Why was king Herod trying to kill the Messiah?

JohnB445 · Feb 17, 2019

MATTHEW 2:13
13And when they were departed, behold, the angel of the Lord appeareth to Joseph in a dream, saying, Arise, and take the young child and his mother, and flee into Egypt, and be thou there until I bring thee word: for Herod will seek the young child to destroy him.

14When he arose, he took the young child and his mother by night, and departed into Egypt: 15And was there until the death of Herod: that it might be fulfilled which was spoken of the Lord by the prophet, saying, Out of Egypt have I called my son.

MATTHEW 2:16
16Then Herod, when he saw that he was mocked of the wise men, was exceeding wroth, and sent forth, and slew all the children that were in Bethlehem, and in all the coasts thereof, from two years old and under, according to the time which he had diligently inquired of the wise men. 17Then was fulfilled that which was spoken by Jeremy the prophet, saying,

18In Rama was there a voice heard, lamentation, and weeping, and great mourning, Rachel weeping for her children, and would not be comforted, because they are not.

MATTHEW 2:19
19But when Herod was dead, behold, an angel of the Lord appeareth in a dream to Joseph in Egypt, 20Saying, Arise, and take the young child and his mother, and go into the land of Israel: for they are dead which sought the young child's life. 21And he arose, and took the young child and his mother, and came into the land of Israel. 22But when he heard that Archelaus did reign in Judaea in the room of his father Herod, he was afraid to go thither: notwithstanding, being warned of God in a dream, he turned aside into the parts of Galilee: 23And he came and dwelt in a city called Nazareth: that it might be fulfilled which was spoken by the prophets, He shall be called a Nazarene.

Some questions:

1. Who was king Herod?

2. Why was he trying to kill the Messiah? And why did he kill all the children?

3. Did king Herod get saved? How did he die?

ewq1938 · Feb 17, 2019

JohnB445 said:
2. Why was he trying to kill the Messiah? And why did he kill all the children?

He was worried Christ would take away his kingship/kingdom from him and his family so that was a threat to their way of life.

AvgJoe · Feb 17, 2019

JohnB445 said:
MATTHEW 2:13
13And when they were departed, behold, the angel of the Lord appeareth to Joseph in a dream, saying, Arise, and take the young child and his mother, and flee into Egypt, and be thou there until I bring thee word: for Herod will seek the young child to destroy him.

14When he arose, he took the young child and his mother by night, and departed into Egypt: 15And was there until the death of Herod: that it might be fulfilled which was spoken of the Lord by the prophet, saying, Out of Egypt have I called my son.

MATTHEW 2:16
16Then Herod, when he saw that he was mocked of the wise men, was exceeding wroth, and sent forth, and slew all the children that were in Bethlehem, and in all the coasts thereof, from two years old and under, according to the time which he had diligently inquired of the wise men. 17Then was fulfilled that which was spoken by Jeremy the prophet, saying,

18In Rama was there a voice heard, lamentation, and weeping, and great mourning, Rachel weeping for her children, and would not be comforted, because they are not.

MATTHEW 2:19
19But when Herod was dead, behold, an angel of the Lord appeareth in a dream to Joseph in Egypt, 20Saying, Arise, and take the young child and his mother, and go into the land of Israel: for they are dead which sought the young child's life. 21And he arose, and took the young child and his mother, and came into the land of Israel. 22But when he heard that Archelaus did reign in Judaea in the room of his father Herod, he was afraid to go thither: notwithstanding, being warned of God in a dream, he turned aside into the parts of Galilee: 23And he came and dwelt in a city called Nazareth: that it might be fulfilled which was spoken by the prophets, He shall be called a Nazarene.

Some questions:

1. Who was king Herod?

2. Why was he trying to kill the Messiah? And why did he kill all the children?

3. Did king Herod get saved? How did he die?

Question: "Who was Herod the Great?"

Answer: The name Herod comes up again and again in the New Testament from Matthew 2 to Acts 26. A casual reader might think that Herod had tremendous longevity as a ruler. However, Herod is the family name of a ruling dynasty in Palestine. There are four different Herods in the New Testament as well as Herod Philip II, who is referred to as Philip the tetrarch in the New Testament.

