ICE Nativity scenes: Churches reimagine Christmas story amid deportations

iluvatar5150 · Wednesday at 1:31 PM

BPPLEE said:
Do we have an infinite number of jobs available for all the people that y'all want to come here?

No, we don't, but we somehow manage to make more jobs every quarter in response to the people that do come here and who are born here.

BPPLEE said:
If we do why do we have unemployment now?

Because >0% unemployment is a policy goal of the federal reserve as part of a tradeoff between unemployment and inflation. If we had 0% unemployment, we'd probably have very high inflation since the demand for workers would cause their wages to rise a lot.

FAITH-IN-HIM · Wednesday at 2:19 PM

Hans Blaster said:
The pastor seems a bit confused. According to Matthew, Jesus was born in Bethlehem in Judea which was controlled by Herod the Great and then fled to the Roman province of Egypt to avoid Herod's murderous intent. While Harod was a client king Judea was not "occupied". Luke has a different story. In his, Joseph take Mary *into* Roman occupied Judea from the client state of Galillee (Nazareth) ruled by Herod's son Harod Antipas. Whether Bethlehem in Judea was occupied by the Romans at the time (depending on the timeline) or not, Egypt was *definitely* under under Roman occupation.

The pastor is not mistaken or confused, but your knowledge of Roman law seems limited. Although Egypt and Judea were both Roman provinces when Jesus was born, only Roman citizens could travel freely between them without permission. Mary and Joseph were not Roman citizens or entrepreneurs, so they would have needed authorization from Roman authorities to travel legally from Judea to Egypt. Since they were fleeing King Herod, they likely lacked such permission to enter or reside in Egypt, nor did they have documents to work there. In other words, they were comparable to undocumented immigrants in the USA.

Hans Blaster · Wednesday at 6:49 PM

FAITH-IN-HIM said:
The pastor is not mistaken or confused, but your knowledge of Roman law seems limited.

It has been a long time since I practiced law in the castra at Vetera. I might be a bit rusty.

FAITH-IN-HIM said:
Although Egypt and Judea were both Roman provinces when Jesus was born,

Were they? That is 90% of my point/criticism. According to Matthew they were fleeing to Egypt from Harod the Great. Harod was a client king and his kingdom was not "occupied" (as the pastor claimed) and certainly not a province.

FAITH-IN-HIM said:
only Roman citizens could travel freely between them without permission. Mary and Joseph were not Roman citizens or entrepreneurs, so they would have needed authorization from Roman authorities to travel legally from Judea to Egypt. Since they were fleeing King Herod, they likely lacked such permission to enter or reside in Egypt, nor did they have documents to work there. In other words, they were comparable to undocumented immigrants in the USA.

Luke is even a bigger problem for the pastors claim. In his version, Harod is dead for about 10 years and there is not massacre and no flight. (Though at least Bethlehem was in Roman Judea, a province like Egypt. Nazareth was not, so there was no jurisdiction of Quirinius over Joseph to count him in census at Bethlehem or elsewhere.)

wing2000 · 2025-12-11T07:04:03-0600

RileyG said:
I don’t like politicizing my savior. Right or left, I don’t care. It just feels so, so wrong. IMO

The teachings of Jesus have political implications. I don't fault a church for speaking truth to power.

RileyG · 2025-12-11T13:04:28-0600

wing2000 said:
The teachings of Jesus have political implications. I don't fault a church for speaking truth to power.

Yes, but I still find this nativity scene to be inappropriate. My opinion only.

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ICE Nativity scenes: Churches reimagine Christmas story amid deportations

iluvatar5150

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FAITH-IN-HIM

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Hans Blaster

Stonecutter no. 51

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wing2000

E pluribus unum

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RileyG

Veteran

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