- Aug 18, 2012
- 26,174
- 22,053
- Country
- United States
- Gender
- Male
- Faith
- Christian
- Marital Status
- Married
Does that make her a "Demostic terrorist" as our DHS secretary declared within hours of her event?
Upvote
0
-
Starting today August 7th, 2024, in order to post in the Married Couples, Courting Couples, or Singles forums, you will not be allowed to post if you have your Marital status designated as private. Announcements will be made in the respective forums as well but please note that if yours is currently listed as Private, you will need to submit a ticket in the Support Area to have yours changed.
-
CF has always been a site that welcomes people from different backgrounds and beliefs to participate in discussion and even debate. That is the nature of its ministry. In view of recent events emotions are running very high. We need to remind people of some basic principles in debating on this site. We need to be civil when we express differences in opinion. No personal attacks. Avoid you, your statements. Don't characterize an entire political party with comparisons to Fascism or Communism or other extreme movements that committed atrocities. CF is not the place for broad brush or blanket statements about groups and political parties. Put the broad brushes and blankets away when you come to CF, better yet, put them in the incinerator. Debate had no place for them. We need to remember that people that commit acts of violence represent themselves or a small extreme faction.
-
We hope the site problems here are now solved, however,
if you still have any issues, please start a ticket in Contact Us
New documents shed light on Renee Good’s ties to ICE monitoring efforts in Minneapolis
- Thread starter ThatRobGuy
- Start date
Does that make her a "Demostic terrorist" as our DHS secretary declared within hours of her event?
Matt5
Well-Known Member
- Jun 12, 2019
- 1,065
- 452
- Country
- Switzerland
- Gender
- Male
- Faith
- Christian
- Marital Status
- Married
Civilian violence to affect a political outcome is terrorism.
Systematic, coordinated resistance that includes violence would fall under the terrorism umbrella. Resistance that attempts to harass and includes violence would also be terrorism.
Systematic, coordinated resistance to hinder ICE is a crime. It moves over to terrorism when violence is used.
18 U.S.C. § 111 — Assaulting, resisting, opposing, impeding, intimidating, or interfering with federal officers (including ICE agents) while they perform official duties. This covers forcible resistance, physical obstruction (e.g., blocking agents or vehicles), or other interference. Penalties range from misdemeanors (up to 1 year for simple cases) to felonies (up to 8–20+ years if involving injury, deadly weapons, or serious interference).
Renee was just leaving the scene of a crime, against the orders of ICE agents. And for no reason at all she got shot.
Does what happened to Renee "tugs at your heartstrings?" She was just an innocent mom protesting. See where this thinking is going to lead.
Now comes the muddle.
"The rule of law is not just about writing rules down. It means following them even when they yield an outcome that tugs at your heartstrings or runs contrary to your gut sense of which party is more sympathetic."
“The rule of law will not survive the legal profession becoming majority female.”
The Great Feminization | Compact
Now the rule of law gets muddled as women take over.
Systematic, coordinated resistance that includes violence would fall under the terrorism umbrella. Resistance that attempts to harass and includes violence would also be terrorism.
Systematic, coordinated resistance to hinder ICE is a crime. It moves over to terrorism when violence is used.
18 U.S.C. § 111 — Assaulting, resisting, opposing, impeding, intimidating, or interfering with federal officers (including ICE agents) while they perform official duties. This covers forcible resistance, physical obstruction (e.g., blocking agents or vehicles), or other interference. Penalties range from misdemeanors (up to 1 year for simple cases) to felonies (up to 8–20+ years if involving injury, deadly weapons, or serious interference).
Renee was just leaving the scene of a crime, against the orders of ICE agents. And for no reason at all she got shot.
Does what happened to Renee "tugs at your heartstrings?" She was just an innocent mom protesting. See where this thinking is going to lead.
Now comes the muddle.
"The rule of law is not just about writing rules down. It means following them even when they yield an outcome that tugs at your heartstrings or runs contrary to your gut sense of which party is more sympathetic."
“The rule of law will not survive the legal profession becoming majority female.”
The Great Feminization | Compact
Now the rule of law gets muddled as women take over.
Upvote
0
MarcusGregor
New year, new you...
- Oct 1, 2025
- 131
- 243
- 26
- Country
- United States
- Gender
- Male
- Faith
- Atheist
- Marital Status
- Married
- Politics
- US-Democrat
Upvote
0
- Sep 4, 2005
- 29,775
- 17,742
- Country
- United States
- Gender
- Male
- Faith
- Atheist
- Marital Status
- Single
- Politics
- US-Others
"Domestic terrorist"...I'd personally say no (since it can't be proven that she was trying to strike the officer with the vehicle)
Borderline felonious? Possibly.
I'd have to read up on Minnesota statutes on such matters, but I know in some jurisdictions actively organizing and encouraging others to commit offenses can carry harsher penalties than actually engaging in it yourself.
