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Any proof that Adam and other early people can live a few hundreds years old?

trophy33

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I see no contradictions. Show me.
Not only hard, direct contradictions, but all the differences between gospels in the quotations of Jesus, places etc. seem to destroy your view of the inspiration. "Just" a difference, for example in the divorce instructions, is a huge problem for the dictation view of inspiration.

However, if you want to see some direct contradictions, then for example:

- Mark 5:21-24 indicates that Jairus approaches Jesus while his daughter is still alive and requests healing - but Matthew 9:18 states that Jairus approaches Jesus after his daughter has already died, asking Him to raise her
- the centurion who wanted Jesus to heal his servant approached Jesus in person (Matthew 8:5) or sent an intermediary (Luke 7:3)
- the transfiguration was six days after the promise about seeing the kingdom of God (Mark 9:1-2), or eight days later (Luke 9:27-28)
 
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OnePlanPeopleDestiny

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Not only hard, direct contradictions, but all the differences between gospels in the quotations of Jesus, places etc. seem to destroy your view of the inspiration. "Just" a difference, for example in the divorce instructions, is a huge problem for the dictation view of inspiration.

However, if you want to see some direct contradictions, then for example:

- Mark 5:21-24 indicates that Jairus approaches Jesus while his daughter is still alive and requests healing - but Matthew 9:18 states that Jairus approaches Jesus after his daughter has already died, asking Him to raise her
- the centurion who wanted Jesus to heal his servant approached Jesus in person (Matthew 8:5) or sent an intermediary (Luke 7:3)
- the transfiguration was six days after the promise about seeing the kingdom of God (Mark 9:1-2), or eight days later (Luke 9:27-28)
I still don't see any contradictions. I see harmony where you see doubt.
 
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trophy33

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OnePlanPeopleDestiny

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When you just deny the problem without trying to solve it, its quite easy, right? :)
I don't see a problem, you do. Your attempt to gain consensus that your problem harmonizing scripture should be the shared problem of others who, like me, have no problem harmonizing scripture is, quite frankly, the only problem I see in this thread. As for me and my house, I will continue to trust scripture and harmonize scripture when harmonizing is warranted. Try it.

Blessings and peace to you and yours.
 
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Ivan Hlavanda

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Its not a lie, because both the authors and the original audience knew it is not literal. Exaggerated, symbolic ages and mythical genealogies were common in the ancient writings, its not a special biblical thing.
The book of genesis is historical narrative. I'm sick of people allegorising the book.

'original audience knew it is not literal' you are wrong. The 6 days creation was literal, so was Noah's ark etc.

For example, the Sumerian King List:

After the kingship descended from heaven, the kingship was in Eridu. In Eridu, Alulim became king; he ruled for 28800 years. Alaljar ruled for 36000 years. 2 kings; they ruled for 64800 years. Then Eridug fell and the kingship was taken to Bad-tibira...
Are you seriously comparing some king to the Word of God?
 
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trophy33

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The book of genesis is historical narrative. I'm sick of people allegorising the book.

'original audience knew it is not literal' you are wrong. The 6 days creation was literal, so was Noah's ark etc.
This is just your personal opinion/belief, nothing more.

Are you seriously comparing some king to the Word of God?
I do not compare any king to Jesus. However, it was common in the ancient times to ascribe huge, symbolic ages to ancestors. Its not just a biblical thing. Its simply how they liked it. You must remember that Genesis was not written to you, but to a different culture.
 
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trophy33

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I don't see a problem, you do. Your attempt to gain consensus that your problem harmonizing scripture should be the shared problem of others who, like me, have no problem harmonizing scripture is, quite frankly, the only problem I see in this thread. As for me and my house, I will continue to trust scripture and harmonize scripture when harmonizing is warranted. Try it.

Blessings and peace to you and yours.
You are not addressing the obvious problems with your view, you are just repeating there are none, even after examples were given to you.

Which may work for you personally, but not for an attentive person. Your view of inspiration does not work. Bible is much more human than you are willing to admit.

The easiest way to see it is to simply read two gospels side by side. Its obvious they were not dictated or written in some supernaturally precise way. If this is the case with the most prominent books of the whole Bible, it can hardly be different with Genesis and irrelevant (for Christianity) details like the age numbers.
 
