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I began watching it on Netflix.
I will see more when I have time.
Anyone else see it?
I will see more when I have time.
Anyone else see it?
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The Two Popes
- Thread starter WarriorAngel
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Gnarwhal
☩ Broman Catholic ☩
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I've been reluctant to watch it just because I don't trust Netflix to be honest about the faith, the popes, the Church, any of it. I expect they'll make Benedict look like a crotchety "rigid" old man who has something to learn from the gentle, benevolent, and "in-touch" Francis.
That being said, the casting is remarkable. Especially Jonathan Pryce as Francis, and I love everything Sir Anthony Hopkins touches.
That being said, the casting is remarkable. Especially Jonathan Pryce as Francis, and I love everything Sir Anthony Hopkins touches.
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- Sep 29, 2015
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We watched it a long time ago. Not sure that it would be that relevant any more. I think Ganswein's interviews would be more relevant.
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Reluctant Theologian
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Twice, as a movie, great .. I just think given the current direction the Roman Catholic church is taking under the current Pope with the acceptance of same-sex marriages - I don't think the previous Pope would have made the same decision had he had the foresight ..
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The Pope has not accepted same sex marriage or relationships.
I worry about those who maybe creating a scandal where there may not be one.
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I thought the parts I saw so far were important.
One thing 'Pope Francis' said in their first meeting, as Pope Benedict chastised him, is he is often misquoted.
It was funny... what Pope Benedict said in reply.
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Yeah, I watched it some time ago. I don't remember much, but I seem to recall one Pope being made a bit more likeable than the other. I'm sure you can guess who. It's perhaps not the fairest treatment of both popes. 
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It all depends on perspective.Yeah, I watched it some time ago. I don't remember much, but I seem to recall one Pope being made a bit more likeable than the other. I'm sure you can guess who. It's perhaps not the fairest treatment of both popes.
Pope Benedict was adorable.
I could see both perspectives.
I favored Benedict.
But if you consider all things, Pope Benedict could have ensured Francis was 'retired' as he requested.
So why did he not do that?
Since Benedict was able... and they were distinct in their application of teaching.
Albeit, Francis is misquoted he said... even before he became Pope.
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In reply to Michie's thread...
www.christianforums.com
In the movie The Two Popes, they 'discussed many things' and Benedict knew Francis almost became Pope and knew he would be choosen.
And Francis came to him to sign off his retirement.
Sooooooo I wonder if much said is about those who surround them.
Did Benedict’s death lift restraints on Pope Francis?
Last week when I compiled my list of the top 20 news stories of 2023, I consciously passed over the death of Pope Benedict XVI, since he died on December 31, the final day of the previous year. But now as I reflect on the past year, I suspect that the death of the “Pope Emeritus” had an enormous...
www.christianforums.com
In the movie The Two Popes, they 'discussed many things' and Benedict knew Francis almost became Pope and knew he would be choosen.
And Francis came to him to sign off his retirement.
Sooooooo I wonder if much said is about those who surround them.
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Reluctant Theologian
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I fail to see how 'blessing a same-sex couple' essentially is anything else but accepting that relationship.
Vatican: same-sex couples ruling is not endorsement of homosexuality
For me the fact that that blessing is not connected to some secular/legal government marriage status is irrelevant. Casual couples don't approach the church for a blessing; permanent life-long couples (at least with that intention) do. Trying to argue this new move by the Pope is not him accepting gay marriage to me is semantic gymnastics.
Whether a couple's relationship represents or tries to pass as marriage for me does not depend on secular/government recognition or rubber-stamping. Even in the absence of a government or church/priest a couple still can get married in Biblical terms - that's up to them.
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I think Benedict thought cardinal Scola would be the next pope, and he was one of the favorites. I don't think Bergoglio was ever the presumed next pope. He was in the running.In reply to Michie's thread...
Did Benedict’s death lift restraints on Pope Francis?
Last week when I compiled my list of the top 20 news stories of 2023, I consciously passed over the death of Pope Benedict XVI, since he died on December 31, the final day of the previous year. But now as I reflect on the past year, I suspect that the death of the “Pope Emeritus” had an enormous...
In the movie The Two Popes, they 'discussed many things' and Benedict knew Francis almost became Pope and knew he would be choosen.
And Francis came to him to sign off his retirement.
Sooooooo I wonder if much said is about those who surround them.
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In the movie he said he could have been voted and when Francis presented his retirement papers, Benedict did not sign them.
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It’s inspired by true events. In Hollywood that means taking a lot of artistic license. I would not take this reenactment too seriously.