I'd say organizing, and distributing literature: encouraging a refusal to “comply with demands, requests, and orders.” It suggests “creative tactics,” noting that “Crowds, props, traffic, and noise can make detentions difficult, sometimes ICE vehicles can’t move (‘whoops!’).”
...is treading that line.
Upvote
0
Hans Blaster
Area Meathead
- Mar 11, 2017
- 24,087
- 17,731
- 56
- Country
- United States
- Gender
- Male
- Faith
- Atheist
- Marital Status
- Private
- Politics
- US-Democrat
Not necessarily. Terrorism is violent political strategy that uses *fear* and *terror* to affect political change.
Not all violence, even political violence" is terrorism.
18 USC 111 is not a terrorism statute.
Upvote
0
Richard T
Well-Known Member
- Mar 25, 2018
- 3,803
- 2,390
- Country
- United States
- Gender
- Male
- Faith
- Non-Denom
- Marital Status
- Single
I know a case where a car purposely try to run a man over. The man responded byfiring a handgun striking the car but not the driver. His central defense was that he acted in self-defense because the vehicle was driving toward him. However, appellate courts determined the evidence supported the jury’s finding that his use of deadly force was not necessary or reasonable under the circumstances." Google ai
To me, the rate of speed of the vehicle would not kill or injure him. This is confirmed by the statistics.
"At speeds less than 10 mph, the likelihood of a pedestrian dying is very low, estimated to be around 0.5 percent
"Impact Speed and a Pedestrian's Risk of ...
Sep 14, 2011 — Results show that the average risk of severe injury for a pedestrian struck by a vehicle reaches 10% at an impact speed of 16 mph"
AAA Foundation for Traffic Safety
Instead of trying tomove out of the way, he drew his firearm and shot in anger, as he called her a ------- -----. No doubt his past experience being dragged 100 feet influenced his negative disposition.
That the officers failed to try and give aid shows their disregard for human life. https://people.com/doctor-tried-to-help-woman-shot-by-ice-but-was-blocked-by-agents-11881473
At a minimum he, the other officers and whoever made the decision to reinstate him after his previous accident should be fired. It seems possible a jury would convict similar to the case i quoted. That case did not even have a death.
I base this too on how officers are not supposed to get in the front or behind a vehicle.
To me, the rate of speed of the vehicle would not kill or injure him. This is confirmed by the statistics.
"At speeds less than 10 mph, the likelihood of a pedestrian dying is very low, estimated to be around 0.5 percent
"Impact Speed and a Pedestrian's Risk of ...
Sep 14, 2011 — Results show that the average risk of severe injury for a pedestrian struck by a vehicle reaches 10% at an impact speed of 16 mph"
AAA Foundation for Traffic Safety
Instead of trying tomove out of the way, he drew his firearm and shot in anger, as he called her a ------- -----. No doubt his past experience being dragged 100 feet influenced his negative disposition.
That the officers failed to try and give aid shows their disregard for human life. https://people.com/doctor-tried-to-help-woman-shot-by-ice-but-was-blocked-by-agents-11881473
At a minimum he, the other officers and whoever made the decision to reinstate him after his previous accident should be fired. It seems possible a jury would convict similar to the case i quoted. That case did not even have a death.
I base this too on how officers are not supposed to get in the front or behind a vehicle.
Upvote
0
- Sep 4, 2005
- 29,775
- 17,742
- Country
- United States
- Gender
- Male
- Faith
- Atheist
- Marital Status
- Single
- Politics
- US-Others
Not sure if (or how, due to HIPAA) these would be verified, but multiple news agencies are reporting that Ross suffered internal bleeding after the incident
www.cbsnews.com
ICE agent who shot Renee Good suffered internal bleeding, officials say
Jonathan Ross, who shot Renee Good in Minneapolis last week, suffered internal bleeding after the incident, two officials said, though it's not clear how extensive the bleeding was.
www.cbsnews.com
Upvote
0
- Sep 4, 2005
- 29,775
- 17,742
- Country
- United States
- Gender
- Male
- Faith
- Atheist
- Marital Status
- Single
- Politics
- US-Others
What you're seeing in some of the responses (as I'm sure you've noticed) is becoming a more common tactic...where when people object to an amount of force being used, they'll attempt to reduce an action to it's most innocent/benign sounding description, and then compare the level of force used to that in order to portray an exaggerated disproportionality.
One could just as easily say "sticking ones hands in their pockets isn't a capital offense".
However, if an officer telling me repeatedly "keep your hands when I can see them", and I reach into my pockets, it's not going to end well.
It's not unlike some of the other stories, where you'll hear of a police shooting, and the first thing they'll do is show you an Olan Mills looking yearbook photo and mention that the person was on the track team, with some sort of generic quote from a family member like "He loved to laugh". It's to stack the deck emotionally so that people already think the cop is a villain before all of the details come out.
Upvote
0
I don't know what her actual intent was. It doesn't matter. Because rhe officer didn't know either. What matters is if he had reasonable apprehension based upon the circumstances that existed at the time she drove her vehicle at him and hit him.
