The Left is Rallying to Take Your Guns Again

NxNW · May 30, 2022

dogs4thewin said:
then why do democrats some of them support wide abortion rights?

What are wide abortions?

dogs4thewin · May 30, 2022

NxNW said:
So the well regulated militia was worthless.

You could say that if they were unwilling to do their job ( which it seems they were).

trophy33 · May 30, 2022

dogs4thewin said:
Those questions have a wide number of answers and come as a result of a wide number of issues.

Thats why the "guns" red herring, its easier to discuss, but it solves nothing.

ottawak · May 30, 2022

myst33 said:
I think that your "guns vs no guns" discussion is a red herring promoted by politicians so that nobody is demanding the real answers to questions:
a) why are so many Americans unhappy
b) why are so many Americans unhealthy
c) why so many Americans live in constant stress or fear
d) why people born in poor areas have so low chance to change their life
e) why are stable families disappearing and children left without a proper guide in life

The "Armed Right" would just say it was because of left-wing tyranny and see gun control as just the next step in reducing us to misery.

HARK! · May 30, 2022

NxNW said:
Didn't Trump build the wall and have Mexico pay for it?

Trump built a wall for about 25% of our border, over what already existed. Biden stopped it; and now criminals, including MS-13, are pouring over our borders. Now some on the Left are calling to disarm us in the face of this wave of criminals.

dogs4thewin · May 30, 2022

NxNW said:
What are wide abortions?

Meaning abortion rights with fewer limitations on those rights. Example, would be things like reasons for wanting an abortion or time limits on them.

trophy33 · May 30, 2022

ottawak said:
The "Armed Right" would just say it was because of left-wing tyranny and see gun control as just the next step in reducing us to misery.

I cannot recall even one example from history where guns between common folk helped them against tyranny and the regime the people established after that was better.

DamianWarS · May 30, 2022

HARK! said:
As demonstrated, Blue states are more prone to breeding a culture of murder. They also tens to have the most draconian gun laws, and the highest tolerance for drug abuse. How do you propose we change that culture?

I would be hesitant to say any law in the US can be called draconian. using the term without rational cause suggests hyperbole and bias. the topic at hand is gun control and certainly, we can look at all the problems all at once but that would be out of the scope of this thread.

dogs4thewin · May 30, 2022

ottawak said:
The "Armed Right" would just say it was because of left-wing tyranny and see gun control as just the next step in reducing us to misery.

As far as I remember I have never heard that. I have heard it being blamed ( along with the increasing violence on increasing secularized society.

ottawak · May 30, 2022

HARK! said:
Trump built a wall for about 25% of our border, over what already existed. Biden stopped it;

It was a terrific wall, too. Able to be cut through in minutes with a $49.95 saber saw available at convienient Home Depot locations across Northen Mexico.

and now criminals, including MS-13, are pouring over our borders.

A home-grown gang. Maybe we shouldn't have deported them.

Now some on the Left are calling to disarm us in the face of this wave of criminals.

Who is "us?"

dogs4thewin · May 30, 2022

ottawak said:
It was a terrific wall, too. Able to be cut through in minutes with a $49.95 saber saw available at convienient Home Depot locations across Northen Mexico.A home-grown gang. Maybe we shouldn't have deported them.Who is "us?"

We should of course deport the non-citizens who are part of the gang. If particular members are citizens (homegrown) then of course we do not deport those particular people.

Fantine · May 30, 2022

I agree that there is more crime in large cities. Blue states are more urban. So your answer is to give these city residents an acre and a mule in Idaho?

In truth, the gun laws that work for those mule owners don't work in large urban areas--and people in cities aren't as isolated. They have a broad infrastructure of civil services to keep the peace, fight fires, transport them to hospitals.
I am sure crime is high in Houston. Miami. Atlanta.

NxNW · May 30, 2022

HARK! said:
Trump built a wall for about 25% of our border, over what already existed.

In other words, Trump failed to build the wall he promised.

Biden stopped it; and now criminals, including MS-13, are pouring over our borders. Now some on the Left are calling to disarm us in the face of this wave of criminals.

I wonder why the criminals waited until Biden took office before they started pouring in.

