What do you consider a Biblical Church?

Daniel Carlton said:

What is a biblical church to you? What are the must have or must not have to be considered a biblical church?

I will give my answer later on as I do not want to influence answers.

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A biblical church in today's world would be one that puts compassion and understanding for others first rather than seeing that its primary purpose is to whack people over the head senseless toward the goal of conforming them with the Gospel message, while still impressing upon the essential message of constant renewal in the Holy Spirit.

Basically.....................the kind of biblical church that I have yet to find, being disappointed as I have been with what I've found in various Presbyterian Church U.S.A. congregations on one side, and Southern Baptist Churches and Christian Churches on the other side, over the past 40 years.

However, I do understand the challenge of having to deal with a schizophrenic member sitting in and among the church in the pews who needs "extra care" in interpersonal handling, and so many church leaders and pastors just don't have the chops in neuroscience and psychiatry to mediate that level of care, compassion and understanding. It's sad, but it's true.

Daniel Carlton said:

What is a biblical church to you? What are the must have or must not have to be considered a biblical church?

I will give my answer later on as I do not want to influence answers.

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It's a church with a bible baked into every brick.

Even if people don't show up, the church building remains biblical.

Maybe the most Biblical churches I have found had mature leaders who know how to relate with anyone. And they are by the Bible. And even if there is a young pastor, there are mature members who can mentor the pastor. And the message includes being conformed to the image of Jesus, and how to get free of sin, and holiness has to do with how to become in the character of Jesus . . . not only do's and don'ts.

Gregory Thompson said:

It's a church with a bible baked into every brick.

Even if people don't show up, the church building remains biblical.

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In the New Testament, a church is the people, believers in Jesus Christ, not the building in which those people meet. How can a structure of bricks and mortar be biblical or unbiblical? If nobody shows up, there is no church. When Paul wrote letters to "the church at Ephesus" or "the church at Corinth", he wasn't addressing those letters to the building in which Christians met.

David Lamb said:

In the New Testament, a church is the people, believers in Jesus Christ, not the building in which those people meet. How can a structure of bricks and mortar be biblical or unbiblical? If nobody shows up, there is no church. When Paul wrote letters to "the church at Ephesus" or "the church at Corinth", he wasn't addressing those letters to the building in which Christians met.

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It was a joke, what matters is if a church is Godly.

A biblical Church is one that is faithful to the Apostolic deposit. That resists the ways modernity tries to get it to conform to the world generally.

First and formost I think the church should reflect Christ. Just like an individual they should be first living Christs teachings and example. In that sense they will shine like a beacon in the night in todays stormy seas.

We hear the whitenoise of all the rationalisations and rhetoric about what is right and good and just but so few actually live what they preach.

In that way if and when the church does comment on social issues it will have more respect in that there can be no or little charge against them for doing wrong.

There may still be disputes over the churches authority but there will be little that can be held morally accountable against a church who examples Christ. Just like Pilot could find no fault in Christ as innocent of any wrong doing.

This may seem unreal but I believe there have been times and especially before the church became politicised under Constantine where they lived out Christs example. But also throughout history there have been movements quietly exmpling Christ regardless of the politics.

But today with so many fractures in the church people don't see Christ but division and chaos. Not too disimilar to the wider society.

I believe there may be a movement back to the church becoming more Christlike. Theres been so much abuse and trouble that the spirit is convicting the church to rethink and get back to setting a good example.

stevevw said:

We hear the whitenoise of all the rationalisations and rhetoric about what is right and good and just but so few actually live what they preach.

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I think the end of all is at hand, i.e. today, tomorrow, or very nearly so. The more excuses/ explanations / rhetoric that is used to defend false gospels instead of ousting them has increased exponentially with no sign of sorrow for the false teaching, nor for the sinful lives, and no sign of truthfully turning to God in repentance.

Will this qualify as an 'extinction event' for the people of the world ? God said He Would (would have) save sodom and gomorrah if there were 10 righteous men there, and there weren't, so the sinful wicked cities (or towns) where Lot had lived were destroyed, and only 3 people saved from those places , by an angel sent to bring them out.

Aaron112 said:

I think the end of all is at hand, i.e. today, tomorrow, or very nearly so. The more excuses/ explanations / rhetoric that is used to defend false gospels instead of ousting them has increased exponentially with no sign of sorrow for the false teaching, nor for the sinful lives, and no sign of truthfully turning to God in repentance.

