How Do I Proceed?

Gentle Lamb

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I have been afraid to write about this situation in too much detail here ... but now I will take the chance given that it's so serious...

This is about someone who for a while was one of my closest friends. We met at church, where she was an usher. I stayed at the church where I met her for a few years. Many negative things happened to me there. Such as the Pastor's daughter setting her father and mother against me and painting me as being divisive and oppositional, all because I liked hymns and at times suggested them (when asked for my opinion and input as a worship team member) and they preferred CCM, wanting to be a hip/cool church catering to young people. In the end, the reverend of the church broke my confidence to the Pastor and told him I wanted to leave without my knowledge after I spoke to her about it and asked for her help talking to him. He called me and dismissed me in a 2.5 minute conversation and wished me well on my way. Given all of the hurt I had been through personally at the church and seeing what other people also were put through, I never went back to the church.

My friend was also hurt through the negative actions of the leaders of that church and ended up leaving some time later. There was a fiasco in the church before I left. Her best friend and best friend's fiance ended up getting pregnant (they were baby Christians, new in their faith and trying to serve God). The Pastor and other church leaders had the couple come up in the front of the church and publicly apologize for their pregnancy - after a very dramatic service and sermon about sin. This also followed a major Sunday where the Pastor had invited everyone to talk about ways they had been hurt by the church and open up so that these hurts could be addressed..... Two other pregnancies followed - a teenager, and the same Pastor's daughter who I mentioned before. The teenager was forced to go on the altar and apologize. The Pastor's daughter was given a free pass AND the baby's birth was publicly announced via email and on the pulpit - this was not the case for the other 2 pregnancies. People fled the church following this event.

My friend was not rooted anywhere for a while. I understood the importance of being part of a church and always advised her to find a church so that she wouldn't be a lone sheep vulnerable to be devoured by wolves. She was my prayer partner, we encouraged each other with the word of God, we did evangelism together by handing out tracts and talking to people. She was my good sister in Christ.

She began coming to my church and was doing well for a while with praying and reading her Bible, maintaining her personal relationship with Christ, and even was beginning to be active in my church as a leader. I attend a very small church and I am VERY VERY active in my church. Some months down the line she began to start acting funny with me and I noticed she was becoming a negative influence in my life. I began to pull away because I didn't want the negative influence, but I tried to remain friends. Things became worse. She had a lot of issues and made excuses about not wanting to communicate. She was acting more and more funny. At one point she expressed the need to talk and we did sit down and have a heart to heart. I told her about her funny behavior and she acknowledged some things. I encouraged her, as always, with the word of God. She had some tough family situations and I talked to her about how God shapes us in those situations as we walk with Him. After the heart to heart, she was continuing to be distant and funny. Our friendship and communication suffered. A few weeks later, she met a man who attended a birthday party at my church. The birthday party was for the choir director. She began going out with the man immediately. She attended his church with him and brought him to our church with her. My spirit never felt right about him.

Later I would discover that the man was married (separated, wife in another country). I would discover that my friend knew early on in their dating that he was married and the wife wanted to make things work with her husband. However, my friend came along and began dating him, bringing further separation between the husband and wife. Months and months later, my friend told me all of this information either directly or indirectly (there were some lies/subterfuge - she was never too frank about everything). When she told me this, she was several months pregnant.

Right before the baby was born, I would discover, through an ex, that the choir director was married, and had been committing adultery with every man in the church she could get her hands on. The man my friend met was the brother of the choir director's ex-boyfriend. My own ex was dating/sleeping with the choir director while we had been dating.

My question is, how do I proceed with the friendship with my friend? Given that this is adultery and I desire to live a life that honors God and given that this is some serious backsliding, I have stepped back from being close friends with her. I have not condemned her for this situation, but rather have spoken to her about repentance. Rather than letting go of the other lady's husband, she is carrying on the relationship with the baby daddy and brings him to church with her at times and has planned church events even in this fallen state of adultery. These are the reasons I have stepped back from being her friend and all of these things made me consider leaving my church.

I have decided for the time being to remain at my church (other threads have detailed parts of the situation and my difficulties in staying/wanting to leave). Given that I am so involved in the church, it would be more harmful to the church for me to leave than for me to stay. I am taking up my cross and continuing to follow Jesus in the midst of all of this. I see my friend now as a very lost soul. How do I proceed with the friendship given that I can't be close to her, seeing as how she has involved herself in adultery and I don't condone that behavior?
 

Freth

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I have a brother who lives in sin while professing to know God. I consider him a work in progress. My point is, I am not giving up on my brother and you should've give up on your friend. Forgive her, always. Pray for her. Be there for her and love her.

Yes, we are called to rebuke, but the better course of action after the words have been said is to lead by example and insert truth in passing conversation. Plant seeds and let the Holy Spirit work on them.

There is, however, a point where you should recognize that you are unequally yoked, either with the church or your friend, or both. That is when you should sever the ties and move on. Only you can decide when that should be, if at all.

You can't control what other people do, but you can rise above it all and not participate in the gossip, nor invest yourself in their sin. Rebuke gently, yes. Find subtle ways to impress upon their minds, yes. Jump into the fray and be an active participant, no.

Those are my thoughts.
 
