The Baptism of the Holy Spirit- can you lose it?

Hillsage

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Hillsage- You said "You are going to be inundated with advice from those who are "ungifted" ....Are you saying that Christians who do not speak in tongues are "ungifted"?
I believe scripture says it and I just believe it. 1 Cor is written to a Charismatic church. Maybe the most Charismatic church ever known. I say that because of what it says in 1Cor 14:23.

It mentions three groups of people. The first group is the church where all speak in tongues. Another group is that of the “unbelievers” or unsaved. But the last group, depending on your particular translation are called “outsiders”/“unlearned”/“ungifted”. IOW we are talking about Christian’s who don’t speak in tongues. Scripture then goes on to declare just exactly what we see today. Non tongue speaking, or “ungifted” Christians and the “unbelievers” of today, both think those of us who do speak in tongues are speaking babbel or jiberish. They might just as well say we “are mad” just as verse 23 says. Would you not agree?

Is it not true that tongues is one of the many gifts God gives His children and tongues is the least of these gifts? Please clarify. This is quite disturbing to me.
I don’t believe your statement is correct. Prayer tongues is not the tongue mentioned in chapter 12, as you want to remind me of, in your next post. What you appear to not know is this; The tongue mentioned in 12 is from the Holy Spirit speaking to man. Prayer tongues are from our spirit speaking to God. 1 Cor 14:14. Being a Charismatic has to do with me speaking in the prayer tongue of my spirit and not because the Holy Spirit may or may not ‘manifest His gift of tongues through whoever He Wills’, as scripture declares 1 Cor 12:11. I hope this helps you to see where I am coming from.
 
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LoveGodsWord

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Q: Can a true believer lose his spiritual baptism into God
the Holy Spirit?

A: NO
1 Cor. 12:13 NASB
13 For by one Spirit we were all baptized into one body (Of Jesus Christ), whether Jews or Greeks, whether slaves or free,
and we were all made to drink of one Spirit.

Tongues are a sign gift for unbelievers.

Q:
Can you lose your salvation?

A:No. OSAS

The true believing Christ-Follower is NOT spiritually JUDGED for his POSITION in Christ.

John 3:18
He who believes in Him is not judged;
he who does not believe has been judged already, because he has not believed in the name of the only begotten (not made) Son of God.

John 5:24...“Truly, truly, I say to you,
he who hears My word, and believes Him who sent Me, has eternal life, and does not come into judgment, but has passed out of death into life.(PAST COMPLETED AORIST TENSE!!)

Only the WORKS, in or out of the will of God, are judged by Jesus on His "bema seat" awards platform.

1 Corinthians 3:10-15 (NIV)...Judgment of the BELIEVER'S WORKS

2 Corinthians 5: 1-15 (NIV) + 1 Corinthians 3:10-15 (NIV) + Romans 14:10b,12 (1-23)

10 For we (BELIEVERS) must all appear before the "judgment (bema = awards platform) seat of Christ",
that each one may receive what is due him for the things done (WORKS) while in the BODY, whether good or bad....

I HAVE BEEN saved from the PRISON of sin / death....SEE: Ephesians 8 for example..."born again from above"...redeemed
I AM BEING saved from the POWER of sin / death....SEE: 1 John 4-5..."overcome the world" ....and
I WILL BE saved from the PRESENCE of sin / death...SEE: New Heavens/Earth/Jerusalem in Revelations

Jesus taught and practiced FORGIVENESS OF SINS to believers...NOT loss of spiritual POSITION
Mark 11: 24-25

Hello Ron,

So in your view someone that is living a life of known unrepentant sin is in a saved state before God? Sorry brother I think your going to be disappointed come judgment day. God's Word does not teach such things.

Hebrews 10:26-27
26, For if we sin willfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins, 27, But a certain fearful looking for of judgment and fiery indignation, which shall devour the adversaries.

Hebrew 6:4-8
4, For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted of the heavenly gift, and were made partakers of the Holy Ghost, 5, And have tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the world to come, 6, If they shall fall away, to renew them again unto repentance; seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and put him to an open shame. 7, For the earth which drinks in the rain that cometh oft upon it, and brings forth herbs meet for them by whom it is dressed, receiveth blessing from God: 8, But that which bares thorns and briers is rejected, and is nigh unto cursing; whose end is to be burned.

