• Starting today August 7th, 2024, in order to post in the Married Couples, Courting Couples, or Singles forums, you will not be allowed to post if you have your Marital status designated as private. Announcements will be made in the respective forums as well but please note that if yours is currently listed as Private, you will need to submit a ticket in the Support Area to have yours changed.

  • CF has always been a site that welcomes people from different backgrounds and beliefs to participate in discussion and even debate. That is the nature of its ministry. In view of recent events emotions are running very high. We need to remind people of some basic principles in debating on this site. We need to be civil when we express differences in opinion. No personal attacks. Avoid you, your statements. Don't characterize an entire political party with comparisons to Fascism or Communism or other extreme movements that committed atrocities. CF is not the place for broad brush or blanket statements about groups and political parties. Put the broad brushes and blankets away when you come to CF, better yet, put them in the incinerator. Debate had no place for them. We need to remember that people that commit acts of violence represent themselves or a small extreme faction.
  • We hope the site problems here are now solved, however, if you still have any issues, please start a ticket in Contact Us

How much do demons know?

Michie

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
Feb 5, 2002
186,525
68,819
Woods
✟6,243,863.00
Country
United States
Gender
Female
Faith
Catholic
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Others
On October 27, 1989, while walking from her Middle School in Bay Village, Ohio, to a local shopping center, 10-year-old Amy Mihaljevic was kidnapped. Sadly, on February 8, 1990, the girl's body was found in a rural Ashland County, Ohio field. To date, Amy’s killer has not been identified.

In a documentary detailing the events surrounding her kidnapping and murder, Amy’s best friend revealed that just before Mihaljevic’s kidnapping, she and Amy had been playing with a Ouija Board in Amy’s room. Amy jokingly asked the board when she was going to die. With both girls’ hands lightly touching the board’s pointer, it moved slowly and spelled out one word.

S-O-O-N

Those who have studied the subject of demonology warn that occult tools such as Ouija Boards can act as points of contact between people and the demonic. If that happened in this case, and Amy and her friend were unlucky enough to come into contact with a demon, how did it know that Amy was about to die?

And, bumping things up to a higher-level question, how much knowledge do demons actually have?

The mind of a demon

Continued below.
 

The Liturgist

Traditional Liturgical Christian
Site Supporter
Nov 26, 2019
16,648
8,877
51
The Wild West
✟865,048.00
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Faith
Generic Orthodox Christian
Marital Status
Celibate
On October 27, 1989, while walking from her Middle School in Bay Village, Ohio, to a local shopping center, 10-year-old Amy Mihaljevic was kidnapped. Sadly, on February 8, 1990, the girl's body was found in a rural Ashland County, Ohio field. To date, Amy’s killer has not been identified.

In a documentary detailing the events surrounding her kidnapping and murder, Amy’s best friend revealed that just before Mihaljevic’s kidnapping, she and Amy had been playing with a Ouija Board in Amy’s room. Amy jokingly asked the board when she was going to die. With both girls’ hands lightly touching the board’s pointer, it moved slowly and spelled out one word.

S-O-O-N

Those who have studied the subject of demonology warn that occult tools such as Ouija Boards can act as points of contact between people and the demonic. If that happened in this case, and Amy and her friend were unlucky enough to come into contact with a demon, how did it know that Amy was about to die?

And, bumping things up to a higher-level question, how much knowledge do demons actually have?

The mind of a demon

Continued below.

According to the Desert Fathers and Orthodox monastics, both Eastern and Oriental (Coptic, Syriac, Ethiopian, Armenian), demons do not possess foreknowledge of the future, but will trick humans into thinking they do, because their spiritual nature allows them to travel instantly and to be aware of events occurring in once place someone might not be aware of, and of conspiracies that could probably result in a certain outcome. But anyone who falls into the trap of listening to them is placing themselves in extreme danger, for the demons will exploit the ever-growing confidence with disastrous effects. For this reason, Orthodox clergy take a dim view of ouija boards, the occult and divination, but stand ready to receive any youths who have a traumatic experience or realize such things are evil with open and loving arms.

Thus, demons possess a frightening amount of information, even though they do not know the future, but they have more than enough information to trick and deceive and manipulate us, whenever we forget to ask: What use is knowledge of the future, or anything else, without love?