DamianWarS · May 30, 2022

dogs4thewin said:
The culture that needs changing is one of violence since as I have stated many times truly mass shootings actually take very few lives. It is more common ( behind suicide) for people to shoot others either in the course of another crime or what I refer to as a homicide that would happen one way or another ( because the shooter wanted someone else dead badly enough it would not matter how.

increased gun control could be argued as a bandaid solution that doesn't really address the root of the issue, instead only treating the symptoms. violent culture is a more complex issue and the quick answer is the symptoms are easier to tackle. but I do think taking away some of the tools of violence not only reduces the violence itself but will impact the cultural elements as well since there would be less exposure.

dogs4thewin · May 30, 2022

Fantine said:
I agree that there is more crime in large cities. Blue states are more urban. So your answer is to give these city residents an acre and a mule in Idaho?

In truth, the gun laws that work for those mule owners don't work in large urban areas--and people in cities aren't as isolated. They have a broad infrastructure of civil services to keep the peace, fight fires, transport them to hospitals.
I am sure crime is high in Houston. Miami. Atlanta.

yes, and those places have stricter gun laws ( where permitted ( in other words they usually cannot break state laws in the process, yet more crime. Yes people are tighter together, but still in terms of violence there are way more people who will respond to violence with violence than there are that start violence. Most of the people who start the violence either do not care or there are already laws that are meant to limit their access to guns.

HARK! · May 30, 2022

DamianWarS said:
I would be hesitant to say any law in the US can be called draconian.

You're entitled to your opinion. I'm entitled to mine.

When someone tells me that I have to go into a gang ridden neighborhood, to collect cash; and I can't carry a gun to protect myself from armed gangsters; then that is a draconian law IMO.

When someone tells me that I can't defend human life on my own property, when shots and screams are echoing throughout my neighborhood; then that is a draconian law IMO.

When someone breaks into my home with a gun in his hand; and I am told that I have a duty to retreat; then that is a draconian law IMO.

dogs4thewin · May 30, 2022

DamianWarS said:
increased gun control could be argued as a bandaid solution that doesn't really address the root of the issue, instead only treating the symptoms. violent culture is a more complex issue and the quick answer is the symptoms are easier to tackle. but I do think taking away some of the tools of violence not only reduces the violence itself but will impact the cultural elements as well since there would be less exposure.

What we really need to address is mental health as two in three gun deaths are actually suicides.

dogs4thewin · May 30, 2022

HARK! said:
You're entitled to your opinion. I'm entitled to mine.

When someone tells me that I have to go into a gang ridden neighborhood, to collect cash; and I can't carry a gun to protect myself from armed gangsters; then that is a draconian law IMO.

When someone tells me that I can't defend human life on my own property, when shots and screams are echoing throughout my neighborhood; then that is a draconian law IMO.

When someone breaks into my home with a gun in his hand; and I am told that I have a duty to retreat; then that is a draconian law IMO.

For the record, most if not all states do not have duty to retreat in your own home, now they may have stricter laws as to when no duty to retreat applies or they may open the person up to civil liablability ( either in the form of wrongful death suits or otherwise lawsuits, but I believe that all sates have at least some form of castle doctine

ottawak · May 30, 2022

HARK! said:
You're entitled to your opinion. I'm entitled to mine.

When someone tells me that I have to go into a gang ridden neighborhood, to collect cash; and I can't carry a gun to protect myself from armed gangsters; then that is a draconian law IMO.

When someone tells me that I can't defend human life on my own property, when shots and screams are echoing throughout my neighborhood; then that is a draconian law IMO.

When someone breaks into my home with a gun in his hand; and I am told that I have a duty to retreat; then that is a draconian law IMO.

That's terrible. What state do you live in?

HARK! · May 30, 2022

DamianWarS said:
I do think taking away some of the tools of violence not only reduces the violence itself but will impact the cultural elements as well since there would be less exposure.

Taking the guns away from law abiding citizens and leaving them at the mercy of armed criminals doesn't work. Blue states that are weak on violent crimes, and tough on imposing draconian laws on the upright, have demonstrated what should have been obvious to them. Yet they continue to ignore this axiom when it is being waved in their faces.. What is their motive?

The Left is Rallying to Take Your Guns Again

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