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Why is the extreme issue with ICE only in one state?

hedrick

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We've now corrected misinformation from ICE about state prisons in Minnesota. So what's up with the county? First, the county only holds people with less than a year sentence. That's not the worst of the worst, but misdemeanors and less serous felonies. That office believes it is unconsitutional to honor detainers if they don't come from a court.

As you should know from previous discussion there are ambiguities in intepretation of both Federal law and the MN constitution. So far it appears that there is no requirement at the Federal level. Sanctuary Policies: An Overview - American Immigration Council, and the MN constituion can be reasonably understood to not allow it.
 
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hedrick

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Then don't write he is not any Federal employee as if he ia king.
He is an elected employee, though many now regret voting for him
I originally used the term federal emplooyee because demands are not just coming from the president, but from a range of people in DHS and ICE. But I do believe Trump thinks he's king. He has said that there are no limitations on his action other than his own morality, such as it is. His actions are consistent with that statement. Obviously I'm using "king" metaphorically. Most real kings these days are constitutional monarchs.
 
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stevevw

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Are you talking about protests or "law enforcement operations"? You seem to be conflating the two.
I am talking about protestors entering a law enforcement operations. When officers tell them to stay away and then they keep crossing the line.
'Cause they's American, duh. [Lee greenwood plays...]
Its not just because they are American. I am talking about the intention of being armed with that many bullets. I am talking about carrying while agitating.

You don't have to be American to do that. Its being a trouble maker and I don't think just because you carry means you can be a trouble maker. It actually means you have to avoid trouble making.
 
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stevevw

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You can police the city without ever inquiring about the citizenship of victims or perps.
The point was Fret was referring to not cooperating when illegal criminals come into the cities system. When a city cop arrests one of those illegals as part of their cop work. They won't cooperate and hand them over.
 
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stevevw

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In a list of those three countries, those are the best three.

On larger lists, I'm not so certain. I've been to Australia, it was fine, but I could probably come up with 2 other countries I've been to that I would prefer. Never been to England and don't feel like I am missing anything.
I am talking about generally the culture and worldview. We all speak english, a free democracies, help each other in wars, have similar emtertainment, relate to similar icons in literature and science ect.
That's your problem.
Why. Whats wrong with England. We also look to the US. Are you saying looking to the US is ok but not England. We are looking up to them for similar reasons. So if England is your problem then you make the US a problem.
Ich bin kein Engländer.
"Ich bin englisch", I live as if I were an Englishman.
 
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stevevw

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Under current court interpretations, Walz can't honor administrative detainers. There are two easy solutions:
* Bring the matter to Federal court, and let the Supreme Court make it clear that Federal law requires it
* Go pick them up when they are released.
I think Waltz has just agreed to cooperate and hand them over when they are released. Or inform the feds when they are going to be released.
 
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stevevw

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OK, I'm now getting confused. There are lots of articles, but they all give partial views of the situation. This article "https://www.cnn.com/2026/01/30/us/jails-ice-access-minnesota-trump" say:

"Days later, ICE official Marcos Charles suggested detainers sent to “the state’s jails and prisons” weren’t being honored. He later acknowledged the state Department of Corrections had fully cooperated, but said most local sheriffs had not."

If that's true, Walz is doing what he can. The beef is with certain county facilities. One of the biggest problems for ICE is apparently Hennapin County. But the jail there is under the control of a separaely elected sherriff, not either Walz or Frey.

But even if there are things ICE objects to, they seem to be exaggerating. Minnesota prisons head calls out ICE misinformation on arrests, cooperation

"Schnell also highlighted that not only does Homeland Security continue to claim DOC doesn’t cooperate with ICE, but it also insinuates that some of their agents are arresting people that Minnesota is actually handing over.

“We are seeing them claim that they arrested people that they picked up from our prisons through our cooperation in the last few months. What we do know is this: DHS’s claims do not match Minnesota’s records, Minnesota court data or basic jurisdictional realities,” Schnell said.