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Daniel Marsh

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Much of what you wrote sounds like rumor, please edit it. Approach Elders to carry out below:

Matthew 18:15-18
Easy-to-Read Version

When Someone Hurts You
15 “If your brother or sister in God’s family does something wrong, go and tell them what they did wrong. Do this when you are alone with them. If they listen to you, then you have helped them to be your brother or sister again. 16 But if they refuse to listen, go to them again and take one or two people with you. Then there will be two or three people who will be able to tell all that happened. 17 If they refuse to listen to them, tell the church. And if they refuse to listen to the church, treat them as you would treat someone who does not know God or who is a tax collector.

18 “I can assure you that when you speak judgment here on earth, it will be God’s judgment. And when you promise forgiveness here on earth, it will be God’s forgiveness

If those in charge of the church are not willing to handling Church Discipline, it is best to leave and find a better church.

Bible Gateway passage: 1 Corinthians 6 - Easy-to-Read Version

Bible Gateway passage: 1 Corinthians 7 - Easy-to-Read Version
 
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Gentle Lamb

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Much of what you wrote sounds like rumor, please edit it. Approach Elders to carry out below:

Matthew 18:15-18
Easy-to-Read Version

When Someone Hurts You
15 “If your brother or sister in God’s family does something wrong, go and tell them what they did wrong. Do this when you are alone with them. If they listen to you, then you have helped them to be your brother or sister again. 16 But if they refuse to listen, go to them again and take one or two people with you. Then there will be two or three people who will be able to tell all that happened. 17 If they refuse to listen to them, tell the church. And if they refuse to listen to the church, treat them as you would treat someone who does not know God or who is a tax collector.

18 “I can assure you that when you speak judgment here on earth, it will be God’s judgment. And when you promise forgiveness here on earth, it will be God’s forgiveness

If those in charge of the church are not willing to handling Church Discipline, it is best to leave and find a better church.

Bible Gateway passage: 1 Corinthians 6 - Easy-to-Read Version

Bible Gateway passage: 1 Corinthians 7 - Easy-to-Read Version

These are my real life experiences, what are you talking about that it sounds like a rumor? These are the cold hard facts of what have happened. I am not putting up rumors on here, in fact I have been so hesitant to write about all of these awful things. Real life, cold hard facts. No rumors here, no need for your accusation. Unappreciated given the level of hurt.
 
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Gentle Lamb

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Much of what you wrote sounds like rumor, please edit it. Approach Elders to carry out below:

Matthew 18:15-18
Easy-to-Read Version

When Someone Hurts You
15 “If your brother or sister in God’s family does something wrong, go and tell them what they did wrong. Do this when you are alone with them. If they listen to you, then you have helped them to be your brother or sister again. 16 But if they refuse to listen, go to them again and take one or two people with you. Then there will be two or three people who will be able to tell all that happened. 17 If they refuse to listen to them, tell the church. And if they refuse to listen to the church, treat them as you would treat someone who does not know God or who is a tax collector.

18 “I can assure you that when you speak judgment here on earth, it will be God’s judgment. And when you promise forgiveness here on earth, it will be God’s forgiveness

If those in charge of the church are not willing to handling Church Discipline, it is best to leave and find a better church.

Bible Gateway passage: 1 Corinthians 6 - Easy-to-Read Version

Bible Gateway passage: 1 Corinthians 7 - Easy-to-Read Version

Also I have already approached the elders and have done all that I can do. I have done so much to try to address and correct things. I mentioned that I have written about these situations in former threads. No rumors here, I did what I was supposed to do biblically.
 
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Gentle Lamb

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I have a brother who lives in sin while professing to know God. I consider him a work in progress. My point is, I am not giving up on my brother and you should've give up on your friend. Forgive her, always. Pray for her. Be there for her and love her.

Yes, we are called to rebuke, but the better course of action after the words have been said is to lead by example and insert truth in passing conversation. Plant seeds and let the Holy Spirit work on them.

There is, however, a point where you should recognize that you are unequally yoked, either with the church or your friend, or both. That is when you should sever the ties and move on. Only you can decide when that should be, if at all.

You can't control what other people do, but you can rise above it all and not participate in the gossip, nor invest yourself in their sin. Rebuke gently, yes. Find subtle ways to impress upon their minds, yes. Jump into the fray and be an active participant, no.

Those are my thoughts.

Thank you so much for your words of wisdom. You're right, I can't control anyone else. I can only control my own actions. I realize that sin affects so deeply not just the person who commits the sin, but also the people around us. Maybe you are correct, I think when I realized the unequal yoking, that's when I started to step back. She always expressed a desire to be stronger in her faith but she has gone off in a really wrong direction.
 
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Tolworth John

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My question is, how do I proceed with the friendship with my friend?

Three are so issues here?
He e viruses act towards your friend and how you should react.

You say the church leaders know about the details of this situation.

Well do they permit her to take communion?
If they do, I would suggest talking with the pastor about this, if they are unwilling or will not give a comprehensive answer, you have to decide whether you can stay a member of this church.

Your friend. Stay her friend, but you are her friend not the friend of her adulterous partner. I.e. met with her but not with her partner.

As to how you talk to her. I would let her raise the issue and then don't be afraid to say that repentance means being sorry and not doing it again.
 
