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Profane to Divine: Does God Drag You Through the Church Doors—or Do You Drag Your Feet?

bob121

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Brothers and sisters in Christ,

Picture this: Six days drowning in the profane—work, worries, world. Then Sunday dawns, and God Himself yanks you across the threshold into the divine sanctuary. One shepherd nailed it: “We move from the profane into the divine.”

But here’s the rub: It’s not your alarm clock or coffee that gets you there. It’s sovereign grace. The Spirit who elected you before time (Eph 1:4) now calls you out of the curse into Christ’s rest (Heb 4:9-10). The Lord’s Day isn’t optional—it’s the weekly portal where sinners meet the Savior in Word and sacrament.

Quick Hits to Chew On:

  1. Profane Left Behind: Creation groans six days; resurrection claims the seventh (Rom 8:22).
  2. Divine Threshold: You don’t stumble in—God ushers the regenerate (John 6:44).
  3. Sanctuary Foretaste: Heaven leaks through pulpit and table. Skip it, and you starve your soul.
When’s the last time crossing those doors felt like stepping into glory—not just another checkbox? What pulls you away?

Spill your story below. Let’s stir each other to treasure the Lord’s Day like the Reformers did (Heb 10:25).

Soli Deo Gloria,

Jason in Japan
 

BNR32FAN

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Brothers and sisters in Christ,

Picture this: Six days drowning in the profane—work, worries, world. Then Sunday dawns, and God Himself yanks you across the threshold into the divine sanctuary. One shepherd nailed it: “We move from the profane into the divine.”

But here’s the rub: It’s not your alarm clock or coffee that gets you there. It’s sovereign grace. The Spirit who elected you before time (Eph 1:4) now calls you out of the curse into Christ’s rest (Heb 4:9-10). The Lord’s Day isn’t optional—it’s the weekly portal where sinners meet the Savior in Word and sacrament.

Quick Hits to Chew On:

  1. Profane Left Behind: Creation groans six days; resurrection claims the seventh (Rom 8:22).
  2. Divine Threshold: You don’t stumble in—God ushers the regenerate (John 6:44).
  3. Sanctuary Foretaste: Heaven leaks through pulpit and table. Skip it, and you starve your soul.
When’s the last time crossing those doors felt like stepping into glory—not just another checkbox? What pulls you away?

Spill your story below. Let’s stir each other to treasure the Lord’s Day like the Reformers did (Heb 10:25).

Soli Deo Gloria,

Jason in Japan
I haven’t been to church in years. I don’t really see a need to.
 
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bob121

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I haven’t been to church in years. I don’t really see a need to.
Grace and peace to you in Christ. Thank you for your comment—“I haven’t been to church in years. I don’t really see a need to.” That names the very question the Lord’s Day presses upon us: Is gathering with the saints truly necessary, or merely optional?


I ask only to understand. Why do you not see the need? One of my own family members says the same—I would like to hear your reason why if you are happy to share.

Jason in Japan
 
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timothyu

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Once the unwashed realize that that day is representative of a counter-culture to the world of man and elohim alike, its purpose will be served as they will no longer set aside one day for 'gathering', but apply it to all seven. Its not about church but about living in the ways of the Kingdom contrary to the adversarial ways of man and elohim. Remember, even today in an effort to sustain themselves and keep the flock under their thumb seeking nourishment rather than being nourishers...

Matthew 23: 13 Woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, you hypocrites! You shut the kingdom of heaven in men's faces. You yourselves do not enter, nor will you let in those who wish to enter.
 
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BNR32FAN

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Grace and peace to you in Christ. Thank you for your comment—“I haven’t been to church in years. I don’t really see a need to.” That names the very question the Lord’s Day presses upon us: Is gathering with the saints truly necessary, or merely optional?


I ask only to understand. Why do you not see the need? One of my own family members says the same—I would like to hear your reason why if you are happy to share.

Jason in Japan
I honor and praise God everyday no matter where I am. And I converse with other brothers & sisters here on a regular basis. I just haven’t found a church that holds my same theology and I often feel pressured by church members to do things I don’t want to do. For example, all the husbands got together and thought it would be a great idea if we all got on stage and sang a song for our wives on Mother’s Day. I’m not a singer. I’ll sing with the congregation in service but I don’t want to get on stage and sing because I have a terrible singing voice and I know it. And all the other husbands were like oh don’t you want to do something nice for your wife on Mother’s Day to show her how much she means to you? As if implying that singing on stage is my only means of accomplishing that. So this isn’t what made me stop going it was a lot of situations like this that made me lose interest. The old if you don’t do it this way then you’re not honoring God or your wife or your family or whatever. I don’t need someone to tell me how to honor God and my family, I can do it just fine on my own. Don’t get me wrong these are really great people and I have absolutely no doubt that the Holy Spirit is at work in them everyday and I do love them they’ve been great friends but they do get pushy sometimes and I choose not to deal with it anymore even tho I do miss them sometimes.
 
