I need some advice please

Southernscotty

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And this is the key to understanding where COC people are coming from. We seek to follow the example set for us by the 1st century church in all respects. Nothing more nothing less. If the early church observed communion weekly, so do we. If they did not use instrumental music, neither do we. If they baptized for the remission of sins, so do we. Etc. Etc. It really is as simple as that.
2 Timothy 2:15 Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth.
If you do not separate out the dispensations in the book of Acts, You have a huge problem.
Hebrews 1,2
God, who at sundry times and in divers manners spake in time past unto the fathers by the prophets,
Hath in these last days spoken unto us by his Son, whom he hath appointed heir of all things, by whom also he made the worlds.
Eph 3 The mystery Gospel of Paul
Romans 15:16 That I should be the minister of Jesus Christ to the Gentiles, ministering the gospel of God, that the offering up of the Gentiles might be acceptable, being sanctified by the Holy Ghost.
 
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112358

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2 Timothy 2:15 Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth.
If you do not separate out the dispensations in the book of Acts, You have a huge problem.
Hebrews 1,2
God, who at sundry times and in divers manners spake in time past unto the fathers by the prophets,
Hath in these last days spoken unto us by his Son, whom he hath appointed heir of all things, by whom also he made the worlds.
Eph 3 The mystery Gospel of Paul
Romans 15:16 That I should be the minister of Jesus Christ to the Gentiles, ministering the gospel of God, that the offering up of the Gentiles might be acceptable, being sanctified by the Holy Ghost.
I'm not sure I'm following you Scotty. Could you elaborate on dispensations in the book of Acts? 100% agreed with each of the scriptures quoted, fwiw.
 
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112358

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I've been in many different denominations who say they base their doctrines and practices on the early church....
Yes, many say they do. Many make no such claims. Many make the claim but can't support their doctrines and practices with a shred of scriptural evidence or authority.
 
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Southernscotty

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dispensa.gif
 
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Southernscotty

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I'm not sure I'm following you Scotty. Could you elaborate on dispensations in the book of Acts? 100% agreed with each of the scriptures quoted, fwiw.


Answer:
Dispensationalism is a method of interpreting history that divides God’s work and purposes toward mankind into different periods of time. Usually, there are seven dispensations identified, although some theologians believe there are nine. Others count as few as three or as many as thirty-seven dispensations. In this article, we will limit ourselves to the seven basic dispensations found in Scripture.

The first dispensation is called the Dispensation of Innocence (Genesis 1:28-30 and 2:15-17). This dispensation covered the period of Adam and Eve in the Garden of Eden. In this dispensation God's commands were to (1) replenish the earth with children, (2) subdue the earth, (3) have dominion over the animals, (4) care for the garden, and (5) abstain from eating the fruit from the tree of knowledge of good and evil. God warned of the punishment of physical and spiritual death for disobedience. This dispensation was short-lived and was brought to an end by Adam and Eve’s disobedience in eating the forbidden fruit and their expulsion from the garden.

The second dispensation is called the Dispensation of Conscience, and it lasted about 1,656 years from the time of Adam and Eve’s eviction from the garden until the flood (Genesis 3:8–8:22). This dispensation demonstrates what mankind will do if left to his own will and conscience, which have been tainted by the inherited sin nature. The five major aspects of this dispensation are 1) a curse on the serpent, 2) a change in womanhood and childbearing, 3) a curse on nature, 4) the imposing of difficult work on mankind to produce food, and 5) the promise of Christ as the seed who will bruise the serpent's head (Satan).

The third dispensation is the Dispensation of Human Government, which began in Genesis 8. God had destroyed life on earth with a flood, saving just one family to restart the human race. God made the following promises and commands to Noah and his family:

1. God will not curse the earth again.
2. Noah and family are to replenish the earth with people.
3. They shall have dominion over the animal creation.
4. They are allowed to eat meat.
5. The law of capital punishment is established.
6. There never will be another worldwide flood.
7. The sign of God's promise will be the rainbow.

Noah’s descendants did not scatter and fill the earth as God had commanded, thus failing in their responsibility in this dispensation. About 325 years after the flood, the earth’s inhabitants began building a tower, a great monument to their solidarity and pride (Genesis 11:7-9). God brought the construction to a halt, creating different languages and enforcing His command to fill the earth. The result was the rise of different nations and cultures. From that point on, human governments have been a reality.

The fourth dispensation, called the Dispensation of Promise, started with the call of Abraham, continued through the lives of the patriarchs, and ended with the Exodus of the Jewish people from Egypt, a period of about 430 years. During this dispensation God developed a great nation that He had chosen as His people (Genesis 12:1Exodus 19:25).