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Gentle Lamb

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Three are so issues here?
He e viruses act towards your friend and how you should react.

You say the church leaders know about the details of this situation.

Well do they permit her to take communion?
If they do, I would suggest talking with the pastor about this, if they are unwilling or will not give a comprehensive answer, you have to decide whether you can stay a member of this church.

Your friend. Stay her friend, but you are her friend not the friend of her adulterous partner. I.e. met with her but not with her partner.

As to how you talk to her. I would let her raise the issue and then don't be afraid to say that repentance means being sorry and not doing it again.

Okay, I will let her bring it up, if she wants to talk about it. I realized that this is her family now and I don't want it to seem like I'm attacking her so I stepped back. She wasn't quite gracious to her friends about their own pregnancy before marriage and she expressed disappointment in them, which I thought was harsh. I'm trying to extend grace because I know we are human and the flesh can be weak. But it's beyond difficult for me to see her in this. As for taking communion... I am not sure if she's still taking it.
I've addressed the adultery/sexual immorality with the church leaders and I can do no more. I've done what I could, now I'm just prayerful and considering/praying about leaving with the least amount of harm/offense to my church.
 
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paul1149

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Do I understand correctly that it is the current church with a philandering choir director? Does eldership know about it? If so they should set the moral tone for the church, as at 1Cor 5. Without that moral grid in place, I don't see much correction happening.
 
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Gentle Lamb

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Do I understand correctly that it is the current church with a philandering choir director? Does eldership know about it? If so they should set the moral tone for the church, as at 1Cor 5. Without that moral grid in place, I don't see much correction happening.

Yes this is the same church. The philanderer left the church of her own accord. However my adulterous friend remains, she is still in the relationship... I think you are right. If there were going to be correction, I think those corrective actions would have been taken when the philanderer/prostitute was still attending the church and in her leadership role when the first man came forward to make correction. No action was taken. I'm thinking of leaving the church completely and looking for a more serious church/group of fellowship. However, in the meantime I'm just trying to see how to manage the friendship. I've been praying for her a lot. I'm so utterly grieved and burdened in my spirit. I know the prayer burden from the Holy Spirit is heavy, my friend has gotten herself in a hole so deep she will never be able to fully come out of it. But I just pray for her to be restored to Christ. That's all I care about and want at this point. The rest is just details.
 
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bèlla

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I’ve read your OP and keep returning to the same thought. Your connection isn’t as close as you think. Several comments lead me to this point:
  • The odd behavior you noted when she came to your church.
  • Secrecy and deception.
  • And reporting her to the elders. Was she aware you did it?
I would never report my best friend to church officials. I would encourage her to speak to someone she felt comfortable confiding with. But I wouldn’t turn her in. That conversation should occur with unbiased parties. The fallout will be less grievous.

Because everyone sins and the majority do so in secret. Nobody knows your business. Before we open our mouths we should check our hearts. And consider the situation if the shoe was on the other foot.

In my opinion, you’re too involved with church affairs to the degree you’re desiring to leave once more. There’s a measure of idealistic naïveté in all of this. Every church has a problem. Everyone is doing something they shouldn’t and things you don’t agree with. Including you. And most of it is hidden.

What you’re unable to see in all you’ve said is this: You told on your friend. And you’re waiting for her correction. Given the circumstances they have to consider your motives.

Everyone confides in someone. But most confessions don’t land on the elder’s ears or the pastor’s. She didn’t acknowledge it of her own volition. You pressed the issue and went to the officials.

They have to consider if it was done out of spite, jealousy, or genuine concern. If my friend did this to me we wouldn’t be friends anymore. I couldn’t trust her and that’s a must.

~bella
 
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Gentle Lamb

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I’ve read your OP and keep returning to the same thought. Your connection isn’t as close as you think. Several comments lead me to this point:
  • The odd behavior you noted when she came to your church.
  • Secrecy and deception.
  • And reporting her to the elders. Was she aware you did it?
I would never report my best friend to church officials. I would encourage her to speak to someone she felt comfortable confiding with. But I wouldn’t turn her in. That conversation should occur with unbiased parties. The fallout will be less grievous.

Because everyone sins and the majority do so in secret. Nobody knows your business. Before we open our mouths we should check our hearts. And consider the situation if the shoe was on the other foot.

In my opinion, you’re too involved with church affairs to the degree you’re desiring to leave once more. There’s a measure of idealistic naïveté in all of this. Every church has a problem. Everyone is doing something they shouldn’t and things you don’t agree with. Including you. And most of it is hidden.

What you’re unable to see in all you’ve said is this: You told on your friend. And you’re waiting for her correction. Given the circumstances they have to consider your motives.

Everyone confides in someone. But most confessions don’t land on the elder’s ears or the pastor’s. She didn’t acknowledge it of her own volition. You pressed the issue and went to the officials.

They have to consider if it was done out of spite, jealousy, or genuine concern. If my friend did this to me we wouldn’t be friends anymore. I couldn’t trust her and that’s a must.

~bella

I did not tell on my friend. Any impression that I told on my friend is incorrect. That is not what I wrote or meant to convey. She was trying to tell the pastor about her pregnancy before I ever knew she was pregnant. I encouraged her to confess as she was trying to keep the fact hidden.
 
