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A conversation about unity.

Strong in Him

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Saint John Chrysostom (c 347-Sept 14, 407 A.D) spoke to 1 Cor 11:29 in one of his homilies, Homily 28:
I wasn't talking about him, nor am I really bothered what he said.
Paul said that the Corinthians were divided when they came to the Lord's Supper. They didn't share - some were eating their own food and others were getting drunk. He said in 1 Corinthians 11:33-34 that when they came together to eat they should wait for one another. Whoever was hungry should eat in his own home, lest they be judged when they meet together.

Nowhere does the text say, "unless you recognise that the bread that you eat literally is, or becomes, the body of Christ, you cannot have fellowship with him."
 
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2PhiloVoid

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I see Jesus displaying a self-sacrificing love, in that he endured great suffering bearing the sins of this cruel world that mercilessly mocked him beat him and crucified him; And yet he would forgive it on account that they know not what they do. The commemoration of that act of Love is what is being preserved in the Eucharist (thanksgiving). There's only One Holy Spirit testifying to the Father and His Christ. Doesn't everyone led by the testimony of the Holy Spirit see the same thing?

On a certain level, yes I agree that everyone led by the testimony of the Holy Spirit will have similar perspectives about the basic meaning of the Eucharist, but unfortunately for all of us that's not the only issue involved in the problem of disunity that is manifested here in this thread.
 
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2PhiloVoid

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It was broken down in post #529 if that helps.

There are a few additional conceptual nuances regarding the Lord's Supper in its meaning and administration that simply citing and reading 1 Corinthians 11 doesn't really get at or solve for the purposes of this thread. Not that it isn't relevant, but it's a little tangential to the larger problem.
 
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Servus

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There are a few additional conceptual nuances regarding the Lord's Supper in its meaning and administration that simply citing and reading 1 Corinthians 11 doesn't really get at or solve for the purposes of this thread. Not that it isn't relevant, but it's a little tangential really.
Go ahead and exposit.
 
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2PhiloVoid

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Go ahead and exposit.

In short, the central problem comes in that the Catholic meaning and administration of the Eucharist is fully dependent upon "their" prior concept of Apostolic Tradition and Succession. In their theology, it's not enough to merely have good manners at the Lord's Table, one must also be served by authorized bishops or priests, and "propriety" also includes having the right leader to therefore define and serve the Eucharist.

By contrast, those of us in non-Catholic, congregational and/or baptist style churches, think the only requirement is that we all repose ourselves with a proper, reverent attitude, and if Joe Schmoe is available to volunteer to lead the congregation in prayer and to help hand out the wafers and juice, we think it's essentially copacetic 'enough' to qualify as the Lord's Supper. And this is the specific nuance I'm referring that, but that Paul in 1 Corinthians 11 doesn't really address. He sort of does over in his Pastoral Letters to Timothy and Titus, but we'd have to get "inter-textual" and bring that in as well.

For the purpose of this thread, I'd also bring in a verse like Matthew 20:25-28, Luke 22:25-27, and 1 Peter 5:3 ................ and then haggle over what it might mean to "Lord it over one another" within the faith, and how this principle rubs up against having the "right, qualified leaders" in place in the Church by whom we'll receive definition and administration of the Sacraments / Ordinances, or the explication of the meaning of biblical passages.

And this is what I'm getting at. (Keep in mind, too, I'm not Catholic).
 
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Valletta

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In short, the central problem comes in that the Catholic meaning and administration of the Eucharist is fully dependent upon "their" prior concept of Apostolic Tradition and Succession. In their theology, it's not enough to merely have good manners at the Lord's Table, one must also be served by authorized bishops or priests, and "propriety" also includes having the right leader to therefore define and serve the Eucharist.

By contrast, those of us in non-Catholic, congregational and/or baptist style churches, think the only requirement is that we all repose ourselves with a proper, reverent attitude, and if Joe Schmoe is available to volunteer to lead the congregation in prayer and to help hand out the wafers and juice, we think it's essentially copacetic 'enough' to qualify as the Lord's Supper. And this is the specific nuance I'm referring that, but that Paul in 1 Corinthians 11 doesn't really address. He sort of does over in his Pastoral Letters to Timothy and Titus, but we'd have to get "inter-textual" and bring that in as well.