In Orthodoxy we make the Sign of the Cross constantly, and say the Jesus Prayer “Lord Jesus Christ, Son of God, Have Mercy on me, a Sinner” or “Kyrie Eleison” or other arrow prayers such as the Angelic Salutation of the Theotokos, because demons really hate this.

When I visited a monastery for the first time I was plagued by nightmares, until a monk told me to say the Jesus Prayer, and it worked. Demons do not want us going to monasteries, or any sacred place.
 
Upvote 0

RandyPNW

Well-Known Member
Jun 8, 2021
3,767
860
Pacific NW, USA
✟187,550.00
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Republican
On October 27, 1989, while walking from her Middle School in Bay Village, Ohio, to a local shopping center, 10-year-old Amy Mihaljevic was kidnapped. Sadly, on February 8, 1990, the girl's body was found in a rural Ashland County, Ohio field. To date, Amy’s killer has not been identified.

In a documentary detailing the events surrounding her kidnapping and murder, Amy’s best friend revealed that just before Mihaljevic’s kidnapping, she and Amy had been playing with a Ouija Board in Amy’s room. Amy jokingly asked the board when she was going to die. With both girls’ hands lightly touching the board’s pointer, it moved slowly and spelled out one word.

S-O-O-N

Those who have studied the subject of demonology warn that occult tools such as Ouija Boards can act as points of contact between people and the demonic. If that happened in this case, and Amy and her friend were unlucky enough to come into contact with a demon, how did it know that Amy was about to die?

And, bumping things up to a higher-level question, how much knowledge do demons actually have?

The mind of a demon

Continued below.
I tend to ignore stories about demons. I would rather listen to stories about Christ.
 
Upvote 0

tturt

Senior Veteran
Site Supporter
Oct 30, 2006
16,227
7,682
✟1,039,663.00
Gender
Female
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married
I understand but "Lest Satan should get an advantage of us: for we are not ignorant of his devices." II Cor 2:11

"Put on the whole armour of God, that ye may be able to stand against the wiles of the devil." Eph 6:11
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0

Bob Crowley

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
Dec 27, 2015
4,136
2,608
71
Logan City
✟1,022,023.00
Country
Australia
Gender
Male
Faith
Catholic
Marital Status
Married
While the devil and demons can't see the future, they can put two and two together pretty well.

Fr. Jose Fortea answered this question in his book "Interview with an Exorcist".

11. Do demons know the future?

No. Demons do not have knowledge of future events. In addition, what belongs to human freedom is undetermined; they do no know in advance our free choices. However, since their intelligence is far superior to ours, they can often predict the future simply by observation and deduction. With their superior intelligence, they can see the effects of certain causes whereas we would perceive nothing. Thus, there are times when they can accurately predict what will happen, even though the most intelligent of human beings would not even suspect such a result, no matter how many factors are analyzed in the present. On other occasions, due to the complexities and variability of human action, even the most powerful angelic intellect can be mistaken in its prediction.

One thing they can do is to listen in to conversations. I've said before my Presbyterian pastor was prophetic. He predicted that I would join the Catholic Church, and the devil or a demon would have heard him say that. When the time was approaching whenever I drove past a Catholic Church I'd get this odd sense I should make a move. But then something would always seem to come up with an objection.

It might have been me, but I suspect it was a combined effort - a demonic discouragement if you like added to my own wariness, since they'd already been tipped off by the pastor. They'd have known the pastor to be a stalwart servant of God, and would have known God was telling him of this future event.

Sometimes they know things simply by listening in.

If I thought about it a bit more, I could probably come up with a better example, but I'd need to be sure it fit the bill first.
 
Upvote 0

The Liturgist

Traditional Liturgical Christian
Site Supporter
Nov 26, 2019
16,648
8,877
51
The Wild West
✟865,048.00
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Faith
Generic Orthodox Christian
Marital Status
Celibate
While the devil and demons can't see the future, they can put two and two together pretty well.

Fr. Jose Fortea answered this question in his book "Interview with an Exorcist".



One thing they can do is to listen in to conversations. I've said before my Presbyterian pastor was prophetic. He predicted that I would join the Catholic Church, and the devil or a demon would have heard him say that. When the time was approaching whenever I drove past a Catholic Church I'd get this odd sense I should make a move. But then something would always seem to come up with an objection.

