Embracing Socialism - a growing trend among Democrats

Hans Blaster

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Government Controlled - is Government run.

Government control is called "reg-u-la-tion". Does that mean every regulated activity is actually run by the government?

Does the city government run all the restaurants because they have fire and food safety regulations that they (sometimes) enforce?
 
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Isilwen

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Have the Republicans ever come up with anything better?

Medical prices are out-of-control. I have insurance a PPO plan and my inhaler still costs over $270. I cannot afford that and it's been this way since before the ACA went into effect. I cannot even take advantage of the programs the pharmaceutical companies have because I have insurance. It disqualifies me.

Thank God for my mom who also gets the same medication I do and doesn't need it as much as me. She gives me her extras so that I can live.
 
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ottawak

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Have the Republicans ever come up with anything better?
Sure they have. It's called "not socialism" and because it is not sociallism it is intrinsically better regardless of public health outcomes or personal suffereing.
 
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seeking.IAM

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Taxpayer funded means government run.

The Government controls pricing
The Government controls hospitals
The Government controls treatment plans
The Government controls payments.
The Government tells you how much you are going to pay for healthcare.

Is it so much better when:

Insurance Companies control pricing
Insurance Companies control hospitals
Insurance Companies control treatment plans
Insurance Companies control payments.
Insurance Companies control how much you are going to pay for healthcare.

The reason we don't have universal health care is because our insurance companies don't want us to have it and give campaign contributions to our legislators to ensure we don't.
 
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Fantine

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Since American conservatives tend to have a very hyperbolic, exaggerated view of what "socialism" is, this thread really isn't relevant to me. The greatest fears of conservatives are so far removed from what real socialism is that I beg you all to revisit this issue when your views are more realistic.
And I still say, with absolute certainty, that America's biggest danger is authoritarian oligarchical dictatorship. Whether a dictator is a free-market capitalist or a democratic socialist, we lose our freedom, we lose our self-determination, and every segment of society suffers.
With a collaborative inclusive leader who believes in democracy and equality, our society is better--even if that leader leans further right or further left.
You fear the wrong thing. You have seen where unfettered authoritarianism leads--in the U.S. in 2017-21, and in Florida now. This is our greatest threat.
 
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durangodawood

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Taxpayer funded means government run.

The Government controls pricing
The Government controls hospitals
The Government controls treatment plans
The Government controls payments.
The Government tells you how much you are going to pay for healthcare.

Governmental control is what socialism is known for.
Some parts of the economy make for miserable markets. Basic health care has proven to be one of those.
 
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hislegacy

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President Joe Biden drew a biting rebuke on Twitter and Fox News after saying that record-high gas prices are part of an "incredible transition" away from fossil fuels.

Biden made the comment during a press conference Monday in Tokyo, Japan, as part of a diplomatic trip to Asia. The president's foes quickly pounced on the comment as proof that Biden's clean-energy policies were woefully out of touch and harming the American public with heightened gas prices.
Observation: It seems plausible that the intent is to push through the clean energy act by bypassing Congress where it does not have the chance of passing by vote. Such actions - if accurate - are a hallmark of totalitarian socialism.
 
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Belk

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Is it that time of year again already? Yet again we have to point out that having Government involved in society is not socialism and if it was that makes most first word countries socialist?
 
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Isilwen

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Sure they have. It's called "not socialism" and because it is not sociallism it is intrinsically better regardless of public health outcomes or personal suffereing.

Sarcasm?
 
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President Joe Biden drew a biting rebuke on Twitter and Fox News after saying that record-high gas prices are part of an "incredible transition" away from fossil fuels.

Biden made the comment during a press conference Monday in Tokyo, Japan, as part of a diplomatic trip to Asia. The president's foes quickly pounced on the comment as proof that Biden's clean-energy policies were woefully out of touch and harming the American public with heightened gas prices.
Observation: It seems plausible that the intent is to push through the clean energy act by bypassing Congress where it does not have the chance of passing by vote. Such actions - if accurate - are a hallmark of totalitarian socialism.
Oh my goodness! Tax credits for private industry! How socialist can you get??? Somewhere the ghost of Karl Marx must be dancing a jig. :)
 
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Matt5

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Is it that time of year again already? Yet again we have to point out that having Government involved in society is not socialism and if it was that makes most first word countries socialist?