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bob121

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I honor and praise God everyday no matter where I am. And I converse with other brothers & sisters here on a regular basis. I just haven’t found a church that holds my same theology and I often feel pressured by church members to do things I don’t want to do. For example, all the husbands got together and thought it would be a great idea if we all got on stage and sang a song for our wives on Mother’s Day. I’m not a singer. I’ll sing with the congregation in service but I don’t want to get on stage and sing because I have a terrible singing voice and I know it. And all the other husbands were like oh don’t you want to do something nice for your wife on Mother’s Day to show her how much she means to you? As if implying that singing on stage is my only means of accomplishing that. So this isn’t what made me stop going it was a lot of situations like this that made me lose interest. The old if you don’t do it this way then you’re not honoring God or your wife or your family or whatever. I don’t need someone to tell me how to honor God and my family, I can do it just fine on my own. Don’t get me wrong these are really great people and I have absolutely no doubt that the Holy Spirit is at work in them everyday and I do love them they’ve been great friends but they do get pushy sometimes and I choose not to deal with it anymore even tho I do miss them sometimes.
Brother BNR32FAN,


Grace and peace to you in Christ. Thank you for sharing your heart so openly—your story rings true to many who have felt the same squeeze between genuine love for the brethren and the burden of man-made expectations.


I hear you: daily praise to God wherever you are, rich fellowship here online, and a clear conscience about honoring Him and your family on your terms, not the stage’s. That Mother’s Day pressure—singing when you know your voice isn’t for solos—became a symbol of something deeper: “If you don’t do it our way, you’re not honoring God.” That’s a heavy yoke Christ never laid on us (Matt 11:30).


Here’s the gentle question I’m wrestling with myself: Is there a way to keep the baby (the true fellowship) without swallowing the bathwater (the extra-biblical demands)? I’ve walked a long road through several churches before landing in one where the Word is simply opened, Christ is lifted in song, and no one scripts my worship. It’s rare, but it exists.


What would a church have to look like for you to walk back through the doors without that old weight on your shoulders? P.S. My voice is like a flat tire too-God must love a little hiss and wheeze in worship. Good thing He hears hearts, not notes. God is good!
 
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bob121

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Once the unwashed realize that that day is representative of a counter-culture to the world of man and elohim alike, its purpose will be served as they will no longer set aside one day for 'gathering', but apply it to all seven. Its not about church but about living in the ways of the Kingdom contrary to the adversarial ways of man and elohim. Remember, even today in an effort to sustain themselves and keep the flock under their thumb seeking nourishment rather than being nourishers...

Matthre 23: 13 Woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, you hypocrites! You shut the kingdom of heaven in men's faces. You yourselves do not enter, nor will you let in those who wish to enter.
Brother, totally get it-the church shouldn't be a stage or a culture club. I've hunted for years, too, and finally found a little reformed spot here in Japan where no one's putting on a show. Just solid preaching, real psalms, and hearts actually opening-not to relevance, but to heaven. You're right to want that. So what keeps you from trying somewhere new, if you're ever up for it?
 
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bob121

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Seeking God is something new all the time.. it never ends as insight becomes purpose
Amen—“insight becomes purpose.” When insight reveals no local church yet free of cultural clutter, purpose still moves: start small. House-to-house prayer, shared Scripture, simple bread and cup—like the early church (Acts 2:46). God honors the hungry heart that gathers two or three in His name (Matt 18:20).

If none can be found, we become the quiet, heaven-opening fellowship we seek. I went many months out of fellowship back home myself. Have a great day/night. God bless.

What do you think has gone wrong with the church at large?
 
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SabbathBlessings

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For what its worth this is what God of the Bible said about the Lords Day and being a holy convocation.

The Lords Day in God's own Words- the only one in the Bible He claimed as His

Isa 58:13 “If you turn away your foot from the Sabbath,
From doing your pleasure on My holy day,
And call the Sabbath a delight,
The holy day of the Lord honorable,
And shall honor Him, not doing your own ways,
Nor finding your own pleasure,
Nor speaking your own words,

Exo20:10 but the seventh day is the Sabbath of the Lord your God.

What He claimed as a holy convocation or church

Lev 23:3 ‘Six days shall work be done, but the seventh day is a Sabbath of solemn rest, a holy convocation. You shall do no work on it; it is the Sabbath of the Lord in all your dwellings.