In its coverage of the film, Timepointed out that the two popes' relationship has not been as smooth as in the fictionalized version. In April 2019, Pope Benedict released a 6,000-word letter blaming the clergy sex abuse scandal on factors including the "dangerously liberal theological ideas" within the Church. While the letter[32] did not criticize Francis' papacy,[33] its content was described by The New York Times as "the most significant undercutting yet of the authority of Pope Francis".[34][35] The Guardian also discussed a letter that Benedict had written, complimentary of Cardinal Joachim Meisner, who was an outspoken critic of Pope Francis, and added that a 2020 book partly authored by Benedict "was intervening to halt Pope Francis relaxing celibacy rules".[36]
In one scene, Pope Benedict confesses to Bergoglio (Francis) and mentions Marcial Maciel before the audio fades out. The audience sees but does not hear the rest of his confession. J. Peter Nixon, in the publication U.S. Catholic, decried "the film's implication that it was Benedict who allowed Father Marcial Maciel Degollado to remain leader of the Legionaries of Christdespite mounting evidence that he was a sexual predator. It was during the papacy of Pope John Paul II, however, that efforts to investigate Maciel were repeatedly frustrated. It was Benedict who ultimately removed him."[37] However, publications including National Catholic Reporter[38] and Slate Magazine have disagreed, with Slate writing: "For years, Joseph Ratzinger also refused to act against Maciel. As the prefect responsible for enforcing church doctrine, he chose to handle the church's sexual abuse through secrecy rather than transparency. For almost a quarter-century, Ratzinger failed to push for the detachment of Marcial Maciel from the position of privilege he enjoyed for so long. He finally did so in 2006, when, as Pope, he found the courage to remove Maciel from the priesthood and send him to Mexico to supposedly focus on a 'discreet life of penance and prayer'. If Maciel followed Benedict's spiritual marching orders, it certainly did not lead to atonement. He never admitted any wrongdoing, much less showed remorse. He died in 2008 without ever asking for forgiveness."[39]
Bishop Robert Barron criticized the film for its characterization of Benedict in an article on the Word on Firewebsite titled "The One Pope."[40]
en.wikipedia.org
time.com
www.walksofitaly.com
slate.com
Historical authenticity
Although much of the content is based on historic events, including speeches and philosophical debates that were published, most other aspects were fictionalized: "What you always do is you speculate", McCarten said in an interview with TheWrap. "Hopefully that speculation is based in facts and the truth, and hopefully it's inspired", he added.In its coverage of the film, Timepointed out that the two popes' relationship has not been as smooth as in the fictionalized version. In April 2019, Pope Benedict released a 6,000-word letter blaming the clergy sex abuse scandal on factors including the "dangerously liberal theological ideas" within the Church. While the letter[32] did not criticize Francis' papacy,[33] its content was described by The New York Times as "the most significant undercutting yet of the authority of Pope Francis".[34][35] The Guardian also discussed a letter that Benedict had written, complimentary of Cardinal Joachim Meisner, who was an outspoken critic of Pope Francis, and added that a 2020 book partly authored by Benedict "was intervening to halt Pope Francis relaxing celibacy rules".[36]
In one scene, Pope Benedict confesses to Bergoglio (Francis) and mentions Marcial Maciel before the audio fades out. The audience sees but does not hear the rest of his confession. J. Peter Nixon, in the publication U.S. Catholic, decried "the film's implication that it was Benedict who allowed Father Marcial Maciel Degollado to remain leader of the Legionaries of Christdespite mounting evidence that he was a sexual predator. It was during the papacy of Pope John Paul II, however, that efforts to investigate Maciel were repeatedly frustrated. It was Benedict who ultimately removed him."[37] However, publications including National Catholic Reporter[38] and Slate Magazine have disagreed, with Slate writing: "For years, Joseph Ratzinger also refused to act against Maciel. As the prefect responsible for enforcing church doctrine, he chose to handle the church's sexual abuse through secrecy rather than transparency. For almost a quarter-century, Ratzinger failed to push for the detachment of Marcial Maciel from the position of privilege he enjoyed for so long. He finally did so in 2006, when, as Pope, he found the courage to remove Maciel from the priesthood and send him to Mexico to supposedly focus on a 'discreet life of penance and prayer'. If Maciel followed Benedict's spiritual marching orders, it certainly did not lead to atonement. He never admitted any wrongdoing, much less showed remorse. He died in 2008 without ever asking for forgiveness."[39]
Bishop Robert Barron criticized the film for its characterization of Benedict in an article on the Word on Firewebsite titled "The One Pope."[40]
The Two Popes - Wikipedia
The True Story Behind the Movie The Two Popes
The film's dialogue is a reflection of profoundly different worldviews
The Two Popes: A Vatican Guide Breaks Down Truth vs Fiction
Discover the true story behind The Two Popes. Explore what's fact, what's fiction, and how to visit real locations from the Netflix film.
www.walksofitaly.com
What’s Fact and What’s Fiction in The Two Popes
Was Pope Benedict XVI really a “Nazi”? Did Pope Francis almost get married? We break down Netflix’s new movie.
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The anticipated Netflix historical drama is largely fiction.
uscatholic.org
www.catholicnewsagency.com
aleteia.org
In ‘The Two Popes,’ a blurry line between fact, fiction
The Netflix drama depicts the relationship between Pope Benedict XVI and Cardinal Jorge Bergoglio, soon to be Pope Francis.
uscatholic.org
Does 'The Two Popes' fairly represent Francis and Benedict? Critics say ‘no’
While filmmakers say the "The Two Popes" is a work of fiction, the movie’s director also says it represents his understanding of Pope Francis’ values. But critics emphasize the movie does not accurately represent Pope Benedict and Pope Francis, and instead reflects an ideological approach to the...
www.catholicnewsagency.com
In ‘The Two Popes’ movie, what is truth and what is fiction?
At the beginning of Fernando Meirelles' film, viewers are informed that it was based on real events. A look at the facts, however, shows that it should be viewed as a fictional documentary.
aleteia.org
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Evidence shows us that the Two met frequently.Why, it's in the sand, W.A.; in the sand.
Nobody would meet often if they could not stand the other.
Often times reported a friendship.
In the movie they talk about defending the previous Pope.
“I think Benedict's death was instrumentalized,” Francis said. “People wanted to score points for their own side. And the people who instrumentalize such a good person, so close to God, I would almost say ... those people don't have ethics, they are people who belong to a party, not to the church.”
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