Ezekiel 18:20-26,
20, The soul that sins, it shall die. The son shall not bear the iniquity of the father, neither shall the father bear the iniquity of the son: the righteousness of the righteous shall be upon him, and the wickedness of the wicked shall be upon him. 21, But if the wicked will turn from all his sins that he hath committed, and keep all my statutes, and do that which is lawful and right, he shall surely live, he shall not die. 22, All his transgressions that he hath committed, they shall not be mentioned unto him: in his righteousness that he hath done he shall live. 23, Have I any pleasure at all that the wicked should die? saith the Lord GOD: and not that he should return from his ways, and live? 24, But when the righteous turneth away from his righteousness, and commits iniquity, and does according to all the abominations that the wicked man does, shall he live? All his righteousness that he hath done shall not be mentioned: in his trespass that he hath trespassed, and in his sin that he hath sinned, in them shall he die. 25, Yet ye say, The way of the Lord is not equal. Hear now, O house of Israel; Is not my way equal? are not your ways unequal? 26, When a righteous man turneth away from his righteousness, and commits iniquity, and dies in them; for his iniquity that he hath done shall he die.

1 Corinthians 6:9-10
9, Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind, 10, nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revellers, nor extortioners, shall inherit the kingdom of God.

Galatians 5:19-21
19, Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness, 20, Idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies, 21, Envying’s, murders, drunkenness, revelling’s, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God.

2 Peter 4:6
4, For if God spared not the angels that sinned, but cast them down to hell, and delivered them into chains of darkness, to be reserved unto judgment; 5, And spared not the old world, but saved Noah the eighth person, a preacher of righteousness, bringing in the flood upon the world of the ungodly; 6, And turning the cities of Sodom and Gomorrah into ashes condemned them with an overthrow, making them an example unto those that after should live ungodly;

19, While they promise them liberty, they themselves are the servants of corruption: for of whom a man is overcome, of the same is he brought in bondage. 20, For if after they have escaped the pollution's of the world through the knowledge of the Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ, they are again entangled therein, and overcome, the latter end is worse with them than the beginning. 21, For it had been better for them not to have known the way of righteousness, than, after they have known it, to turn from the holy commandment delivered unto them. 22, But it is happened unto them according to the true proverb, The dog is turned to his own vomit again; and the sow that was washed to her wallowing in the mire.

Romans 6:18-23
18, Being then made free from sin, ye became the servants of righteousness. 19, I speak after the manner of men because of the infirmity of your flesh: for as ye have yielded your members servants to uncleanness and to iniquity unto iniquity; even so now yield your members servants to righteousness unto holiness. 20, For when ye were the servants of sin, ye were free from righteousness. 21, What fruit had ye then in those things whereof ye are now ashamed? for the end of those things is death. 22, But now being made free from sin, and become servants to God, ye have your fruit unto holiness, and the end everlasting life. 23, For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.

Romans 8:13,
For if ye live after the flesh, ye shall die: but if ye through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body, ye shall live.

Romans 2:12
For as many as have sinned without law shall also perish without law: and as many as have sinned in the law shall be judged by the law.

James 2:8-12,
8, If ye fulfill the royal law according to the scripture, Thou shalt love thy neighbor as thyself, ye do well: 9, But if ye have respect to persons, ye commit sin, and are convinced of the law as transgressors.10, For whosoever shall keep the whole law, and yet offend in one point, he is guilty of all. 11, For he that said, Do not commit adultery, said also, Do not kill. Now if thou commit no adultery, yet if thou kill, thou art become a transgressor of the law. 12, So speak ye, and so do, as they that shall be judged by the law of liberty.

Jeremiah 31:30
But every one shall die for his own iniquity: every man that eateth the sour grape, his teeth shall be set on edge

2 Corinthians 7:1
Having therefore these promises, dearly beloved, let us cleanse ourselves from all filthiness of the flesh and spirit, perfecting holiness in the fear of God.

Ephesians 4:21-24
21, If so be that ye have heard him, and have been taught by him, as the truth is in Jesus: 22, That ye put off concerning the former conversation the old man, which is corrupt according to the deceitful lusts; 23, And be renewed in the spirit of your mind; 24, And that ye put on the new man, which after God is created in righteousness and true holiness.