What Jesus kept as a holy convocation

Luke4:16 So He came to Nazareth, where He had been brought up. And as His custom was, He went into the synagogue on the Sabbath day, and stood up to read. What He read from is the Book of Isaiah if you keep reading in this passage

What His church and apostles kept as a holy convocation, just as Jesus quoted from and predicted

Isa 56:6 “Also the sons of the foreigner
Who join themselves to the Lord, to serve Him,
And to love the name of the Lord, to be His servants—
Everyone who keeps from defiling the Sabbath,
And holds fast My covenant—
7 Even them I will bring to My holy mountain,
And make them joyful in My house of prayer.
Their burnt offerings and their sacrifices
Will be accepted on My altar;
For My house shall be called a house of prayer for all nations.

Why we see both Jews and Gentiles and all people coming together to hear the word of God every Sabbath in the NT

Acts 13:14
But when they departed from Perga, they came to Antioch in Pisidia, and went into the synagogue on the Sabbath day and sat down.

Acts 13:27
For those who dwell in Jerusalem, and their rulers, because they did not know Him, nor even the voices of the Prophets which are read every Sabbath, have fulfilled them in condemning Him.

Acts 13:42
So when the Jews went out of the synagogue, the Gentiles begged that these words might be preached to them the next Sabbath.

Acts 13:44
On the next Sabbath almost the whole city came together to hear the word of God.

Acts 15:21
For Moses has had throughout many generations those who preach him in every city, being read in the synagogues every Sabbath.”

Acts 16:13
And on the Sabbath day we went out of the city to the riverside, where prayer was customarily made; and we sat down and spoke to the women who met there.

Acts 17:2
Then Paul, as his custom was, went in to them, and for three Sabbaths reasoned with them from the Scriptures,

Acts 18:4
And he reasoned in the synagogue every Sabbath, and persuaded both Jews and Greeks.

And what continues on forever as a holy convocation but instead of worshipping Him in spirit, it will be in person. :)

Isa 66:23 “For as the new heavens and the new earth
Which I will make shall remain before Me,” says the Lord,
“So shall your descendants and your name remain.
23 And it shall come to pass
That from one New Moon to another,
And from one Sabbath to another,
All flesh shall come to worship before Me,” says the Lord.

What Paul was referring to

Heb 10: 25 not forsaking the assembling of ourselves together, as is the manner of some, but exhorting one another, and so much the more as you see the Day approaching.
 
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timothyu

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What do you think has gone wrong with the church at large?
Financial upkeep, the result of institutional business, instead of following a way of life, a movement that seeks to aide and share.. That Kingdom was rejected on favour of an opportunity to partner with the enemy, the govt/world of man and it wasn't the world that changed.
 
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bob121

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For what its worth this is what God of the Bible said about the Lords Day and being a holy convocation.

The Lords Day in God's own Words- the only one in the Bible He claimed as His

Isa 58:13 “If you turn away your foot from the Sabbath,
From doing your pleasure on My holy day,
And call the Sabbath a delight,
The holy day of the Lord honorable,
And shall honor Him, not doing your own ways,
Nor finding your own pleasure,
Nor speaking your own words,

Exo20:10 but the seventh day is the Sabbath of the Lord your God.

What He claimed as a holy convocation or church

Lev 23:3 ‘Six days shall work be done, but the seventh day is a Sabbath of solemn rest, a holy convocation. You shall do no work on it; it is the Sabbath of the Lord in all your dwellings.

What Jesus kept as a holy convocation

Luke4:16 So He came to Nazareth, where He had been brought up. And as His custom was, He went into the synagogue on the Sabbath day, and stood up to read. What He read from is the Book of Isaiah if you keep reading in this passage

What His church and apostles kept as a holy convocation, just as Jesus quoted from and predicted

Isa 56:6 “Also the sons of the foreigner
Who join themselves to the Lord, to serve Him,
And to love the name of the Lord, to be His servants—
Everyone who keeps from defiling the Sabbath,
And holds fast My covenant—
7 Even them I will bring to My holy mountain,
And make them joyful in My house of prayer.
Their burnt offerings and their sacrifices
Will be accepted on My altar;
For My house shall be called a house of prayer for all nations.

Why we see both Jews and Gentiles and all people coming together to hear the word of God every Sabbath in the NT

Acts 13:14
But when they departed from Perga, they came to Antioch in Pisidia, and went into the synagogue on the Sabbath day and sat down.

Acts 13:27
For those who dwell in Jerusalem, and their rulers, because they did not know Him, nor even the voices of the Prophets which are read every Sabbath, have fulfilled them in condemning Him.

Acts 13:42
So when the Jews went out of the synagogue, the Gentiles begged that these words might be preached to them the next Sabbath.

Acts 13:44
On the next Sabbath almost the whole city came together to hear the word of God.

Acts 15:21
For Moses has had throughout many generations those who preach him in every city, being read in the synagogues every Sabbath.”