Will this qualify as an 'extinction event' for the people of the world ? God said He Would (would have) save sodom and gomorrah if there were 10 righteous men there, and there weren't, so the sinful wicked cities (or towns) where Lot had lived were destroyed, and only 3 people saved from those places , by an angel sent to bring them out.

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I agree I think we are heading in that direction at the moment. Which in some ways is inevitable if Christs truth is to finally defeat all possible rationalisations and alternative claims to truth.

In some ways it has to play out this way and I think this is how the world works. Our history shows we can be evil and then be Godly. But I think as time goes by and each time we fail this brings us closer to Christs truth. As we see the failures and become more aware we come closer to Christs truth in the world.

So now we are pretty close. Christians and the church community know all the failures and know Christs truth. Theres little excuse now.
But I also think the enermy knows this as well and thats why things are becoming heated in many issues locally and on the world stage.

I think we may be coming into a cycle where as a response or reaction to the failures of the past that there will be a growing Christlike presense rising up in the world that cannot be denied. I don't think God gives up so easy and will reveal Christs truth more destinctly so that many who maybe unsure will see.

But also this will esculate those who deny Christ. This may repeat again but each time becoming more a spiritual battle for Christs truth. The more it is destinguished the more it nears the final battle.

Which poses the question will we reach a point where the destinction is so clear that just standing with Christ is enough to create a situation where this is not tolerated anymore by secular powers that people will suffer for standing with Christ not just in far away nations but in the west which once stood with God.

Gregory Thompson said:

It was a joke, what matters is if a church is Godly.

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I am so sorry for not realising. Unfortunately, there are so many people here in the UK who do indeed think that the church is a physical building of bricks and mortar.

In answer to the OP's question:-
Sound Biblical teaching, a gospel of salvation by grace through faith, mutual love and support, compassion and a desire to reach the lost and serve the community, Also a willingness to join with other born-again believers in ecumenical projects and to be able to have different views on the non-essential issues.

To not compromise the gospel, but to be aware that we all fall short at times and that forgiveness is available on repentance. All are welcome to join us but to become a member one must have received the Lord as their Saviour. This may mean that there is an unseen distinction between the congregation and the membership. The congregation are welcome to participate in many things but only members would be able to lead ministries, teach or preach. A sensitivity to the leading of the Holy Spirit is essential.

Accountability in leadership, either by being part of a Biblical denomination or by having team leadership, in which each leader is accountable to the others. I think it is best if the leaders are not all related to each other if there is no denominational accountability. This prevents anyone going off on their own particular hobby-horse.

David Lamb said:

I am so sorry for not realising. Unfortunately, there are so many people here in the UK who do indeed think that the church is a physical building of bricks and mortar.

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No worries, it is also tied to the language in Canada to through the phrase "go to church"

It is one that doesn't care about the way of the world, and follows the scripture.

A biblical church is a group of people that follow the bible. What is interesting though is what parts do they major/minor in? Secondly how true do they follow the pattern that the bible gives? I am sure one could write a whole book on this but I will advance to what I am looking for in a church. Love, compassion, sound doctrine, reverent in their worship and other expressions and sound biblical teaching. They also must have a heart and boldness not only for missions but for assisting others, including laying hands on the sick and ministering as the Holy Spirit leads.
The services are engaging because they are participatory and not generally fully scripted.
1 Corinthians 14:26 (KJV)
26 How is it then, brethren? when ye come together, every one of you hath a psalm, hath a doctrine, hath a tongue, hath a revelation, hath an interpretation. Let all things be done unto edifying.

The church needs the power of the Holy Spirit too. It can give deliverance, and it can assist the poor. It should have a pastor and/or a small group of elders that shepherd the people, lead services and organize outreaches. Other ministries and gifts are also recognized and should be cultivated.

The church hopefully functions well in praise and worship, corporate prayer, communion, teaching and even have some fellowship opportunities for various groups including children to seniors.

Lastly, the church should have some oversight from others. This can be a formal denomination, to a more loose collection of ministers to board members. Whatever is adopted should hold the church leaders accountable for their conduct and church finances as well as anything else deemed important.