"In just one example, Schnell showed video of ICE picking up Meng Khong Yang and Joshua Fornoh, two people highlighted by DHS on one of its “Worst of the Worst” releases, just a day before Homeland Security announced them as “criminal illegal aliens arrested yesterday during Operation Metro Surge.”

"Charles had claimed earlier Thursday that Homeland Security doesn’t highlight arrests of individuals turned over by Minnesota prisons.

"Others highlighted by DHS, according to Schnell, were released from Minnesota prisons to ICE “decades ago.”

“We’ve reviewed every single person that DHS has publicly named and here’s what we found: Many individuals were never in Minnesota DOC custody at all, several have no Minnesota court or prison records whatsoever, some had short stays in Minnesota county jails, some are in custody in other states, many were released directly to ICE, including cases going back to 2009, 2001, even into the 1990s,” Schnell said."

It's amazing that the State continues to cooperate when ICE keeps denouncing them.

Surprisingly, Fox did their own investigation and agrees: Records undercut ICE claims that MN jails, prisons release 'worst of the worst'
I don't think the operation was just targeting existing detainees but any illegal criminal identified including on the streets.

Anyway whatever was the problem it seems to be clarified. An agreement has been made that at least Waltz will ensure detainees are handed over.

Not sure about county jurisdiction. What happens if they don't cooperate ? Like the judge who released a detainee at court.
 
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Hans Blaster

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I am talking about generally the culture and worldview.
OK, I understand.
We all speak english,
If you say so.
a free democracies,
If you say so.
help each other in wars,
So do lots of other countries.
have similar emtertainment,
You made this claim earlier about TV and Movies and "growing up". I gather that countries under the thumb of "the queen" watch some our stuff, but of the 4 (later 5) TV channels, only 1 showed any foreign TV (PBS) and it was all British and a small part of their programming (but most of the fiction). The only Foreign movies that were "popular" were
relate to similar icons in literature
There was a lot of english authors in my lit classes. I can give you that one. Do Australians write books? (Don't know any.)
and science ect.
etc. Science is global and not tied to language or culture.
Why. Whats wrong with England. We also look to the US. Are you saying looking to the US is ok but not England. We are looking up to them for similar reasons. So if England is your problem then you make the US a problem.
England is the ancient enemy of my ancestors and my nation. I try to sustain the spirit of '76.
"Ich bin englisch", I live as if I were an Englishman.
I'll keep that in mind.
 
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essentialsaltes

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The point was Fret was referring to not cooperating when illegal criminals come into the cities system. When a city cop arrests one of those illegals as part of their cop work. They won't cooperate and hand them over.
Obviously. However, this has nothing to do with making the city less safe, as you had falsely insinuated, if they are locking criminals up.
 
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Hans Blaster

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I am talking about protestors entering a law enforcement operations. When officers tell them to stay away and then they keep crossing the line.
Legal observers are not protestors. They are monitoring law enforcement operations, documenting it, and giving public warning of its presence.
Its not just because they are American. I am talking about the intention of being armed with that many bullets. I am talking about carrying while agitating.

You don't have to be American to do that. Its being a trouble maker and I don't think just because you carry means you can be a trouble maker. It actually means you have to avoid trouble making.
I'm pointing out that you don't understand US gun culture. Those that "strap up" with such arms do so frequently in all kinds of time, situations, and places those of us who don't would find weird.
 
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Vambram

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It has been very well established that enforcement of immigration is a federal job, not a state's job, and that the President cannot force states to do federal work.
When sanctuary states and sanctuary cities resist handing over to federal immigration law enforcement authorities criminals whom are also illegal immigrants, those blue states and blue cities are making the job of deporting criminal illegal immigrants at least 20 times more difficult. In sanctuary states and sanctuary cities, it really does look like their leaders care more about criminal illegal immigrants than their own law-abiding citizens.
 
