Why are so many people hateful and selfish ?

David Lamb said:

A church doesn't have to have Calvinist beliefs in order to have a pastor who acts like a dictator, though thankfully I have never been in a church that has one!

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That is true, but I was just replying to your appeal to quantity.

Gregory Thompson said:

That is true, but I was just replying to your appeal to quantity.

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My only mention of quantity was to say that most Calvinists are not hyper-Calvinists. I'm not sure I understand the connection between that and your post about dictators in some churches.

MassimoTheChristian said:

I don't understand does God only want a few people in heaven ?

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Would you want bad people in heaven or people who disobey God? if it was so it would not be Heaven anymore.

Jesus was clear that not all will make it and tells us how we can get eternal life.

Lucifer was made perfect, then sinned and was kicked out. There is no place In heaven for those who disobey God who do not love him.

The way of the world.

Sounds like your expectations are high and i get that because as a believer you don't have the same spirit, but it's important to remember if not for the grace of God, there go I.

It will help with humility. Everytime i think i have something over another of myself it is like God removes his hand and i see if not for the grace of God, there go I.

So not saying you have the same problem, just saying. Don't let it distract you. Continue to grow in your relationship with the Lord and shine his light in a lost and dark world. Some will hate you because the light reveals their darkened condition. Jesus was never surprised with men because He knew what was in them

David Lamb said:

My only mention of quantity was to say that most Calvinists are not hyper-Calvinists. I'm not sure I understand the connection between that and your post about dictators in some churches.

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That whole no true scotsman deal.

MassimoTheChristian said:

I don't understand does God only want a few people in heaven ?

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It was not God's original purpose, to have anyone in heaven, besides the angels he created and placed there. Psalm 115:16; 1 Corinthians 15:38-49

God created the earth with the intention that man would live on it, forever. Genesis 1:26-30; Genesis 2:7-25; Genesis 9:1; Isaiah 45:18; Acts 17:25-28

The only reason hope of heavenly life was opened to, yes, only a few Luke 12:32; Luke 22:28-30, was because God arranged for a kingdom ruled by the King of kings - God's Christ/Messiah, to remove all the ills resulting from Satan's, Adams and Eve's rebellion; undo all the damage done, and restore the earth to the state God wants it. Daniel 7:27; 1 Corinthians 15:22-28; Matthew 5:4; Matthew 6:10; Ephesians 1:4-10; Colossian 1:19, 20; Hebrews 2:14; 1 John 3:8; Revelation 1:6; Revelation 5:9, 10; Revelation 21:1-5

I know there are quite a few scriptures, but it is beneficial to read them, since they support the comments.
In the end though, only a few go to heaven, while millions will live on an earth restored, and they will dwell there forever. See Isaiah 65:17-25; Isaiah 11:6-9; Psalm 37:11, 29, 34; Proverbs 2:21, 22

I detect that your question here, is designed moreso, to answer the question in the title - Why are so many people hateful and selfish?
The Bible gives the answer.

• During the time of the end, lawlessness will increase. Matthew 24:13; 2 Timothy 3:1-5
• This is due to the fact that when the King of kings - the Messiah, begins his rule, the chief adversary is ousted from heaven along with his angelic following. Matthew 24:3; Revelation 12:7-10
• Notice that Satan knows his time is running out, and so, is bent on misleading as many as possible, and so the Bible describes the conditions on the earth, as very bad. Woe.
• So, because we are living in the last days of Satan's rule, and since Satan's influence is now, more than ever before, up close and personal, mankind is reflecting Satan's spirit - angry; hateful; prideful; vicious; selfish; deceitful; etc.

Most of mankind wants peace, but they will be no peace. Not until the Prince of peace, takes over rulership of the earth. Isaiah 9:6, 7; Daniel 2:44, 45

MassimoTheChristian said:

Sounds pretty hopeless.

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That would be the case, was it not for this: Matthew 28:18-20; Matthew 24:14; Acts 1:8
As you can see from the Acts of the apostles, thousands accepted the gospel, and changed their life. This will continue, as Jesus said, until the end of the world.

True, many billions will lose their life, because they do not submit to Christ, but some will be saved. Matthew 7:13, 14
God isn't concerned with numbers, as can be seen from the flood of Noah's day.
God saved only 8 persons, and a world came out of that minority.
It will be the same at Armageddon. Matthew 24:37-42

David Lamb said:

But neither Calvinism nor the bible teach that God wants only a few people in heaven. In the bible, we read in Revelation:

“After these things I looked, and behold, a great multitude which no one could number, of all nations, tribes, peoples, and tongues, standing before the throne and before the Lamb, clothed with white robes, with palm branches in their hands,” (Re 7:9 NKJV)

As far as Calvinism is concerned, I always think that the TULIP acronym is unfortunate, as the "L", Limited Atonement, does give the impression of fewness. I prefer the term "particular redemption".

