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How Long have Humans Lived on Earth?

o_mlly

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If you consider citing the Catechism and a pope ex cathedra to be "mining through Catholiic teaching", we've located the problem. The Catechism:
Red herring alert. The issue is not the authority in the Catechism. As an aside and to improve your catechesis in citing the catechism, I explained and you learned that sole source of the Catechism's authority resides in its footnotes.

The issue in this thread is resolving your erroneous claim that as Catholics we believe, "We have a body. We are a soul, each of us." That is false, and for good reason.

Catholic teaching is that we are a composite of body and soul as my previous posts citing magisterial documents evidence. Do you want to learn why that truth is important to our very kerygma? It appears @Free2bHeretical4Him! would like to know.
 
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Firstlightdawn

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Turns out, the German, Latin, and Spanish versions are also wrong, if you're right.
Correct, you have to read the Bible in the origional Hebrew Language. God confused the language at the tower of Babel. We see this in Numbers 12 6 He said, “Hear now My words: If there is a prophet among you, I, the LORD, will reveal Myself to him in a vision; I will speak to him in a dream. 7 But this is not so with My servant Moses; he is faithful in all My house. 8 I speak with him face to face, clearly and not in riddles; he sees the form of the LORD. Why then were you unafraid to speak against My servant Moses?”

I speak in riddles all the time: Do you know how to discombobulate the goose? The reason I do that is because the Bible is written in riddles and only Moses is direct. Nothing has been added to Moses so we can always go back to what he tells us.
we've located the problem. The Catechism:
The problem with the Catechism is that people do not follow it; I do not think they even read it.
 
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John Bauer

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I believe that all of these are subspecies of H. sapiens. This is still not settled, however.

This is a minority taxonomic view. The dominant current position treats Homo neanderthalensis and H. longi (Denisovans) as distinct species, based on morphology, deep genomic divergence (~550–765 kya split), and long independent evolution.
 
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The Barbarian

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Red herring alert. The issue is not the authority in the Catechism. As an aside and to improve your catechesis in citing the catechism, I explained and you learned that sole source of the Catechism's authority resides in its footnotes.
So you think the footnotes are wrong? Is was John Paul II wrong about the Catechism accurately reflecting the Church's magisterium?
 
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The Barbarian

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The issue in this thread is resolving your erroneous claim that as Catholics we believe,
In Catholic schools, I was taught that the Catechism explains what we as Catholics believe. Apparently, John Paul II thought so, too. You're free to disagree, of course. Meantime, let's stop derailing the thread and get back to the topic, um?
 
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Firstlightdawn

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Meantime, let's stop derailing the thread and get back to the topic, um?
To answer the question “What is a human?” we have to separate categories. Adam lived about 6,000 years ago, so biblically, man has been on Earth for 6,000 years. Scientifically, the first humans belong to the species Homo sapiens, which appear about 250,000 years ago. These are not a single named individual but a population.

In the cosmological model I’m working with, Day One is about 8 billion years long, beginning when the Earth first appears. Each subsequent day is shorter by a ratio of 1.98. Schroeder uses a ratio of 2.0, but if you use 2.0 the sixth day does not align correctly with the appearance of mammals and primates. To avoid compounding errors (a “butterfly effect”), the ratio must be 1.98, not 2.0.

Using 1.98, the beginning of Day Six falls around 262.9 million years ago. This is an average, because the universe does not expand at a perfectly constant rate. It speeds up and slows down, so the number cannot be exact.

This timing matters because mammals appear about 200–220 million years ago, which fits the Day‑Six window when using the 1.98 ratio. Primates appear much later, around 55–60 million years ago.

We can visualize all of this using the cone diagram. The cone shows that:
  • The vertical axis is time.
  • The horizontal radius is the size of the universe at that moment.
  • The slanted sides represent expansion.
Time, space, and expansion are not separate things — they are one fabric. When we take a slice of the cone (a moment in cosmic time), that slice is “flat,” even though spacetime as a whole is curved. Because of this curvature, our numbers can never be perfectly exact; they are approximations based on the geometry of the cone.
 
