Respect for diversity without respect

I don't actively think about respect. I think I treat everybody the same. If a coworker seems to be a jerk, I then internalize a level of disrespect. IOW, it is the disrespect, for me, that is an active response whether I articulate it to my self or not.

doubtingmerle said:

OK, you sat through diversity training. There you were told that, in your workplace, you will be expected to treat everybody with respect, regardless of race, creed, gender or national origin.

OK, yes, you can put on a cheesy smile and put on a show of respect. But do you also feel a sincere respect for say, a Muslim, sitting next to you?

In particular, if you think that the person in the next cubicle deserves to go to hell, can you at the same time feel respect for that person?

And if you do not feel respect, how do you sincerely show respect? Or do you elect to show respect that is not sincere?

As a freethinker, I find it my goal to both feel respect and to treat others with respect.

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My Christian neighbor said she loves the sinner but hates the sin; I believe this is a necessity of life. The people I associate with do not need to have beliefs and values that always align with mine in order for me to respect them as people. Whether they worship a God, vote Democrat, or have political or social ideologies that I do not agree with, I can still respect them as people without respecting their sins.

[ I'm deliberately setting aside the hell thing, because that's a whole discussion unto itself. ]

I usually try to look for specific values we have in common, or specific things that person does well. I disagree with my Muslim colleagues about some important areas of theology, but I see that they are seeking to worship God and to devote their lives to serving God as best as they can, and that's a value I share. More generally, I see that various of my colleagues are good teachers, or they always follow through on their commitments, or they're kind and generous, or some other positive quality, and I respect those things.

If nothing else -- and, yes, there are some people in whom it's really hard to see positive qualities -- this person was created by God and is a beloved child of God, and I try to look at them from that point of view if I can.

doubtingmerle said:

OK, you sat through diversity training. There you were told that, in your workplace, you will be expected to treat everybody with respect, regardless of race, creed, gender or national origin.

OK, yes, you can put on a cheesy smile and put on a show of respect. But do you also feel a sincere respect for say, a Muslim, sitting next to you?

In particular, if you think that the person in the next cubicle deserves to go to hell, can you at the same time feel respect for that person?

And if you do not feel respect, how do you sincerely show respect? Or do you elect to show respect that is not sincere?

As a freethinker, I find it my goal to both feel respect and to treat others with respect.

Click to expand...

There's more than one dictionary definition of "respect". You should check that out and maybe re-write your OP. As far as trying to manufacture "feelings" which don't actually exist, I've tried that in romantic relationships before. It doesn't work.

doubtingmerle said:

OK, you sat through diversity training. There you were told that, in your workplace, you will be expected to treat everybody with respect, regardless of race, creed, gender or national origin.

OK, yes, you can put on a cheesy smile and put on a show of respect. But do you also feel a sincere respect for say, a Muslim, sitting next to you?

In particular, if you think that the person in the next cubicle deserves to go to hell, can you at the same time feel respect for that person?

And if you do not feel respect, how do you sincerely show respect? Or do you elect to show respect that is not sincere?

As a freethinker, I find it my goal to both feel respect and to treat others with respect.

Click to expand...

I respect, or dont, according to what respect
someone earns.

Everyone deserves a base level of respect.
I won't spit on or sneer at a beggar.
I'm not arrogant or rude with my maid.

But I won't respect the her, or the janitor's views on
real estate law.

doubtingmerle said:

And if you do not feel respect, how do you sincerely show respect? Or do you elect to show respect that is not sincere?

As a freethinker, I find it my goal to both feel respect and to treat others with respect

Click to expand...

I'm going to disagree that respect needs to be accompanied by a particular feeling. A person can have various emotional responses to another that range from admiration to disgust while being consistent in treating them with respect/dignity.

I don't think it's always possible to manufacture a particular feeling for someone else, which is why it's probably not a good idea to ground how we treat others in how we feel about them. I think the tendency is to tie the way we treat others in some transcendent feature shared by all humans, e.g., image of God or a sense that we all share an inherent right to be treated well. I don't think that would be insincere unless I assumed treating others well had to be rooted in how I felt about them.