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Ivan Hlavanda

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This is just your personal opinion/belief, nothing more.
When interpreting the Bible, we have to observe the text, look at the gramma, look at the context, compare Scripture with Scripture, and look at how the Chur fathers looked at this.

The book of Genesis seems to be structured on the recurrence of the Hebrew phrase eleh toledoth (“This is the book of the genealogy of . . .” or “This is the history of . . .”) Clearly, the author intended that the book of Genesis should be interpreted in the same way—as historical narrative.

The New Testament also treats the book of Genesis as historical narrative. At least 25 New Testament passages refer directly to the early chapters of Genesis, and they are always treated as real history. For example the Flood is mentioned by Jesus Himself in Matthew 24 37-39. So for you to to interpret the book of Genesis in the same way Lord Jesus did, you must treat the passage as historical narrative and follow the standard principles of interpretation.

When you look at the gramma and the 6 days creation, the Hebrew word for 'day' that we found in Genesis 1 is the word Yom, which means literal 24 hours.

The authors of Old and New Testament treated the book of Genesis as historical fact. So no, it is not just my personal belief, but it is what the Scripture teaches.
 
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Adventist Dissident

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I think you can look at the fossil record and show that plants, insects, animals, birds, fish, and dinosaurs were bigger at some point in the past.

Ask yourself this question how could that happen? 2 things had to be in place
1. different environmental conditions
2. longer time periods. This is especially relevant when dealing with dinosaurs, the only way they exist is more oxygen in the atmosphere and a longer time to grow. That means life would have been longer.

With that in mind read Genesis and ask yourself, is it possible that humans grew taller and lived longer? very likely yes.
 
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Zenos777

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Now, here is a novel approach. The bible says there was water above the firmament and below the firmament. Some believe that the earth was surrounded by floating water (not clouds). Just a little number of cosmic rays, infrared, ultraviolet light penetrating the atmosphere. Under those conditions, it was possible that the earth was like a pressure chamber. Instead of 14.7 lbs. per sq. /In. it was most likely twice, maybe three times higher. Under those conditions oxygen would not only be in your lungs but forced through your skin and into your organs at a higher concentration. The body of those at that time would live longer. Since I have no personal knowledge of those conditions, I can only take an educated guess. Yet, after the flood God said I will limit man to 120 years. Interesting observation. Atmospheric conditions after the flood are like those today.
Blessings to you all.
 
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2PhiloVoid

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Any proof that Adam and other early people can live a few hundred years old?

Nope. There's no proof that any early people from several millennia ago lived several hundred years. Then again, archaeology doesn't provide "proofs." Rather, it provides fragments from the past that become evidence for historical propositions in light of human evaluation and interpretation.

From a historical angle informed by theology, I think it's more copacetic to see the book of Genesis as a prophetic and cultural narrative constructed from the worldview of its author (~ Moses) or authors (~ assuming the application of one of the versions of the Documentary Hypothesis). Either way, the book of Genesis beats whatever the Sumerian Enuma Elish or the Old Babylonian Atrahasis had to offer about the meaning and ordering of the world.
 
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Diamond72

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I mean proof. Not just theory.
In prehistoric times, the average lifespan was likely around 30-40 years. I have studied the cause of death for the remains they find and the cause of death is they were hunted down and killed. This is exactly what Cain talks about. Genesis 4 14 "Anyone who finds me will kill me!”

If you want to life 1,000 years that means you can not age. You hit your prime and you stay there. Adam was 30 years old when he sinned and that was when he began to age. You do not find any disease in people more then 6,000 years ago before Adam and Eve.

The Sumerian King List was considered as an invaluable source for the reconstruction of the political history of Early Dynastic Mesopotamia. Kings were said to have lived thousands of years. There are various theories that attempt to explain this.

We know that Turtles live a long life. Up to 300 years and they continue to grow all of their life. Alligators also live a very long life and they get very big. They both go back to the time of the dinosaurs. The climate was very wet back then and that is why they need a very wet climate today.
 