Herod I came to be known as Herod the Great and was also called King of the Jews. He ruled from 37 or 36 BC to 4 BC. He is mentioned in the New Testament in Matthew 2. Magi from the East came to Jerusalem looking for the one who had been born King of the Jews. Of course, this would arrest Herod’s attention, as this was his title. Herod called the scribes and determined that, according to prophecy, the Messiah would be born in Bethlehem. As the magi left for Bethlehem to find the Messiah, Herod asked them to report back to him with the location of the newborn King “so that I too may go and worship him” (Matthew 2:8).

Of course, Herod had no such intentions. The magi find Jesus and worship Him, presenting their gifts to Him, but they are then warned by God in a dream not to return to Herod. When Herod realizes that the magi have not reported back to him, he is furious and calls for the slaughter of all the boys up to two years old in Bethlehem and the surrounding area, hoping to end the life of any potential rival. God warns Joseph that he needs to flee to Egypt with Jesus and Mary. Jesus is not harmed; however, there is a great slaughter of the innocents in and around Bethlehem (Matthew 2:16–18). Such is Herod the Great’s biblical legacy.

Herod the Great was the son of a high-ranking official in the Hasmonean dynasty, which was ruling Palestine as an independent kingdom. He was an Idumean or Edomite (a descendant of Esau), but there had been intermarriage between Jews and Edomites, and Herod publicly identified himself as a Jew, although he was not faithful to observe Jewish Law. In 41 BC Herod the Great was named governor of Galilee. However, the Jewish Hasmonean dynasty was in conflict with Rome, and Herod supported Rome in the conflict. He was given the title King of the Jews by the Roman Senate and then charged with the responsibility of conquering Judea so that he could rule as a client king. After about three years of fighting, Herod was victorious in 37 or 36 BC.

As king of Judea, Herod the Great’s primary directive was to carry out the wishes of Rome. As always, Rome wanted to maintain peace and foster good will among the local inhabitants who had been conquered. (If that didn’t work, Rome would eventually respond with overwhelming force.) Herod tried to foster good will by reducing taxes, enacting policies that helped bring about economic prosperity, and building public works including the incredible artificial port city of Caesarea, the fortress of Masada, and fortifications around Jerusalem. Herod also built a magnificent palace for himself atop a man-made mountain. The palace was called the Herodium.

In order to gain favor with the Jews, Herod the Great greatly enlarged and updated the temple in Jerusalem to a size and magnificence it had never enjoyed before, not even under Solomon. This renovated structure became known as Herod’s temple. He also married Mariamne, a Hasmonean princess, and appointed her brother as high priest.

Despite his brilliant and ambitious building projects, Herod the Great had a dark side that showed itself in the events of Matthew 2 and in other historical events. He always feared potential rivals. He had his wife’s brother Aristobulus, the high priest, drowned in the swimming pool in his palace. He put to death 46 members of the Sanhedrin. He killed his mother-in-law. He also had his wife Mariamne murdered along with two of their sons, as he considered them potential rivals with legitimate claim to the throne because of their Hasmonean lineage. (Herod had ten wives in all and many other children who did not have Hasmonean blood.) Augustus Caesar is reported to have said, “It is better to be Herod’s dog than one of his children.” When placed in this context, the incident in Matthew 2 does not seem out of character.

In BC 4, after a long and excruciating illness, Herod the Great died. This news was reported to Joseph by an angel of the Lord in a dream in Matthew 2:19, so Joseph knew it was safe to return to Israel with Jesus.

Of course, our dating system will cause some consternation. We know that Herod died in 4 BC, which means that Jesus must have been born before 4 BC. It is normally assumed that Jesus was born in 1 BC (or perhaps 0 BC or AD 1), but these dates were assigned at least nine centuries later, and there were some errors in the calculations. So Jesus was born some time before 4 BC, and we do not know how much time passed between Joseph’s taking his family to safety in Egypt and Herod’s death.

