Before Adam?

The Bible doesn't give a definite answer as to whether other people existed. Part of the issue is how you define the non-biblical term "person." There are many Christians who believe Adam was not the very first hominid to exist on the earth, but rather that Adam was the first to "have a soul." I personally prefer to think (more biblically, esp. WRT the OT) that a human being is a soul, rather than that a human being has a soul.

Different Christians treat Genesis differently WRT its empiricity (I don't know if that's really a word, but I mean whether it is true in an empirical sense, in comparison to a theological or poetic sense). How tolerant you are of different views on this question will necessarily affect your approach to the OP question.

There are scriptures in Job (another poetic book) that imply that angels were created before humans, but I am not aware of any scripture that gives a chronology of creation other than that contained in Genesis 1-2.

IMHO, it seems like God didn't think it important to reveal to us a definitive answer to this question.

On the contrary, the Bible is very specific. It declares Adam the first man:

1 Corinthians 15:45 And so it is written, The first man Adam was made a living soul; the last Adam was made a quickening spirit. 46 Howbeit that was not first which is spiritual, but that which is natural; and afterward that which is spiritual. 47 The first man is of the earth, earthy: the second man is the Lord from heaven.

And the Bible mentions those who pre-existed the material realm:

Job 38:4 Where wast thou when I laid the foundations of the earth? declare, if thou hast understanding. 5 Who hath laid the measures thereof, if thou knowest? or who hath stretched the line upon it? 6 Whereupon are the foundations thereof fastened? or who laid the corner stone thereof; 7 When the morning stars (plural) sang together, and all the sons of God shouted for joy?

Revelation 13:8 And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world.

Indicates a prehistoric (of the material realm, that is) determination of what would be in this realm before it was created.

It is my opinion (and that's all it is) based on the implications of scripture that the physical realm was created for the purpose of glorifying God in the spirit realm. That prior to the physical realm Lucifer and follwers rebelled (Ezekiel 28 / Isaiah 14). And they were quite probably judged. But before the sentence was carried out (remember hell was created for Satan and his angels {Matthew 25:41}), perhaps an accusation was leveled at the Almighty being unjust. And under no obligation whatsoever, he set out to prove himself as more than fair... enter Genesis 1:1...

Gen 3:20 And Adam called his wife's name Eve; because she was the mother of all living.

This says (to me) that there was no person born that didn't come from Eve.

Mat 19:4 And he answered and said unto them, Have ye not read, that he which made them at the beginning made them male and female,

This tells me that Adam and Eve were in the beginning (the first).

If we doubt Genesis we have to doubt the rest of the Book, and then what's the point?

The heavens were created first and then the earth thats what God wrote in His word so that's the way it is. The heavens were created in one day the earth took 6.

Depends again on your view of Genesis. The Gap Theory contends that there was nations before Adam.

We read in Gen 1:2 "And the earth was without form, and void; and darkness was upon the face of deep"

The Word "void" - bohuw; from an unused root (meaning to be empty); a vacuity, i.e. (superficially) an undistinguishable RUIN :- emptiness, void

With out form: from an unused root meaning to lie waste; a desolation (of surface), i.e. desert; figurative a worthless thing; adverbial in vain :- confusion, empty place, without form, nothing, vain, waste, wilderness

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Now that doesn't sound like something God would make. In the beginning God created the heavens and earth. What happened to cause it to become waste? Did God make it waste? Not if we believe scripture.

Isa 45:18 "For thus saith the Lord that created the heavens; God himself that formed the earth and made it; he hath established it, He created it NOT in vain, he formed it to be INHABITED;"

Doesn't sound like the earth we are looking at in Gen 1:2

Anyways; I dont have time to go into the whole Gap Theory! To make it short, the earth was created perfect, Lucifer rebelled, the nations and the earth was laid to waste. Christ even seen Lucifer fall from the sky as stated in the Gospels. Isaiah talks about this fall.