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Diamond72

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it was possible that the earth was like a pressure chamber.
If you watch the news they talk about high and low pressure and how that effects the weather. My son is a engineer and they do not talk about high and low temperature, they talk about high and low pressure. They were working on a factory that was making silicone bases nano resistors and other electronics.
 
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Diamond72

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I mean proof. Not just theory.
The proof are the remains of the people we find that died before Adam and Eve. NONE of them look older than 30 years of age. None of them died from natural causes. They were hunted down and killed like an animal. Usually the police are doing an investigation for murder when they find out how old the remains are and they turn them over to the experts. Cheddar man is an example. He is famous because they find living relatives of his today. Then "Kennewick Man," was very popular because of the dispute over his remains. Turns out that the people who wanted to claim him were not related to him. So those are two witness as required by the Bible and I am sure there are a lot more.

Of course, many claim that no one lived before Adam and Eve. But that is not what the evidence shows.
 
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Palmfever

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Any proof that Adam and other early people can live a few hundred

How Old Can Humans Get?​


July 31, 2023
An expert on aging thinks humans could live to be 1,000 years old—with a few tweaks to our genetic “software”
By Bill Gifford

Genetics
How long can human beings live? Although life expectancy has increased significantly over the past century, thanks largely to improved sanitation and medicine, research into hunter-gatherer populations suggests that individuals who escaped disease and violent deaths could live to about their seventh or eighth decade. This means our typical human life span may be static: around 70 years, with an extra decade or so for advanced medical care and cautious behavior. Some geneticists believe a hard limit of of around 115 years is essentially programmed into our genome by evolution.

Other scientists in the fast-moving field of aging research, or geroscience, think we can live much longer. A handful of compounds have been shown to lengthen the life spans of laboratory animals slightly, yet some scientists are more ambitious—a lot more ambitious.
João Pedro de Magalhães, a professor of molecular biogerontology at the Institute of Inflammation and Ageing at the University of Birmingham in England, thinks humans could live for 1,000 years. He has scrutinized the genomes of very long-lived animals such as the bowhead whale (which can reach 200 years) and the naked mole rat. His surprising conclusion: if we eliminated aging at the cellular level, humans could live for a millennium—and potentially as long as 20,000 years.

How can that be? If aging is programmed, scientists could theoretically reprogram our cells by tweaking genes that are central to aging. This would require technology that we don’t presently have, but Magalhães thinks it can be created. His great-grandfather died of pneumonia—a leading cause of mortality in the 1920s. When Magalhães contracted the same disease as a child, he was cured with a simple dose of penicillin. He thinks scientists can similarly develop therapies for aging, an endeavor to which he has now devoted his career. “I want to cheat death,” he says bluntly.
[An edited transcript of the interview follows.]
How has cheating death worked out so far?
I don’t think we’re going to have a drug that “cures” aging the way penicillin cures infections anytime soon. But a compound called rapamycin is quite promising. It extends life span by 10 to 15 percent in animals, and it is approved for human use, such as for organ transplant recipients. It does have side effects. I am optimistic that we will develop drugs akin to statins [taken daily to lessen risk of heart disease] that we take every day for longevity purposes. If you could slow down human aging 10 or even 5 percent, that would still be pretty amazing.
How does rapamycin work?
Rapamycin does quite a number of things in the cell, but a lot of its effects [involve] slowing down growth and slowing down cell metabolism, which is why it has an impact on aging.
Your grandmother lived to be 103 years old. Did she take rapamycin, or was her long life linked to something else?

I think it was the sun and the beach [laughs]. We know that to become a centenarian is mostly genetic. My grandmother didn’t really exercise, and she didn’t eat very healthily. She didn’t smoke; she didn’t have very bad habits, but she also didn’t have particularly healthy habits. Yet she was quite healthy almost until the end—she was barely in hospital. With her it came down to genetics, environment and some luck.
You’ve sequenced genomes of very long-lived animals such as the bowhead whale, which lives up to 200 years. How are their genes different from ours, and what can we learn from them?
Various long-lived animals, such as humans, whales and elephants, all have to cope with the same issues, such as cancer, but they use different molecular tricks to achieve their longevity. With bowhead whales, they seem to have much better DNA repair. My dream experiment is to take a bowhead whale gene and implant it in a mouse to see if the mouse would then live longer. Another obvious example would be the p53 gene, which is very strongly associated with cancer suppression. Elephants have multiple copies of this gene, which makes them resistant to cancer. There are a few other candidate genes that we’ve discovered, not only in whales but in rodents such as the naked mole rat.