Upon Herod the Great’s death, his sons were appointed rulers in his place. Archelaus was appointed ethnarch (ruler of an ethnic group, but not a king) of Samaria, Judea, and Idumea. He is mentioned once in Scripture: when Joseph heard that Archelaus was ruling in Judea in place of his father Herod, Joseph took his family to Nazareth in Galilee (Matthew 2:22–23). Philip (Herod Philip II) was appointed tetrarch of Iturea and Traconitus. Philip is mentioned later in the New Testament as the one who lost his wife to his half-brother, Herod Antipas, the Herod who was then rebuked by John the Baptist for taking his brother Philip’s wife (Matthew 14:3–4).

Herod the Great was an ambitious and ruthless ruler who set himself in opposition to the King of kings and Lord of lords. Throughout history and the scriptural record, we see the Herod family following in the footsteps of their father in opposing Christ.

www.gotquestions.org/Herod-the-Great.html

Tone · Feb 17, 2019

JohnB445 said:
16Then Herod, when he saw that he was mocked of the wise men, was exceeding wroth, and sent forth, and slew all the children that were in Bethlehem

This says, because his feelings were hurt...

eleos1954 · Feb 17, 2019

JohnB445 said:
MATTHEW 2:13
13And when they were departed, behold, the angel of the Lord appeareth to Joseph in a dream, saying, Arise, and take the young child and his mother, and flee into Egypt, and be thou there until I bring thee word: for Herod will seek the young child to destroy him.

14When he arose, he took the young child and his mother by night, and departed into Egypt: 15And was there until the death of Herod: that it might be fulfilled which was spoken of the Lord by the prophet, saying, Out of Egypt have I called my son.

MATTHEW 2:16
16Then Herod, when he saw that he was mocked of the wise men, was exceeding wroth, and sent forth, and slew all the children that were in Bethlehem, and in all the coasts thereof, from two years old and under, according to the time which he had diligently inquired of the wise men. 17Then was fulfilled that which was spoken by Jeremy the prophet, saying,

18In Rama was there a voice heard, lamentation, and weeping, and great mourning, Rachel weeping for her children, and would not be comforted, because they are not.

MATTHEW 2:19
19But when Herod was dead, behold, an angel of the Lord appeareth in a dream to Joseph in Egypt, 20Saying, Arise, and take the young child and his mother, and go into the land of Israel: for they are dead which sought the young child's life. 21And he arose, and took the young child and his mother, and came into the land of Israel. 22But when he heard that Archelaus did reign in Judaea in the room of his father Herod, he was afraid to go thither: notwithstanding, being warned of God in a dream, he turned aside into the parts of Galilee: 23And he came and dwelt in a city called Nazareth: that it might be fulfilled which was spoken by the prophets, He shall be called a Nazarene.

Some questions:

1. Who was king Herod?

Herod “the Great” ruled as king of the Jews under Roman authority for thirty-three years, from 37–4 BC. It is this Herod who appears in the account of Jesus’ birth (Matt. 2:1–19; Luke 1:5).

2. Why was he trying to kill the Messiah? And why did he kill all the children?

Herod was "king" at the time and the news of another king being born was he considered a rival to him as "king".

Whom he considered a rival (as a king), he thought would be among the children he ordered slain as he didn't know specifically what child it could be.

3. Did king Herod get saved? How did he die?

Died‎: ‎c. 4 BC; ‎Jericho‎, ‎Judea

Different historical writings about how he died.

Josephus states that a loathsome disease descended upon the ruler as a judgment from God on account of his sins. He describes the horrible details —burning fever, ulcerated entrails, foul discharges, convulsions, stench, etc. (Antiquities 17.6.5).

Nothing I find in the bible to suggest Herod repented/saved.

He was a deplorable man. He even killed a couple of his own sons.

Only thing I find in the bible is:

“But when Herod was dead, behold an angel of the Lord appears in a dream to Joseph in Egypt, saying, Arise and take the young child and his mother, and go into the land of Israel: for they are dead that sought the young child’s life” (Matthew 2:19-20).