Looks more like creeping fascism: pretense of private property with heavy government control over its use and disposal.

"The main characteristic of socialism (and of communism) is public ownership of the means of production, and, therefore, the abolition of private property. The right to property is the right of use and disposal. Under fascism, men retain the semblance or pretense of private property, but the government holds total power over its use and disposal."

Fascism and Communism/Socialism | Ayn Rand Lexicon
 
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hedrick

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Some services are best done by the government, some private, and some as a partnership. There are characteristics of the service that make one or another better. Health is probably best done jointly. This is an area where we have lots of examples of such arrangements. Results seem better than our current system, except when a conservative government takes o er and tries to make it fail.

Part of the problem is our current system has more bureaucracy than a government run system.

That is in fact my biggest worry about the US. It’s not safe to turn over health to public funding as long as there is a reasonable chance of a Republican government.
 
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Fantine

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Some services are best done by the government, some private, and some as a partnership. There are characteristics of the service that make one or another better. Health is probably best done jointly.
Universal health care is not "socialism." It is ethical government practice. Moral government practice. Practical, common-sense, fair government practice.
Medicare works well. VA Medical care works well. The Affordable Care Act took some mean hits during the Trump years and my friend, a pharmacist, says it costs her family $3,000 a month now. Yikes!
Read this U.S. News and World Report article.
It reflects my family's personal experience. My husband worked in information technology management for 43 years, working for 5 different companies, but except for 1980-89 when he was a VP of a company with a "Cadillac" plan for execs he never had better healthcare than he did with the Veterans Administration. With heart disease, prostate cancer, and insulin dependent diabetes, I shudder to think what his health care expenses would be--even with Medicare. I say this because I have seen friends on Medicare getting insulin from Walgreens and being billed hundreds of dollars--unsustainable. Some use Canadian mail order when they hit the donut hole (just shows whose health care is better.) A few go on cruises in the beginning of the year and pick up their drugs in Mexico (they say everyone does it...to survive.)
I have Medicare, a Medicare supplement with dental and vision, and a prescription plan. Don't listen to Joe Namath, or JJ--I hate to see them trying to mislead senior citizens. Yes, I have premiums--about $325 for Part B, the supplement, and prescriptions--but I never have deductibles or copays, I can see whatever doctors I want, and I have a free fitness center membership I use daily.
He retired in 2013. My daughter and I were on his health plan. It cost him about $8000 a year and it was terrible compared to what we have today (and he was already using the VA most of the time.) When he turned 65 I had to get my own insurance through my small employer. It cost me $600 a month just for me and it was no better than my husband's.
Yeah, we live in one of the least expensive states in the country. My sister pays a lot more for her Medicare supplement and prescriptions in Florida.
I shudder when I see what younger people pay for insurance.
I think about my husband's aunt, whose husband owned a small cemetery florist all his life. No insurance. They caught her cancer too late. She was only 60. Is that how people who probably worked 100 hours a week over the holidays to decorate graves should be treated?
Read this article for the truth about our costly inferior health care system.
Why the U.S. Needs Universal Health Care | For Better | US News
 
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Oompa Loompa

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Government Controlled - is Government run.
*annoying nerd voice* But not government owned. So it is more likened to that of a corrupt third world dictatorship than a totalitarian communist state.
 
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perplexed

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Is it so much better when:

Insurance Companies control pricing
Insurance Companies control hospitals
Insurance Companies control treatment plans

I always assumed it was
"the insurance companies AND the government prices" because I assume there a massive is government bureaucracy placing restrictions on who can provide health care and who can provide insurance and this would ruin any advantages of the free market
 
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ottawak

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I always assumed it was
"the insurance companies AND the government prices" because I assume there a massive is government bureaucracy placing restrictions on who can provide health care and who can provide insurance and this would ruin any advantages of the free market
What free market? There has never been a free market in health care.
 
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Ana the Ist

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Taxpayer funded means government run.

The Government controls pricing
The Government controls hospitals
The Government controls treatment plans
The Government controls payments.
The Government tells you how much you are going to pay for healthcare.

Governmental control is what socialism is known for.

There's an argument to be made for any market with....

Static demand.
Static supply.
No competition.

At bare minimum, any free market requires elasticity in supply/demand and competition.
 
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