Acts 16:13
And on the Sabbath day we went out of the city to the riverside, where prayer was customarily made; and we sat down and spoke to the women who met there.

Acts 17:2
Then Paul, as his custom was, went in to them, and for three Sabbaths reasoned with them from the Scriptures,

Acts 18:4
And he reasoned in the synagogue every Sabbath, and persuaded both Jews and Greeks.

And what continues on forever as a holy convocation but instead of worshipping Him in spirit, it will be in person. :)

Isa 66:23 “For as the new heavens and the new earth
Which I will make shall remain before Me,” says the Lord,
“So shall your descendants and your name remain.
23 And it shall come to pass
That from one New Moon to another,
And from one Sabbath to another,
All flesh shall come to worship before Me,” says the Lord.

What Paul was referring to

Heb 10: 25 not forsaking the assembling of ourselves together, as is the manner of some, but exhorting one another, and so much the more as you see the Day approaching.
SabbathBlessings, grace and peace to you in Christ. Your comment has much 'worth'—your words are worth far more than fine gold, for they point us straight to God’s own (Ps 19:10). Thank you for this rich Sabbath thread from Genesis to the new earth. It stirs the heart to treasure the Lord’s Day as a holy convocation.

Your verses breathe the same fire that drives my original post: God calls His people to cease, to gather, to hear His voice together. I love how you trace the pattern through Jesus and the apostles.

A gentle question to deepen the joy: When the shadow meets the Substance, does the day itself shift with Him? Christ rose on the first day (Matt 28,28:1), the Spirit fell on a first-day feast (Lev 23:15–16; Acts 2), and the church broke bread and collected offerings then (Acts 20:7; 1 Cor 16:2). Colossians calls sabbaths “a shadow… but the substance is Christ” (Col 2:16–17).

So we still gather weekly—eagerly, as Heb 10:25 urges—but on the day resurrection broke the grave. What do you make of that first-day pattern?
 
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bob121

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Financial upkeep, the result of institutional business, instead of following a way of life, a movement that seeks to aide and share..
Agreed—institutional business has eclipsed the way of life. Churches chasing hundreds of thousands or millions for flashy projects in prime districts while real needs go unmet? That’s the very inversion Jesus warned against: storing treasure where moth and rust destroy (Matt 6:19–21).
Why not pour the surplus into widows, orphans, and gospel outreach? The early church met in homes, shared everything, and turned the world upside down (Acts 2:44–47; 4:32–35). No marble foyers required, or glass cathedrals.
What would a truly counter-cultural church look like in your eyes—one that aids and shares instead of builds empires? Hope you are having a great day or night.
 
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bob121

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Quick poll: What’s the #1 thing that keeps you coming back to Sunday worship?

☐ The preaching of the Word ☐ The singing & psalms ☐ Fellowship with the saints ☐ The Lord’s Table ☐ Other (tell us below!)

Vote & spill your story. Have a great day/night. God bless.

Jason in Japan
 
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SabbathBlessings

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SabbathBlessings, grace and peace to you in Christ. Your comment has much 'worth'—your words are worth far more than fine gold, for they point us straight to God’s own (Ps 19:10). Thank you for this rich Sabbath thread from Genesis to the new earth. It stirs the heart to treasure the Lord’s Day as a holy convocation.
I accidently deleted my original post, not sure how I did that, so I may be more brief on this one. :)

I appreciate the warm welcome, and agree we need to treasure the Lords day as a holy convocation, but we need to honor the one God said so, no? isn’t that the whole point? I would think it would be the only one God claimed in His own words as My holy day, the holy day of the Lord, meaning there’s just one Isa8:13 and told us to keep holy on a weekly basis Exo20:8-11 Lev 23:3, the only day God sanctified in the entire Bible, as far as I know man can’t sanctify a day or sanctify themselves Isa 66:17 only God can to do this and both of these are only linked to God’s Sabbath Eze20:12 Gen2:3 Exo20:11
Your verses breathe the same fire that drives my original post: God calls His people to cease, to gather, to hear His voice together. I love how you trace the pattern through Jesus and the apostles.
Yes the Scriptures and pattern through Jesus and apotles are very plain. I do not think its wise to take this clear pattern and change it to a different day it loses all its value because it becomes a man-made tradition over a commandment of God, coming with His power and sanctification. Something Paul warned about in the same passage you quoted Col2:8
A gentle question to deepen the joy: When the shadow meets the Substance, does the day itself shift with Him?
Can you tell me how our Creator and Sanctifier could ever be a shadow of anything? Is the Creator not the Subtance? Sorry this argument doesn't make sense.

Christ rose on the first day (Matt 28,28:1),
Yes, He did. He rested on the seventh day, rose and went back to His Fathers work on the first day. Can you point to the verse that says because He rose on the first day, we no longer need to keep the Sabbath commandment but keep Sunday instead?