1 Thessalonians 4:7
For God hath not called us unto uncleanness, but unto holiness.

Hebrews 12:14
Follow peace with all men, and holiness, without which no man shall see the Lord

1 Peter 1:15-16
But as he which hath called you is holy, so be ye holy in all manner of conversation;
Because it is written, Be ye holy; for I am holy.

There are many more scriptures but you get the point. You can indeed lose your salvation if you choose to turn away from God. It is not too late to repent and turn back to God if you do so with all your heart.
 
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Dave L

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I am new to this forum and wasn’t sure where to post this. I was baptized in the Holy Spirit ten years ago. I have been speaking in tongues since then, but since May after a suicide attempt, and it got worse in July after I lied about something, now when I try and speak in tongues they are stopping. It’s made me question my salvation (I don’t believe you have to speak in tongues to be saved, I just don’t understand why they are stopping all the sudden after ten years, in which I made just as many mistakes as now) I emailed my pastor about it but I haven’t gotten a response yet. Can anyone give some thoughts on this? I’m super depressed and scared because of it. I’m concerned it is because of sin in my life and that I’ve lost my salvation. Can you lose the baptism of the Holy Spirit? Can you lose your salvation?
Look at all the Christians who do not speak in tongues. Some of us believe tongues are not genuine today and should be avoided. Love in your heart proves you have the Holy Spirit Baptism. And as you love others, the fullness of the Spirit returns.
 
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Nancy Ann Perrine

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I am new to this forum and wasn’t sure where to post this. I was baptized in the Holy Spirit ten years ago. I have been speaking in tongues since then, but since May after a suicide attempt, and it got worse in July after I lied about something, now when I try and speak in tongues they are stopping. It’s made me question my salvation (I don’t believe you have to speak in tongues to be saved, I just don’t understand why they are stopping all the sudden after ten years, in which I made just as many mistakes as now) I emailed my pastor about it but I haven’t gotten a response yet. Can anyone give some thoughts on this? I’m super depressed and scared because of it. I’m concerned it is because of sin in my life and that I’ve lost my salvation. Can you lose the baptism of the Holy Spirit? Can you lose your salvation?
I believe in real repentance. Pray to God, he knows we are sinners.
 
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Maria Billingsley

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Hillsage- Just to clarify, I am a Charismatic. I believe the Holy Spirit works today in the same way He did in the beginning. I spoke in tongues upon conversion at an AOG congregation in the early 80's. I knew nothing about tongues, it just happened. So you are not talking to an "ungifted" or "outsider" as you describe. When I pray, I pray with my understanding. When I sing, I sing with my understanding and when I pray with others, I pray so they can understand me. This is the true meaning of 1 Corinthians 14:22-25.


22 Therefore tongues are for a sign, not to those who believe but to unbelievers; but prophesying is not for unbelievers but for those who believe. 23 Therefore if the whole church comes together in one place, and all speak with tongues, and there come in those who are uninformed or unbelievers, will they not say that you are out of your mind? 24 But if all prophesy, and an unbeliever or an uninformed person comes in, he is convinced by all, he is convicted by all. 25 And thus the secrets of his heart are revealed; and so, falling down on his face, he will worship God and report that God is truly among you.

I unfortunately see in you a boasting that does not serve the Kingdom of God well. I do hope and pray that God will work in your life so that unity among His Bride becomes more important than edifying yourself.
Blessings
 
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YeshuaFan

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I am new to this forum and wasn’t sure where to post this. I was baptized in the Holy Spirit ten years ago. I have been speaking in tongues since then, but since May after a suicide attempt, and it got worse in July after I lied about something, now when I try and speak in tongues they are stopping. It’s made me question my salvation (I don’t believe you have to speak in tongues to be saved, I just don’t understand why they are stopping all the sudden after ten years, in which I made just as many mistakes as now) I emailed my pastor about it but I haven’t gotten a response yet. Can anyone give some thoughts on this? I’m super depressed and scared because of it. I’m concerned it is because of sin in my life and that I’ve lost my salvation. Can you lose the baptism of the Holy Spirit? Can you lose your salvation?
The scriptures teach that all who are saved have been baptized by the Holy Spirit into the Body of Christ, and He seals us until Jesus glorifies us at time of the Second Coming event!
 