It might have been me, but I suspect it was a combined effort - a demonic discouragement if you like added to my own wariness, since they'd already been tipped off by the pastor. They'd have known the pastor to be a stalwart servant of God, and would have known God was telling him of this future event.

Sometimes they know things simply by listening in.

If I thought about it a bit more, I could probably come up with a better example, but I'd need to be sure it fit the bill first.

This corresponds with the Orthodox understanding.
 
Upvote 0

MarkRohfrietsch

Unapologetic Apologist
Site Supporter
Dec 8, 2007
31,205
6,033
✟1,063,365.00
Country
Canada
Gender
Male
Faith
Lutheran
Marital Status
Married
Speaking from personal experience, one of our Pastors cautioned us that they know a lot; enough to dig up past indiscretions and sins and throw them in your face during the performance of an exorcism, things that the demoniac has no way of knowing.
 
  • Winner
Reactions: The Liturgist
Upvote 0

MarkRohfrietsch

Unapologetic Apologist
Site Supporter
Dec 8, 2007
31,205
6,033
✟1,063,365.00
Country
Canada
Gender
Male
Faith
Lutheran
Marital Status
Married
I tend to ignore stories about demons. I would rather listen to stories about Christ.
Know your enemy; Satan and the demons know their enemy, and they tremble. They know that they have already lost, and want to take as many with them as they can.
 
  • Agree
Reactions: The Liturgist
Upvote 0

The Liturgist

Traditional Liturgical Christian
Site Supporter
Nov 26, 2019
16,648
8,877
51
The Wild West
✟865,048.00
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Faith
Generic Orthodox Christian
Marital Status
Celibate
Demons have had billions of hours studying human behavior, and human behavior is the same now as it ever was.

Not quite - through Christ and the indwelling of the Holy Spirit, some people are able to improve, and many others are able to count on God’s infinite mercy, which is why demons now run from the sign of the Cross and the name of our Lord, for Christ has plundered and despoiled Hades, trampling down death by death.

This does not mean demons are not dangerous, but that Christians have help we can count on - according to the economy of salvation, our guardian angel protects us, our fellow Christians, both those contending in this life and those who have won the race - the Holy Martyrs, Confessors, Apostles, Prophets, Patriarchs, Ascetics, Evangelists, and all the saints, especially our glorious Lady Theotokos and Ever Virgin Mary pray for us, God the Holy Spirit indwells us, and Christ our True God saves us through His body and blood offered for us and for many on the Holy and Life Giving Cross, revealing to us in His person likeness of God the unoriginate Father, in whose essence the uncreated, coeternal and coequal Son and Holy Spirit abide, three persons, ever one God, pure love and beyond our ability to comprehend, except in that Christ has revealed it by putting on our human nature, restoring it, glorifying it and uniting it with His divinity in one hypostasis (underlying reality), without change, confusion, separation or division.

This gives us blessings that until the events that happened in the Incarnation, Baptism, Transfiguration, Passion, Resurrection and Ascension of Christ and the descent of the Holy Spirit between roughly 2,032 years ago and 1,993 years ago were limited to at most a handful of prophets such as St. Eiljah close enough to God to be taken up bodily.
 
Upvote 0

The Liturgist

Traditional Liturgical Christian
Site Supporter
Nov 26, 2019
16,648
8,877
51
The Wild West
✟865,048.00
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Faith
Generic Orthodox Christian
Marital Status
Celibate
Know your enemy; Satan and the demons know their enemy, and they tremble. They know that they have already lost, and want to take as many with them as they can.

And know how to make the, tremble, through the Sign of the Cross, the Jesus Prayer (and also simply Kyrie Eleison), the name of Christ, the mention of the Theotokos and others,
 
Upvote 0

The Liturgist

Traditional Liturgical Christian
Site Supporter
Nov 26, 2019
16,648
8,877
51
The Wild West
✟865,048.00
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Faith
Generic Orthodox Christian
Marital Status
Celibate
Speaking from personal experience, one of our Pastors cautioned us that they know a lot; enough to dig up past indiscretions and sins and throw them in your face during the performance of an exorcism, things that the demoniac has no way of knowing.