His faithful disciples who followed Jesus everywhere kept the Sabbath after His death according to the commandment Luke23:56 they were the first ones to see Jesus after He rose, had there been a change to one of His commandments why would He not tell them or anyone. An argument from silence over the plain written and spoken Word of God does not seem like a good idea to me.
the Spirit fell on a first-day feast (Lev 23:15–16; Acts 2)
This was an annual feast and there is no Scripture that says Pentecost was on the first day, it could have fallen on any day.
, and the church broke bread and collected offerings then (Acts 20:7; 1 Cor 16:2).
They broke bread daily Acts 2:46 and 1Cor16:2 was not a church offering, it was a one time at home collection to help the needy. Neither of these verses say anything about transferring the 4th commandment to the first day. That would be something only God could do, He already promised in His word He would not Psa89:34 Mat5:18-19

Colossians calls sabbaths “a shadow… but the substance is Christ” (Col 2:16–17).
I know this is the go to verse everyone uses to get rid of the 4th commandment but with this serious of warning of Paul’s writing doesn’t it deserve more than just a surface read if we are going to use it against the Testimony of God. Exo 31:18

2 Peter 3: 15 and consider that the longsuffering of our Lord is salvation—as also our beloved brother Paul, according to the wisdom given to him, has written to you, 16 as also in all his epistles, speaking in them of these things, in which are some things hard to understand, which untaught and unstable people twist to their own destruction, as they do also the rest of the Scriptures.

Lets bring in some more context

Col 2:14 Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross;

Paul is speaking about something that was handwritten and was against and contrary to us.

The weekly Sabbath was written by the finger of God along with the other 9 commandments Deut4:13 Exo31:18 and God singled out the Sabbath in this unit as the one being holy and blessed by God and points to Him as our Creator. Exo20:11 And the God we are to worship in the very three commandments. What God blessed man can’t reverse Numbers 23:20 we would need a thus saith the Lord to get rid of the 4th commandment. God said He would not alter His words Psa89:34 not a jot or tittle Mat5:18-19. Would Paul really be teaching against God? I do not think so… this is what Paul was quoting

2 Cor 33:8 and I will not again remove the foot of Israel from the land which I have appointed for your fathers—only if they are careful to do all that I have commanded them, according to the whole law and the statutes and the ordinances by the hand of Moses.

God wrote the Ten Commandments which included the Sabbath commandment, its under His mercy seat, was written by the Holy Spirit of Truth, man cannot edit this as there is no one greater than He. Moses hand wrote all the other laws that included the animal sacrifices, annual feast days, that some were also annual sabbaths that had to do with food and drink offerings the context of this passage and was placed besides the ark there as a witness against Deuteronomy 31:24-26 so clearly this is what Paul is quoting and the shadow he was pointing to Heb10:1-10 Heb9:10-15.

The weekly Sabbath started at Creation Exo20:11 when God made everything according to His perfect plan, before a need of a plan of salvation so its not a shadow of anything, it points to our Creator, Exo20:11 our Sanctifier Eze20:11 and the God we are to worship Rev 14:7

Jesus said the Sabbath was made for man Mark2:27- what God made for man is not against man, so this teaching that it’s about God’s Sabbath is really an attack on the character of God.

Jesus in His own words said the Sabbath would be kept up to His Second Coming Mat24:20 and for eternity Isa66:23 so obviously Col 2:16 cannot be about God’s holy Sabbath day. Again as we see in the life of the apostles keeping every Sabbath with both Jews and Gentiles just as Jesus said Isa56:6-7 decades after the Cross.
So we still gather weekly—eagerly, as Heb 10:25 urges—but on the day resurrection broke the grave. What do you make of that first-day pattern?
There is no first day pattern in all of Scripture. The apotles did things daily, doesn’t mean it starts deleting the commandments of God.

Please re-read the Biblical pattern with plain Scriptures provided to you in the post you are replying to. This is God’s will, not doing something different. Making a common day as a holy day never worked out before for anyone Eze22:26. I do not think it will again.

PS: Jason in Japan, I love Japan, only went there once, loved it, hope I can go back again once day soon. :)
 
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bob121

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I accidently deleted my original post, not sure how I did that, so I may be more brief on this one. :)

I appreciate the warm welcome, and agree we need to treasure the Lords day as a holy convocation, but we need to honor the one God said so, no? isn’t that the whole point? I would think it would be the only one God claimed in His own words as My holy day, the holy day of the Lord, meaning there’s just one Isa8:13 and told us to keep holy on a weekly basis Exo20:8-11 Lev 23:3, the only day God sanctified in the entire Bible, as far as I know man can’t sanctify a day or sanctify themselves Isa 66:17 only God can to do this and both of these are only linked to God’s Sabbath Eze20:12 Gen2:3 Exo20:11

Yes the Scriptures and pattern through Jesus and apotles are very plain. I do not think its wise to take this clear pattern and change it to a different day it loses all its value because it becomes a man-made tradition over a commandment of God, coming with His power and sanctification. Something Paul warned about in the same passage you quoted Col2:8

Can you tell me how our Creator and Sanctifier could ever be a shadow of anything? Is the Creator not the Subtance? Sorry this argument doesn't make sense.