Admittedly, it is rare to find such a biblical church as this. No church is perfect but we all can help through the contributions that God brings through us; from ministry, monies, and especially our help as needed.

Richard T said:

A biblical church is a group of people that follow the bible. What is interesting though is what parts do they major/minor in? Secondly how true do they follow the pattern that the bible gives? I am sure one could write a whole book on this but I will advance to what I am looking for in a church. Love, compassion, sound doctrine, reverent in their worship and other expressions and sound biblical teaching. They also must have a heart and boldness not only for missions but for assisting others, including laying hands on the sick and ministering as the Holy Spirit leads.
The services are engaging because they are participatory and not generally fully scripted.
1 Corinthians 14:26 (KJV)
26 How is it then, brethren? when ye come together, every one of you hath a psalm, hath a doctrine, hath a tongue, hath a revelation, hath an interpretation. Let all things be done unto edifying.

The church needs the power of the Holy Spirit too. It can give deliverance, and it can assist the poor. It should have a pastor and/or a small group of elders that shepherd the people, lead services and organize outreaches. Other ministries and gifts are also recognized and should be cultivated.

The church hopefully functions well in praise and worship, corporate prayer, communion, teaching and even have some fellowship opportunities for various groups including children to seniors.

Lastly, the church should have some oversight from others. This can be a formal denomination, to a more loose collection of ministers to board members. Whatever is adopted should hold the church leaders accountable for their conduct and church finances as well as anything else deemed important.

Admittedly, it is rare to find such a biblical church as this. No church is perfect but we all can help through the contributions that God brings through us; from ministry, monies, and especially our help as needed.

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As some churches today are claiming healings and and all that do you think there is a need for decernment as to what is being claimed or just accept that this is from the holy spirit.

I say this as we have seen some big churches and movements and especially Penticostals using these claims as a way to show others they are the true church of Christ.

In my area there is a church that makes such claims and I have heard from other Christians who have visited that it is very protective and selective with those allowed in. If anyone questions they are shunned.

It reminds me to some extent of the American type evanglist churches and TV pastors selling books and whatnot. I remember reading from Paul that if any overseer asks for something in return for their work they are to be avoided.

It seems just the slightest hint of any overseer leading a church having any involvement in personal gain is not to be trusted. In that sense I think chuches that are making worship like a Ted Talk, selling merchandise, promoting personal books or claiming something miraculous about someone this is a sign of bad fruit.

In fact it seems an overseer should display the opposite disposition. Ignatius I think mentions a worthy overseer is quiet and meek and of few words and lives a Christlike example.

I think the entire church is to be this way. Not being in the news as a social justice warrior but quietly and seperately going about preaching the gospel, helping others practically and ensuring they protect the doctrines and sheep from the surrounding culture.

stevevw said:

As some churches today are claiming healings and and all that do you think there is a need for decernment as to what is being claimed or just accept that this is from the holy spirit.

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Absolutely there is some fake stuff. Yes, we are to discern everything from good doctrine to prophecy and anything that is done in a church service. A participatory church where things can be spontaneous as the bible seems to suggest, means that this discernment and some guidance there as well.

stevevw said:

I say this as we have seen some big churches and movements and especially Penticostals using these claims as a way to show others they are the true church of Christ.

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I imagine there are some like that but most Pentecostals are not exclusive thinking that their church is the only way to Jesus.

stevevw said:

In my area there is a church that makes such claims and I have heard from other Christians who have visited that it is very protective and selective with those allowed in. If anyone questions they are shunned.

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That sounds cult-like. All churches should be welcoming.

stevevw said:

It reminds me to some extent of the American type evanglist churches and TV pastors selling books and whatnot. I remember reading from Paul that if any overseer asks for something in return for their work they are to be avoided.

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The worst church leaders in a way even sell access. There is at least one alleged prophet that will give you a personal prophecy if you pay him enough. I have seen a TV icon preacher that only allowed his close supporters in the seats up close. This is certainly not biblical.

stevevw said:

It seems just the slightest hint of any overseer leading a church having any involvement in personal gain is not to be trusted. In that sense I think chuches that are making worship like a Ted Talk, selling merchandise, promoting personal books or claiming something miraculous about someone this is a sign of bad fruit.

