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SCOTUS Limits Federal Judges’ Ability to Block Executive Actions Nationwide

A2SG

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He doesn’t have to support my argument, but if he believes I am wrong, he needs to prove that, himself. I already did the work to know that I am right, why should I try to prove myself wrong?
Remember back in school when they told you to show your work? Same principle.

-- A2SG, I can't prove you wrong if I don't even know where your information comes from, can I?
 
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A New Dawn

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What if I did investigate it myself, and were unable to confirm your figures? Would that convince you you're wrong?

-- A2SG, maybe I did, and am trying to give you the benefit of the doubt....
I would say that as long as you actually investigate, go with what you find. As I said, even though I believe that it is a much higher number than the ones reported due to testimonies from people in the know about trafficked border crossings, but who testimonies I can’t reproduce, I’m not even going to bring those numbers into the discussion and went with the much smaller, but more verifiable number, for the discussion.

The trouble is that people these days tend to do the minimalist work possible and don’t research for themselves. For myself, a retired nurse who has nothing to do but go down rabbit holes and listen to just about any video someone posts, I then watch as many videos as I can and read as many articles as I can on the issue to try to verify things. Some things I can reproduce, some things I can’t. As I said, I’m not even bringing the things I can’t reproduce into the discussion.
 
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A2SG

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I would say that as long as you actually investigate, go with what you find. As I said, even though I believe that it is a much higher number than the ones reported due to testimonies from people in the know about trafficked border crossings, but who testimonies I can’t reproduce, I’m not even going to bring those numbers into the discussion and went with the much smaller, but more verifiable number, for the discussion.

The trouble is that people these days tend to do the minimalist work possible and don’t research for themselves. For myself, a retired nurse who has nothing to do but go down rabbit holes and listen to just about any video someone posts, I then watch as many videos as I can and read as many articles as I can on the issue to try to verify things. Some things I can reproduce, some things I can’t.
As a trained journalist myself, I tend to view claims with skepticism, and if they can't be documented, I tend to doubt them until I have good reason not to.

As I said, I’m not even bringing the things I can’t reproduce into the discussion.
And yet, that's exactly what you have done.

-- A2SG, oh well....
 
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A New Dawn

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As a trained journalist myself, I tend to view claims with skepticism, and if they can't be documented, I tend to doubt them until I have good reason not to.


And yet, that's exactly what you have done.

-- A2SG, oh well....
Not true. It’s reproducible enough somewhere on the internet that google’s AI can create a summation about it. And short of looking through hours of video clips to find the ones I’ve heard, which verify google’s AI summation, I’m going with that. But I understand that you are skeptical of it.
 
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A2SG

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Not true. It’s reproducible enough somewhere on the internet that google’s AI can create a summation about it. And short of looking through hours of video clips to find the ones I’ve heard, which verify google’s AI summation, I’m going with that. But I understand that you are skeptical of it.
Look, let's put aside the question of whether or not your figures are correct. I'll admit, refusing to substantiate claims is a pet peeve of mine. I'll even concede the point, for the sake of argument, though the Supreme Court did reverse the lower court order.

Let's call President Biden's refusal to reinstate the remain in Mexico policy as executive branch overreach. How does President Biden's overreach compare to Trump's? One was refusing to follow a policy seen as harmful to the asylum seekers, the other is denying due process and shipping people off to foreign prisons based solely on accusations of criminal activity, which were never proven. (And that's not the only example of overreach, but let's go with it for now.)

Which overreach poses more danger, overall?

‐- A2SG, and which one creeps more toward authoritarianism....
 
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A New Dawn

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Look, let's put aside the question of whether or not your figures are correct. I'll admit, refusing to substantiate claims is a pet peeve of mine. I'll even concede the point, for the sake of argument, though the Supreme Court did reverse the lower court order.

Let's call President Biden's refusal to reinstate the remain in Mexico policy as executive branch overreach. How does President Biden's overreach compare to Trump's? One was refusing to follow a policy seen as harmful to the asylum seekers, the other is denying due process and shipping people off to foreign prisons based solely on accusations of criminal activity, which were never proven. (And that's not the only example of overreach, but let's go with it for now.)

Which overreach poses more danger, overall?