Jonaitis · Feb 17, 2019

JohnB445 said:
Some questions:

1. Who was king Herod?

2. Why was he trying to kill the Messiah? And why did he kill all the children?

3. Did king Herod get saved? How did he die?

King Herod was Roman appointed, and was himself not even Jewish (by birth), his father was by descent an Edomite, meaning he was not even a legitimate rule on David's throne period (he didn't really have that kind of power in those times anyways). The arrival of the Messiah threatened his influence, power, and status, simply for who he is.

The Righterzpen · Feb 18, 2019

AvgJoe said:
Question: "Who was Herod the Great?"

Answer: The name Herod comes up again and again in the New Testament from Matthew 2 to Acts 26. A casual reader might think that Herod had tremendous longevity as a ruler. However, Herod is the family name of a ruling dynasty in Palestine. There are four different Herods in the New Testament as well as Herod Philip II, who is referred to as Philip the tetrarch in the New Testament.

Herod I came to be known as Herod the Great and was also called King of the Jews. He ruled from 37 or 36 BC to 4 BC. He is mentioned in the New Testament in Matthew 2. Magi from the East came to Jerusalem looking for the one who had been born King of the Jews. Of course, this would arrest Herod’s attention, as this was his title. Herod called the scribes and determined that, according to prophecy, the Messiah would be born in Bethlehem. As the magi left for Bethlehem to find the Messiah, Herod asked them to report back to him with the location of the newborn King “so that I too may go and worship him” (Matthew 2:8).

Of course, Herod had no such intentions. The magi find Jesus and worship Him, presenting their gifts to Him, but they are then warned by God in a dream not to return to Herod. When Herod realizes that the magi have not reported back to him, he is furious and calls for the slaughter of all the boys up to two years old in Bethlehem and the surrounding area, hoping to end the life of any potential rival. God warns Joseph that he needs to flee to Egypt with Jesus and Mary. Jesus is not harmed; however, there is a great slaughter of the innocents in and around Bethlehem (Matthew 2:16–18). Such is Herod the Great’s biblical legacy.

Herod the Great was the son of a high-ranking official in the Hasmonean dynasty, which was ruling Palestine as an independent kingdom. He was an Idumean or Edomite (a descendant of Esau), but there had been intermarriage between Jews and Edomites, and Herod publicly identified himself as a Jew, although he was not faithful to observe Jewish Law. In 41 BC Herod the Great was named governor of Galilee. However, the Jewish Hasmonean dynasty was in conflict with Rome, and Herod supported Rome in the conflict. He was given the title King of the Jews by the Roman Senate and then charged with the responsibility of conquering Judea so that he could rule as a client king. After about three years of fighting, Herod was victorious in 37 or 36 BC.

As king of Judea, Herod the Great’s primary directive was to carry out the wishes of Rome. As always, Rome wanted to maintain peace and foster good will among the local inhabitants who had been conquered. (If that didn’t work, Rome would eventually respond with overwhelming force.) Herod tried to foster good will by reducing taxes, enacting policies that helped bring about economic prosperity, and building public works including the incredible artificial port city of Caesarea, the fortress of Masada, and fortifications around Jerusalem. Herod also built a magnificent palace for himself atop a man-made mountain. The palace was called the Herodium.

In order to gain favor with the Jews, Herod the Great greatly enlarged and updated the temple in Jerusalem to a size and magnificence it had never enjoyed before, not even under Solomon. This renovated structure became known as Herod’s temple. He also married Mariamne, a Hasmonean princess, and appointed her brother as high priest.

Despite his brilliant and ambitious building projects, Herod the Great had a dark side that showed itself in the events of Matthew 2 and in other historical events. He always feared potential rivals. He had his wife’s brother Aristobulus, the high priest, drowned in the swimming pool in his palace. He put to death 46 members of the Sanhedrin. He killed his mother-in-law. He also had his wife Mariamne murdered along with two of their sons, as he considered them potential rivals with legitimate claim to the throne because of their Hasmonean lineage. (Herod had ten wives in all and many other children who did not have Hasmonean blood.) Augustus Caesar is reported to have said, “It is better to be Herod’s dog than one of his children.” When placed in this context, the incident in Matthew 2 does not seem out of character.