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Hillsage

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Hillsage- Just to clarify, I am a Charismatic. I believe the Holy Spirit works today in the same way He did in the beginning. I spoke in tongues upon conversion at an AOG congregation in the early 80's. I knew nothing about tongues, it just happened. So you are not talking to an "ungifted" or "outsider" as you describe. When I pray, I pray with my understanding. When I sing, I sing with my understanding and when I pray with others, I pray so they can understand me. This is the true meaning of 1 Corinthians 14:22-25.
I never needed your “clarification”, as I never thought you weren’t Spirit baptized with the evidence of speaking in tongues. Therefore I wasn’t referring to you concerning what I shared concerning scripture talking about those who are “ungifted” Christians. I’m happy for you that you received in “the early 80s.” Though that testimony of yours is about 10 years later than mine. So I do hope your reference wasn’t meant to impress me. If it was then you may have been thinking more highly of yourself than you ought.

unfortunately see in you a boasting that does not serve the Kingdom of God well. I do hope and pray that God will work in your life so that unity among His Bride becomes more important than edifying yourself.
Blessings
Yes that is an unfortunate observation for you. Those who make such judgements often do so because they aren’t spiritually discerning the difference between arrogance and assurance. So I am more than willing to await HIS judgment of your judgment of me. ;)
 
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Maria Billingsley

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Hillsage-I call myself a Christian and not a Charismatic for a reason. Perfectly displayed here in our interaction is division. We are of one Body no matter which gift God gives us.
Blessings
 
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Blade

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I use to go this bible study. Where they would very kindly lovingly ask me sometimes.. would I like the Holy Spirit. I said yes one night. They read the bible about where it talked about the holy Spirit. Then asked me again. I said yes. They prayed then stopped and said.. THATS IT. You got it. See they took GOD at His word. He said ASK and He will give.. I got up feeling NOTHING what so ever. NO ONE said a word..

I go to sit down..not thinking about anything and it just came out. ALL that to say..since that day.. I have sinned wow wow so much.. FATHER forigive me :) said got made at the Father and the sweet sweet Holy Spirit..

KNOW that your FATHER and the sweet sweet Holy Spirit is not like man. Your Father when He gives HE does NOT take it back. You still have it. just the enemy is lying to you. Well GOD would NEVER does not EVER use fear. So..no matter what it looks like sounds like feels like.. you are just as filed as you were..

So..rejoice and ..no just rejoice and dont give it another thought. So..for you.. what you will find is.. you will just STOP one day.. I have been praying in tongues and you never noticed anything stopping you :)
 
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Hillsage

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Hillsage-I call myself a Christian and not a Charismatic for a reason.
Perfectly displayed here in our interaction is division. We are of one Body no matter which gift God gives us.
Blessings
Good for you. But I f you think that gesture will serve you as you think, here, you simply are thinking like a 39 posts newby IMO. And again, as to ‘how well you are thinking of yourself’ here, I too started out as “Christian” ‘many years back’ when I too was a newby.
Hillsage-I call myself a Christian and not a Charismatic for a reason.
As do I.

[/quote ]Perfectly displayed here in our interaction is division. We are of one Body no matter which gift God gives us.
Blessings
I’m afraid the division of us being one body is yours, not mine. Good luck here, our interaction leads me to believe you’ll be gone in three months.
 
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AllDayFaith

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Can you lose the baptism of the Holy Spirit? Can you lose your salvation?

No you cannot lose your salvation, but it just seems that you have lost some of the favor that God was showing you by letting you speak in tongues. I've never spoke in tongues so I don't know what that is like.
 
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Oldmantook

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Romans 8:38-39 For I am persuaded, that neither death, nor life, nor angels, nor principalities, nor powers, nor things present, nor things to come, Nor height, nor depth, nor any other creature, shall be able to separate us from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord.
Notice that this list does not mention sin. That is because sin does separate us from the love of God.
 
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Oldmantook

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No you cannot lose your salvation, but it just seems that you have lost some of the favor that God was showing you by letting you speak in tongues. I've never spoke in tongues so I don't know what that is like.
So a believer who denies the faith or keeps sinning without repentance is still saved?
 