For the purpose of this thread, I'd also bring in a verse like Matthew 20:25-28, Luke 22:25-27, and 1 Peter 5:3 ................ and then haggle over what it might mean to "Lord it over one another" within the faith, and how this principle rubs up against having the "right, qualified leaders" in place in the Church by whom we'll receive definition and administration of the Sacraments / Ordinances, or the explication of the meaning of biblical passages.

And this is what I'm getting at. (Keep in mind, too, I'm not Catholic).
The understanding of the Holy Eucharist caused great divisions, many disciples who had followed Jesus walked away from Jesus, and it came up in the early Church as per this from Ignatius of Antioch :

“Take note of those who hold heterodox opinions on the grace of Jesus Christ which has come to us, and see how contrary their opinions are to the mind of God. . . . They abstain from the Eucharist and from prayer because they do not confess that the Eucharist is the flesh of our Savior Jesus Christ, flesh which suffered for our sins and which that Father, in his goodness, raised up again. They who deny the gift of God are perishing in their disputes” (Letter to the Smyrnaeans 6:2–7:1 [A.D. 110]).

All three of the major leaders of the reformation had different views from each other on the Holy Eucharist.
 
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childeye 2

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The understanding of the Holy Eucharist caused great divisions, many disciples who had followed Jesus walked away from Jesus, and it came up in the early Church as per this from Ignatius of Antioch :

“Take note of those who hold heterodox opinions on the grace of Jesus Christ which has come to us, and see how contrary their opinions are to the mind of God. . . . They abstain from the Eucharist and from prayer because they do not confess that the Eucharist is the flesh of our Savior Jesus Christ, flesh which suffered for our sins and which that Father, in his goodness, raised up again. They who deny the gift of God are perishing in their disputes” (Letter to the Smyrnaeans 6:2–7:1 [A.D. 110]).
Divisions arise due to misunderstandings. Those many disciples who walked away in John 6:52 thought Jesus was talking about 'cannibalism', and Ignatius cannot be referring to them.

I recall reading that Ignatius was addressing certain beliefs that had arisen in those days claiming that Jesus was an apparition and didn't actually have a flesh and blood body. This is why the context below of whether his blood was ever truly shed and whether he actually suffered pain is extremely relevant for any sincere thankfulness to occur when partaking of the Eucharist. And when we look at the context in which Ignatius speaks, this does appear to be the case.

Chapter 2. Christ's true passion​

Now, He suffered all these things for our sakes, that we might be saved. And He suffered truly, even as also He truly raised up Himself, not, as certain unbelievers maintain, that He only seemed to suffer, as they themselves only seem to be [Christians]. And as they believe, so shall it happen unto them, when they shall be divested of their bodies, and be mere evil spirits.

Chapter 3. Christ was possessed of a body after His resurrection​

For I know that after His resurrection also He was still possessed of flesh, and I believe that He is so now. When, for instance, He came to those who were with Peter, He said to them, Lay hold, handle Me, and see that I am not an incorporeal spirit. And immediately they touched Him, and believed, being convinced both by His flesh and spirit. For this cause also they despised death, and were found its conquerors. And after his resurrection He ate and drank with them, as being possessed of flesh, although spiritually He was united to the Father.

Chapter 6. Unbelievers in the blood of Christ shall be condemned​

Let no man deceive himself. Both the things which are in heaven, and the glorious angels, and rulers, both visible and invisible, if they believe not in the blood of Christ, shall, in consequence, incur condemnation. He that is able to receive it, let him receive it. Matthew 19:12 Let not [high] place puff any one up: for that which is worth all is faith and love, to which nothing is to be preferred. But consider those who are of a different opinion with respect to the grace of Christ which has come unto us, how opposed they are to the will of God. They have no regard for love; no care for the widow, or the orphan, or the oppressed; of the bond, or of the free; of the hungry, or of the thirsty.