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bèlla

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I did not tell on my friend. Any impression that I told on my friend is incorrect. That is not what I wrote or meant to convey. She was trying to tell the pastor about her pregnancy before I ever knew she was pregnant. I encouraged her to confess as she was trying to keep the fact hidden.

Thank you for clarifying. :)
 
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Gentle Lamb

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I’ve read your OP and keep returning to the same thought. Your connection isn’t as close as you think. Several comments lead me to this point:
  • The odd behavior you noted when she came to your church.
  • Secrecy and deception.
  • And reporting her to the elders. Was she aware you did it?
I would never report my best friend to church officials. I would encourage her to speak to someone she felt comfortable confiding with. But I wouldn’t turn her in. That conversation should occur with unbiased parties. The fallout will be less grievous.

Because everyone sins and the majority do so in secret. Nobody knows your business. Before we open our mouths we should check our hearts. And consider the situation if the shoe was on the other foot.

In my opinion, you’re too involved with church affairs to the degree you’re desiring to leave once more. There’s a measure of idealistic naïveté in all of this. Every church has a problem. Everyone is doing something they shouldn’t and things you don’t agree with. Including you. And most of it is hidden.

What you’re unable to see in all you’ve said is this: You told on your friend. And you’re waiting for her correction. Given the circumstances they have to consider your motives.

Everyone confides in someone. But most confessions don’t land on the elder’s ears or the pastor’s. She didn’t acknowledge it of her own volition. You pressed the issue and went to the officials.

They have to consider if it was done out of spite, jealousy, or genuine concern. If my friend did this to me we wouldn’t be friends anymore. I couldn’t trust her and that’s a must.

~bella

You're welcome. I was also explaining in the OP that we used to be quite close but her behavior started changing before the met the guy. She met the guy and subsequently, everything went really downhill from there. A steady steep downhill slope. Maybe more like a cliff.

Because of her deception, I cannot frankly and openly discuss this situation with anyone I know who also knows her ... given that we were close friends for a while we have a lot of people in common. Hence my distress, having to keep quiet about certain details in order to preserve her confidence. Hence my turning to CF for advice. :(:(:(:(:(:(:(:(:(
 
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paul1149

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we were close friends for a while we have a lot of people in common. Hence my distress, having to keep quiet about certain details in order to preserve her confidence.
I think the best thing to do is to keep it general and avoid details. If asked you could say she began to change, you two talked about it, and you found you didn't have as much in common anymore, but you wish her the best. This gets the big picture across but doesn't betray any confidences. Any astute friend can fill in the gaps themselves.
 
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Gentle Lamb

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I think the best thing to do is to keep it general and avoid details. If asked you could say she began to change, you two talked about it, and you found you didn't have as much in common anymore, but you wish her the best. This gets the big picture across but doesn't betray any confidences. Any astute friend can fill in the gaps themselves.

Thank you, I will try to keep it along these lines.
 
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I have been afraid to write about this situation in too much detail here ... but now I will take the chance given that it's so serious...

This is about someone who for a while was one of my closest friends. We met at church, where she was an usher. I stayed at the church where I met her for a few years. Many negative things happened to me there. Such as the Pastor's daughter setting her father and mother against me and painting me as being divisive and oppositional, all because I liked hymns and at times suggested them (when asked for my opinion and input as a worship team member) and they preferred CCM, wanting to be a hip/cool church catering to young people. In the end, the reverend of the church broke my confidence to the Pastor and told him I wanted to leave without my knowledge after I spoke to her about it and asked for her help talking to him. He called me and dismissed me in a 2.5 minute conversation and wished me well on my way. Given all of the hurt I had been through personally at the church and seeing what other people also were put through, I never went back to the church.

My friend was also hurt through the negative actions of the leaders of that church and ended up leaving some time later. There was a fiasco in the church before I left. Her best friend and best friend's fiance ended up getting pregnant (they were baby Christians, new in their faith and trying to serve God). The Pastor and other church leaders had the couple come up in the front of the church and publicly apologize for their pregnancy - after a very dramatic service and sermon about sin. This also followed a major Sunday where the Pastor had invited everyone to talk about ways they had been hurt by the church and open up so that these hurts could be addressed..... Two other pregnancies followed - a teenager, and the same Pastor's daughter who I mentioned before. The teenager was forced to go on the altar and apologize. The Pastor's daughter was given a free pass AND the baby's birth was publicly announced via email and on the pulpit - this was not the case for the other 2 pregnancies. People fled the church following this event.

My friend was not rooted anywhere for a while. I understood the importance of being part of a church and always advised her to find a church so that she wouldn't be a lone sheep vulnerable to be devoured by wolves. She was my prayer partner, we encouraged each other with the word of God, we did evangelism together by handing out tracts and talking to people. She was my good sister in Christ.

