Pope calls idea of declaring Mary co-redemptrix ‘foolishness’

Michie said:

This is one thing I agree with the Pope about. I think it would just be a stumbling block to many.

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What would it mean to be a co-redemptrix? I am confused by the word and do not understand why there are some people that wish to call Mary by that title. . Perhaps in a different language, like Latin, the meaning is more clear?

Not sure if I'm allowed to respond.

As a non-catholic I would need to see a more cogent explanation of John 19:25-27 and Colossians 1:24 than Catholic scholars have offered. The passages require significant eisogesis to make them support the coredemtrix inference.

I don't however call the inference,"foolishness," as several of the church fathers including Iranaes, have made statements in support of the view. It seems we should examine the various explanations of Mary's role in salvation and ask which view best explains the data we find in scripture (if one is Protestant) and also Church History (if one is Catholic).

Michie said:

This is one thing I agree with the Pope about. I think it would just be a stumbling block to many.

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Wow, me too. That's the first one in a looooooooong time. Good for him.

Besides, I fail to see the need for this addition. Why is this needed?

If anything we should give St. Paul some titles. He has been downplayed and neglected since the feminization of the church went all haywire in the 60s.

We need something that attracts men to endorse Catholicism. It reminds me of how we evangelized the Vikings in Norway.
We preached the risen Christ, the conqueror of death. They all wanted to be a part of his victory.

I'm sure that these wise men knew that if they'd preached the cross, as humiliation and suffering they'd not succeed.

They chose a different angle, which was clever.

Michie said:

This is one thing I agree with the Pope about. I think it would just be a stumbling block to many.

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I would also agree.

Michie said:

*You are in the Catholic forum*

Pope Francis appeared to flatly reject proposals in some theological circles to add “co-redemptrix” to the list of titles of the Virgin Mary, saying the mother of Jesus never took anything that belonged to her son, and calling the invention of new titles and dogmas “foolishness.”

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Pope calls idea of declaring Mary co-redemptrix 'foolishness'

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For those of you who are looking for answers, here's an interesting and very detailed broadcast on that subject from a few years ago. And if you liked Mother Angelica, you'll love this broadcast.
co-redemptrix - Bing video

I've never understood the concept. I want to grow closer to Mary, but also want to give Jesus the perfect respect He deserves.

What about Mediatrix of All Graces? I've heard that one used.

Mediatrix of all graces - Wikipedia

I think it's allowed, but not formal dogma.

The Immaculate: Mediatrix of Divine Love - St. Maximilian Kolbe

I wouldn't call it foolish but I agree with what he said.

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I'm sure not an expert on Marian "theology" if you want to call it that.

During discussions with a Catholic psychiatrist (I mainly continue to see him as we both share certain spiritual experiences) who like me is a former Protestant, he once said to me "It took me years to work out where Mary stood in the scheme of things ... She intercedes with God on behalf of those in Purgatory - I think that's her primary role."

Maybe he was right. She's not "co-redemptrix". Christ is the lock, stock and barrel of of redemption.

But she's got an important role to play.

Bob Crowley said:

I'm sure not an expert on Marian "theology" if you want to call it that.

During discussions with a Catholic psychiatrist (I mainly continue to see him as we both share certain spiritual experiences) who like me is a former Protestant, he once said to me "It took me years to work out where Mary stood in the scheme of things ... She intercedes with God on behalf of those in Purgatory - I think that's her primary role."

Maybe he was right. She's not "co-redemptrix". Christ is the lock, stock and barrel of of redemption.

But she's got an important role to play.

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Its based on her fiat. The entire salvation of mankind began with Mary's fiat. If this isnt co redemption, then what is?

I understand the desire to push for this doctrine, but it's not needed. We already honor Mary plentiful in our liturgical life and in our personal devotions.

On a personal note, Mary has been a HUGE help to me these past few years.
I want to acknowledge that the example of her life has been like a beacon of hope for me in times when I desperately needed one.

I knew the Nativity story well. But when I took a closer look, I could see how God orchestrated every step of her way in answer to her fiat. She was protected, guided, loved, encouraged, provided for, comforted, and befriended through an ordeal that could have turned ugly on a dime.

Whenever there was a problem, God provided an answer. And He never stopped.

Even at the death of Jesus, when Mary was there at the Cross with Him, God had already prepared help for her in her life as a widow.

As a result, that which was provided for her, she in turn has provided that same kind of help and reassurance for us through her intercession in heaven to both God and Jesus on our behalf. And in doing so, she has come to the recue of so many, many Christians in the example of her life, her faith, and her obedience as she relied on God and His Son, Jesus.

Without that example so many Christians would have lost their way when the going got hard or took longer than they had thought it would. But with the example of her listening ear and her intercession to Jesus for us, things changed.
Prayers were answered, a way was found where there had been none before, and hope was restored.

I know full well what Jesus has done for me, and I don't discount it at all.
But I also know that it is Mary who, time after time, has born me up when I would surely have stumbled and fallen, were it not for the free gift of her example of generous obedience that marked my pathway for me through this past time.

In thanking Mary, I also thank Jesus, who made all things possible as the Son of God.

The Pope's words will probably not go over well with those who are pushing for the Church to decree that Mary is Co-Redemptrix and Mediatrix of all graces.