Chapter 7. Let us stand aloof from such heretics​

They abstain from the Eucharist and from prayer, because they confess not the Eucharist to be the flesh of our Saviour Jesus Christ, which suffered for our sins, and which the Father, of His goodness, raised up again. Those, therefore, who speak against this gift of God, incur death in the midst of their disputes. But it were better for them to treat it with respect, that they also might rise again. It is fitting, therefore, that you should keep aloof from such persons, and not to speak of them either in private or in public, but to give heed to the prophets, and above all, to the Gospel, in which the passion [of Christ] has been revealed to us, and the resurrection has been fully proved. But avoid all divisions, as the beginning of evils.
 
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Hentenza

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The understanding of the Holy Eucharist caused great divisions, many disciples who had followed Jesus walked away from Jesus, and it came up in the early Church as per this from Ignatius of Antioch :

“Take note of those who hold heterodox opinions on the grace of Jesus Christ which has come to us, and see how contrary their opinions are to the mind of God. . . . They abstain from the Eucharist and from prayer because they do not confess that the Eucharist is the flesh of our Savior Jesus Christ, flesh which suffered for our sins and which that Father, in his goodness, raised up again. They who deny the gift of God are perishing in their disputes” (Letter to the Smyrnaeans 6:2–7:1 [A.D. 110]).

All three of the major leaders of the reformation had different views from each other on the Holy Eucharist.
The problem with this interpretation of the words of Ignatius is that it lacks the context in which he wrote his letter. He was fighting Docetism at the time. Docetists believed that Jesus only appeared to be human but was not fully incarnated in a physical body. In context, the heretics at the time denied the body of Christ so how could Ignatius celebrate the Lord’s Supper if they denied that Christ physically existed? Furthermore, Ignatius calls the gospel the “flesh of Jesus Christ“ in Philadelphians 5. Sensibly and responsibly, given the context, it would be an over reach to consider the interpretations of Ignatius words to refer to the present RCC doctrine of transubstantiation.
 
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Valletta

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The problem with this interpretation of the words of Ignatius is that it lacks the context in which he wrote his letter. He was fighting Docetism at the time. Docetists believed that Jesus only appeared to be human but was not fully incarnated in a physical body. In context, the heretics at the time denied the body of Christ so how could Ignatius celebrate the Lord’s Supper if they denied that Christ physically existed? Furthermore, Ignatius calls the gospel the “flesh of Jesus Christ“ in Philadelphians 5. Sensibly and responsibly, given the context, it would be an over reach to consider the interpretations of Ignatius words to refer to the present RCC doctrine of transubstantiation.
Saint Justin Martyr stated the following:
“We call this food Eucharist, and no one else is permitted to partake of it, except one who believes our teaching to be true and who has been washed in the washing which is for the remission of sins and for regeneration [i.e., has received baptism] and is thereby living as Christ enjoined. For not as common bread nor common drink do we receive these; but since Jesus Christ our Savior was made incarnate by the word of God and had both flesh and blood for our salvation, so too, as we have been taught, the food which has been made into the Eucharist by the Eucharistic prayer set down by him, and by the change of which our blood and flesh is nurtured, is both the flesh and the blood of that incarnated Jesus” (First Apology 66 [A.D. 151]).

 
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2PhiloVoid

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The understanding of the Holy Eucharist caused great divisions, many disciples who had followed Jesus walked away from Jesus, and it came up in the early Church as per this from Ignatius of Antioch :

“Take note of those who hold heterodox opinions on the grace of Jesus Christ which has come to us, and see how contrary their opinions are to the mind of God. . . . They abstain from the Eucharist and from prayer because they do not confess that the Eucharist is the flesh of our Savior Jesus Christ, flesh which suffered for our sins and which that Father, in his goodness, raised up again. They who deny the gift of God are perishing in their disputes” (Letter to the Smyrnaeans 6:2–7:1 [A.D. 110]).

All three of the major leaders of the reformation had different views from each other on the Holy Eucharist.

Yes, I know.
 
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concretecamper

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It was the teaching on the Eucharist where Judas was lost, he could not accept that Jesus was to literally give His Body and Blood, I can see the same in this thread.

John 6:65 But there are some of you that believe not. For Jesus knew from the beginning who they were that did not believe and who he was that would betray him.
6:66 And he said: Therefore did I say to you that no man can come to me, unless it be given him by my Father.
6:67 After this, many of his disciples went back and walked no more with him.
6:68 Then Jesus said to the twelve: Will you also go away?
6:69 And Simon Peter answered him: Lord, to whom shall we go? Thou hast the words of eternal life.
6:70 And we have believed and have known that thou art the Christ, the Son of God.
6:71 Jesus answered them: Have not I chosen you twelve? And one of you is a devil.
6:72 Now he meant Judas Iscariot, the son of Simon: for this same was about to betray him, whereas he was one of the twelve.
 