That being said, I think I get what you're saying. It would be nice If I had warm, fuzzy feelings for everyone, but I just don't. On a related note, I don't think love is emotionally grounded but instead is grounded in a desire for their good. For instance, I can love my annoying relative even though I would rather not be around them. I just think emotions are too unpredictable and varied to be a foundation for much of anything.

It depends. There's something about blue hair that seems to cause weight gain. There's something about being nonbinary that causes people to focus on others publicly accepting and encouraging them on who they choose to have sex with. The response I have when such things are brought up is visceral disgust. I suspect a gay man would feel the same way if I talked about a guy loving a woman. That said, if we focus on work then there is no issue and I will respect them based on their aptitude for the job and how they publicly conduct themselves. There are lots of rude people who I do not respect beyond courtesy who I have no idea about their sexual proclivity.

doubtingmerle said:

OK, you sat through diversity training. There you were told that, in your workplace, you will be expected to treat everybody with respect, regardless of race, creed, gender or national origin.

OK, yes, you can put on a cheesy smile and put on a show of respect. But do you also feel a sincere respect for say, a Muslim, sitting next to you?

In particular, if you think that the person in the next cubicle deserves to go to hell, can you at the same time feel respect for that person?

And if you do not feel respect, how do you sincerely show respect? Or do you elect to show respect that is not sincere?

As a freethinker, I find it my goal to both feel respect and to treat others with respect.

Click to expand...

I'll be perfectly honest, I don't go around thinking that the person next to me "deserves to go to hell". I think the person next to me is a just a person and deserves my respect, kindness, compassion, patience, and love--regardless of race, creed, gender, or national origin. If I was faking respect, faking love, then I'm the one in the wrong and God will hold me accountable, because His commandment is that I love my neighbor. Not that I pretend to love my neighbor, not that I fake it--but that I actually do it.

You generally also won't find me saying, or even thinking, "these people deserve to go to hell", when I talk and think about "deserving hell" my finger points to myself. My Lord and God, Jesus Christ, has taught that rather than pointing out the speck in my neighbor's eye I should be concerned with the log in my own eye. You might find me saying that I deserve death and hell, because I am acknowledging my own sin, my own unrighteousness; because God's word to me is my need for mercy, my need to repent, my need to cling to Jesus. It does not come from a place of fear, or a place of thinking God is mean and angry; it comes from a place of recognizing that in me is something very wrong, something that doesn't love my neighbor as myself; that within myself there is a darkness and emptiness that would rather be angry, spiteful, unforgiving, unkind, hateful. I'm the sinner who deserves death and hell, my neighbor is the beloved and good creation of God who I am called to love unconditionally.

You might also notice that I preach repentance to myself, and I preach it to other Christians. Because I expect that myself and other Christians should be aware of the fact that we are sinners, in need of repentance, and thus need to daily turn to Jesus for mercy and our salvation. I don't expect non-Christians to share those beliefs, and so that isn't how I treat my non-Christian neighbor. To my neighbor who isn't a Christian I seek to be a disciple of Jesus by the way I treat them, the way I think about them, the way I feel about them, by loving them--actually loving them. I believe that it is in this that I can bear witness to the Jesus I place my faith, and the work of God that brings people to faith, the Gospel, can flow from my lips and my actions.

Thinking that my neighbor is evil and deserves hell and that I am only going to pretend to respect and love them won't do them or myself any good. It will only generate in me more sin, more unrighteousness, and it will only sow injury to my neighbor. My neighbor won't be loved and cared for, and I will only heap shame and guilt upon myself. In that I would expect a far harsher judgment on the Last Day than my neighbor.

-CryptoLutheran

doubtingmerle said:

f you think that the person in the next cubicle deserves to go to hell, can you at the same time feel respect for that person?

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yes

doubtingmerle said:

As a freethinker, I find it my goal to both feel respect and to treat others with respect.

Click to expand...

problem solved. They might not be in your religion but they are fellow human beings, A neighbor as Jesus describes is to be treated the way you want to be treated. I'm sure you want to be treated with respect so according to Jesus, we MUST treat others with respect. Unless you don't respect yourself but that's a whole other issue and I'm sure you do anyway..