In BC 4, after a long and excruciating illness, Herod the Great died. This news was reported to Joseph by an angel of the Lord in a dream in Matthew 2:19, so Joseph knew it was safe to return to Israel with Jesus.

Of course, our dating system will cause some consternation. We know that Herod died in 4 BC, which means that Jesus must have been born before 4 BC. It is normally assumed that Jesus was born in 1 BC (or perhaps 0 BC or AD 1), but these dates were assigned at least nine centuries later, and there were some errors in the calculations. So Jesus was born some time before 4 BC, and we do not know how much time passed between Joseph’s taking his family to safety in Egypt and Herod’s death.

Upon Herod the Great’s death, his sons were appointed rulers in his place. Archelaus was appointed ethnarch (ruler of an ethnic group, but not a king) of Samaria, Judea, and Idumea. He is mentioned once in Scripture: when Joseph heard that Archelaus was ruling in Judea in place of his father Herod, Joseph took his family to Nazareth in Galilee (Matthew 2:22–23). Philip (Herod Philip II) was appointed tetrarch of Iturea and Traconitus. Philip is mentioned later in the New Testament as the one who lost his wife to his half-brother, Herod Antipas, the Herod who was then rebuked by John the Baptist for taking his brother Philip’s wife (Matthew 14:3–4).

Herod the Great was an ambitious and ruthless ruler who set himself in opposition to the King of kings and Lord of lords. Throughout history and the scriptural record, we see the Herod family following in the footsteps of their father in opposing Christ.

www.gotquestions.org/Herod-the-Great.html

Good run down of Herod the Great here! :oldthumbsup:

To add a little more color to this picture now.

Augustus Caesar had a military general who's sir name was "Agrippa". General Agrippa was Caesar's "right hand man" and was basically the administrative brains behind the empire. He was also a prolific builder of public works projects. G.A. built much of Rome's sewer and aqueduct infrastructure. Caesar basically gave him free reign of what ever resource he needed to complete these projects. Back in that day, most of the labor for public works projects came from the military. The Roman army functioned as a military, public works department and a police force. It was in charge of the prison system as well as responsible for executing criminals. The Roman army was an interesting entity; but anyways, back to the general.

To my knowledge nothing is known of G.A.'s origins except he was disliked by members of the senate for not being aristocracy. The name "Agrippa" though is not of Greek or Latin origin and is believed to be Jewish. Herod the Great had an "admiration" for this general, so he named his grandson Herod Agrippa. And this is how the name "Agrippa" got into the Herod family line.

Now why did Herod want to kill Jesus?

Well, it wasn't just "political power"; Herod the Great really, really, .... really wanted to believe he was the Messiah. Now keep in mind, the Jewish leadership was looking for a political Messiah. And of all the "candidates" of possible Jewish bloodlines; this General Agrippa fit their definition more than Herod did; and this is my speculation as to why Herod took on all the building projects he did. I believe he was the second most prolific builder in the empire at the time and "took after" General Agrippa.

So because Herod really, really, ..... really wanted to believe he was the Messiah; when he came to power, he destroyed all the genealogical records that had been brought back from the Babylonian captivity. He did this because these records proved he was not of the line of David. What of General Agrippa though? What was his genealogy? We have no idea. We only have good circumstantial evidence that the sir name is Jewish.

G.A. was a skilled soldier and battle strategist and basically Augustus owed his empire to G.A. as he'd defeated Mark Antony in the battle of Axiom. Now Mark Antony is the one who recommended Herod the Great to the Roman senate and this is how Herod "got the job" of first governorship in Galilee (I believe it was?)

When Mark Antony was defeated. Herod went to Rome; (and probably in the only act of humility in his entire life) he apologized to Caesar for taking the wrong side in the war and pledged allegiance to Augustus in the stead of Mark Antony. To my knowledge though, I believe he and Antony remained friends until Antony died.