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Hentenza

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Saint Justin Martyr stated the following:
“We call this food Eucharist, and no one else is permitted to partake of it, except one who believes our teaching to be true and who has been washed in the washing which is for the remission of sins and for regeneration [i.e., has received baptism] and is thereby living as Christ enjoined. For not as common bread nor common drink do we receive these; but since Jesus Christ our Savior was made incarnate by the word of God and had both flesh and blood for our salvation, so too, as we have been taught, the food which has been made into the Eucharist by the Eucharistic prayer set down by him, and by the change of which our blood and flesh is nurtured, is both the flesh and the blood of that incarnated Jesus” (First Apology 66 [A.D. 151]).

This is a perfect example of the literary sin of presentism. In short presentism is the tendency to interpret past texts in terms of modern concepts. You are using this text to prove transubstantiation which is the literal change of the elements to Christ actual flesh and blood while retaining the appearance of bread and wine. Let’s examine your interpretation.

1. The Christians in the second century totally despised the thought of eating actual flesh and drinking actual blood. Justin Martyr writes in chapter 12 of his second apology:

“For I myself, too, when I was delighting in the doctrines of Plato, and heard the Christians slandered, and saw them fearless of death, and of all other things which are counted fearful, perceived that it was impossible that they could be living in wickedness and pleasure. For what sensual or intemperate man, or who that counts it good to feast on human flesh,[4] could welcome death that he might be deprived of his enjoyments, and would not rather continue always the present life, and attempt to escape the observation of the rulers; and much less would he denounce himself when the consequence would be death?”

Even Tatian, Justin Martyr’s own student, decries the thought of eating human flesh. This is an excerpt from his “Address to the Greeks” chapter 25.

“Why do you hate those who follow the word of God, as if they were the vilest of mankind? It is not we who eat human flesh --they among you who assert such a thing have been suborned as false witnesses; it is among you that Pelops is made a supper for the gods, although beloved by Poseidon, and Kronos devours his children, and Zeus swallows Metis.”

2. Justin Marty is not describing an ontological change in the elements but a spiritual change of those receiving it. In “Dialogue with Trypho” chapter 41 Justin states the following.

“And the offering of fine flour, sirs," I said, "which was prescribed to be presented on behalf of those purified from leprosy, was a type of the bread of the Eucharist, the celebration of which our Lord Jesus Christ prescribed, in remembrance of the suffering which He endured on behalf of those who are purified in soul from all iniquity, in order that we may at the same time thank God for having created the world, with all things therein, for the sake of man, and for delivering us from the evil in which we were, and for utterly overthrowing principalities and powers by Him who suffered according to His will.”

Here Justin describes the celebration of the Eucharist as a remembrance of the suffering which Christ endured on behalf of those who are purified in soul. Here there is no change in elements and the reason is one of remembrance of Jesus suffering.

In chapter 70 of the same book he states:

“Now it is evident, that in this prophecy[allusion is made] to the bread which our Christ gave us to eat, in remembrance of His being made flesh for the sake of His believers, for whom also He suffered; and to the cup which He gave us to drink, in remembrance of His own blood, with giving of thanks.”

Here he plainly states that both the bread and the cup are given in remembrance of His own blood and the bread in remembrance of His being made flesh for the sake of His believers. There is nothing here about transubstantiation. In fact he is not even talking about real presence. You would think that if Justin was teaching transubstantiation or even real presence that his own student would teach the same.

3. Let’s examine the context of the portion that you posted. You posted chapter 66 but let’s set the scene right before the giving of the Eucharist in chapter 65.