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I don't like any personal promotion. So many especially in Africa use self appointed titles as prophets, apostles etc. In the USA many use diploma mill Dr.'s in front of their name.

stevevw said:

In fact it seems an overseer should display the opposite disposition. Ignatius I think mentions a worthy overseer is quiet and meek and of few words and lives a Christlike example.

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Amen

stevevw said:

I think the entire church is to be this way. Not being in the news as a social justice warrior but quietly and seperately going about preaching the gospel, helping others practically and ensuring they protect the doctrines and sheep from the surrounding culture.

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All your reservations about churches in general seem right on to me. On giving, I prefer boxes at the back of church, with no special part of the service given time for an offering or even appeals for money. I am not saying there is never time for legitimate needs. But Christians should not need long appeals for money. Just teach in the subject of giving as you would any other topic. There is nothing wrong with all the different kinds of churches, I just gave my own preferences and reasons. A church in the same denomination can also vary greatly. A lot does depend on the Pastor and staff.

Richard T said:

Absolutely there is some fake stuff. Yes, we are to discern everything from good doctrine to prophecy and anything that is done in a church service. A participatory church where things can be spontaneous as the bible seems to suggest, means that this discernment and some guidance there as well.

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Yes and I think its when there is proper order that this allows more freedom of the spirit. The church is being qualified and thus also being open to the full potential of the spirit without corruption.

Richard T said:

I imagine there are some like that but most Pentecostals are not exclusive thinking that their church is the only way to Jesus.

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I did not mean to tar Penticostals as I think this could happen in any church. But moreso those who commercialise or secularise the church that its hard to tell the difference.

To me a church should be fairly poor. The opposite should be happening. Instead of making gain for self or even a particular church. Rather the leaders and members should be giving of their own possessions and everyone is helping each other.

I think it shows how far we have drifted away that we think having wealth to the point its no different to secular society is perfectly ok.

Richard T said:

That sounds cult-like. All churches should be welcoming.

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I don't think they are standing around barring people. This is what someone said and it may be that they personally had an issue. Though like I said I thought they were a bit too showy.

The point is that this is what is happening. Unlike MacDonalds where you can walk into any resturant in the country and expect more or less the same thing. Today its like walking into a Macs and getting Kentucky or Berger King or some back street takeaway who is dishing up something hot and spicy lol.

Richard T said:

The worst church leaders in a way even sell access. There is at least one alleged prophet that will give you a personal prophecy if you pay him enough. I have seen a TV icon preacher that only allowed his close supporters in the seats up close. This is certainly not biblical.

I don't like any personal promotion. So many especially in Africa use self appointed titles as prophets, apostles etc. In the USA many use diploma mill Dr.'s in front of their name.

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Do you think that this is moreso today generally in that everything seems to be about credentials or not, ad hominums and appeals to authority. A celebrity age and where looks, position, associations and possessions are the measure of power disguised as success.

Richard T said:

Amen

All your reservations about churches in general seem right on to me. On giving, I prefer boxes at the back of church, with no special part of the service given time for an offering or even appeals for money. I am not saying there is never time for legitimate needs. But Christians should not need long appeals for money. Just teach in the subject of giving as you would any other topic. There is nothing wrong with all the different kinds of churches, I just gave my own preferences and reasons. A church in the same denomination can also vary greatly. A lot does depend on the Pastor and staff.

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Yes it would seem a basic teachings like the Good Samaritan which is simple and obvious. Yet it seems it can be compromised and rationalised as that the church does not have to be so extreme in giving the shirt off their own back. Even half as much would increase help for the needy.

But also I think that the church leadership should be involved in all aspects of the communities life. Be able to give counsel in marriage and any issue of modern society and how to handle this in todays world. Not be left to be swept along by whatever idea comes along.

The fact is its hard to be a Christian today and its easy to be lured into secular norms. I think a big part of the overseers as shepherds is to minister and protect the church as a seperated family in the world but not of the world. Which is hard as it means sometimes going against popular beliefs.

Daniel Carlton said:

What is a biblical church to you? What are the must have or must not have to be considered a biblical church?

I will give my answer later on as I do not want to influence answers.

Click to expand...

If a church proposes young earth creationism, I usually would say that is not Biblical. And I would go elsewhere. Whereas if it acknowledges ancient Israelite context of Genesis, then I would say that it is Biblical.