Federal agents kill Alex Pretti

rjs330 · Sunday at 11:22 PM

FreeinChrist said:
So you didn't see "and such"? Didn't figure I needed to post each and every crime.

Fair enough.

FreeinChrist said:
He said "the worst of the worst."

He said that he would focus on them. He never said he would not go after anyone else. As I pointed out that was a discussion point before the election.

I don't care if they aren't only going after the worst. I think they are. They are also picking up others as well. Some that are more minor criminals and some who haven't committed any other crimes other than simply being a criminal illegal.

Just like I dont want police only going after murderers and rapists. I want tgem going after all criminals. Even if they are minor ones.

FreeinChrist said:
If they are only focusing on the "worst of the worst", why are they arresting immigrants who are following all the rules for immigration at there meetings with the immigration judges? Why are they targeting children?

I said somewhere I don't think they should go after those who are following the rules. They should leave them alone. And tgey aren't "targeting" children.

Stopped_lurking · Sunday at 11:22 PM

rjs330 said:
I don't think you actually have to be convicted to be a criminal. That is a purely legal standard. I'm sure you have heard of cases where the criminal got away with the crime due to legal loopholes or perhaps a screw up by police. Do you believe every single person that was found not guilty or had a case dismissed was actually innocent of the crime? There have been criminals that were killed before a trial or maybe in the commission of or shortly after the crime and were never found guilty. Does that mean they were not a criminal either?

Also, a illegals are criminals.

The numbers are different. However, that is irrelevant to the situation. Because you dont know how many if those that were arrested would be convicted. Secondly you don't know how many actually committed the crime and got would get away with it.

So limiting yourself to only those who were actually convicted is putting Americans at risk. I maintain if an illegal does something that gives police probable cause to arrest you, you should be deported. First and foremost because you ARE already a criminal for being here illegally and secondly you shouldn't be doing stuff that gets you arrested.

Yes.

You have just thrown the presumption of innocence under the bus. How is this not an argument for the dissolution of the rule of law?

rjs330 · Sunday at 11:25 PM

Belk said:
Those judges sure have. Also election workers who were outed when Trump lied about them. Somehow no one on the MAGA side seems to be leaping to their

Thats silly. Of course they shouldn't be threatened. No one should be. And I wouldn't have a lick of problem if judges covered their faces if it helped poo prevent that.

People on both sides need to knock that crap off.

Belk · Sunday at 11:54 PM

rjs330 said:
Thats silly. Of course they shouldn't be threatened. No one should be. And I wouldn't have a lick of problem if judges covered their faces if it helped poo prevent that.

People on both sides need to knock that crap off.

Yet they are being threatened. A far as I have been able to find there have been about 10 confirmed cases of people being charged for threatening ICE agents. The confirmed cases of doxxing are only work email and other data that is available for all public employees. I've seen nothing to confirm home addresses being posted.

As far as the administration claim of 8000% increase, giving a percentage is a dead giveaway that the actual numbers are not that impressive. That is giving the benefit of the doubt to a group who has repeatedly shown themselves to be less then honest.

I see nothing here that justifies agents remaining anonymous. Though I do note that even if people knew who the agents were there is zero legal recourse against them as individuals. Our government has made it almost impossible to hold them to account for bad behavior.

Pommer · Monday at 12:29 AM

Stopped_lurking said:
You have just thrown the presumption of innocence under the bus. How is this not an argument for the dissolution of the rule of law?

He’s talking about the colloquial use of the term, “criminal”, and while it’s a valid point to be in agreement over the definition of the word, it’s moot, if you’re not getting this.

Pommer · Monday at 12:33 AM

rjs330 said:
Thats silly. Of course they shouldn't be threatened. No one should be. And I wouldn't have a lick of problem if judges covered their faces if it helped poo prevent that.

People on both sides need to knock that crap off.

The ICE masks don’t bother me at all.
They could use rubber Garfield masks for all I care.

That they’re masked tells me more about them than they know.

Enjoy your evening.

Hans Blaster · Monday at 8:07 AM

Vambram said:
Anti-ICE 'digital Minutemen' use military-grade surveillance tactics against feds

At least 200 groups train civilians in S.A.L.U.T.E. intelligence method to track federal agents in 13 databases, raising national security concerns.

www.foxnews.com

It's just a mnemonic created so that guys who identify by their type/color of hat can remember to take all necessary information.

RDKirk · Monday at 8:16 AM

Vambram said:
Anti-ICE 'digital Minutemen' use military-grade surveillance tactics against feds

At least 200 groups train civilians in S.A.L.U.T.E. intelligence method to track federal agents in 13 databases, raising national security concerns.

www.foxnews.com

Back in the early 80s, military intelligence was facing a relatively minor, but troubling matter.

The battlefield reconnaissance and reporting capability of the Army and Air Force, and our growing communication interoperability had created a problem. It would happen like this:

Say, an enemy unit was moving across the countryside. One US intelligence source would see it unit and report that one at its "instantaneous" location. A short while later, a different US intelligence source would see a military unit--very similar-- and report that one at its then "instantaneous" location.