“But we, after we have thus washed him who has been convinced and has assented to our teaching, bring him to the place where those who are called brethren are assembled, in order that we may offer hearty prayers in common for ourselves and for the baptized [illuminated] person, and for all others in every place, that we may be counted worthy, now that we have learned the truth, by our works also to be found good citizens and keepers of the commandments, so that we may be saved with an everlasting salvation. Having ended the prayers, we salute one another with a kiss. There is then brought to the president of the brethren bread and a cup of wine mixed with water; and he taking them, gives praise and glory to the Father of the universe, through the name of the Son and of the Holy Ghost, and offers thanks at considerable length for our being counted worthy to receive these things at His hands. And when he has concluded the prayers and thanksgivings, all the people present express their assent by saying Amen. This word Amen answers in the Hebrew language to genoito [so be it]. And when the president has given thanks, and all the people have expressed their assent, those who are called by us deacons give to each of those present to partake of the bread and wine mixed with water over which the thanksgiving was pronounced, and to those who are absent they carry away a portion.”

Here the elements are brought out and prayers by all present are given finishing with amen. The elements are bread and wine mixed with water. There is nothing about a consecration of the elements to change ontologically to the real flesh and blood of Christ. Even here the emphasis is on a meal of thanksgiving and praise. The food is said to be bread and wine mixed with water and after the prayers and blessings the meal is said to still be bread and wine mixed with water.

Your conclusion drawn from chapter 66 to show transubstantiation or even real presence is clouded by you assigning today’s beliefs to an antique text. There is zero evidence that Justin Martyr was teaching transubstantiation or even real presence. In fact, his own words proves the opposite.
 
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caffeinated.hermit

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It was the teaching on the Eucharist where Judas was lost, he could not accept that Jesus was to literally give His Body and Blood, I can see the same in this thread.

John 6:65 But there are some of you that believe not. For Jesus knew from the beginning who they were that did not believe and who he was that would betray him.
6:66 And he said: Therefore did I say to you that no man can come to me, unless it be given him by my Father.
6:67 After this, many of his disciples went back and walked no more with him.
6:68 Then Jesus said to the twelve: Will you also go away?
6:69 And Simon Peter answered him: Lord, to whom shall we go? Thou hast the words of eternal life.
6:70 And we have believed and have known that thou art the Christ, the Son of God.
6:71 Jesus answered them: Have not I chosen you twelve? And one of you is a devil.
6:72 Now he meant Judas Iscariot, the son of Simon: for this same was about to betray him, whereas he was one of the twelve.

Transubstantiation is one of those Catholic ideas that just seems Scriptural to me. I've never understood how some can take Genesis literally and yet not take Matthew 26:26-29 literally. Makes no sense to me. We talk of faith yet can not believe His words on this matter.

If we start with Scripture I think we can come to conclude something similar to Transubstantiation, can see that the Woman of Revelation is Mary, realize that what we do in Christ does impact where we wind up when we die, and realize that there is ground to stand on. I hope everyone gets back together some day. I do. And I believe there is something unique, original, and God-given about the Catholic Church. You guys have the best Saints, and that can't be an accident.

Still, I do think the doors of Salvation must be open a bit wider than some Catholics, Orthodox, and Protestants imagine. And yes, the Sacraments are important, but we all know there are plenty of active Catholic and Orthodox Christians who also seem to be wolves in spite of the Sacraments. And there are Protestants who seem to be wolves in spite of their abundance of faith, Bible-reading, and lively preaching.


:herb:
 
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Servus

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I think those who partake should at the very least in all sincerity say "this is the body of Christ broken for me" when partaking of the bread, and "this is the blood of Christ shed for me" when partaking of the wine.
 
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Xeno.of.athens

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I think those who partake should at the very least in all sincerity say "this is the body of Christ broken for me" when partaking of the bread, and "this is the blood of Christ shed for me" when partaking of the wine.
that would help.
 
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childeye 2

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I think those who partake should at the very least in all sincerity say "this is the body of Christ broken for me" when partaking of the bread, and "this is the blood of Christ shed for me" when partaking of the wine.
That's the heart of the Gospel.
 
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childeye 2

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It was the teaching on the Eucharist where Judas was lost, he could not accept that Jesus was to literally give His Body and Blood, I can see the same in this thread.

