All Are Children Of Wrath, By The Spirit Of Disobedience

Mr. M said:

Ephesians 2:
1 And you who were dead in trespasses and sins,
2 in which you once walked according to the course of this world,
according to the prince of the power of the air,
the spirit who now works in the sons of disobedience,
3 among whom also we all once conducted ourselves in the lusts of our flesh,
fulfilling the desires of the flesh and of the mind,
and were by nature children of wrath, just as the others.

Paul here says that we were all by nature children of wrath,
by the spirit of disobedience.
Those who receive the Gospel are born again by the Spirit, they don't
get a new vessel, they receive the promise of the Father for those who
obey His Son.

Colossians 1:13 He has delivered us from the power of darkness
and conveyed us into the kingdom of the Son of His love.
He remains long suffering towards those who continue in disobedience,
for He has appointed a day in which the Son while judge the secrets of men's hearts.

Romans 2:16 In the day when God shall judge the secrets of men
by Jesus Christ according to my gospel.

2 Peter 3:9 The Lord is not slack concerning His promise, as some count slackness,
but is longsuffering toward us, not willing that any should perish
but that all should come to repentance.

There is no reason to believe that Paul is saying that there are vessels
of wrath that are pre-ordained, but this is determined by the spirit they
choose to abide under.

Click to expand...

I think he is saying they are vessels of wrath who have prepared themselves (reflexive) for destruction.

Mr. M said:

Ephesians 2:
1 And you who were dead in trespasses and sins,
2 in which you once walked according to the course of this world,
according to the prince of the power of the air,
the spirit who now works in the sons of disobedience,
3 among whom also we all once conducted ourselves in the lusts of our flesh,
fulfilling the desires of the flesh and of the mind,
and were by nature children of wrath, just as the others.

Paul here says that we were all by nature children of wrath,
by the spirit of disobedience.
Those who receive the Gospel are born again by the Spirit, they don't
get a new vessel, they receive the promise of the Father for those who
obey His Son.

Colossians 1:13 He has delivered us from the power of darkness
and conveyed us into the kingdom of the Son of His love.
He remains long suffering towards those who continue in disobedience,
for He has appointed a day in which the Son while judge the secrets of men's hearts.

Romans 2:16 In the day when God shall judge the secrets of men
by Jesus Christ according to my gospel.

2 Peter 3:9 The Lord is not slack concerning His promise, as some count slackness,
but is longsuffering toward us, not willing that any should perish
but that all should come to repentance.

There is no reason to believe that Paul is saying that there are vessels
of wrath that are pre-ordained, but this is determined by the spirit they
choose to abide under.

Click to expand...

There are vessels of wrath bound for eventual predetermined extinction presented in scriptures beyond any question.

Who might these be you ask? That answer should be entirely obvious:

The devil and his messengers. Predetermined destruction beyond any doubt

Remember we're tempted by the tempter between our own 2 ears

Kind of keeps us from getting too cocky before our Maker. Especially when we're engaged in trying to cover up the obvious problem, our adversary