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Male powerlifter enters women’s event to protest rule, breaks record

ThatRobGuy

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A bearded pro powerlifter entered a women’s competition in Canada — and smashed a record held by a trans lifter who was watching.

Avi Silverberg, the head coach for Team Canada Powerlifting for more than 10 years, entered Saturday’s Heroes Classic tournament in Lethbridge, Alberta, after identifying as a female.

Video shared by athlete activist group the Independent Council on Women’s Sports (ICONS) shows him walking up to the platform still fully bearded and wearing a regular men’s singlet.

He then casually bench-pressed nearly 370 pounds — beating the current Alberta women’s record by almost 100 pounds.

That record — 275 pounds — was held by trans athlete Anne Andres, who was seen watching Silverberg while volunteering at the event.

ICONS said Silverberg “mocked the discriminatory [Canadian Powerlifting Union] policy” that allows competitors to register for events under their “gender identity and expression, rather than their sex or gender,” vowing “no consequences” for doing so.

CPU’s trans policy states that an individual “should be able to participate in the gender with which they identify and not be subject to requirements for disclosure of personal information beyond those required of cisgender athletes.”
 
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Ana the Ist

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There's no point in having women's sports at all if there are no testosterone restrictions.

There's no point in women's sports at all if trans women can compete. It's simply a matter of time before they hold all records.
 
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ThatRobGuy

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I agree that tans man to woman shouldn't be competing against non trans women in sports that are divided by gender.

But I also think this guy who won this event is a douche.
When all reasonable forms of protest and objections are declined (or dismissed as bigotry), the less reasonable forms of protest will come out of the woodwork.

People have been trying to highlight the challenges in the sports realm for a while, and they're either dismissed as "transphobic", or in some cases, voicing objections gets labelled as hate speech and against the rules.

In Canada especially (where there are stricter "speech codes" on such matters), I'm not sure how else this guy could've protested this that wouldn't have either been labelled as "hate" or fallen on deaf ears.
 
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RocksInMyHead

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And, personally, I'm shocked that there haven't been more challenges pertaining to people who identify as nonbinary or gender-fluid with regards to sports.
I'm not, for two primary reasons:

1. Most professional sporting bodies already have defined limits for hormones.

2. The number of trans athletes competing at an elite level is vanishingly small.
 
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Ana the Ist

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I'm not, for two primary reasons:

1. Most professional sporting bodies already have defined limits for hormones.

That doesn't really matter. Testosterone matters of course, just like bone density, and issues of strength and speed have multiple other factors. Hormone levels alone won't change a thing....they won't even the playing field at all.


2. The number of trans athletes competing at an elite level is vanishingly small.

It doesn't matter. It may take 20 years or it may take 100....but eventually, all records will be held by people born men. Women will be driven out of sport entirely.
 
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ThatRobGuy

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I'm not, for two primary reasons:

1. Most professional sporting bodies already have defined limits for hormones.

2. The number of trans athletes competing at an elite level is vanishingly small.
I was more referring to people who identify as neither gender, or people whose self-identification varies with some level of regularity.


With regards to the defined limits for hormones, is that suppression of hormones that can get someone into the reference range of the sex they wish to compete with takes while a while for those advantages to diminish.

And there is much debate over to what levels the hormones need to be suppressed to, and for how long, to sufficiently diminish the advantages.

Per the British Journal of Sports Medicine:
Transgender women elite athletes may need more than the recommended year of feminising hormone therapy to remove the competitive advantage conferred by testosterone, suggests research published online in the British Journal of Sports Medicine.

Twelve months of treatment to suppress testosterone is the period currently recommended by World Athletics (IAAF) and the International Olympics Committee to ensure a level playing field for all competing athletes.

But the study findings indicate that while hormone treatment was associated with changes in athletic performance, transgender women still retained a competitive advantage 2 years later.