She began coming to my church and was doing well for a while with praying and reading her Bible, maintaining her personal relationship with Christ, and even was beginning to be active in my church as a leader. I attend a very small church and I am VERY VERY active in my church. Some months down the line she began to start acting funny with me and I noticed she was becoming a negative influence in my life. I began to pull away because I didn't want the negative influence, but I tried to remain friends. Things became worse. She had a lot of issues and made excuses about not wanting to communicate. She was acting more and more funny. At one point she expressed the need to talk and we did sit down and have a heart to heart. I told her about her funny behavior and she acknowledged some things. I encouraged her, as always, with the word of God. She had some tough family situations and I talked to her about how God shapes us in those situations as we walk with Him. After the heart to heart, she was continuing to be distant and funny. Our friendship and communication suffered. A few weeks later, she met a man who attended a birthday party at my church. The birthday party was for the choir director. She began going out with the man immediately. She attended his church with him and brought him to our church with her. My spirit never felt right about him.

Later I would discover that the man was married (separated, wife in another country). I would discover that my friend knew early on in their dating that he was married and the wife wanted to make things work with her husband. However, my friend came along and began dating him, bringing further separation between the husband and wife. Months and months later, my friend told me all of this information either directly or indirectly (there were some lies/subterfuge - she was never too frank about everything). When she told me this, she was several months pregnant.

Right before the baby was born, I would discover, through an ex, that the choir director was married, and had been committing adultery with every man in the church she could get her hands on. The man my friend met was the brother of the choir director's ex-boyfriend. My own ex was dating/sleeping with the choir director while we had been dating.

My question is, how do I proceed with the friendship with my friend? Given that this is adultery and I desire to live a life that honors God and given that this is some serious backsliding, I have stepped back from being close friends with her. I have not condemned her for this situation, but rather have spoken to her about repentance. Rather than letting go of the other lady's husband, she is carrying on the relationship with the baby daddy and brings him to church with her at times and has planned church events even in this fallen state of adultery. These are the reasons I have stepped back from being her friend and all of these things made me consider leaving my church.

I have decided for the time being to remain at my church (other threads have detailed parts of the situation and my difficulties in staying/wanting to leave). Given that I am so involved in the church, it would be more harmful to the church for me to leave than for me to stay. I am taking up my cross and continuing to follow Jesus in the midst of all of this. I see my friend now as a very lost soul. How do I proceed with the friendship given that I can't be close to her, seeing as how she has involved herself in adultery and I don't condone that behavior?

Dear one,
This is what we have heard:
"Let not your hearts be troubled. Believe in God; believe also in me. -John 14:1

Aren’t you, dear one, crying in this distress like David ?

Answer me when I call, O God of my righteousness!
You have given me relief when I was in distress.
Be gracious to me and hear my prayer! -Psalms 4:1

So dear one, trust in the Lord can give you relief in this distress.

Dear one, yes, I have heard that you have experienced many negative in the church before. Let us first understand what church is and bear with me:

What is the word for “the church” mean ?
The New Testament word for "church" is ekklesia [ejkklhsiva], which means "the called out ones."

Let us consider the parable that the Lord have spoken:
“Is a lamp not brought in to be put on a stand?”

As we have heard:
Your word is a lamp to my feet and a light to my path. -Psalms 119:105

Likewise, we have heard the Lord said:

As for the mystery of the seven stars that you saw in my right hand, and the seven golden lampstands, the seven stars are the angels of the seven churches, and the seven lampstands are the seven churches. -Revelation 1:20

So, we can paraphrase the parable,
“Is the word not brought in to be put on a stand” or
“Is the word not brought to be heard by the churches”

So, let us paraphrase the parable,
“Is the word not brought to be heard by the called out ones?”

The answer is Yes.

The word is to be brought to be heard by the called out ones !

How the word is to be brought to be heard ? By witness

This is why we have heard:
And I will grant authority to My two witnesses, and they will prophesy for twelve hundred and sixty days, clothed in sackcloth. These are the two olive trees and the two lampstands that stand before the Lord of the earth. (NASB) Rev. 11:3-4

Here, the two witnesses are called as the two lampstands.

Likewise, we also have heard:

The Spirit Himself bears witness with our spirit that we are children of God, -Romans 8:16

Thus, we can paraphrase the parable,
“Is the Spirit of His word not brought to be heard by the called out ones?”

“Is the Spirit of His word not brought to be heard by the spirit of the called out ones ?”

What is the word that the spirit of the called ones hear ?

The called out ones hear the Holy Spirit’s witness that we are children of God.

So what is manifest by the witness ?

But you will receive power when the Holy Spirit has come upon you, and you will be my witnesses in Jerusalem and in all Judea and Samaria, and to the end of the earth." -Acts 1:8

The witness will receive power when the Holy Spirit has come upon those who are children of God.

So what has been kept secret that come to light in this witness ?

the Spirit and the water and the blood; and these three agree. -1 John 5:8

If we receive the testimony of men, the testimony of God is greater, for this is the testimony of God that He has borne concerning His Son. -1 John 5:9

Whoever believes in the Son of God has the testimony in himself. Whoever does not believe God has made Him a liar, because he has not believed in the testimony that God has borne concerning His Son. -1 John 5:10

Whoever has the Son has life; whoever does not have the Son of God does not have life. -1 John 5:12

Therefore, the secret about the called out ones that come to light is :

the called out ones who brings the testimony of the Son has life.

a lamp brought in to be put on a stand, — can be paraphrased to be :

Is a word that is brought in to the called out ones not to be put on a stand as a witness ?