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Hillsage

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Hillsage- You said "you'll be gone in three months"
Are you saying I will die in three months? Is this a prophesy?
No, not a prophesy, but like I said; "based upon our 'interaction here'." Just been here long enough Maria to see a lot of people come and go. So, definitely more of an 'impression', than a "Thus saith the Lord". And certainly not talking about dying.
 
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Hillsage

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No you cannot lose your salvation, but it just seems that you have lost some of the favor that God was showing you by letting you speak in tongues. I've never spoke in tongues so I don't know what that is like.
Since you've never spoke in tongues let me clarify some things, from the perspective of one who does. God doesn't really 'let you speak in tongues'. Not if we're talking about, prayer tongues, which is what ThriftyPassenger was speaking of in the OP. And 'prayer tongues' from your spirit is initiated by you not God. The supernatural of this 'heavenly or angelic or spiritual language' is not in the speaking, but in the vocabulary that comes out, as it bypasses the understanding of your 'English' speaking soul (or Whatever languages of man you've learned). Prayer tongues is vocalized just like speech from my soul (mind), a speech which is initiated by me. In the same way, so is the speech that is initiated by my body. What do I mean 'speech from my body'? Well, if I was 'mute' I could still 'sign' with someone who understood 'signing'. And in the same way, as a Charismatic, even now I still speak to God with my spirit, soul and body. But my body 'signing' is limited to 'raising the hand', 'bowing the knee' and 'laying prostrate on my face' before the Lord. I hope this gives you a better view, coming from one whose experience differs from yours.
 
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Maria Billingsley

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Alldayfaith- Speaking in tongues is just one of the gifts that God gives a believer. He does not give anyone all the gifts. There are a few denominations that claim if you do not speak in tongues you do not have the Holy Spirit. Since there is no clear scriptural teaching on this, it has sewn division between the have's and the have not's, as you mentioned in your post.... " lost some of the favor that God was showing you by letting you speak in tongues". Unfortunately, the pressure of this sign has laid a path for many false forms of this gift, thus inviting other forms of manifestations not displayed in scripture.

In conclusion, we should focus on the fruits of the Spirit rather than the gifts as this is what we will be judged on in the end.

1 Corinthians 13:1-3
Though I speak with the tongues of men and of angels, and have not love, I am become as sounding brass, or a clanging cymbal.And though I have the gift of prophecy, and understand all mysteries, and all knowledge; and though I have all faith, so that I could remove mountains, and have not love, I am nothing.And though I bestow all my goods to feed the poor, and though I give my body to be burned, and have not love, it profits me nothing.


Blessings
 
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Southernscotty

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Notice that this list does not mention sin. That is because sin does separate us from the love of God.
Of course sin separates us from God and it cheats us out of a blessing here until we repent . But it doesn't steal away our salvation because we are sealed with the Holy Spirit.
 
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Oldmantook

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Of course sin separates us from God and it cheats us out of a blessing here until we repent . But it doesn't steal away our salvation because we are sealed with the Holy Spirit.
No where in Scripture is the sealing of the Spirit implied to mean that the seal cannot be broken. We remain sealed as long as we lead obedient lives. You presume that a believer repents. What if a believer does not repent? Still sealed? Still saved? I think not. Paul warned us of such presumption when he warned the brethren living in Rome. "For if you live according to the flesh, you will die; but if by the Spirit you put to death the misdeeds of the body, you will live." Rom 8:13
 
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Southernscotty

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No where in Scripture is the sealing of the Spirit implied to mean that the seal cannot be broken. We remain sealed as long as we lead obedient lives. You presume that a believer repents. What if a believer does not repent? Still sealed? Still saved? I think not. Paul warned us of such presumption when he warned the brethren living in Rome. "For if you live according to the flesh, you will die; but if by the Spirit you put to death the misdeeds of the body, you will live." Rom 8:13
Nope, You do not become sealed with the Holy Spirit unless you repent and truly accept him. The seal cannot be broken by anyone other than the King or his representative if you will look at OT history.
No one can pluck them from His hand and since God cannot lie, He is held to His Word, I give them eternal life and they should not perish but have eternal life, Eternal life is eternal.
You can't cheapen the Blood of Jesus Christ as it is powerful and washes one completely and seals them.
My sheep hear my voice John 10 27-29, Romans 8:30, Eph 1:13-14, John 3:3, Titus 3:5
These just a fast few scriptures
 
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