‐- A2SG, and which one creeps more toward authoritarianism....
You never responded to my previous post about the supposed denial of due process and the Abrego Garcia incident. Where else has that been an issue? And if it is really an issue, why did the SC green light the program?
 
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A2SG

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You never responded to my previous post about the supposed denial of due process and the Abrego Garcia incident.
Supposed? Did he get due process before Trump shipped him off or didn't he? Maybe I missed it.

Where else has that been an issue? And if it is really an issue, why did the SC green light the program?
Can't recall the SCOTUS reasoning at the moment, but I'll check into it. As a guess, there does seem to be a tendency among certain justices toward favoring a more authoritarian executive branch that I find troubling, to say the least.

-- A2SG, no need to mention any names....
 
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Always in His Presence

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Can't recall the SCOTUS reasoning at the moment, but I'll check into it. As a guess, there does seem to be a tendency among certain justices toward favoring a more authoritarian executive branch that I find troubling, to say the least.
You have repeated that charge numbers of times

As a trained journalist myself, I tend to view claims with skepticism, and if they can't be documented, I tend to doubt them until I have good reason not to.

Look, let's put aside the question of whether or not your figures are correct. I'll admit, refusing to substantiate claims is a pet peeve of mine.
Will you be documenting your repeated claims against the Justices with documentation? I am not a trained journalist, but I view them with skepticism because you have not addressed previous queries with specificity.

Since the oft repeated accusation cannot be documented, they remain unsubstantiated and thereby made moot.
 
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A2SG

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You have repeated that charge numbers of times




Will you be documenting your repeated claims against the Justices with documentation?
Actually, I've avoided making specific claims. I have voiced my opinion, however. Is that not okay with you?

I am not a trained journalist, but I view them with skepticism because you have not addressed previous queries with specificity.
Fine with me. Everyone's entitled to their own opinion.

Since the oft repeated accusation cannot be documented, they remain unsubstantiated and thereby made moot.
Feel free to not care about my opinion, then.

-- A2SG, no skin off my nose....
 
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rjs330

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Why do you think your opponent in an argument should be the one to try to support what you are arguing?

And if it is so easy to do so, why do you not just do it yourself and offer the sources? A "20 second google search" on your part presumably would have taken less time than the multiple posts you've offered refusing to offer sources.
At some point I quit providing sources for most things. I used to spend a ton of time locating, saving and logging sources and proving my points. I quit doing that for most things.

I finally realized it was a waste if time. People didnt read them nor did it change their minds or opinions.

Ive learned that we are all pretty stuck on our opinions on things and believe what we believe. I come here to debate. And if my words aren't good enough to alter someone's opinion, any sources wont either because my opinions are based on the sources.

Ive also discovered a lot of what people post as sources are also opinion pieces and are often nothing more than journalists spinning something.

So now, I'm pretty much if you think I'm wrong about my argument, prove it or move on. Or we can discuss it.

My arguments are based upon what ive seen, read, and heard. Take it or leave it. Or prove me wrong.
 
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RocksInMyHead

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I don't think we can say they were necessarily "going for more than that" because they didn't say more than that. Given the historical context, they may well have not seen a need to be explicit about exclusivity: "What else would we be talking about in this time and this place?"
While the 14th Amendment doesn't explicitly say more on the subject, it was brought up in the debate. For example, from Senator John Conness, in response to Senator Edward Cowan's concern that the amendment would grant citizenship to the children of Gypsies and Chinese immigrants, thus tying them to the country:
The proposition before us … relates simply in that respect to the children begotten of Chinese parents in California, and it is proposed to declare that they shall be citizens. … I am in favor of doing so. … We are entirely ready to accept the provision proposed in this constitutional amendment, that the children born here of Mongolian parents shall be declared by the Constitution of the United States to be entitled to civil rights and to equal protection before the law with others.
ETA: should have read the next page lol
 
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A New Dawn

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Supposed? Did he get due process before Trump shipped him off or didn't he? Maybe I missed it.


Can't recall the SCOTUS reasoning at the moment, but I'll check into it. As a guess, there does seem to be a tendency among certain justices toward favoring a more authoritarian executive branch that I find troubling, to say the least.

-- A2SG, no need to mention any names....
 
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