Yes, the called out ones did not hide the light of the word but manifest with power that they receive from the Holy Spirit.

the called out ones come to light by witnessing the secret that those who have the testimony of the Son in himself have life.

So will those who hear understand?and receive the testimony of the Son that they may have everlasting life ?

So dear one,
Who is the called out ones ? The church. So the church is the called out ones who are enlightened by His words, as we have heard what the Lord have spoken in parable.
 
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SANTOSO

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I have been afraid to write about this situation in too much detail here ... but now I will take the chance given that it's so serious...

This is about someone who for a while was one of my closest friends. We met at church, where she was an usher. I stayed at the church where I met her for a few years. Many negative things happened to me there. Such as the Pastor's daughter setting her father and mother against me and painting me as being divisive and oppositional, all because I liked hymns and at times suggested them (when asked for my opinion and input as a worship team member) and they preferred CCM, wanting to be a hip/cool church catering to young people. In the end, the reverend of the church broke my confidence to the Pastor and told him I wanted to leave without my knowledge after I spoke to her about it and asked for her help talking to him. He called me and dismissed me in a 2.5 minute conversation and wished me well on my way. Given all of the hurt I had been through personally at the church and seeing what other people also were put through, I never went back to the church.

My friend was also hurt through the negative actions of the leaders of that church and ended up leaving some time later. There was a fiasco in the church before I left. Her best friend and best friend's fiance ended up getting pregnant (they were baby Christians, new in their faith and trying to serve God). The Pastor and other church leaders had the couple come up in the front of the church and publicly apologize for their pregnancy - after a very dramatic service and sermon about sin. This also followed a major Sunday where the Pastor had invited everyone to talk about ways they had been hurt by the church and open up so that these hurts could be addressed..... Two other pregnancies followed - a teenager, and the same Pastor's daughter who I mentioned before. The teenager was forced to go on the altar and apologize. The Pastor's daughter was given a free pass AND the baby's birth was publicly announced via email and on the pulpit - this was not the case for the other 2 pregnancies. People fled the church following this event.

My friend was not rooted anywhere for a while. I understood the importance of being part of a church and always advised her to find a church so that she wouldn't be a lone sheep vulnerable to be devoured by wolves. She was my prayer partner, we encouraged each other with the word of God, we did evangelism together by handing out tracts and talking to people. She was my good sister in Christ.

She began coming to my church and was doing well for a while with praying and reading her Bible, maintaining her personal relationship with Christ, and even was beginning to be active in my church as a leader. I attend a very small church and I am VERY VERY active in my church. Some months down the line she began to start acting funny with me and I noticed she was becoming a negative influence in my life. I began to pull away because I didn't want the negative influence, but I tried to remain friends. Things became worse. She had a lot of issues and made excuses about not wanting to communicate. She was acting more and more funny. At one point she expressed the need to talk and we did sit down and have a heart to heart. I told her about her funny behavior and she acknowledged some things. I encouraged her, as always, with the word of God. She had some tough family situations and I talked to her about how God shapes us in those situations as we walk with Him. After the heart to heart, she was continuing to be distant and funny. Our friendship and communication suffered. A few weeks later, she met a man who attended a birthday party at my church. The birthday party was for the choir director. She began going out with the man immediately. She attended his church with him and brought him to our church with her. My spirit never felt right about him.

Later I would discover that the man was married (separated, wife in another country). I would discover that my friend knew early on in their dating that he was married and the wife wanted to make things work with her husband. However, my friend came along and began dating him, bringing further separation between the husband and wife. Months and months later, my friend told me all of this information either directly or indirectly (there were some lies/subterfuge - she was never too frank about everything). When she told me this, she was several months pregnant.

Right before the baby was born, I would discover, through an ex, that the choir director was married, and had been committing adultery with every man in the church she could get her hands on. The man my friend met was the brother of the choir director's ex-boyfriend. My own ex was dating/sleeping with the choir director while we had been dating.

My question is, how do I proceed with the friendship with my friend? Given that this is adultery and I desire to live a life that honors God and given that this is some serious backsliding, I have stepped back from being close friends with her. I have not condemned her for this situation, but rather have spoken to her about repentance. Rather than letting go of the other lady's husband, she is carrying on the relationship with the baby daddy and brings him to church with her at times and has planned church events even in this fallen state of adultery. These are the reasons I have stepped back from being her friend and all of these things made me consider leaving my church.

I have decided for the time being to remain at my church (other threads have detailed parts of the situation and my difficulties in staying/wanting to leave). Given that I am so involved in the church, it would be more harmful to the church for me to leave than for me to stay. I am taking up my cross and continuing to follow Jesus in the midst of all of this. I see my friend now as a very lost soul. How do I proceed with the friendship given that I can't be close to her, seeing as how she has involved herself in adultery and I don't condone that behavior?
Dear one,
Thank you for bearing with me on my first reply. I hope that you understand whom the Lord as church.

I understand that you were misunderstood when you said that you liked hymns. And those who heard distort what you mean. And that you were offended by what they have said and done to you.

This is what we have heard:
if one has a complaint against another, forgiving each other; as the Lord has forgiven you, so you also must forgive. -Colossians 3:13

Yes, you may have heard but don’t take lightly my dear one. For we all need the Lord’s strength to forgive those who offend us. Let us humble ourselves before the Lord and walk in His ways, and not in our ways.

