Antiochus Epiphanes archetype of the antichrist,any others?

Timtofly said:

So are you saying Hanukkah was based on imagination, and Antiochus Epiphanes never set foot in Jerusalem?

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Not at the time of the end.

Douggg said:

Not at the time of the end.

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But he was the little horn in the past in the Greek empire. That is why I asked you why you think he returns, or are there 2 little horns?

Timtofly said:

But he was the little horn in the past in the Greek empire. That is why I asked you why you think he returns, or are there 2 little horns?

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There is only one little horn. And that person is time of the end. And that person is not Antiochus.

Douggg said:

There is only one little horn. And that person is time of the end. And that person is not Antiochus.

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So the Greeks are soon going to overthrow the Medes and the Persians, as you don't accept Daniel 8 as historical?

Jesus mentions Daniel, but in the context of reading. That is historical. People read about history. Jesus never said Daniel 8 is still future.

If Daniel 8 is about the future, at what point does history stop, and the future is yet to come?

How can you state there was never an Antiochus Epiphanes who desecrated the temple in Jerusalem?

Yes, I think the idea of an Antichrist comes from a number of sources. Of course, the biggest source is Dan 7, the "Little Horn." That is the only place where Antichrist really takes form prior to the New Testament. And in the book of Daniel, prophecy of the rise of Antiochus 4 is given, side by side, with the prophecy of Antichrist. They seem to present similar truths, and thus to convey similar ideas.

The main idea, therefore, is that both Antiochus and Antichrist are figures that are part of the satanic rebellion of the present age. Despite God owning the Kingdom, the world seems strangely under the control of rebels, because sinful humanity has given over part of their world to the control of demons.

As such, not only is Antiochus a figure, but the Serpent in the garden is a figure, as well. Satan himself is the source of spiritual rebellion on earth, and its inspiration. Anybody in the Bible who presents leadership in this spiritual rebellion is, in a sense, a type of Antichrist, who leads the whole world to abandon the laws of God for outright rebellion in the most universal, organized way. This is just before Christ comes to judge all mankind, and to establish his Kingdom on earth among His people.

In Daniel Antiochus and Rome both are presented as "abominations of desolation," in my view. As such, Caesar, or Roman generals, appeared as prefigures or foreshadowings of Antichrist. This was an attempt to crush God's Kingdom on earth among His people, the Jews, even though we know that the Jews themselves had fallen into Antichristianity and apostasy.

Jesus mentioned that in his own generation there would be false Christs and false prophets. There certainly were! A number of Jewish leaders promoted open rebellion against Rome, posing as "Christs." This is also similar to the rebellion of Antichrist against God's ways inasmuch as they promote actions in the name of God that were not really inspired by God.

The result is a form of Antichristianity that lifted up corrupt Jews and attacked Christians. That's what the Jews did in Jesus' time. Antiochus, similarly, elevated apostate Jews against more orthodox Jews. And he killed those who tried to remain faithful to the laws of God. We see the same thing describing Antichrist in the book of Revelation as he seeks to mark people with his name, or have them killed.

TrevorL said:

The three centres of the latter day Roman Empire are seen in Revelation 16:12-16 and I understand these to be Russia when she takes over Istanbul, the Papacy and Central Europe. Russia will head the military aspect of the Battle of Armageddon when she invades the Middle East Ezekiel 38:1-2, Daniel 11:40-45 and will be destroyed by Christ, and then the RCC as The Antichrist will oppose Christ and the establishment of the Kingdom at Jerusalem Revelation 17:12-14.

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How far future ? Tonight ? Tomorrow? Next week ? Next year?

Tom Maccabeus said:

I think there is a good consensus that Emperor Antiochus Epiphanes IV (167 B.C.) is seen as the archetype of the antichrist. He fulfilled many of the prophecies in Daniel 11 and Daniel 8. In blasphemous pride Antiochus assumed the title "Theos Epiphanes" (god manifest) Daniel 11:36 states… he will exalt and magnify himself above every god, and he will speak monstrous things against the God of gods" (also in 2 Thess. 2).
What do you think, any others ? BTW there is a reason I ask.
Tom

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Nimrod would be one of the first, who was building the Tower of Babel
the Pharaoh of Egypt in Exodus, not sure which one he is historically, but some think Ramses II
Goliath, and probably some of the other giants faced by Moses and Joshua before Israel was settled by Joshua.
Nebuchadnezzar with his golden idol that he forced people to worship or threw them into a furnace is definitely a type, though I think weirdly enough he might have gotten saved after losing his mind and not being restored until he acknowledged God, God did restore him, and he actually wrote a chapter of Daniel, which is astounding for him to have been so evil to be a type of Antichrist, but somehow redeemed.
Haman, a Persian King's advisor in the book of Esther which if you look past the surface level meaning has a LOT of Eschatological meanings, with the Persian King representing Christ, Esther representing the Church (the bride of Christ), Haman representing Antichrist, and Mordecai representing Israel.
That plus Antiochus covers the types that are found in the bible, outside of the bible, I'd have to say Adolf Hitler stands as definitely a type