Through confession, auricular and congregational, we can obtain forgiveness for the same and thus be untroubled by the demons if they try that. Not that I want to appear to he making light of exorcism, which is solemn and should be left to the most experienced clergy, except insofar as we routinely exorcise everyone received into the Church through baptism - even the Holy Water of the font and the salt used to trace the sign of the Cross within it.
 
Upvote 0

RDKirk

Alien, Pilgrim, and Sojourner
Site Supporter
Mar 3, 2013
42,979
23,712
US
✟1,812,521.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
Not quite - through Christ and the indwelling of the Holy Spirit, some people are able to improve, and many others are able to count on God’s infinite mercy, which is why demons now run from the sign of the Cross and the name of our Lord, for Christ has plundered and despoiled Hades, trampling down death by death.
Yes, quite.

I said "human behavior." Through Christ and the indwelling of the Holy Spirit, Christians have the mind of Christ.

Demons have humans figured out.

They don't have Christ figured out.

The only way we ever fool a demon or catch one off guard when we take the step the Holy Spirit directs. That's the only time a demon says, "Didn't see that coming."
 
  • Like
Reactions: The Liturgist
Upvote 0

RandyPNW

Well-Known Member
Jun 8, 2021
3,767
860
Pacific NW, USA
✟187,550.00
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Republican
Know your enemy; Satan and the demons know their enemy, and they tremble. They know that they have already lost, and want to take as many with them as they can.
Yes, I have no unwillingness to address issues involving Satan and demons. My point (not so well made) is that demon-inspired propaganda should be ignored. That's why God in the Law told Israel to avoid seances, astrologers, possessed people, etc. Don't listen to musers or prognosticators supposedly filled with spirits and led by liars who wish to do damage to God's Kingdom.
 
Upvote 0

MarkRohfrietsch

Unapologetic Apologist
Site Supporter
Dec 8, 2007
31,205
6,033
✟1,063,365.00
Country
Canada
Gender
Male
Faith
Lutheran
Marital Status
Married
Yes, quite.

I said "human behavior." Through Christ and the indwelling of the Holy Spirit, Christians have the mind of Christ.

Demons have humans figured out.

They don't have Christ figured out.

The only way we ever fool a demon or catch one off guard when we take the step the Holy Spirit directs. That's the only time a demon says, "Didn't see that coming."
Pretty hard for them not to have Christ figured out; Christ's victorious decent into hell, they know they are defeated, but, as I posted above, they are going to try to take as many souls as they can.
 
Upvote 0

RDKirk

Alien, Pilgrim, and Sojourner
Site Supporter
Mar 3, 2013
42,979
23,712
US
✟1,812,521.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
Pretty hard for them not to have Christ figured out; Christ's victorious decent into hell, they know they are defeated, but, as I posted above, they are going to try to take as many souls as they can.
They know the end story, but they don't know how the Holy Spirit guides the day-by-day steps Christians take when we have the mind of Christ. Christ's actions caught demons by surprise while He walked the earth, and so can Christians.
 
Upvote 0

RandyPNW

Well-Known Member
Jun 8, 2021
3,767
860
Pacific NW, USA
✟187,550.00
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Republican
According to the Desert Fathers and Orthodox monastics, both Eastern and Oriental (Coptic, Syriac, Ethiopian, Armenian), demons do not possess foreknowledge of the future, but will trick humans into thinking they do, because their spiritual nature allows them to travel instantly and to be aware of events occurring in once place someone might not be aware of, and of conspiracies that could probably result in a certain outcome. But anyone who falls into the trap of listening to them is placing themselves in extreme danger, for the demons will exploit the ever-growing confidence with disastrous effects. For this reason, Orthodox clergy take a dim view of ouija boards, the occult and divination, but stand ready to receive any youths who have a traumatic experience or realize such things are evil with open and loving arms.

Thus, demons possess a frightening amount of information, even though they do not know the future, but they have more than enough information to trick and deceive and manipulate us, whenever we forget to ask: What use is knowledge of the future, or anything else, without love?

In Orthodoxy we make the Sign of the Cross constantly, and say the Jesus Prayer “Lord Jesus Christ, Son of God, Have Mercy on me, a Sinner” or “Kyrie Eleison” or other arrow prayers such as the Angelic Salutation of the Theotokos, because demons really hate this.