By doing what the Lord has told us to release forgiveness to others, our prayers won’t be hindered, as we heard :

Behold, the LORD's hand is not shortened, that it cannot save, or his ear dull, that it cannot hear; -Isaiah 59:1
but your iniquities have made a separation between you and your God, and your sins have hidden his face from you so that he does not hear. -Isaiah 59:2

So dear one, release forgiveness to them that wrong you and your friends.

Remember:
The LORD is a stronghold for the oppressed, a stronghold in times of trouble. -Psalms 9:9

So when you are oppressed, let the Lord be your strength —- your stronghold. Trust the Lord that He can redeem you out of troubles.
 
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SANTOSO

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I have been afraid to write about this situation in too much detail here ... but now I will take the chance given that it's so serious...

This is about someone who for a while was one of my closest friends. We met at church, where she was an usher. I stayed at the church where I met her for a few years. Many negative things happened to me there. Such as the Pastor's daughter setting her father and mother against me and painting me as being divisive and oppositional, all because I liked hymns and at times suggested them (when asked for my opinion and input as a worship team member) and they preferred CCM, wanting to be a hip/cool church catering to young people. In the end, the reverend of the church broke my confidence to the Pastor and told him I wanted to leave without my knowledge after I spoke to her about it and asked for her help talking to him. He called me and dismissed me in a 2.5 minute conversation and wished me well on my way. Given all of the hurt I had been through personally at the church and seeing what other people also were put through, I never went back to the church.

My friend was also hurt through the negative actions of the leaders of that church and ended up leaving some time later. There was a fiasco in the church before I left. Her best friend and best friend's fiance ended up getting pregnant (they were baby Christians, new in their faith and trying to serve God). The Pastor and other church leaders had the couple come up in the front of the church and publicly apologize for their pregnancy - after a very dramatic service and sermon about sin. This also followed a major Sunday where the Pastor had invited everyone to talk about ways they had been hurt by the church and open up so that these hurts could be addressed..... Two other pregnancies followed - a teenager, and the same Pastor's daughter who I mentioned before. The teenager was forced to go on the altar and apologize. The Pastor's daughter was given a free pass AND the baby's birth was publicly announced via email and on the pulpit - this was not the case for the other 2 pregnancies. People fled the church following this event.

My friend was not rooted anywhere for a while. I understood the importance of being part of a church and always advised her to find a church so that she wouldn't be a lone sheep vulnerable to be devoured by wolves. She was my prayer partner, we encouraged each other with the word of God, we did evangelism together by handing out tracts and talking to people. She was my good sister in Christ.

She began coming to my church and was doing well for a while with praying and reading her Bible, maintaining her personal relationship with Christ, and even was beginning to be active in my church as a leader. I attend a very small church and I am VERY VERY active in my church. Some months down the line she began to start acting funny with me and I noticed she was becoming a negative influence in my life. I began to pull away because I didn't want the negative influence, but I tried to remain friends. Things became worse. She had a lot of issues and made excuses about not wanting to communicate. She was acting more and more funny. At one point she expressed the need to talk and we did sit down and have a heart to heart. I told her about her funny behavior and she acknowledged some things. I encouraged her, as always, with the word of God. She had some tough family situations and I talked to her about how God shapes us in those situations as we walk with Him. After the heart to heart, she was continuing to be distant and funny. Our friendship and communication suffered. A few weeks later, she met a man who attended a birthday party at my church. The birthday party was for the choir director. She began going out with the man immediately. She attended his church with him and brought him to our church with her. My spirit never felt right about him.

Later I would discover that the man was married (separated, wife in another country). I would discover that my friend knew early on in their dating that he was married and the wife wanted to make things work with her husband. However, my friend came along and began dating him, bringing further separation between the husband and wife. Months and months later, my friend told me all of this information either directly or indirectly (there were some lies/subterfuge - she was never too frank about everything). When she told me this, she was several months pregnant.

Right before the baby was born, I would discover, through an ex, that the choir director was married, and had been committing adultery with every man in the church she could get her hands on. The man my friend met was the brother of the choir director's ex-boyfriend. My own ex was dating/sleeping with the choir director while we had been dating.

My question is, how do I proceed with the friendship with my friend? Given that this is adultery and I desire to live a life that honors God and given that this is some serious backsliding, I have stepped back from being close friends with her. I have not condemned her for this situation, but rather have spoken to her about repentance. Rather than letting go of the other lady's husband, she is carrying on the relationship with the baby daddy and brings him to church with her at times and has planned church events even in this fallen state of adultery. These are the reasons I have stepped back from being her friend and all of these things made me consider leaving my church.

I have decided for the time being to remain at my church (other threads have detailed parts of the situation and my difficulties in staying/wanting to leave). Given that I am so involved in the church, it would be more harmful to the church for me to leave than for me to stay. I am taking up my cross and continuing to follow Jesus in the midst of all of this. I see my friend now as a very lost soul. How do I proceed with the friendship given that I can't be close to her, seeing as how she has involved herself in adultery and I don't condone that behavior?