Yes, He did. He rested on the seventh day, rose and went back to His Fathers work on the first day. Can you point to the verse that says because He rose on the first day, we no longer need to keep the Sabbath commandment but keep Sunday instead?

His faithful disciples who followed Jesus everywhere kept the Sabbath after His death according to the commandment Luke23:56 they were the first ones to see Jesus after He rose, had there been a change to one of His commandments why would He not tell them or anyone. An argument from silence over the plain written and spoken Word of God does not seem like a good idea to me.

This was an annual feast and there is no Scripture that says Pentecost was on the first day, it could have fallen on any day.

They broke bread daily Acts 2:46 and 1Cor16:2 was not a church offering, it was a one time at home collection to help the needy. Neither of these verses say anything about transferring the 4th commandment to the first day. That would be something only God could do, He already promised in His word He would not Psa89:34 Mat5:18-19


I know this is the go to verse everyone uses to get rid of the 4th commandment but with this serious of warning of Paul’s writing doesn’t it deserve more than just a surface read if we are going to use it against the Testimony of God. Exo 31:18

2 Peter 3: 15 and consider that the longsuffering of our Lord is salvation—as also our beloved brother Paul, according to the wisdom given to him, has written to you, 16 as also in all his epistles, speaking in them of these things, in which are some things hard to understand, which untaught and unstable people twist to their own destruction, as they do also the rest of the Scriptures.

Lets bring in some more context

Col 2:14 Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross;

Paul is speaking about something that was handwritten and was against and contrary to us.

The weekly Sabbath was written by the finger of God along with the other 9 commandments Deut4:13 Exo31:18 and God singled out the Sabbath in this unit as the one being holy and blessed by God and points to Him as our Creator. Exo20:11 And the God we are to worship in the very three commandments. What God blessed man can’t reverse Numbers 23:20 we would need a thus saith the Lord to get rid of the 4th commandment. God said He would not alter His words Psa89:34 not a jot or tittle Mat5:18-19. Would Paul really be teaching against God? I do not think so… this is what Paul was quoting

2 Cor 33:8 and I will not again remove the foot of Israel from the land which I have appointed for your fathers—only if they are careful to do all that I have commanded them, according to the whole law and the statutes and the ordinances by the hand of Moses.

God wrote the Ten Commandments which included the Sabbath commandment, its under His mercy seat, was written by the Holy Spirit of Truth, man cannot edit this as there is no one greater than He. Moses hand wrote all the other laws that included the animal sacrifices, annual feast days, that some were also annual sabbaths that had to do with food and drink offerings the context of this passage and was placed besides the ark there as a witness against Deuteronomy 31:24-26 so clearly this is what Paul is quoting and the shadow he was pointing to Heb10:1-10 Heb9:10-15.

The weekly Sabbath started at Creation Exo20:11 when God made everything according to His perfect plan, before a need of a plan of salvation so its not a shadow of anything, it points to our Creator, Exo20:11 our Sanctifier Eze20:11 and the God we are to worship Rev 14:7

Jesus said the Sabbath was made for man Mark2:27- what God made for man is not against man, so this teaching that it’s about God’s Sabbath is really an attack on the character of God.

Jesus in His own words said the Sabbath would be kept up to His Second Coming Mat24:20 and for eternity Isa66:23 so obviously Col 2:16 cannot be about God’s holy Sabbath day. Again as we see in the life of the apostles keeping every Sabbath with both Jews and Gentiles just as Jesus said Isa56:6-7 decades after the Cross.

There is no first day pattern in all of Scripture. The apotles did things daily, doesn’t mean it starts deleting the commandments of God.

Please re-read the Biblical pattern with plain Scriptures provided to you in the post you are replying to. This is God’s will, not doing something different. Making a common day as a holy day never worked out before for anyone Eze22:26. I do not think it will again.

PS: Jason in Japan, I love Japan, only went there once, loved it, hope I can go back again once day soon. :)
Brother SabbathBlessings,


Thank you for this thoughtful, Scripture-saturated reply—glad you enjoyed Japan! It’s a unique country and very peaceful; I love the wa (harmony, space for each other) unlike back home where everyone crowds in.