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Hi David.
This multitude is the same group mentioned at Revelation 21:3, 4 (See Revelation 7:15-17), and they are mankind that make up the new earth. They are not in heaven.
Hopefully, you see that.

MassimoTheChristian said:

Most people are not good.

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I agree. I just can’t understand how some people can be so cruel and evil either.

CoreyD said:

Hi David.
This multitude is the same group mentioned at Revelation 21:3, 4 (See Revelation 7:15-17), and they are mankind that make up the new earth. They are not in heaven.
Hopefully, you see that.

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Not so. If you read on in Revelation 7, you come to these words about the multitude:

“13 ¶ Then one of the elders answered, saying to me, "Who are these arrayed in white robes, and where did they come from?" 14 And I said to him, "Sir, you know." So he said to me, "These are the ones who come out of the great tribulation, and washed their robes and made them white in the blood of the Lamb. 15 "Therefore they are before the throne of God, and serve Him day and night in His temple. And He who sits on the throne will dwell among them.” (Re 7:13-15 NKJV)

Where is the throne of God? Surely in heaven.

MassimoTheChristian said:

I don't understand does God only want a few people in heaven ?

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Because we are in the modern Anthropocene age. Maybe even post modern humans where Ai takes over. Gods creation has become god.

The aim of Satan is to copy God but with Gods own creation. There has been a gradual evolution away from God and the natural result of that is nature itself and humans become gods.

But as we know Gods order is the truth and any deviation will decend into chaos. Satan is the anti Christ so just think of what Christ is and look at the opposite. Where there is love there is hate, envy, conspiring, gossip, anger, rebellion, selfishness. All the things that are in conflict with Gods nature.

Satan is the master deciever and a wolf in sheep clothing. So he knows how to manipulate and the best way is to dress up the hate in humanism. A human made and counterfeit morality that really is about displaying humans as the gods of goodness and bring praise on themselves. Except that false goodness comes with a catch.

Its all about the fruits of the spirit and the bad fruits of the flesh. Its a spiritual battle and we know there is only one way to cultivate the good fruits which is with the spirit of God. Of course part of the human made world is that there is no such thing as God or the spiritual. Its all about the material, instincts and feelings.

We are fallen creatures and we cannot overcome our fallen natures by our own efforts. But of course that would require submitting to God which is the last thing a humanistic world where individuals aree their own god wants to do.

The crazy thing is everyone deep down knows it. Knows God through His creation. Knows that as humans we mess things up, cannot be trusted and are slowly destroying everything God created. Its there to see, the climate change, the wars, destruction of the planet, the poverty, hate which are all growing and not getter better and certainly not creating some new wonderful utopia Satan promised.

So in that sense its a spiritual battle of belief because no amount of reasoning and evidence will change people who have rejected God. God has given them over to the world they want to create in defience.

stevevw said:

Because we are in the modern Anthropocene age. Maybe even post modern humans where Ai takes over. Gods creation has become god.

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You're correct but many don't believe it. They think they'll help us and be able to control it. This will be a source of division for many in the future. Adopters versus dissenters.

stevevw said:

The aim of Satan is to copy God but with Gods own creation. There has been a gradual evolution away from God and the natural result of that is nature itself and humans become gods.

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There's a movie on Netflix that was added recently called The Uglies. I mentioned 'the beautiful people' a week ago in a conversation on the site and said we've entered that period. It would reflect a primacy on attractiveness and the discrimination that follows. I watched the movie last night and that was the plot.

All the citizens received cosmetic surgery to make them pretty but it included additional changes that made them docile. The uglies were segregated from the rest and lived in dorms until they had the procedure. Children were separated from their parents and reunited afterwards.

They had super soldiers too with enhanced strength and agility. This was an extra procedure applied to recipients who couldn't forget their past upon improvement that fractured the soul. It was eerie to see it on the screen but I wasn't surprised because we're on that track.

We're perfecting His creation more and more and racing towards transhumanism.

~bella

MassimoTheChristian said:

I don't understand does God only want a few people in heaven ?

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God loves humanity incredibly but much of mankind doesn't love him back. In spite of that, God gave us an easy way to salvation because he has already done the hard part.