Upvote
0
They aren't simply monitoring activities. As was shown they are actually training and learning to obstruct and hinder law enforcement activities. Which IS a crime.
Upvote
0
I pointed out during the Babit case that based upon the actions of the group she was with this appeared to be justifiable use of of force. They weren't just trespassing, but were breaking through a barricaded space in a tumultuous manner which could lead those inside to believe they were in serious danger.
I still stand by that as I stand by the fact that the officer in this case could behave reasonable apprehension that he was in serious danger as well.
Upvote
0
I would say no. She was a radical leftist who joined a radical leftist cauae and was breaking the law. That doesn't automatically make her a domestic terrorist. The fact that she hit rhe officer with her car muddies it a little, but I'm not convinced she was a domestic terrorist..
Upvote
0
That's being debated at this time. It actually could have been said by another officer. I don't think we have an answer to that. But even if he did, its a legitimate verbal response to someone who just scared the crap out of you and hit you with their car.
Upvote
0
com7fy8
Well-Known Member
- May 22, 2013
- 14,932
- 6,723
- Country
- United States
- Gender
- Male
- Faith
- Christian
- Marital Status
- Single
Well, now it is reported how certain ones try to ambush ICE people, even firing guns at them. So, if I interfere with movement of ICE people, I can be helping a murderer to have more opportunity to shoot at and kill an agent who has been slowed or stopped so the agent is easier for me to kill the person.
The one who is helping to make agents easier to kill, by interfering with their movement, could be charged with conspiracy to commit murder, then, perhaps. So . . . would it be legal to shoot someone who is doing what can help killers to kill ICE people?
Even if you don't directly run your vehicle at someone, you can be interfering with them efficiently doing their job so they can get away from a potential ambush area.
Of course, I have had ***some*** time to think this up! What that shooter was thinking, I do not know.
But you could establish a directive that from now on, any activity which can help make ICE agents an easier ambush target can be considered conspiracy to commit murder. Never mind "terrorism" and that stuff. There are ambushers, don't help them.
Upvote
0
- Sep 4, 2005
- 29,775
- 17,742
- Country
- United States
- Gender
- Male
- Faith
- Atheist
- Marital Status
- Single
- Politics
- US-Others
That or people could simply not intentionally escalate things by being as obnoxious as possible.
The way I described it before is that of an obnoxious younger sibling who sticks their finger an inch from your eye and says "see, I'm not touching you, I'm not touching you", and when they get their hand slapped away, cry to mom saying "he hit me!"
The megaphone & whistles thing seems to be becoming more popular. Where they'll get 3-4 inches from the persons ear, and blow the whistle as loud as they can, or sound the megaphone horn, or they'll follow the ICE agents around, and then lay on the horn while they're trying to talk.
As I was perusing some Facebook groups earlier, I noticed people mentioning the similar tactics that Good was instructing people to do. They also mentioned a reason for being as noisy and obnoxious as possible is two-fold.
1) If they're being so noisy that they distract the officer, and they make a slip up while reading someone their rights, it gets the person off the hook
2) If the person being arrested says "I didn't understand my rights, because I could see that the officer was saying something, but there was too much noise so I didn't hear it", it also gives them a legal defense.
I always thought this scene from the HBO show "The Newsroom" did a good job presenting what the flaws are in the modern methods of protest
Upvote
0
BasedLutheran
Active Member
Interfering =/= 'monitoring'. And yes, when that interfering involves running into an officer with your vehicle, self defense and resulting death, is very much appropriate
Upvote
0
- Sep 4, 2005
- 29,775
- 17,742
- Country
- United States
- Gender
- Male
- Faith
- Atheist
- Marital Status
- Single
- Politics
- US-Others
Correct, I snipped out the part about the vehicle contact because that has the potential to go down the rabbit hole.
But yes, monitoring doesn't involve honking your horn, bringing megaphones, blowing whistles, and making a spectacle of oneself.
If anything, quite the opposite. Effective monitoring would involve a certain element of covertness.
If I was suspecting someone in my neighborhood of something illegal, I'd be busting out the zoom lens from a good distance (going out of my way NOT to be seen) and then sending an anonymous tip with the recording to my local news station. Not parking my car cockeyed across the driveway, honking the horn, while I have my GF jumping out of a car and making a scene.
Dare I say, some people want to "go viral" for "cred" more than they actually sincerely care about a cause?
Similar to how some of those social media personalities hand out food to the homeless (which is a fine and noble thing on its own), but the camera needs to be rolling when they do it so they can upload it and get likes and visibility as part of cultivating their "brand".
Upvote
0
Hans Blaster
Area Meathead
- Mar 11, 2017
- 24,087
- 17,731
- 56
- Country
- United States
- Gender
- Male
- Faith
- Atheist
- Marital Status
- Private
- Politics
- US-Democrat
Of course ICE shouldn't be shooting people for trespass, but these incidents are taking place in public places and ICE isn't authorized to police trespass in the first place.
Upvote
0
Similar threads
- Locked