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o_mlly

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So you think the footnotes are wrong?
Why would you write that? Researchers prefer primary sources, always.
Is was John Paul II wrong about the Catechism accurately reflecting the Church's magisterium?
The Catechism does not merely reflect the Magisterium. The Catechism is in itself Magisterial, albeit in Cliff Notes form. When one reads the catechism and does not understand, the footnotes will lead them to a fuller explanation of the catechism's summary from its primary sources, i.e., Scripture, Tradition or the constant teaching of the Magisterium.
In Catholic schools, I was taught that the Catechism explains what we as Catholics believe. Apparently, John Paul II thought so, too. You're free to disagree, of course ...
The disagreement is with your incorrect posts as Catholic teaching. You claim to be Catholic so in deference to other readers, I am obliged to correct those errors.
.... let's stop derailing the thread and get back to the topic
The OP is about how long humans have lived on earth. Knowing when the first human, whom we call Adam, existed seems a good place to start.
To answer the question “What is a human?”
Biologists focused on morphology, look to bones or other biological artifacts to determine the first instance of human life. (Genetics is to an extent morphology under a microscope).

Bible scholars look to clues in the text.

Philosophers knowing that effects reveal something about their causes look also at human habitats. Enter the archaeologists.

Adam, made in His image, had unique faculties unlike all other creatures, i.e., reason and freewill. What uniquely human effects would disclose such a creature made in His image? The evidence then includes not only biology and belief, but behavior as well e.g., cave painting, ritual burials, body adornments, tools to make tools, etc. Investigating these uniquely human effects leads to dating of humans to as far back as 800M years ago. Was H. Erectus the first Adam? 7 haunting caves ancient humans used for art, burials and butchering
 
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The Barbarian

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To answer the question “What is a human?” we have to separate categories. Adam lived about 6,000 years ago, so biblically, man has been on Earth for 6,000 years. Scientifically, the first humans belong to the species Homo sapiens, which appear about 250,000 years ago. These are not a single named individual but a population.
You have a point here, except we don't know how long ago Adam lived, or even if he was an anatomically modern human. If his species was H. heidelbergensis, that would change nothing theologically.

140,000-Year-Old Skeleton in Mount Carmel Cave Rewrites Human Origins

140,000-year-old skeleton found in Mount Carmel Cave reveals human origins rewritten with new evidence of Homo sapiens and Neanderthals interbreeding in Israel.
 
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The Barbarian

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The evidence then includes not only biology and belief, but behavior as well e.g., cave painting, ritual burials, body adornments, tools to make tools, etc. Investigating these uniquely human effects leads to dating of humans to as far back as 800M years ago.
No. That would be before the dinosaurs. 800K would be more realistic. H. erectus, about 1M years ago, used fire, made tools and left Africa to spread throughout Eurasia. Anatomically modern humans left Africa much later, met and interbred with other populations of humans.

Doesn't really matter theologically.
 
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Firstlightdawn

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You have a point here, except we don't know how long ago Adam lived, or even if he was an anatomically modern human.

POST 1 — Noah, Eden, and the Biological System

When you read Genesis with real science in mind — botany, zoology, ecology — the story becomes far more sophisticated than most people realize.

Noah didn’t just save “animals two by two.” He preserved the entire Eden life‑system:

  • Botany — seed‑bearing plants, fruit trees, stored food, and the genetic lines of the wild plants that later became domesticated.
  • Zoology — the breath‑bearing creatures “according to their kinds,” the biological families that form the backbone of today’s ecosystems.
  • Human genealogy — the Adamic line that leads to Abraham, David, and ultimately Jesus.
You cannot restart civilization with only eight people. You must preserve the whole biodiverse system that supports human life. That is exactly what the text describes.

Modern science — especially the botanists at Hebrew University in Jerusalem — studies how wild plants of the ancient Near East became the domesticated crops that fed early civilization. Those same wild plants existed before the Flood, and Noah carried their seed‑based food system through the catastrophe.

Our world today exists because Noah preserved the biological blueprint of Eden.


POST 2 — Civilization, Migration, and the Silk Road Before Writing

Science is deeply interested in how civilization began and how it spread into Europe and Asia. But one thing often overlooked is the ancient travel corridor that later became known as the Silk Road.

People were moving along that route long before written language.

You can still travel parts of it today — even rent a motorcycle and ride the same paths ancient traders walked. These routes connected:

  • Mesopotamia
  • Anatolia
  • The Levant
  • Persia
  • Central Asia
  • Eventually Europe and China
The Hebrew alphabet even preserves this early world. The letter ג (gimel) originally depicted a camel, one of the key animals of long‑distance trade. The alphabet remembers the world that existed before writing was widespread.

Civilization didn’t appear in isolation. It spread along real roads, real ecosystems, and real trade routes.