The Lord uses even mishaps (deletes) to refine our thoughts and words.

You ask the heart of it: If God claims one day as “My holy day,” dare we shift it? Fair question. Let’s walk gently through the texts—this is a good opportunity for views to be shared.

  1. The Sabbath is God’s gift—creation sign (Gen 2:3), redemption sign (Deut 5:15), sanctification seal (Ex 31:13). No dispute.
  2. Yet Colossians 2:16–17 calls sabbaths (plural, including the weekly) a shadow whose substance is Christ. Paul isn’t contradicting God; he’s saying the shadow points to the One now present.
  3. The shift isn’t man-made tradition—it’s resurrection reality:
    • Christ rose first day (Matt 28:1).
    • Spirit poured out on a first-day feast (Acts 2).
    • Church broke bread and collected on the first day (Acts 20:7; 1 Cor 16:2). That’s apostolic pattern, not Roman invention.

Jesus kept the seventh day perfectly—for us. Now He is our Sabbath rest (Heb 4:9–10). We don’t abandon the convocation; we fulfill it in Him, gathering where His victory is proclaimed.

You love the texts—let’s keep digging together. What do you make of the first-day gatherings in Acts and Corinthians? No pressure, just iron sharpening iron.

Thank you again for your thoughts—it gives me a chance to dig deeper, always good for the mind.

Have a great day/night. God bless.
 
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bob121

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Jesus said there will always be poor so the churches took it to mean it was an opportunity to empire build
Brother timothyu,

Grace and peace to you in Christ. Jesus said the poor would always be with us (Mark 14:7), but as a call to open hands, not empire-building. Churches twist it into a license for marble foyers while widows wait. Spot on.

I’ve been thinking about that one for a while—the pastor’s six-figure salary (still “not enough”) versus the poor fellow down the road who calls a $20 gift “a fortune” with a bigger thank-you than the sum.

So pour the surplus into mercy and mission? That’s the gospel heartbeat (James 1:27). More thoughts always welcome.

Have a great day/night. God bless.
 
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SabbathBlessings

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Brother SabbathBlessings,
Its sister. :)
Thank you for this thoughtful, Scripture-saturated reply—glad you enjoyed Japan! It’s a unique country and very peaceful; I love the wa (harmony, space for each other) unlike back home where everyone crowds in.
Yes, its beautiful and everyone was so kind and friendly, even a huge city like Tokyo.
The Lord uses even mishaps (deletes) to refine our thoughts and words.
Agreed! He does if we allow Him to and allow the Holy Spirit to guide us through the writings of His word and teach us and be open to make changes based on His word, He promises never to go away from Isa8:20
You ask the heart of it: If God claims one day as “My holy day,” dare we shift it? Fair question. Let’s walk gently through the texts—this is a good opportunity for views to be shared.
Wouldn’t God know what is His holy day? He only named one in all of Scripture, He only sanctified one day in all of Scripture, He says He does not change. For me, if we are going to make a change or shift as you say, I would want a thus saith the Lord. Do you have one verse for this shift in God’s own Words. God did say in His own Words- My covenant I will not alter My words Psa89:34, not a jot or tittle, heaven and earth would pass before so and heaven and earth are still here and Jesus has not come in the clouds Mat5:18-19. Jesus said He is Lord of the Sabbath, not Lord of the first day. I think it’s important to allow God to reveal Himself just as He says.

Jesus said the Sabbath was made for man (not against man). The word Jesus used Greek: anthrōpos, meaning all humanity. Jesus Himself said He is Lord of the Sabbath, not the destroyer of the Sabbath or said Lord of the first day. If there was going to be a shift that makes up the character of God, the Sabbath points to Him as our Creator Exo20:11, our Sanctifier Eze20:12 in the 4th commandment is where He chose to place His seal - which contains His name, territory and title. It was written by the Holy Spirit of Truth, that sits under His mercy seat Exo25:21 in the Most Holy of His Temple and shown in heaven Rev15:5 Rev11:19. If God was going to make a shift or change, He would have told us plainly. He did warn there would be a shift as you call it to His times and laws, but not by Him Dan7:25 and the only law that is a time (every seventh day Exo 20:10) and Law (4th commandment) is the Sabbath. There is a clear history of this change and the government (or beast power) who made this change that they claim if keeping Sunday over God’s Sabbath, you are obeying them over God, said they made this change that the whole world followed, based on their own sense of power over the word of God. I can provide all of the references if you would like. The point is the shift is not a biblical one, God is calling us back to worship the God of Creation Rev14:7 Exo20:11