The basic promise during the Dispensation of Promise was the Abrahamic Covenant. Here are some of the key points of that unconditional covenant:

1. From Abraham would come a great nation that God would bless with natural and spiritual prosperity.
2. God would make Abraham’s name great.
3. God would bless those that blessed Abraham’s descendants and curse those that cursed them.
4. In Abraham all the families of the earth will be blessed. This is fulfilled in Jesus Christ and His work of salvation.
5. The sign of the covenant is circumcision.
6. This covenant, which was repeated to Isaac and Jacob, is confined to the Hebrew people and the 12 tribes of Israel.

The fifth dispensation is called the Dispensation of Law. It lasted almost 1,500 years, from the Exodus until it was suspended after Jesus Christ’s death. This dispensation will continue during the Millennium, with some modifications. During the Dispensation of Law, God dealt specifically with the Jewish nation through the Mosaic Covenant, or the Law, found in Exodus 19–23. The dispensation involved temple worship directed by priests, with further direction spoken through God’s mouthpieces, the prophets. Eventually, due to the people’s disobedience to the covenant, the tribes of Israel lost the Promised Land and were subjected to bondage.

The sixth dispensation, the one in which we now live, is the Dispensation of Grace. It began with the New Covenant in Christ’s blood (Luke 22:20). This “Age of Grace” or “Church Age” occurs between the 69th and 70th week of Daniel 9:24. It starts with the coming of the Spirit on the Day of Pentecost and ends with the Rapture of the church (1 Thessalonians 4). This dispensation is worldwide and includes both Jews and the Gentiles. Man’s responsibility during the Dispensation of Grace is to believe in Jesus, the Son of God (John 3:18). In this dispensation the Holy Spirit indwells believers as the Comforter (John 14:16-26). This dispensation has lasted for almost 2,000 years, and no one knows when it will end. We do know that it will end with the Rapture of all born-again believers from the earth to go to heaven with Christ. Following the Rapture will be the judgments of God lasting for seven years.

The seventh dispensation is called the Millennial Kingdom of Christ and will last for 1,000 years as Christ Himself rules on earth. This Kingdom will fulfill the prophecy to the Jewish nation that Christ will return and be their King. The only people allowed to enter the Kingdom are the born-again believers from the Age of Grace and righteous survivors of the seven years of tribulation. No unsaved person is allowed access into this kingdom. Satan is bound during the 1,000 years. This period ends with the final judgment (Revelation 20:11-14). The old world is destroyed by fire, and the New Heaven and New Earth of Revelation 21 and 22 will begin
 
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Deborah D

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Yes, many say they do. Many make no such claims. Many make the claim but can't support their doctrines and practices with a shred of scriptural evidence or authority.
My point is how can they all be right when their doctrines and practices vary so much? Do you believe the COC to be the one true church?
 
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A_Thinker

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Yes, many say they do. Many make no such claims. Many make the claim but can't support their doctrines and practices with a shred of scriptural evidence or support.

And this is an example of where the COC and I disagreed.

It's fine to want to mirror the practices of the New Testament church as closely as possible. What's not fine is to condemn other churches who don't mirror to the extent that you do.

For instance, the COC makes use of no instrumental music in their worship services (thought the Old Testament is full of commands by God to make use of such). But the COC will claim that any other church's use of such instruments is contrary to the will of God, just because it is not explicitly stated that the early church did so (never mind that the early church probably didn't want to advertise its meeting locations for fear of persecution).

However, when I pointed out that the church did use a speaker system (unlike the New Testament church), that counter-example was hand-waved away.

The problem is that the church rags on other churches, for instance ... telling me that I couldn't be saved in a Baptist church. That's the real rub ...
 
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Deborah D

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And this is an example of where the COC and I disagreed.

It's fine to want to mirror the practices of the New Testament church as closely as possible. What's not fine is to condemn other churches who don't mirror to the extent that you do.

For instance, the COC makes use of no instrumental music in their worship services (thought the Old Testament is full of commands by God to make use of such). But the COC will claim that any other church;s use of such instruments is contrary to the will of God, just because it is not explicitly stated that the early church did so (never mind that the early church probably didn't want to advertise its meeting locations for fear of persecution).

However, when I pointed out that the church did use a speaker system (unlike the New Testament church), that counter-example was hand-waved away.

The problem is that the church ragged on other churches, for instance ... telling me that I couldn't be saved in a Baptist church. That's the real rub ...
You couldn't be saved in the Baptist Church even though they dunk?
 