Then we'd get another US intelligence report originally issued earlier, but reaching us by a slower communication route reporting a similar military unit at the "instantaneous" position it occupied at that time.

Was this a single unit moving around? Or was it multiple units? That was a question tossed out, and there were lots of answers proposed. I'm pleased to say I came up with a reporting method immediately practicable by any Army or Air Force unit, using the same tools we already had and costing zero additional dollars. It was selected and I got kudos.

But it wasn't a lot different from SALUTE. Just one guy's idea for organizing mass data in real time.

FreeinChrist · Monday at 11:13 AM

Vambram said:
The far-left network that helped put Alex Pretti in harm's way, then made him a martyr

Encrypted chats show activists tracked ICE agents using a sophisticated database before the fatal shooting of Alex Pretti in Minneapolis. They then used it to mobilize agitators.

www.foxnews.com

One way of trying to make Pretti guilty of his own murder. Fox goes as low as Trump.

There was no excuse to shoot an unarmed man who was lying on the ground in the back. None.

RDKirk · Monday at 11:16 AM

FreeinChrist said:
One way of trying to make Pretti guilty of his own murder. Fox goes as low as Trump.

There was no excuse to shoot an unarmed man who was lying on the ground in the back. None.

Their message is, "Pretti deserved to be killed, so however he got killed is okay."

Vambram · Monday at 12:47 PM

Pommer said:
Yes, this is nice, and nothing at all illegal about it.

I disagree and I will let the courts decide about whether or not it is legal.

Vambram · Monday at 12:49 PM

FreeinChrist said:
One way of trying to make Pretti guilty of his own murder. Fox goes as low as Trump.

There was no excuse to shoot an unarmed man who was lying on the ground in the back. None.

What does your comment have to do with the article that I posted?
Also, an armed man should not have been fighting against law enforcement officers.

Vambram · Monday at 12:50 PM

RDKirk said:
People were doing this with newsgroups in the run-up to the Persian Gulf War.

They're making clever use of a common Internet chat capability, but the article decorates it with lots of military jargon to make it look like something surreptitious. "Military grade surveillance tactic" doesn't even mean anything. Birdwatchers do the same thing.

I will let the courts decide about the legality of this when used against law enforcement officers.

RDKirk · Monday at 1:11 PM

Vambram said:
I will let the courts decide about the legality of this when used against law enforcement officers.

It's not illegal to use an information sorting scheme with a common Internet application.

No ex post facto laws.

FreeinChrist · Monday at 2:00 PM

Vambram said:
What does your comment have to do with the article that I posted?
Also, an armed man should not have been fighting against law enforcement officers.

Wow, tell that to the J6ers, and the Proud Boys.

Or these right wing portestors protesting stay at home laws in Michigan:

Or the gun rights protestors who came to Virginia's capital.

The right seems to think that anyone who is not the side of Trump and ICE are restricted from rights that the right side has.
(Not all the right - but many do) It's a 'do what I wish, not what I do' type of thing.

Pretti's gun stayed holstered, and he was unarmed when the bullets where shot into his back. Any other police agency would have an investigation into that.

Pommer · Monday at 2:05 PM

Vambram said:
I will let the courts decide about the legality of this when used against law enforcement officers.

Trying to make usual Constitutionally protected rights a “crime”, isn’t a “good look”.

RDKirk · Monday at 2:07 PM

FreeinChrist said:
The right seems to think that anyone who is not the side of Trump and ICE are restricted from rights that the right side has.
(Not all the right - but many do) It's a 'do what I wish, not what I do' type of thing.

Pretti's gun stayed holstered, and he was unarmed when the bullets where shot into his back. Any other police agency would have an investigation into that.

And that's where we are seeing a rift opening between the "2A Absolutists" and the "Authoritarian Cultists" (sometimes called "bootlickers" by the 2A Absolutists).

But if we look at the past, the 2A Absolutists were the people on the right who were angered by the incidents involving Philandro Castile, Daniel Shavers, and Breonna Taylor.

Desk trauma · Monday at 2:26 PM

RDKirk said:
sometimes called "bootlickers" by the 2A Absolutists

Vambram · Monday at 2:29 PM

FreeinChrist said:
Wow, tell that to the J6ers, and the Proud Boys.
View attachment 376347

Or these right wing portestors protesting stay at home laws in Michigan:

View attachment 376348

Or the gun rights protestors who came to Virginia's capital. View attachment 376349

The right seems to think that anyone who is not the side of Trump and ICE are restricted from rights that the right side has.
(Not all the right - but many do) It's a 'do what I wish, not what I do' type of thing.

Pretti's gun stayed holstered, and he was unarmed when the bullets where shot into his back. Any other police agency would have an investigation into that.

Were the groups in your pictures obstructing law enforcement officers?

Vambram · Monday at 2:30 PM

Pommer said:
Trying to make usual Constitutionally protected rights a “crime”, isn’t a “good look”.

Is obstruction of law enforcement officers a crime, or not?

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Federal agents kill Alex Pretti

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