  1. The Sabbath is God’s gift—creation sign (Gen 2:3), redemption sign (Deut 5:15), sanctification seal (Ex 31:13). No dispute.
Yes, the Sabbath started at Creation, He made everything according to His perfect plan and the Sabbath was a big part of that. God rested on the seventh day from all His works and blessed and sanctified the seventh day what He calls the Sabbath. God commanded man this same cycle Exo20:8-11 as man was made in the image and likeness of God to do what He does. Both God and Jesus who is God made flesh, kept the Sabbath- is there a greater example we are to follow in Scripture? Who does Scripture tell us to follow?
  1. Yet Colossians 2:16–17 calls sabbaths (plural, including the weekly) a shadow whose substance is Christ. Paul isn’t contradicting God; he’s saying the shadow points to the One now present.
Yes it says sabbath(s) plural, that are connected to the sabbath(s) feast days, not the weekly Sabbath God gave to humanity that started at Creation so its impossible to be a shadow as it points to God Himself Exo20:11 , it is a commandment of God, that came with God’s sanctification and blessing.

Paul came after Christ ratified His covenant at the Cross. It Is Finished. Nothing can be added or changed after His blood. Any changes to God’s covenant requires blood Heb9:15-16. Paul cannot change one thing to God’s covenant, it would require the blood of Jesus all over again and His sacrifice was once and for all Heb10:10. Paul was a servant of Christ and a servant is not greater than their master- we are called to be servants as well Isa56:6. Paul was commissioned to spread the gospel, not change the law of God written by the Holy Spirit. God’s Laws never changed, the words of the Covenant, the Ten Commandments Exo34:28 Deut4:13 written by God, not man, went from tables of stone, to tablets of the heart Heb8:10 2Cor3:3 the law never changed because the law was never the issue, it is perfect Psa19:7 holy, just and good Rom7:12 the issue is mans heart.

I will provide you a deeper study of Col 2:14-17 but before I do that can you tell me how the Sabbath ended at the Cross, which is what Col2:14 says, the laws contained in ordinances ended at the cross. So how can the weekly Sabbath end at the Cross, if Jesus in His own Words expected His people to be still keeping it decades later Mat24:20 and eternity Isa66:23. So either we are misunderstanding what Paul is saying like we are warned plainly would happen or Jesus doesn’t know what He is talking about. Both cannot be true. If the weekly Sabbath ended at the Cross, why would His apostles be keeping every Sabbath decades after the Cross just as Jesus indicated and predicted His house will be a house of prayer for ALL nations- those who hold fast to His covenant by keeping the Sabbath Isa56:6-7. The shift to God’s Sabbath to Sunday would provide a lot of contradictions to the plain writings of Jesus. Jesus is the way- my faith is in Him.
  1. The shift isn’t man-made tradition—it’s resurrection reality:
    • Christ rose first day (Matt 28:1).
Can you please go back and respond to what I previously addressed on this verse. Where did Jesus say, this made a shift in one of His commandments. Jesus was on this earth 40 days before descending back to heaven where did He once say, we no longer need to keep the Sabbath and now we shift everything to Sunday. Just one verse please.
  • Spirit poured out on a first-day feast (Acts 2).
Where does it say the first day, where does it say, this annual feast now removes our moral obligation to keep God’s 4th commandment?
    • Church broke bread and collected on the first day (Acts 20:7; 1 Cor 16:2). That’s apostolic pattern, not Roman invention.
This was already addressed, if you can please respond to what I addressed previously,
Jesus kept the seventh day perfectly—for us. Now He is our Sabbath rest (Heb 4:9–10). We don’t abandon the convocation; we fulfill it in Him, gathering where His victory is proclaimed.
Jesus kept the Sabbath perfect, He is our example to follow, so now we no longer need to obey or follow what Jesus did? Hebrews 4 does not say Jesus is our Sabbath rest and therefore we can break God’s 4th commandment. I am open to going through this passage with you verse by verse, I have studied it for a long time and what most people don’t look at, is the OT references, it at least references 4 OT references in this passage, so one would need to understand these OT references to understand this passage. It’s not an easy one to understand because there’s a lot going on in a short amount of verses. I am happy going through it if you would like, I can promise you though what it’s saying is the exact opposite of what most people use it against. It’s actually warning us about not keeping the Sabbath. Would you like to go through this verse by verse? We can look at the Greek words used here which will also help bring in more context and understanding.
You love the texts—let’s keep digging together. What do you make of the first-day gatherings in Acts and Corinthians? No pressure, just iron sharpening iron.
I am happy to do this and pray we can both be open to what the Scriptures are really saying. In order to progress, we need to respond to things that have been addressed so we can keep proceeding forward. Does that sound fair to you?
Thank you again for your thoughts—it gives me a chance to dig deeper, always good for the mind.
At the end, we should all be seeking for God’s Truth. That’s what sets us free. :)
Have a great day/night. God bless.
Thank you and God bless!
 
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