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A_Thinker

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My point is how can they all be right when their doctrines and practices vary so much? Do you believe the COC to be the one true church?

Depends on what those doctrines and practices are.

Certainly the seven churches of Revelation had some differences in doctrine and practice. Yet Christ claimed them all for His own.

Not that they didn't all have some work to do ... as do we all ...
 
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Deborah D

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Depends on what those doctrines and practices are.

Certainly the seven churches of Revelation had some differences in doctrine and practice. Yet Christ claimed them all for His own.

Not that they didn't all have some work to do ... as do we all ...

Good point, so there is no one true church (meaning denomination) today that bases ALL of their doctrines and practices on the early church because the early church was a group of churches that had various practices....
 
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112358

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Answer:
Dispensationalism is a method of interpreting history that divides God’s work and purposes toward mankind into different periods of time. Usually, there are seven dispensations identified, although some theologians believe there are nine. Others count as few as three or as many as thirty-seven dispensations. In this article, we will limit ourselves to the seven basic dispensations found in Scripture.

The first dispensation is called the Dispensation of Innocence (Genesis 1:28-30 and 2:15-17). This dispensation covered the period of Adam and Eve in the Garden of Eden. In this dispensation God's commands were to (1) replenish the earth with children, (2) subdue the earth, (3) have dominion over the animals, (4) care for the garden, and (5) abstain from eating the fruit from the tree of knowledge of good and evil. God warned of the punishment of physical and spiritual death for disobedience. This dispensation was short-lived and was brought to an end by Adam and Eve’s disobedience in eating the forbidden fruit and their expulsion from the garden.

The second dispensation is called the Dispensation of Conscience, and it lasted about 1,656 years from the time of Adam and Eve’s eviction from the garden until the flood (Genesis 3:8–8:22). This dispensation demonstrates what mankind will do if left to his own will and conscience, which have been tainted by the inherited sin nature. The five major aspects of this dispensation are 1) a curse on the serpent, 2) a change in womanhood and childbearing, 3) a curse on nature, 4) the imposing of difficult work on mankind to produce food, and 5) the promise of Christ as the seed who will bruise the serpent's head (Satan).

The third dispensation is the Dispensation of Human Government, which began in Genesis 8. God had destroyed life on earth with a flood, saving just one family to restart the human race. God made the following promises and commands to Noah and his family:

1. God will not curse the earth again.
2. Noah and family are to replenish the earth with people.
3. They shall have dominion over the animal creation.
4. They are allowed to eat meat.
5. The law of capital punishment is established.
6. There never will be another worldwide flood.
7. The sign of God's promise will be the rainbow.

Noah’s descendants did not scatter and fill the earth as God had commanded, thus failing in their responsibility in this dispensation. About 325 years after the flood, the earth’s inhabitants began building a tower, a great monument to their solidarity and pride (Genesis 11:7-9). God brought the construction to a halt, creating different languages and enforcing His command to fill the earth. The result was the rise of different nations and cultures. From that point on, human governments have been a reality.

The fourth dispensation, called the Dispensation of Promise, started with the call of Abraham, continued through the lives of the patriarchs, and ended with the Exodus of the Jewish people from Egypt, a period of about 430 years. During this dispensation God developed a great nation that He had chosen as His people (Genesis 12:1Exodus 19:25).

The basic promise during the Dispensation of Promise was the Abrahamic Covenant. Here are some of the key points of that unconditional covenant:

1. From Abraham would come a great nation that God would bless with natural and spiritual prosperity.
2. God would make Abraham’s name great.
3. God would bless those that blessed Abraham’s descendants and curse those that cursed them.
4. In Abraham all the families of the earth will be blessed. This is fulfilled in Jesus Christ and His work of salvation.
5. The sign of the covenant is circumcision.
6. This covenant, which was repeated to Isaac and Jacob, is confined to the Hebrew people and the 12 tribes of Israel.

The fifth dispensation is called the Dispensation of Law. It lasted almost 1,500 years, from the Exodus until it was suspended after Jesus Christ’s death. This dispensation will continue during the Millennium, with some modifications. During the Dispensation of Law, God dealt specifically with the Jewish nation through the Mosaic Covenant, or the Law, found in Exodus 19–23. The dispensation involved temple worship directed by priests, with further direction spoken through God’s mouthpieces, the prophets. Eventually, due to the people’s disobedience to the covenant, the tribes of Israel lost the Promised Land and were subjected to bondage.