When I visited a monastery for the first time I was plagued by nightmares, until a monk told me to say the Jesus Prayer, and it worked. Demons do not want us going to monasteries, or any sacred place.
Yea, I can see that. In my experience, demons don't like being around those regularly walking with the Lord because they are instantly exposed. And they don't like to be exposed. They thrive on fear.

There have been times when in my weakness nothing I could do could make them go away--I just had to wait it out. What horrible, ugly creatures with great hate for the Lord. We have to let God fight the battles, unless He instructs us to do something about it.

I found that I brought on evil thoughts because I had indulged in things that gave them space. I've tried to close all doors to the occult.

I'm all for any kind of engaging in disciplines, rituals, or practices that glorify God and Christ. Practicing love prevents us from failing to help those afflicted by evil. In this we agree.
 
Upvote 0

Richard T

Well-Known Member
Mar 25, 2018
3,783
2,377
traveling Asia
✟154,268.00
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Single
The demon was using the power if suggestion to sow fear in the girls. The fear took root and the demon communicated it to others demons who took up their places. The alternative is that the death was already on the schedul. That schedule is subject to God, though no doubt the demons have plans to kill steal and destroy. Sadly, the evil manifested and Satan even gotbthe false glory printed so it could sow future maniplulations in the minds of readers unaware of their authority in Christ. It seems likely that a single intercessor could have stood in the gap and the girl would be alive. Im guessing too that there is a family history of some type of demonic involvement. Could be the place is heavily demonic too.Regardless, the door was opened to evil and the death occured. It should make us angry, angry enough to take our authority in Christ and be the salt God intended.
 
  • Like
Reactions: johansen
Upvote 0

Dan Perez

Well-Known Member
Dec 13, 2018
4,886
410
89
Arcadia
✟281,465.00
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
And this what the APOSTLES TO. THE GENTILES has written. about DEMONS since SATAN was thrown from. heaven

# 1 NOW. /// DE. is a CONJUNCATION

# 2. THE ///. HO. is a DEFINITE ARTICLE. in. the NOMINATIVE CASE in. the SINGULAR in. the HEUTER

# 3 SPIRIT. ///. PNEUNA. in. the NOMINATIVE CASE in. the SIGNULAR. in. the HEUTER. meaning MALE. and FEMALE

# 4. SPEAKETH. ///. LEGO. in. the PRESENT TENSE. means DEMONS are here since SATAN. out on heaven in. the ACTIVE VOICE

in. the INDICATIVE MOOD in. the SINGULAR

# 5 EXPRESSLY. ///. METOS. is an. ADVERB

# 6. THAT. ///. HOTI. is a CONJUNCATION

# 7 IN. ///. EN. is. a PREPOSTION

# 8. THE LATTER. ///. HYSTEROS. in. the DATIVE CASE. in. the PLURAL

# 9 TIMES. ///. KAIROS. in. the DATIVE CASE in. the PLURAL

# 10 SOME. // TIS. INDEFINTE PRONOUN. in. the NOMINATIVE CASE. in the PLURAL

# 11. SHALL DEPARTE FROM. ///. APHISTEMI. in the FUTURE TENSE in. the MIDDLE VOICE. in. the INDICATIVE MOOD. means

you better BELIEVE IT

# 12. THE. /// HO is a DEFINITE ARTICLE. in. the GENITIVE CASE in. the SINGULAR

# 13. FAITH. ///. PISTIS. in the GENITIVE CASE. in. the SINGULAR

# 14. GIVING. HEED ///. PROSECHO. in the PRESENT TENSE. in the ACTIVE VOICE. is a PARTICIPLE CASE

in the NORMINATIVE CASE in. the PLURAL

# 15. TO SEDUCING /// PLANOS. in. the DATIVE CASE in. the PLURAL in. the NEUTER

# 16 AND /// KAI. is a CONJUNCATION

# 17. DOCTRINES ///. DIDOSKALA. in. the DATIVE CASE in. the PLURAL

# 18. OF DEVILS. ///. DAMONION. in. the DATIVE CASE in. the PLURAL

And just watch TV. and see all. of the apostles that promise you , even money and see what they are TEACHING

dan P
 
Upvote 0