Now one of Herod's big building projects was the Antonia Fortress; which he named after Mark Antony. Now besides Masada, the only thing still standing in Jerusalem that Herod built, is the Antonia fortress. It was built as a military base and held a lot of "retired" soldiers who'd fought in the battle of Axiom. These were also soldiers who'd helped Herod keep order after he'd become king. So thus was the reason this fortress was there. I believe he'd started construction of it in like 24 BC.

About 10 years later, Herod started reconstruction of the temple. The Sanhedrin did not trust Herod. So in order to rebuild the temple; Herod had to bring in all the materials as a good faith gesture to show that he was indeed going to reconstruct the temple before tearing the old one down. And tear down the old temple, Herod did. He leveled the location and started from scratch.

Now what is thought to be the "temple mount" today is actually the remnants of Antonia. (You can see this from Josephus's accounts.) The location of the Dome of the Rock, is not where the temple was. The temple was south of that, inside the "City of David".

Within the Antonia fortress was an entire legion of Roman soldiers. The 10th legion was "stationed" there and a legion consists of about 5000 soldiers. Now with support staff and "civilian contractors" Antonia housed 8 to 10 thousand people. Pilate likely "lived" in Antonia too, although his wife (and any small children he would have had) lived in the city of Jerusalem. Soldiers' families did not live on military bases, unless they were employed by the Roman army; Of which, mostly would have been people who brought in food supplies, did laundry and other such tasks as caring for the sick. The set up of the modern American military base comes from Rome. This has been the case basically through out the history of standing armies in Europe. They all use(d) the Roman model.

So inside Antonia (besides soldier housing) was also what's called "the Praetorium" The Praetorium was a judgement hall where hearing were held by the Roman authorities. It resided inside the military base and is where Pilate oversaw the trial of Jesus. The Praetorium would have sat approximately where the Dome of the Rock is. And the reason for that is, there is a natural feature of a stone bolder under this Mosque. That stone bolder made up part of what was called "the Pavement" in the New Testament. "The Pavement" is where Jesus's "trial" was heard.

This stone is believed by Muslims to be the place were Ishmael was to be sacrificed. (The Muslims have the story... rearranged.) The Jews call it "the foundation stone" and they believe it is the corer stone of the temple. This could have been where the saying "Stone builders rejected; has become the corner stone." Came from.

Behind the Praetorium would have been a temple to the Roman god "Mars" (Yes, this is also were we get the planet name from.) Mars was the god of war and was seen as "the father" of the army. Inside this temple would have been a statue of Mars. He may or may not have been clothed and was usually depicted with a spear in his hand and a helmet on his head.

Now the place the Roman authorities heard trials was the Praetorium. The place they executed criminals they called Calvary. The Jews called it Golgotha. "Place of the skull" comes from a Jewish word that loosely means "counting heads". This was the location the Romans took the census of people coming into Jerusalem for these feasts. It was located on the Mount of Olives, somewhere in the proximity of what was the Red Heifer alter.

The Red Heifer Alter was directly east of the temple and the reason for this was because the sacrifice that was supposed to be performed by two different sets of priests (one at the temple and the other at the Red Heifer alter) were to be done simultaneously. And in order for that to happen, the two sets of priests had to be able to see each other.

Now the location Rome crucified people was in that area too; and was close enough that people standing at the crucifixion site would have been able to see the temple. This is an important detail as the gospel accounts say the Centurion and the soldiers witnessed the veil of the temple being torn. The only way they would have been able to see this is if they were east of the temple, which means they would have been on the Mount of Olives, looking west.

So, a little more history there to "fill in the blanks".

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Why was king Herod trying to kill the Messiah?

JohnB445

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ewq1938

I love you three.

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AvgJoe

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Tone

"Whenever Thou humblest me, Thou makest me great."

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eleos1954

God is Love

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Jonaitis

Soli Deo Gloria

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The Righterzpen

Jesus is my Shield in any Desert or Storm

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