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Trump sued by preservationists seeking reviews and congressional approval for ballroom project

ThatRobGuy

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Yes, I know but neither of them are your picture.

This is the Oval ballroom (Langhans hall)
View attachment 374443

And this is the Great hall
View attachment 374444

Neither of which is pictured in your post.

Well, looks I had the wrong picture for that one example... doesn't negate the fact that it's still nicer than having people in Tuxedos eating in tents in the back yard.

Plus, I provided numerous other examples.

The main point was that wanting to have a "fancy" venue to host receptions that's on official property is by no means "uniquely Trump'ish"
 
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Stopped_lurking

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Well, looks I had the wrong picture for that one example... doesn't negate the fact that it's still nicer than having people in Tuxedos eating in tents in the back yard.

Plus, I provided numerous other examples.

The main point was that wanting to have a "fancy" venue to host receptions that's on official property is by no means "uniquely Trump'ish"
But it shows that you don't need a very large hall, or a very gaudy one. No other president have started the building of a ballroom before so it seems as far as American presidents go, it is uniquely Trump'ish.
 
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Goonie

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How is it ham-fisted?

Are the construction steps being done out of order? Anything concerning with the blueprints or the floor plan?


From what I'm reading, this is the construction company slated to handle the project

They seem to know what they're doing. (they've done everything from Amazon buildings, to professional stadiums, to office HQs)
Great please show us the agreed plans, planning permission etc that Amazon building, stadiums and other non hamfisted projects submit.
 
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Hans Blaster

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Being that they were able to handle the renovation and expansions to the Smithsonian National Air & Space museum project (that building wasn't exactly a "spring chicken" either), I think they'll be fine.

They also did the Cannon House (which is home to several congressional offices), that was a building that was almost 120 years old.
You could have started there. This is finally getting close. (Though I don' think either Air & Space or Cannon was built with wooden beams and load barring masonry walls.)
This one would also demonstrate that they have some "chops" with regards to working with historical structures.
 
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ThatRobGuy

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Great please show us the agreed plans, planning permission etc that Amazon building, stadiums and other non hamfisted projects submit.
They have their project portfolio on their website, and I've already listed several of them.

Everything from major stadiums, to modern buildings, to the Smithsonian National Air and Space Museum, to historic buildings in DC, to historic buildings at universities.


Do you think a multi-billion per year revenue construction company (that's done a lot of their work in DC) doesn't know about the DC planning/permit process?

If you peruse their portfolio, they've also done work for University of California buildings and the San Francisco municipal government (which is a state with a notoriously convoluted and extensive permitting and red-tape environment...so they've worked under tougher conditions)
 
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Goonie

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They have their project portfolio on their website, and I've already listed several of them.

Everything from major stadiums, to modern buildings, to the Smithsonian National Air and Space Museum, to historic buildings in DC, to historic buildings at universities.


Do you think a multi-billion per year revenue construction company (that's done a lot of their work in DC) doesn't know about the DC planning/permit process?

If you peruse their portfolio, they've also done work for University of California buildings and the San Francisco municipal government (which is a state with a notoriously convoluted and extensive permitting and red-tape environment...so they've worked under tougher conditions)
That’s great now has the ballroom gone through any of the planning/permit process? No demolished without a set plan.
 
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ThatRobGuy

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But it shows that you don't need a very large hall, or a very gaudy one. No other president have started the building of a ballroom before so it seems as far as American presidents go, it is uniquely Trump'ish.

Would the reaction to this be the same had any other non-Trump president went down this path? ...just if you had to take a wild guess.

It seems as if (based on a few of the other posts), people seem to assume that because it was a Trump idea, that it's going to be the worst of everything.

To me, it feels like the inverse of the whole "Obama put in a basketball court" outrage.
 
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Goonie

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Would the reaction to this be the same had any other non-Trump president went down this path? ...just if you had to take a wild guess.

It seems as if (based on a few of the other posts), people seem to assume that because it was a Trump idea, that it's going to be the worst of everything.

To me, it feels like the inverse of the whole "Obama put in a basketball court" outrage.
Wow turning an existimg tennis court into a basketball court is soooooo comparable….Not!
 
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ThatRobGuy

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That’s great now has the ballroom gone through any of the planning/permit process? No demolished without a set plan.

In September, the commission chair clarified during a public meeting of the NCPC that the approval process is only required for construction, not demolition or site preparation work.

Given that Clark Construction is handling the construction work, and Shalom Baranes is handling the architectural designs and plans
(they've done design work for the Pentagon, Treasury Building, and Red Cross historic headquarters)


I think it's pretty safe to say that they know what they're doing.

Shalom Baranes Associates won the American Institute of Architects' Institute Honor Award for Regional and Urban Design for their design for Burnham Place,[3] a $7 billion development of the air rights over the Amtrak and CSX railway tracks behind the Washington Union Station railway terminal.[4]

The firm is also the architect for two apartment buildings which are part of the $1 billion CityCenterDC development. SBA also assisted with the master plan for the development.[5][6]

On December 4, 2025, it was announced that Shalom Baranes had been selected by President Donald Trump to pick up the design of the new White House State Ballroom that will replace the demolished East Wing of the White House complex.
[7]
 
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Hans Blaster

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To me, it feels like the inverse of the whole "Obama put in a basketball court" outrage.
That could be, because as a tried and true believer that "both sides are bad", you mistakenly assume that the bad things each side does are equivalent.
 
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Goonie

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In September, the commission chair clarified during a public meeting of the NCPC that the approval process is only required for construction, not demolition or site preparation work.