Why are naked mole rats so interesting?
Naked mole rats are fascinating because they can live up to 30 years, yet they are smaller than a rat, which only lives to about four years. So you have a small rodent that’s related to mice and rats but lives much longer and is very cancer-resistant.
What’s their secret?
In terms of cancer resistance and probably overall aging as well, it’s their ability to respond to and repair DNA damage. But the threshold for a mouse cell to become a cancer cell is much lower than [the threshold] in humans. If you expose mouse cells to DNA damage, they will get cancer; if you expose naked mole rat cells to the same damage, it’s going to be fixed. They won’t get cancer.
So if mice live several years, and naked mole rats live 30 years, and we live about 80 years, does that mean life spans are genetically programmed?
The dominant theory of aging was about wear and tear—damage accumulating in our cells and components of our body like cars that break down over time. I’ve never really liked that because humans are not inanimate objects. There is damage, of course, and often aging seems to be very deterministic, almost like a program. A mouse will age 20 to 30 times faster than a human being. There are a lot of aging [characteristics] that just happen to everybody and even across species, such as loss of muscle mass. This doesn’t seem like something that’s random; it seems predetermined. So I think of aging as more akin to a software problem than a hardware problem.

My hypothesis is that we have a very complicated set of computerlike programs in our DNA that turn us into an adult human being. But maybe some of these same programs, as they continue into later life, become detrimental.
What’s an example of that?
A classic example would be thymus involution. Your thymus is a gland that produces T cells, which are very important to your immune system. But it disappears fairly early in life, around age 20—earlier if you’re obese; later if you’re an athlete. Basically it turns into fat. That strikes me as very programmatic. It’s a classic case of antagonistic pleiotropy, where a process that is beneficial earlier in life becomes harmful later on.

See more
 
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Diamond72

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An expert on aging thinks humans could live to be 1,000 years old
Moses tells us: Psalm 90:10 (NIV): "Our days may come to seventy years, or eighty, if our strength endures; yet the best of them are but trouble and sorrow, for they quickly pass, and we fly away."

There are other scriptures that tell us we can add years onto that. The limit now seems to be 120.

Genesis 6:3:​

"Then the LORD said, 'My Spirit shall not strive with man forever, because he also is flesh; nevertheless his days shall be one hundred and twenty years.'"

The 1,000 years is in Rev 20 and is subject to translation and interpretation.

Revelation 20:4-6 (NIV): "They came to life and reigned with Christ a thousand years. (The rest of the dead did not come to life until the thousand years were ended.) This is the first resurrection. Blessed and holy are those who share in the first resurrection. The second death has no power over them, but they will be priests of God and of Christ and will reign with him for a thousand years."
 
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Adventist Dissident

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Moses tells us: Psalm 90:10 (NIV): "Our days may come to seventy years, or eighty, if our strength endures; yet the best of them are but trouble and sorrow, for they quickly pass, and we fly away."

There are other scriptures that tell us we can add years onto that. The limit now seems to be 120.

Genesis 6:3:​

"Then the LORD said, 'My Spirit shall not strive with man forever, because he also is flesh; nevertheless his days shall be one hundred and twenty years.'"

The 1,000 years is in Rev 20 and is subject to translation and interpretation.

Revelation 20:4-6 (NIV): "They came to life and reigned with Christ a thousand years. (The rest of the dead did not come to life until the thousand years were ended.) This is the first resurrection. Blessed and holy are those who share in the first resurrection. The second death has no power over them, but they will be priests of God and of Christ and will reign with him for a thousand years."
he was making the case in favor of long time periods, saying it was possible. Why are you opposing him. he is on our side.
 
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Adventist Dissident

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It must be possible because then lived 1,000 years before Noah's flood.
dinosaurs are evidence of different environmental conditions and longer periods of time. They could not exist in our current environment and would not live very long.
 
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