POST 3 — Early Humans, Neanderthals, and the Biblical Story

You mentioned something important: the Middle East was home to Neanderthals long before the rise of Mesopotamian civilization.

Archaeology confirms that:

  • Neanderthals lived across the Levant
  • Early Homo sapiens migrated through the same region
  • Their populations overlapped for thousands of years
The biblical story doesn’t describe “primitive man” in scientific terms, but it does describe population balance in the land. When Israel came up from Egypt, God speaks about the land not becoming empty or overrun by wild peoples or wild animals. The principle is ecological: human population and the land’s ecosystem must stay in balance.

That same principle applies to the earlier world as well. As Homo sapiens increased in Mesopotamia, Neanderthal populations decreased. The biosystem shifted, just as ecosystems always do when one species becomes dominant.


POST 4 — The Unified Picture

When you put all of this together — Bible, archaeology, botany, biology, and early human migration — you get a coherent picture:

  • Eden introduces the original biological system.
  • Noah preserves that system through the Flood.
  • Early humans spread along the ancient trade corridors.
  • Wild plants become domesticated crops.
  • Civilizations rise in Mesopotamia and spread outward.
  • Population changes reshape the human landscape (including Neanderthals).
  • The Silk Road becomes the backbone of cultural exchange.
This is not mythic or primitive. It is a real, biodiverse, ecological, historical world that the Bible describes in ancient language — and science is now uncovering in modern terms.
 
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The Barbarian

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Scientist. In science, 800M is 800 million. 800K is 800 thousand. You often see paleontologists write something like "65MYA" for "sixty-five million years ago."

"M" is the Roman numeral for thousand.
When in science, do as the scientists do.
 
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Job 33:6

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Scientist. In science, 800M is 800 million. 800K is 800 thousand. You often see paleontologists write something like "65MYA" for "sixty-five million years ago."


When in science, do as the scientists do.
A fresh reminder of the level of experience we are communicating through. I try to remind myself that there was once a time when I wouldn't have known this. How strange the world seemed back then.
 
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The Barbarian

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This is not mythic or primitive. It is a real, biodiverse, ecological, historical world that the Bible describes in ancient language
It's a remarkably consistent and well-considered concept. I'd disagree about farming arising before the extinction of Neanderthals.
Edit: except in the sense that people like me retain some Neanderthal DNA.
 
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Firstlightdawn

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Neanderthals.
They were hunter gathers. I sold out at an Amish flea market for many years. People have things they want to gather and they will pay a premium price if you can find it for them. I remember cobalt glass. Difficult to find and if I did have any someone would buy it within hours. My wife has her degree in Socialogy so she understands people and how to manipulate them. So we know the hunter gather desire is very pronounced in people.
 
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Akita Suggagaki

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In the cosmological model I’m working with, Day One is about 8 billion years long, beginning when the Earth first appears. Each subsequent day is shorter by a ratio of 1.98. Schroeder uses a ratio of 2.0, but if you use 2.0 the sixth day does not align correctly with the appearance of mammals and primates
I don’t fully understand why some people think they need to contrive reconciliation of Genesis and the archeological record. Especially so when the order in chapter two is different than in chapter one. But that has probably been hashed elsewhere.

How long hVe humans lived on earth mostly comes down to who we call the first humans and how we date their appearance.
 
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The Barbarian

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I'd disagree about farming arising before the extinction of Neanderthals.
They were hunter gathers.
Yep.
I sold out at an Amish flea market for many years. People have things they want to gather and they will pay a premium price if you can find it for them. I remember cobalt glass. Difficult to find and if I did have any someone would buy it within hours. My wife has her degree in Socialogy so she understands people and how to manipulate them. So we know the hunter gather desire is very pronounced in people.
Now, I wasn't expecting that response...
 
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The Barbarian

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How long hVe humans lived on earth mostly comes down to who we call the first humans and how we date their appearance.
Right. I figure anyone in the genus Homo qualifies. But we don't even have universal agreement on who is in the genus.
 
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o_mlly

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Scientist. In science, 800M is 800 million. 800K is 800 thousand. You often see paleontologists write something like "65MYA" for "sixty-five million years ago."

When in science, do as the scientists do.
So, it's pettiness then.

And for that trait, you have been roundly praised by your devoted followers. If you took the time to read the cited article then you would not have been so confused. You and your gear-head friends just need to get out more often. Try to watch some of the Olympic events ... and think metric.
 
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