David Lamb said:

Not so. If you read on in Revelation 7, you come to these words about the multitude:

“13 ¶ Then one of the elders answered, saying to me, "Who are these arrayed in white robes, and where did they come from?" 14 And I said to him, "Sir, you know." So he said to me, "These are the ones who come out of the great tribulation, and washed their robes and made them white in the blood of the Lamb. 15 "Therefore they are before the throne of God, and serve Him day and night in His temple. And He who sits on the throne will dwell among them.” (Re 7:13-15 NKJV)

Where is the throne of God? Surely in heaven.

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I responded in another thread, so as not to derail this one with something off topic.

bèlla said:

You're correct but many don't believe it. They think they'll help us and be able to control it. This will be a source of division for many in the future. Adopters versus dissenters.

There's a movie on Netflix that was added recently called The Uglies. I mentioned 'the beautiful people' a week ago in a conversation on the site and said we've entered that period. It would reflect a primacy on attractiveness and the discrimination that follows. I watched the movie last night and that was the plot.

All the citizens received cosmetic surgery to make them pretty but it included additional changes that made them docile. The uglies were segregated from the rest and lived in dorms until they had the procedure. Children were separated from their parents and reunited afterwards.

They had super soldiers too with enhanced strength and agility. This was an extra procedure applied to recipients who couldn't forget their past upon improvement that fractured the soul. It was eerie to see it on the screen but I wasn't surprised because we're on that track.

We're perfecting His creation more and more and racing towards transhumanism.

~bella

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Yeah I seen that movie and was thinking of watching it. Sounds like a scary scenario. But I think in reality its the so called beauties are really the Uglies on the inside and the uglies have the beauty on the inside.

That was Christs message that exterior beauty and human wisedom was foolish to God and the meek will inherit the earth.

But as for Ai I was thinking about how it will be utilised to control people. An extention of the elite beauties. Where you cannot buy or sell without the mark of Ai control. Where we are treated like cogs in a machine. Thats the logical extension of making humans gods and treating creation as a tool for installing humans as gods.

stevevw said:

Yeah I seen that movie and was thinking of watching it. Sounds like a scary scenario.

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The procedure changed them and made them hollow. It created a new personality that divorced them from their past.

stevevw said:

But as for Ai I was thinking about how it will be utilised to control people. An extention of the elite beauties. Where you cannot buy or sell without the mark of Ai control. Where we are treated like cogs in a machine. Thats the logical extension of making humans gods and treating creation as a tool for installing humans as gods.

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I can see that. I heard a clip of a black AI pastor yesterday. You'd think you were in a baptist church. It was surreal eerily so. We keep welcoming this technology and never question it.

Have you seen the commercial for the new Iphone?

~bella

bèlla said:

The procedure changed them and made them hollow. It created a new personality that divorced them from their past.

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Interesting and I think this reflects reality where the superficial is treated like reality.

bèlla said:

I can see that. I heard a clip of a black AI pastor yesterday. You'd think you were in a baptist church. It was surreal eerily so. We keep welcoming this technology and never question it.

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Ai and applications is scary. Tachnocrats talk about creating human like Ai even toying with the idea of creating consciousness in machines. While I don't think thats possible I think it will come close and perhaps be very good at mimicking humans.

Already we see this in how people are more engaged with computer tech where they become detached from human contact. The Siri type tech in retail is an example of things to come. How we like sheep are controlled by machines telling us what to do. Sometimes people reply to the automatic checkouts like they are human.

Imagine a human like Ai robot that may look human. Its easy to see how people will be deluded into thinking they are real. If people believe that there is no God or spirituality then its easy to see how they could think of robots as an extention of humans.

But we have seen how this detaches people from reality, from empathy with humans on social media where they can hide behind tech and become callous and cold promoting hate. Like they are becoming robots themselves.

bèlla said:

Have you seen the commercial for the new Iphone?

~bella

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Not sure, I just looked it up. Is it the one with the Star Wars convention where the guy dressed in the Star Wars outfit finds his friends through his iphone.

stevevw said:

Ai and applications is scary. Tachnocrats talk about creating human like Ai even toying with the idea of creating consciousness in machines. While I don't think thats possible I think it will come close and perhaps be very good at mimicking humans.