The sixth dispensation, the one in which we now live, is the Dispensation of Grace. It began with the New Covenant in Christ’s blood (Luke 22:20). This “Age of Grace” or “Church Age” occurs between the 69th and 70th week of Daniel 9:24. It starts with the coming of the Spirit on the Day of Pentecost and ends with the Rapture of the church (1 Thessalonians 4). This dispensation is worldwide and includes both Jews and the Gentiles. Man’s responsibility during the Dispensation of Grace is to believe in Jesus, the Son of God (John 3:18). In this dispensation the Holy Spirit indwells believers as the Comforter (John 14:16-26). This dispensation has lasted for almost 2,000 years, and no one knows when it will end. We do know that it will end with the Rapture of all born-again believers from the earth to go to heaven with Christ. Following the Rapture will be the judgments of God lasting for seven years.

The seventh dispensation is called the Millennial Kingdom of Christ and will last for 1,000 years as Christ Himself rules on earth. This Kingdom will fulfill the prophecy to the Jewish nation that Christ will return and be their King. The only people allowed to enter the Kingdom are the born-again believers from the Age of Grace and righteous survivors of the seven years of tribulation. No unsaved person is allowed access into this kingdom. Satan is bound during the 1,000 years. This period ends with the final judgment (Revelation 20:11-14). The old world is destroyed by fire, and the New Heaven and New Earth of Revelation 21 and 22 will begin
Ok I'm with you on the fact that there are different dispensations. What is the point specifically with regard to the book of Acts?
 
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A_Thinker

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You couldn't be saved in the Baptist Church even though they dunk?

Nope ... we had a demon piano, called our ministers "Reverend", we only had "Lord's Supper" once per month, etc. ...
 
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Deborah D

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Nope ... we had a demon piano, called our ministers "Reverend", we only had "Lord's Supper" once per month, etc. ...
LOL! I'm glad to know that pianos are possessed. I have one in my living room. :eek:
 
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My advice is to not debate scripture with buddies. So long as y'all have your salvation, that's what's most important. I think more harm than good will come from any debating. Just look how much squabbling, downright nastiness even there is on this forum right here between Christians.

Hope you're doing well otherwise Scotty.
 
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ToBeLoved

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You are correct, I do, and isn't it funny how at times like this is when everyone wants to debate and discuss things and ask hard questions. lol
I know they are trying to help me in their own minds, However I wish to help them, However I am out of ideas as to how too?
We cannot make people see spiritual things, that is what the Holy Spirit does.
Maybe send them a book.
 
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Southernscotty

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Ok I'm with you on the fact that there are different dispensations. What is the point specifically with regard to the book of Acts?
It is a transitional book friend, It is a transitioning from jew to gentile and the apostle Paul was given the message of grace through faith. Even the other apostles realized this as Simon Peter told the council in Acts 11;16,17 that he in fact saw this transition
 
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Southernscotty

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My advice is to not debate scripture with buddies. So long as y'all have your salvation, that's what's most important. I think more harm than good will come from any debating. Just look how much squabbling, downright nastiness even there is on this forum right here between Christians.

Hope you're doing well otherwise Scotty.
Thank you and I usually don't get involved in these types debates but this one has been thrust on me and I am determined to try and understand the difference in our interpretation of scripture.
There has to be something that I am missing that will cause them to see the truth.
I am hanging in there and doing a lot of praying friend. I have so much going on in my life that I can't really think straight anyway. Lol I am looking forward to getting a bunch of stuff behind me and going somewhere on a short vacation. I have never seen the ocean, So I may try to go there and see it? :]
 
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A_Thinker

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I should mention that, though we attended a Baptist church with our parents on weekends, ... we attended the Church of Christ Vacation Bible School just down the street from where we lived.

I wouldn't have been able to tell the difference ... if it hadn't been conveniently pointed out to me ...
 
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Southernscotty

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Ok I'm with you on the fact that there are different dispensations. What is the point specifically with regard to the book of Acts?
See friend, if we do not correctly divide the Word as 2 Timothy says, We cannot understand what God wants of us.
 
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My point is how can they all be right when their doctrines and practices vary so much? Do you believe the COC to be the one true church?
I do believe that there is one true church, as it was claimed in the singular by Jesus Christ, "I will build My church", and as supported by scriptures like Eph 4:4-6 among others. When one obeys the gospel as outlined in the NT, Christ adds them to His church. Any assembly of Christians converted thus and who are practicing the Christian religion as outlined in the NT both in worship and daily living, is a congregation of the one true church.
 
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