ViaCrucis said:

when I talk and think about "deserving hell" my finger points to myself.

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I agree with most of your post, but it disturbs me that you, or anyone, thinks they deserve hell.

It's perhaps the single worst teaching in Christianity.

That Muslim sitting next you, assuming he is devout, likely thinks you are a decadent Westerner who is likely going to end up in hell. Do you respect that? Do you also respect the sincere and devout Muslim's belief in Allah and the divine authority of the Quran?

I think everyone should be treated with a baseline of respect. I'm not going to coddle a woman or a minority as a white male myself. I think that's the kind of "respect" some have in mind, and one I should be doing socially. I view it as the opposite. Respect is not treating others with kid gloves.

Ignatius the Kiwi said:

That Muslim sitting next you, assuming he is devout, likely thinks you are a decadent Westerner who is likely going to end up in hell. Do you respect that? Do you also respect the sincere and devout Muslim's belief in Allah and the divine authority of the Quran?

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Would that moderate Muslim hold you down while the radical Muslim cuts your head off? Devout Muslims who follow the Quran believe all infidels should be taxed, enslaved or put to the sword as their book teaches. Muslim run areas still have slave markets. Jesus did say slaves should obey their masters, so maybe we go to the same Heaven.

NinjaPirate777 said:

Would that moderate Muslim hold you down while the radical Muslim cuts your head off? Devout Muslims who follow the Quran believe all infidels should be taxed, enslaved or put to the sword as their book teaches. Muslim run areas still have slave markets. Jesus did say slaves should obey their masters, so maybe we go to the same Heaven.

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There is something to be said about the character of Islam and the values it espouses. It is radically different from Christian or even liberal secular values. Islam is a religion ideology that preaches the world as a whole should be Islamic, that it is the rightful place of Muslims to rule over non-Muslims and Allah's law be at the centre and forefront of life. So yeah, they believe they should have the authority to tax infidels, sort of like all governments believe they have the authority to tax everyone.

But I'm not sure what your point is. Are you drawing a parallel between Islam and Christianity on the topic of slavery?

Ignatius the Kiwi said:

There is something to be said about the character of Islam and the values it espouses. It is radically different from Christian or even liberal secular values. Islam is a religion ideology that preaches the world as a whole should be Islamic, that it is the rightful place of Muslims to rule over non-Muslims and Allah's law be at the centre and forefront of life. So yeah, they believe they should have the authority to tax infidels, sort of like all governments believe they have the authority to tax everyone.

But I'm not sure what your point is. Are you drawing a parallel between Islam and Christianity on the topic of slavery?

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It's about diversity. You can respect all the diversity you want until you respect it so much that it is in control and you find diversity does not respect you. All of this talk of diversity only happens in the US and Europe where population replacement is taking place. Once Europeans no longer are the majority, democracy will vote in laws that do away with the myth of inclusive diversity like a fart in the wind.

NinjaPirate777 said:

It's about diversity. You can respect all the diversity you want until you respect it so much that it is in control and you find diversity does not respect you. All of this talk of diversity only happens in the US and Europe where population replacement is taking place. Once Europeans no longer are the majority, democracy will vote in laws that do away with the myth of inclusive diversity like a fart in the wind.

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I agree. Diversity more often than not, is not a strength.

doubtingmerle said:

OK, you sat through diversity training. There you were told that, in your workplace, you will be expected to treat everybody with respect, regardless of race, creed, gender or national origin.

OK, yes, you can put on a cheesy smile and put on a show of respect. But do you also feel a sincere respect for say, a Muslim, sitting next to you?

In particular, if you think that the person in the next cubicle deserves to go to hell, can you at the same time feel respect for that person?

And if you do not feel respect, how do you sincerely show respect? Or do you elect to show respect that is not sincere?

As a freethinker, I find it my goal to both feel respect and to treat others with respect.

Click to expand...

I judge people as individuals and not according to their religion or ethnicity.
I was a police diversity trainer.

Tinker Grey said:

I agree with most of your post, but it disturbs me that you, or anyone, thinks they deserve hell.

It's perhaps the single worst teaching in Christianity.

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Ah the mind of the skeptic. It is perhaps the most sobering and true teaching of Christianity.