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Do you remember the old horror movies? There was always someone in the group who didn't die because they thought the idea was bad and bowed out early. They were safe at home while the others were fighting for their lives. If you're unwilling to admit the technology is over your head and out of your grasp you'll be in the same boat.

stevevw said:

Already we see this in how people are more engaged with computer tech where they become detached from human contact. The Siri type tech in retail is an example of things to come. How we like sheep are controlled by machines telling us what to do.

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I don't use Siri and we've limited smart gadgets in our home as well. I believe they're too intrusive to our detriment. The data is going somewhere and no one considers that.

stevevw said:

Imagine a human like Ai robot that may look human. Its easy to see how people will be deluded into thinking they are real. If people believe that there is no God or spirituality then its easy to see how they could think of robots as an extention of humans.

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If you allow another to think on your behalf you can't complain when you're exploited. Our addiction to ease will be our undoing. I don't use A.I. God has given us a mind He's willing to fill if we allow Him. No amount of technology will ever compare to the Most High's input.

Two roads diverged in a wood, and I—
I took the one less traveled by,
And that has made all the difference.

stevevw said:

Not sure, I just looked it up. Is it the one with the Star Wars convention where the guy dressed in the Star Wars outfit finds his friends through his iphone.

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This is it.

~bella

bèlla said:

Do you remember the old horror movies? There was always someone in the group who didn't die because they thought the idea was bad and bowed out early. They were safe at home while the others were fighting for their lives. If you're unwilling to admit the technology is over your head and out of your grasp you'll be in the same boat.

I don't use Siri and we've limited smart gadgets in our home as well. I believe they're too intrusive to our detriment. The data is going somewhere and no one considers that.

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I'm talking about the siri type tech such as automated telephone receptionists and the like. Automated retail stores are becoming a reality. First we had online shopping and electronic shopping checkouts. Now siri type checkouts, in fact fully automated retail from buying to checkout. Cars will be the same and as we know homes are being setup with many automated siri type features.

You can see how Ai and robotics will take over but it seems to be coming a lot faster than many think. They say social media change society in profound ways. Sort of putting tech and machines between humans, creating artifical worlds for people to indulge in. Now it seems the machines are coming alive and integrating into everything we do.

I think that is going to turn humans into machines and we know machines lack love so people may become cold and detached and be willing to allow all sorts of inhumane things to happen.

bèlla said:

If you allow another to think on your behalf you can't complain when you're exploited. Our addiction to ease will be our undoing. I don't use A.I. God has given us a mind He's willing to fill if we allow Him. No amount of technology will ever compare to the Most High's input.

Two roads diverged in a wood, and I—
I took the one less traveled by,
And that has made all the difference.

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Yeah I am a bit the same. I have a basic computer which is well outdated. I don't go on social media and rarely shop online as I don't trust it. But I recognise the benefits such as gaining information and for communicating with friends and family.

My aim is to go more or less off grid. Tech is good in that we can now for example have solar power in remote places. But thats about it. I enjoy the basics, home grown veggies and nature.

And I think this rush of tech is making some feel this way, that they want to escape the techno jungle and rat race because they see how it is taking over taking something away from humans. The empathy and organic or moreso the spirituality away and replacing it with cold hard metal and machines which make us less human.

bèlla said:

This is it.

~bella

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OK, well my phone is like in the stoneage compared to the iphone 16. Thats all I need as I don't get into the accessaries. Just to contact others and be contacted. I remember the iphone 4 which only seemed a decade ago maybe a bit more. Wow tech changes fast.

I remember someone saying tech was getting to the point where it was instant. I guess thats when the machines are able to recreate themselves and adapt to the real world in real time. Thats a scary prospect and I don't think we are too far away. If phone tech can change that fast. Its a compounding change where what took 10 years now takes 5 and what takes 5 years now takes 3 and on it goes.

Stop the world I want to get off lol.

Many are called (saved).

Why did I say that?


That means the "called" are saved!

Jesus was saying, out of all of the many whom God saves? That only a few were chosen to be promoted to serve with Him in eternity.
God is not a finicky petty God. If anyone believes in Jesus - no matter what a poor example they allow themselves to become - they
will be saved.



God wants no one to go to the Lake of Fire.
If some weak sinner will refuse to walk in the Spirit after his salvation, only believing in Jesus, and nothing else?
God will hold his nose, and save him.

For we can not name one sin that a backslidden believer walks in that was not paid for on the Cross.
Yes, God saves those who will refuse to glorify Him with their own lives after salvation...

Legalists hate God's justice and mercy.


That means the "called" are saved! And, MANY are called!
But, only a few out of the many called will qualify to reign with the Lord!

grace and peace ...............