John 6:65 But there are some of you that believe not. For Jesus knew from the beginning who they were that did not believe and who he was that would betray him.
6:66 And he said: Therefore did I say to you that no man can come to me, unless it be given him by my Father.
6:67 After this, many of his disciples went back and walked no more with him.
6:68 Then Jesus said to the twelve: Will you also go away?
6:69 And Simon Peter answered him: Lord, to whom shall we go? Thou hast the words of eternal life.
6:70 And we have believed and have known that thou art the Christ, the Son of God.
6:71 Jesus answered them: Have not I chosen you twelve? And one of you is a devil.
6:72 Now he meant Judas Iscariot, the son of Simon: for this same was about to betray him, whereas he was one of the twelve.
In John 6, I don't think any of the disciples could perceive that Jesus was talking about the cross where he would give his flesh and blood as food and drink.
 
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The Liturgist

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Because I don't think it should be "our" (exclusive) Eucharist. That hardly befits unity. Will the Kingdom of Heaven be segregated into separate sections for Protestant, Catholic and Orthodox etc? Will any of that exist there?

Is my friend @MarkRohfrietsch correct?

It appears you object to the Orthodox, Catholic and Lutherans having different doctrine from you, because you perceive this as a threat to ecumenical unity.

I should point out that statements such as attacks on our Eucharistic and Marian doctrine and closed communion and a seeming desire of evangelicals to assimilate us is precisely what is fueling the popularity of the schismatic Old Calendarists, who believe ecumenism is some kind of Masonic conspiracy that is engulfing the “World Orthodox”, that is to say, the canonical Orthodox churches. They are wrong, of course, but it is because of similar sentiments encountered in the World Council of Churches and its “Lima Liturgy” intended to be used by all and offend none that have caused the Orthodox Churches of Georgia and Bulgaria to leave the WCC and several others such as Jerusalem to reduce their participation to nothing.

We don’t want to receive communion in churches that are not in fellowship with us and that agree with our doctrine, and entrust their salvation to Christ our True God, who is fortunately infinitely merciful. St. Theophan the Recluse taught we should not worry about other Christians because they have a Savior who desires the salvation of all men, but, he added, if we abandon that faith which we have received unchanged from the Apostles we jeopardize our soul.

Thus anyone who wants the Orthodox Eucharist should become a catechumen rather than attacking our theology, since partaking of Holy Communion is for us the supreme act of accepting the teachings of Christ as received by the millions of men, women and children who are martyrs and confessors of the Orthodox Church, receiving their crowns of Martyrdom under the Pharisees and Romans, Persians, even the pagan Hindus and Armenians in the case of St. Thomas and St. Bartholomew, and more recently, since 600 AD, the Saracens, the Turks, the Communists and now the Islamic Fundamentalists, among others who have decided to seek our demise.

Conversely we desire the demise of no other Christians but love all and confess ourselves to be the worst of sinners.
 
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I think those who partake should at the very least in all sincerity say "this is the body of Christ broken for me" when partaking of the bread, and "this is the blood of Christ shed for me" when partaking of the wine.

We Orthodox confess this is True.

That's the heart of the Gospel.

To a large extent, along with John 3:16, and John 6 which connects the Eucharist and Passion of the Lord to the free gift of salvation he offers, and similar pericopes concerning Baptism, and also John 1:1-18 and the Sermon on the Mount … actually it seems the Heart of the Gospel is the Gospel entire which cannot be reduced to a paraphrase of a pericope or a pious platitude however pleasant.
 
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This is a perfect example of the literary sin of presentism. In short presentism is the tendency to interpret past texts in terms of modern concepts. You are using this text to prove transubstantiation which is the literal change of the elements to Christ actual flesh and blood while retaining the appearance of bread and wine. Let’s examine your interpretation.

1. The Christians in the second century totally despised the thought of eating actual flesh and drinking actual blood. Justin Martyr writes in chapter 12 of his second apology:

“For I myself, too, when I was delighting in the doctrines of Plato, and heard the Christians slandered, and saw them fearless of death, and of all other things which are counted fearful, perceived that it was impossible that they could be living in wickedness and pleasure. For what sensual or intemperate man, or who that counts it good to feast on human flesh,[4] could welcome death that he might be deprived of his enjoyments, and would not rather continue always the present life, and attempt to escape the observation of the rulers; and much less would he denounce himself when the consequence would be death?”

Even Tatian, Justin Martyr’s own student, decries the thought of eating human flesh. This is an excerpt from his “Address to the Greeks” chapter 25.