Dear one,
You have said about fiasco that happened. This is what we have heard:
So put away all malice and all deceit and hypocrisy and envy and all slander. -1 Peter 2:1
Like newborn infants, long for the pure spiritual milk, that by it you may grow up into salvation' -1 Peter 2:2

Why apostle Peter told us to put away ?
It is not because it is not part of us or of us.

Yes, many commit sin of hypocrisy, envy and slander. If they can put away these sins, then they must have humble themselves and repent and come back to the Lord’s side.

If they can’t put away these things things, there is power of the enemies at work that compel and enslave these people.

So those who commit hypocrisy, envy and slander can only be freed through the Lord’s deliverance.
 
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SANTOSO

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I have been afraid to write about this situation in too much detail here ... but now I will take the chance given that it's so serious...

This is about someone who for a while was one of my closest friends. We met at church, where she was an usher. I stayed at the church where I met her for a few years. Many negative things happened to me there. Such as the Pastor's daughter setting her father and mother against me and painting me as being divisive and oppositional, all because I liked hymns and at times suggested them (when asked for my opinion and input as a worship team member) and they preferred CCM, wanting to be a hip/cool church catering to young people. In the end, the reverend of the church broke my confidence to the Pastor and told him I wanted to leave without my knowledge after I spoke to her about it and asked for her help talking to him. He called me and dismissed me in a 2.5 minute conversation and wished me well on my way. Given all of the hurt I had been through personally at the church and seeing what other people also were put through, I never went back to the church.

My friend was also hurt through the negative actions of the leaders of that church and ended up leaving some time later. There was a fiasco in the church before I left. Her best friend and best friend's fiance ended up getting pregnant (they were baby Christians, new in their faith and trying to serve God). The Pastor and other church leaders had the couple come up in the front of the church and publicly apologize for their pregnancy - after a very dramatic service and sermon about sin. This also followed a major Sunday where the Pastor had invited everyone to talk about ways they had been hurt by the church and open up so that these hurts could be addressed..... Two other pregnancies followed - a teenager, and the same Pastor's daughter who I mentioned before. The teenager was forced to go on the altar and apologize. The Pastor's daughter was given a free pass AND the baby's birth was publicly announced via email and on the pulpit - this was not the case for the other 2 pregnancies. People fled the church following this event.

My friend was not rooted anywhere for a while. I understood the importance of being part of a church and always advised her to find a church so that she wouldn't be a lone sheep vulnerable to be devoured by wolves. She was my prayer partner, we encouraged each other with the word of God, we did evangelism together by handing out tracts and talking to people. She was my good sister in Christ.

She began coming to my church and was doing well for a while with praying and reading her Bible, maintaining her personal relationship with Christ, and even was beginning to be active in my church as a leader. I attend a very small church and I am VERY VERY active in my church. Some months down the line she began to start acting funny with me and I noticed she was becoming a negative influence in my life. I began to pull away because I didn't want the negative influence, but I tried to remain friends. Things became worse. She had a lot of issues and made excuses about not wanting to communicate. She was acting more and more funny. At one point she expressed the need to talk and we did sit down and have a heart to heart. I told her about her funny behavior and she acknowledged some things. I encouraged her, as always, with the word of God. She had some tough family situations and I talked to her about how God shapes us in those situations as we walk with Him. After the heart to heart, she was continuing to be distant and funny. Our friendship and communication suffered. A few weeks later, she met a man who attended a birthday party at my church. The birthday party was for the choir director. She began going out with the man immediately. She attended his church with him and brought him to our church with her. My spirit never felt right about him.

Later I would discover that the man was married (separated, wife in another country). I would discover that my friend knew early on in their dating that he was married and the wife wanted to make things work with her husband. However, my friend came along and began dating him, bringing further separation between the husband and wife. Months and months later, my friend told me all of this information either directly or indirectly (there were some lies/subterfuge - she was never too frank about everything). When she told me this, she was several months pregnant.

Right before the baby was born, I would discover, through an ex, that the choir director was married, and had been committing adultery with every man in the church she could get her hands on. The man my friend met was the brother of the choir director's ex-boyfriend. My own ex was dating/sleeping with the choir director while we had been dating.

My question is, how do I proceed with the friendship with my friend? Given that this is adultery and I desire to live a life that honors God and given that this is some serious backsliding, I have stepped back from being close friends with her. I have not condemned her for this situation, but rather have spoken to her about repentance. Rather than letting go of the other lady's husband, she is carrying on the relationship with the baby daddy and brings him to church with her at times and has planned church events even in this fallen state of adultery. These are the reasons I have stepped back from being her friend and all of these things made me consider leaving my church.

I have decided for the time being to remain at my church (other threads have detailed parts of the situation and my difficulties in staying/wanting to leave). Given that I am so involved in the church, it would be more harmful to the church for me to leave than for me to stay. I am taking up my cross and continuing to follow Jesus in the midst of all of this. I see my friend now as a very lost soul. How do I proceed with the friendship given that I can't be close to her, seeing as how she has involved herself in adultery and I don't condone that behavior?
Dear one,
It is really a blessing that you have a prayer partner. Though she may not have rooted in a church building or institution, I am glad that she seek the Lord to please the Lord by evangelizing. Likewise, you, too.

Dear one, treat such friend with care.
 
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