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eclipsenow

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I am talking about protestors entering a law enforcement operations. When officers tell them to stay away and then they keep crossing the line.
That's the authoritarian demagogue's line, but it is not supported by the Constitution of the United States of America.
ICE agents have ZERO legal authority to tell citizens to go home. None. Yadda. Zilch.

( It's your choice whether you keep repeating this untruth from here. You have been informed. How's your conscience with that? )
 
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stevevw

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That's the authoritarian demagogue's line, but it is not supported by the Constitution of the United States of America.
ICE agents have ZERO legal authority to tell citizens to go home. None. Yadda. Zilch.
I think this is another false representation of what is happening. No one is saying that protestors cannot protest or have to go away at the request of officers.

Its about the line for which protestors cross that changes their actions from a protestor on the sidelines. To an agitator who is interfering with law enforcement operations.

Theres a difference and your trying to conflate illegal actions of crossing that line with legal protests that officers cannot deny people engaging in.

( It's your choice whether you keep repeating this untruth from here. You have been informed. How's your conscience with that? )
The line has now been clearly explained. Pretti crossed that line. This is fact.
 
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stevevw

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Legal observers are not protestors. They are monitoring law enforcement operations, documenting it, and giving public warning of its presence.
And legal observers become antagonists when they cross over the line and agitate or interfer with law enforcement. That includes verbal instructions not to interfer.

An example would be how they told Pretti not to interfer and he did. So they physically removed him out of the area. Then Pretti stepped back into that area again and again.

They physically showed him the perimeter when they set him down with the others standing there. Then he decides to step back in and then agitate by screaming and defying again and again. He crossed the line again and again and the officers were actually lenient and tolerated his breaches. Because each time was breaking the law.
I'm pointing out that you don't understand US gun culture. Those that "strap up" with such arms do so frequently in all kinds of time, situations, and places those of us who don't would find weird.
But there is a legal responsibility that goes with carrying that gun regardless of intentions. To not agrevate or step into situations that are already volitile. They have to doubly stay away to the sidelines more than someone without a gun. If they rush in with a loaded gun then that is illegal.

Are you seriously trying to argue that its ok for a person to carry a loaded gun with enough amo to mass murder into a law enforcement situation and then continually step over the line and disobey officers and expect nothing to happen.

Imagine 30 like Pretti sourrounding ICE and agitating. If thats legal I find that scary. There would be enough amo to do mass killings on an epic scale. Maybe thats where its heading.
 
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Pommer

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I think this is another false representation of what is happening. No one is saying that protestors cannot protest or have to go away at the request of officers.

Its about the line for which protestors cross that changes their actions from a protestor on the sidelines. To an agitator who is interfering with law enforcement operations.

Theres a difference and your trying to conflate illegal actions of crossing that line with legal protests that officers cannot deny people engaging in.

The line has now been clearly explained. Pretti crossed that line. This is fact.
The battle line is where it’s always been:
Those who seek that the Law is enforced to the letter, and those who’d like to address some injustices that they’re witnessing.

We can have “order”, but freedom then becomes more rare.
 
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Servus

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ICE is not paramilitary. ICE and the CBP are law enforcement officers.
They carry more gear than the last four Batman movies but they’re not ”paramilitary“.
Okay, that’s a valid opinion, if you insist on holding it.
Actually police are considered paramilitary. Even private security companies are considered paramilitary. Both use military standards as an operational model. Notice how police departments have sergeants, lieutenants and captains for example.

Paramilitary: (of an unofficial force) organized similarly to a military force.
 
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eclipsenow

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I think this is another false representation of what is happening. No one is saying that protestors cannot protest or have to go away at the request of officers.
You have, repeatedly! Just go back to your post 163:

"I am talking about protestors entering a law enforcement operations. When officers tell them to stay away and then they keep crossing the line."
What line?

Are you talking about the masked ICE agents verbally telling them to stand back? What does that mean?
Did the officers set up a perimeter? What does the law say about such a perimeter? What does it say if they did NOT set up a perimeter? (They did NOT in this case, as the first video below critiques.)