To explore these issues further, and bolster the evidence base, the researchers reviewed the fitness test results and medical records of 29 trans men and 46 trans women who started treatment with gender affirming hormones. After 2 years of feminising therapy the differences in push-up and sit-up performance had disappeared. But trans women were still 12% faster than other women.

Researchers also found that for certain sports, while 10 nmol/L for one year may effectively remove some advantages, for sports (especially ones relying on upper body strength and grip strength), 12 months of suppressing to 10 nmol/L only resulted in a -5% change when compared to the baseline numbers.


Meanwhile, researchers also found the typical biological gap between women and men is so great that 10,000 males have personal-best times that are faster than the current Olympic 100m female champion, as does the 14-year-old male schoolboy 100m record holder.



So as I made reference to in my reply to the other user, it does sound like the current guidelines may not be stringent enough, but it's a case where many people (especially people who are allies of the trans community) wouldn't dare want to be the ones who would suggest telling a trans person they have to sit out for 3 years out of fear of being labelled a bigot.


As far as the numbers of trans athletes being vanishingly small, that doesn't negate the concerns. For instance, if there were a collegiate sport that had 20,000 participants across the country, and one was allowed to take steroids and skip the drug test, and the other 19,999 had to compete clean. The fact that "the number of people competing on steroids is vanishingly small" wouldn't negate the objections that the other athletes may have (especially the ones who worked hard to make it to the finals, and then lose)



I'd also go a step further and suggest that, given what we know about the increase in the percentage of people identifying that way by generation:

Silent Generation: 0.05%
Boomers: 0.2%
Gen X: 0.3%
Millennials: 1%
Gen Z: 1.9%

...it'd be better to get these things sorted out now rather than waiting till 50 years from now. It's easy enough to say, right now, "well, it's a small percentage, and you as an athlete are statistically unlikely to encounter a trans competitor so there's no need to do anything about it". If that trajectory keeps moving at the rate it has been, in 50 years from now when that number is 4-5% (and it may not be so rare to encounter in the sporting world), it's going to be even harder to get people to meet at a reasonable middle ground on this after a "do nothing, don't make a fuss" precedent has been in place for half a century.
 
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RocksInMyHead

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I was more referring to people who identify as neither gender, or people whose self-identification varies with some level of regularity.
I don't see how that changes what I said. If anything, that group is even smaller.
With regards to the defined limits for hormones, is that suppression of hormones that can get someone into the reference range of the sex they wish to compete with takes while a while for those advantages to diminish.

And there is much debate over to what levels the hormones need to be suppressed to, and for how long, to sufficiently diminish the advantages.
It sounds like research is being conducted on this topic. I suspect that rules will be modified if necessary once concrete results surface - that takes time.
As far as the numbers of trans athletes being vanishingly small, that doesn't negate the concerns. For instance, if there were a collegiate sport that had 20,000 participants across the country, and one was allowed to take steroids and skip the drug test, and the other 19,999 had to compete clean. The fact that "the number of people competing on steroids is vanishingly small" wouldn't negate the objections that the other athletes may have (especially the ones who worked hard to make it to the finals, and then lose)
Athletes enter into a competition knowing the rules. If they don't like the rules, they don't have to compete.
 
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Ana the Ist

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Athletes enter into a competition knowing the rules. If they don't like the rules, they don't have to compete.

Can you rephrase this? It's not clear what athletes you're referring to.

Rules can be changed, and there's no reason we can't simply return to women only in women's sports.
 
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stevil

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When all reasonable forms of protest and objections are declined (or dismissed as bigotry), the less reasonable forms of protest will come out of the woodwork.

People have been trying to highlight the challenges in the sports realm for a while, and they're either dismissed as "transphobic", or in some cases, voicing objections gets labelled as hate speech and against the rules.