Given that Clark Construction is handling the construction work, and Shalom Baranes is handling the architectural designs and plans
(they've done design work for the Pentagon, Treasury Building, and Red Cross historic headquarters)


I think it's pretty safe to say that they know what they're doing.

Shalom Baranes Associates won the American Institute of Architects' Institute Honor Award for Regional and Urban Design for their design for Burnham Place,[3] a $7 billion development of the air rights over the Amtrak and CSX railway tracks behind the Washington Union Station railway terminal.[4]

The firm is also the architect for two apartment buildings which are part of the $1 billion CityCenterDC development. SBA also assisted with the master plan for the development.[5][6]

On December 4, 2025, it was announced that Shalom Baranes had been selected by President Donald Trump to pick up the design of the new White House State Ballroom that will replace the demolished East Wing of the White House complex.
[7]
Cool, so wholly legit to demolish the residence without planning in order to build in proportion to the new east wing.
 
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ThatRobGuy

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Wow turning an existimg tennis court into a basketball court is soooooo comparable….Not!


Perhaps a better parallel to draw would be to compare this to Operation Warp Speed from his first term.

Where naysayers on the left half of the political spectrum were saying that they didn't trust the speed of the vaccine development and rollout because they didn't trust Trump. "I'm not going to take it just because Trump wants to rush the process"

Fast-forward a little bit, turns out the vaccine was just fine, and that very same vaccine became the thing by which they judged other people based on their willingness or unwillingness to take it.
 
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ThatRobGuy

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That could be, because as a tried and true believer that "both sides are bad", you mistakenly assume that the bad things each side does are equivalent.
In this instance, it's that both sides are petty.

Maybe if Trump named this "Operation Warp Speed 2", history can repeat itself and it'll be another thing they initially claim to hate it and not trust it, but then a Democratic successor will take over and say the ballroom is good, and everyone should embrace it, then conservatives can sour on it, and their liberal family members can disinvite them from Thanksgiving dinner over their refusal to embrace the ballroom.
 
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Hans Blaster

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In this instance, it's that both sides are petty.
I can tell you why this isn't petty and a few things that *are* petty in opposition to Trump, but you said something silly in the next paragraph, so...
Maybe if Trump named this "Operation Warp Speed 2", history can repeat itself and it'll be another thing they initially claim to hate it and not trust it,
This is a very silly (one could almost say "petty") example given the fluidity of "partisanship" regarding the COVID vaccines from 2020-21.

Were lots of people skeptical of the rapidly produced vaccines? Of course. Did some liberals say "I don't know if I'm going to take a Trump vaccine."? We all know they did. Do we know of any significant numbers who ultimately didn't take it because it was a "Trump vaccine"? I certainly don't.

If there is *ONE* thing that Democrats will admit that was good about Trump I, it will be Operation "Warp Speed". (Even though any non-incompetent administration would have done the same thing: fund all pausible candidates to production and pledge to purchase certain amounts even if it fails [providing that they push into production ahead of approval].)

but then a Democratic successor will take over and say the ballroom is good, and everyone should embrace it, then conservatives can sour on it, and their liberal family members can disinvite them from Thanksgiving dinner over their refusal to embrace the ballroom.
That would be petty.

Why do I think the ballroom is stupid?

1. If your dinner requires a room that big, have a smaller dinner party. So pointless.
2. The whole idea of the rather modest nature of the "Executive Mansion" or "President's House" (as it was originally called) was that it was more suitable for a President of a republic than a king or potentate. We lose something when we imitate the decrepit aristocracies of Europe.
3. The project has bypassed all historical preservation and design procedures in the most extreme fashion.
4. The project is funded by oligarchs and without proper appropriation
5. It is ugly.

Now for somethings petty. There are all of those petty nicknames that are generally not permitted here (orange one, Drumpf, etc.) If you want something petty, how about renaming all of the pit toilets in the national parks as "Donald Trump John"s.

Please don't confuse my disdain for Trump's ugly, unnecessary, unauthorized, vanity project as mere pettiness because I disdain him as well.
 
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durangodawood

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No, I picked the one that made the biggest mockery of your list. I said nothing of them being "fly-by-night". (Why is reading so hard.) I'm sure they'd be fine for a new WH ExOffPres office building on site built to architects standards. Nothing on your list demonstrates that they are appropriate for a free floating building of the planned type with high-quality craftsmanship involved (OK, who am I kidding, trump doesn't know craftsmanship). Even more so integration with historic buildings with 200+ year old *renovations*. If you'd told me they'd done sensitive historical renovations or additions like the Capitol Vistors Center, that would be a different story.
But they arent doing a sensitive historical renovation. The are building a yuge box with some wedding cake ornament plastered on. With decent plans this builder could certainly erect Bellagio II in Las Vegas. So they can manage this.
 
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Stopped_lurking

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Would the reaction to this be the same had any other non-Trump president went down this path? ...just if you had to take a wild guess.
Tearing down parts of a house, seen as a symbol of the people, yes I think many would see that as problematic. I'm pretty sure that if king Charles changed the outward appearance of Buckingham palace, there would be a public outcry. Fixing heating, ventilation and electrical system is ok, as is upkeep of the interior and the facade, but making major changes to the outside would raise some eyebrows. Pretty sure it would be discussed with some antiquarian, at least that is my guess.
It seems as if (based on a few of the other posts), people seem to assume that because it was a Trump idea, that it's going to be the worst of everything.

To me, it feels like the inverse of the whole "Obama put in a basketball court" outrage.
 
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