning in Aramaic is "Our Lord, Come" or "Our Lord is coming".

From an AI summary -

Key details about "Maranatha":

Meaning: It is a combination of Aramaic words maran (our Lord) and atha (come).

Usage: It was a prayer or watchword for early Christians, particularly in liturgical settings.

Context: Paul uses it as a concluding statement in his letter to the Corinthians, likely signifying a longing for the Second Coming.

Similar Sentiments: While Jesus did not say this specific phrase, the sentiment aligns with his promise in Revelation 22:20, "Yes, I am coming soon," to which John responds, "Amen. Come, Lord Jesus".

I didn't persevere, and I'm not very meditative I'm afraid, which is something I need to work on.

In Faith T's case, I think he or she could benefit from being in a local Catholic mediation group if one can be found.

That way there would be encouragement to continue, and guidance if necesary.

Akita Suggagaki · 2026-02-26T17:30:07-0600

Bob Crowley said:
Some years ago when I was still a new Catholic and looking around, I went to a Catholic meditation group.

They used the word "Maranatha" as their centre. It's original meaning in Aramaic is "Our Lord, Come" or "Our Lord is coming".

From an AI summary -

I didn't persevere, and I'm not very meditative I'm afraid, which is something I need to work on.

In Faith T's case, I think he or she could benefit from being in a local Catholic mediation group if one can be found.

That way there would be encouragement to continue, and guidance if necesary.

I don’t hear much about Centering Prayer anymore, nor The Jesus Prayer. I think it would be helpful to talk about the experience in a group. To process what had.

FaithT · 2026-02-26T18:19:05-0600

Akita Suggagaki said:
I don’t hear much about Centering Prayer anymore, nor The Jesus Prayer. I think it would be helpful to talk about the experience in a group. To process what had.

I went to a prayer evening once or twice put on by some Religious Sisters at a nearby Catholic school campus. I think we did Centuring Prayer. I had a hard time with it.

edit to add: I did some googling and yes, it was Centering Prayer. I couldn’t keep still and quiet that long.

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