In Canada especially (where there are stricter "speech codes" on such matters), I'm not sure how else this guy could've protested this that wouldn't have either been labelled as "hate" or fallen on deaf ears.
He didn't have to ruin a contest for all those that have been training for years, he didn't have to dishonestly claim to self identify as a woman.
He could have simply created a picket sign and walked around peacefully.
I have no sympathy for people that behave dishonestly and disrupt other people, especially if those other people have been training hard for years for that event. I hope some of those people seek to sue him.
 
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driewerf

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He didn't have to ruin a contest for all those that have been training for years, he didn't have to dishonestly claim to self identify as a woman.
He could have simply created a picket sign and walked around peacefully.
I have no sympathy for people that behave dishonestly and disrupt other people, especially if those other people have been training hard for years for that event. I hope some of those people seek to sue him.
I sympathize with your main message, but the problem lies somewhere else, in my opinion.
You can regulate many things in sport, like body weight (e.g. boxing) or testosterone levels. You can't regulate sincerity. The guy was insincere, but just that you can't regulate.
 
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Yttrium

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He didn't have to ruin a contest for all those that have been training for years, he didn't have to dishonestly claim to self identify as a woman.
It's not a good idea to go by the honor system when all it takes is for one person to wreck things for everyone.
 
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stevil

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It's not a good idea to go by the honor system when all it takes is for one person to wreck things for everyone.
That's right, but if he gets sued or other repercussions then hopefully that detracts other idiots from doing bad faith actions like his.
 
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Ana the Ist

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It's not a good idea to go by the honor system when all it takes is for one person to wreck things for everyone.

What alternatives do you propose?

Transgenderism is a claim. It's no longer called a mental disorder, so one needs no diagnosis to claim to be whatever they like.
 
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Ana the Ist

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He didn't have to ruin a contest for all those that have been training for years, he didn't have to dishonestly claim to self identify as a woman.
He could have simply created a picket sign and walked around peacefully.
I have no sympathy for people that behave dishonestly and disrupt other people, especially if those other people have been training hard for years for that event. I hope some of those people seek to sue him.

I get what you're saying....if this was indeed protest, I can understand why you might see it that way.

However, as far as that goes in Canada, I don't know if he could retain his rights/freedoms if he did that. It could be considered a hate crime.

How many records does the trans athlete he beat hold? 8 of 9? I have to wonder why that didn't evoke a similar reaction.

Sit ins, die ins, Rosa Parks took a spot she wasn't supposed to take to make a point....her exclusion was absurd. This man did something quite similar in my eyes (if he genuinely is a man) he took a spot he wasn't supposed to take....because his inclusion was absurd.
 
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stevil

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Sued for what?
I dunno, I'm not a lawyer, what powers do people in Canada have for suing?

Perhaps for lying about his self identifying as a woman in the context of a competition.
It would be interesting to see if this man has identified elsewhere as a woman? Has he legally changed his name? Has he had a history of telling family, friends, workmates, associates that he is a woman and should be addressed with the pronouns she/her?
Has he been undergoing hormone therapy?

Or has this happened just for this tournament?
This could be deemed fraud. Was there a financial reward for winning the contest?
His fellow contestants could be aggrieved at having been cheated and having great personal loss given how important this contest was to them.

Could the organisers also be aggrieved, dunno.
 
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stevil

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How many records does the trans athlete he beat hold? 8 of 9? I have to wonder why that didn't evoke a similar reaction.
I am not a supporter of trans people competing in these things against non trans.
BUT at least the trans woman was genuine about her position.
And realise that the trans woman wasn't competing in this contest. If the man's intent was to protest the trans woman, why are his victims people other than the trans woman?

This guy was not. He was being a douche and lying and frauding.
 
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stevil

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Sit ins, die ins, Rosa Parks took a spot she wasn't supposed to take to make a point....her exclusion was absurd. This man did something quite similar in my eyes (if he genuinely is a man) he took a spot he wasn't supposed to take....because his inclusion was absurd.
Rosa Parks didn't go around telling people she was white did she? When she sat in the white seat, was she saying, "I'm white"?
 
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