Its about the line for which protestors cross that changes their actions from a protestor on the sidelines. To an agitator who is interfering with law enforcement operations.
Yup, there you go again. Assert, assert, rinse and repeat. It's his fault for 'crossing the line.'

Define that line for us, please.

Do some more legal reading, and figure out what you are trying to say before you come back here and just repeat yourself. Because you have NOT defined the line at all. As far as I can tell, you are saying exactly what you just said no-one is saying: that the protesters cannot protest.
Try getting specific.

Video from 6 minutes before shows a few protesters turning up and blowing whistles. They are standing on the footpath, defined by law to be a public place where they can protest. They blow whistles, part of the protest. Is this crossing the line?

Then a masked ICE agent (don't you love how Stormtrooper all this is?) starts getting in Pretti's face, not the other way around.

Is this ICE agent allowed to do that?
He walks right up in Pretti's space, forcing Pretti to walk backwards for about 10 meters.


Is the ICE agent allowed to do that?
Did Pretti do anything ILLEGAL by this point?
Public space. Filming. That's it.
Where did he cross the line?
What if Pretti had slipped on the icy sidewalk and banged his head on the concrete and died?

Then these buffoons didn't like him rushing in to help the lady that fell over, so they immediately pepper-spray Pretti, wrestle him to the ground, and there's about 5 seconds of wrestling.

One ICE agent yells "Gun gun" as he REMOVES IT - so what happens?
The other buffoons shoot Pretti dead.

You do not yell "GUN GUN!" when the victim has been immobilised and you are REMOVING IT!

That's just plain unprofessional in a situation of heightened anxiety.

The ICE agents involved should have their body camera footage released to the public so professionals can analyse it and have mainstream reporters release it to the public. Then they should be prosecuted to the maximum extent of the law to set a precedent that this kind of incompetence is NOT acceptable!


The line has now been clearly explained. Pretti crossed that line. This is fact.
Ha ha ha! Buddy - you tell yourself that.

But I'm still just a bit hazy on the details.

So hazy that a I'm tempted to use a certain 3 letter acronym starting W.T...? but I try not to use that sort of language.

Asserting he crossed the line a thousand times does not PROVE he crossed the line, or even define this mythical line of yours.

But you do you!
Just tap your ruby slippers together 3 times.
"He crossed the line. He crossed the line. He crossed the line."

1769930888821.png
 
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Pommer

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Actually police are considered paramilitary. Even private security companies are considered paramilitary. Both use military standards as an operational model. Notice how police departments have sergeants, lieutenants and captains for example.

Paramilitary: (of an unofficial force) organized similarly to a military force.
What’s the Newspeak term for “Peace officers”?
 
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Pommer

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"I am talking about protestors entering a law enforcement operations. When officers tell them to stay away and then they keep crossing the line."
What line?

Are you talking about the masked ICE agents verbally telling them to stand back? What does that mean?
Did the officers set up a perimeter? What does the law say about such a perimeter? What does it say if they did NOT set up a perimeter? (They did NOT in this case, as the first video below critiques.)
In the interests of us all being on the same page.
In general, (and while the folks-on-the-ground are free to make their opinions known and are probably given the weight proportional to the trust their superiors), the decision to treat a protest as a riot is made @ City Hall.

Once the decision is made, the protesters and the general public are informed that the city is going to consider them “rioters” if they continue to protest…and there’s usually a time-delay, for cooler heads to prevail.

The Federal Agents don’t have a legal-authority allowing them to treat protesters as rioters.
But if they don’t “get into trouble” for doing it, they’ll continue to do it.*


*the Feds, though it works for “protesters”, too
 
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Servus

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What’s the Newspeak term for “Peace officers”?
Beats me. I just know that law enforcement agencies and even a lot of private security companies have always been paramilitary. I'd say the newspeak in that instance is the term paramilitary suddenly having sinister connotations and being used as a pejorative.
 
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