“Why do you hate those who follow the word of God, as if they were the vilest of mankind? It is not we who eat human flesh --they among you who assert such a thing have been suborned as false witnesses; it is among you that Pelops is made a supper for the gods, although beloved by Poseidon, and Kronos devours his children, and Zeus swallows Metis.”

2. Justin Marty is not describing an ontological change in the elements but a spiritual change of those receiving it. In “Dialogue with Trypho” chapter 41 Justin states the following.

“And the offering of fine flour, sirs," I said, "which was prescribed to be presented on behalf of those purified from leprosy, was a type of the bread of the Eucharist, the celebration of which our Lord Jesus Christ prescribed, in remembrance of the suffering which He endured on behalf of those who are purified in soul from all iniquity, in order that we may at the same time thank God for having created the world, with all things therein, for the sake of man, and for delivering us from the evil in which we were, and for utterly overthrowing principalities and powers by Him who suffered according to His will.”

Here Justin describes the celebration of the Eucharist as a remembrance of the suffering which Christ endured on behalf of those who are purified in soul. Here there is no change in elements and the reason is one of remembrance of Jesus suffering.

In chapter 70 of the same book he states:

“Now it is evident, that in this prophecy[allusion is made] to the bread which our Christ gave us to eat, in remembrance of His being made flesh for the sake of His believers, for whom also He suffered; and to the cup which He gave us to drink, in remembrance of His own blood, with giving of thanks.”

Here he plainly states that both the bread and the cup are given in remembrance of His own blood and the bread in remembrance of His being made flesh for the sake of His believers. There is nothing here about transubstantiation. In fact he is not even talking about real presence. You would think that if Justin was teaching transubstantiation or even real presence that his own student would teach the same.

3. Let’s examine the context of the portion that you posted. You posted chapter 66 but let’s set the scene right before the giving of the Eucharist in chapter 65.

“But we, after we have thus washed him who has been convinced and has assented to our teaching, bring him to the place where those who are called brethren are assembled, in order that we may offer hearty prayers in common for ourselves and for the baptized [illuminated] person, and for all others in every place, that we may be counted worthy, now that we have learned the truth, by our works also to be found good citizens and keepers of the commandments, so that we may be saved with an everlasting salvation. Having ended the prayers, we salute one another with a kiss. There is then brought to the president of the brethren bread and a cup of wine mixed with water; and he taking them, gives praise and glory to the Father of the universe, through the name of the Son and of the Holy Ghost, and offers thanks at considerable length for our being counted worthy to receive these things at His hands. And when he has concluded the prayers and thanksgivings, all the people present express their assent by saying Amen. This word Amen answers in the Hebrew language to genoito [so be it]. And when the president has given thanks, and all the people have expressed their assent, those who are called by us deacons give to each of those present to partake of the bread and wine mixed with water over which the thanksgiving was pronounced, and to those who are absent they carry away a portion.”

Here the elements are brought out and prayers by all present are given finishing with amen. The elements are bread and wine mixed with water. There is nothing about a consecration of the elements to change ontologically to the real flesh and blood of Christ. Even here the emphasis is on a meal of thanksgiving and praise. The food is said to be bread and wine mixed with water and after the prayers and blessings the meal is said to still be bread and wine mixed with water.

Your conclusion drawn from chapter 66 to show transubstantiation or even real presence is clouded by you assigning today’s beliefs to an antique text. There is zero evidence that Justin Martyr was teaching transubstantiation or even real presence. In fact, his own words proves the opposite.
I would like to thank you for this. I also would like to reiterate that it's the suffering that The Christ endured that displays the depth of God's Love, and that is what to me is the sacred thing that the sacrament is a sign of.

Justin Martyr here --->
“And the offering of fine flour, sirs," I said, "which was prescribed to be presented on behalf of those purified from leprosy, was a type of the bread of the Eucharist, the celebration of which our Lord Jesus Christ prescribed, in remembrance of the suffering which He endured on behalf of those who are purified in soul from all iniquity, in order that we may at the same time thank God for having created the world, with all things therein, for the sake of man, and for delivering us from the evil in which we were, and for utterly overthrowing principalities and powers by Him who suffered according to His will.”
 
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