Isa 14:12-14 "how art thou fallen from heaven, O Lucifer, son of the morning! how art thou cut down to the ground, whcih didst weaken THE NATIONS! For thou hast said in thine heart, I will ascend into heaven, I wil exalt my throne above the stars of God; I wil sit also upon teh mount of the congregation, in the sides of the north: I will ascend abvoe the heights of the clouds; I will be like the most High"

Gen 1:2 goes on to talk about the re-creation of the world to its 2'nd sinless era. Adam fell, earth again fell into sin. One day it will again be perfect as it was ment to be.

I'm gonna have a go at this....here's my initial views:

the devil existed before Adam was created. as he was cast out of heaven before God made Adam. so i do believe that Angels existed before the creation of the world.

Also John1:1 - in the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God... I believe that Jesus was in the beginning (i imagine that most people believe that). but i also believe that he was also man as well as God, as it says somewhere just after the sin of Adama and Eve that they heard God "walking" in the garden. i have always believed this to be Christ as divine man walking in the garden. but this may not be that he was man before creation, but i do believe that he was man at that particular time of the fall.

RadBrad said:

Heres an interesting question to look into: Before Adam, did angels or other people exist?

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I don't know about angels, but certainly human beings did not exist before Adam, "And so it is written, The first man Adam was made a living soul; the last Adam was made a quickening spirit." (1 Cor 15:45)

2 Tim 3:16-17
16 All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:
17 That the man of God may be perfect, throughly furnished unto all good works.
2 Pet 1:20
20 Knowing this first, that no prophecy of the scripture is of any private interpretation.
2 Sam 14:14
14 For we must needs die, and are as water spilt on the ground, which cannot be gathered up again; neither doth God respect any person: yet doth he devise means, that his banished be not expelled from him.
Job 37:24
24 Men do therefore fear him: he respecteth not any that are wise of heart.

God created heaven first day, and there is no record of have many days God walked with Adan, and Eve in the garden before they blew it but we do know they blew it after satan did. The gap theory is necessary for the egoists who like satan think they are equal to God in knowing about things. Hopefuly some day they will understand what God means when He says lean not to your own understanding, and that before it's too late.

Where do Leviathan and Behemoth fit into this?

Maybe I should make a thread about biblical monsters?

Where would it go?

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johnd said:

1 Corinthians 15:45 And so it is written, The first man Adam was made a living soul; the last Adam was made a quickening spirit. 46 Howbeit that was not first which is spiritual, but that which is natural; and afterward that which is spiritual. 47 The first man is of the earth, earthy: the second man is the Lord from heaven.

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The 'first man' in this passage is not to be read literaly. Notice that 'the first man' is contrasted with 'the second man'. If we are trying to make a literal connection between these men and Genesis, then we must conclude that Cain, the second man, is the Lord from Heaven.

perhaps it means man is first physical and then becomes ethereal after the corporeal form is no longer able to function?

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RadBrad said:

Heres an interesting question to look into: Before Adam, did angels or other people exist? i want to come up with a good biblical answer by the next discipleship meeting my friends and me are having. It would be awesome to hear other people's answers on this, and would help me out. So what do you all think?

Click to expand...

Adam was the first man to be created in God's image. There were humanoids existing in a prior creation, but they were not created in God's image. In Jeremiah 4, he repeats some of the same words used for utter ruin and destruction which also appear in Genesis 1:2. He speaks of a great judgment that has not taken place in the current history of man. For, man would have ceased to exist if that were the case. The word appearing as "people" is a generic term for humanoids. I heard this factor taught by a Harvard Professor (Stan Ashby) of Ancient Languages. I heard this on a taped message that he gave in a class at a Bible College.

Words with the *, appear in Genesis 1:2

"23 I looked at the earth,
and it was *formless and *empty; (Heb = Tohu wa Bohu > utter destruction and chaotic havoc)
and at the heavens,
and their light was gone. (condition found in Genesis 1:2)
24 I looked at the mountains,
and they were quaking;
all the hills were swaying.
25 I looked, and there were no people; (Hebrew generic term for humanoids)
every bird in the sky had flown away.
26 I looked, and the fruitful land was a desert;
all its towns lay in ruins
before the LORD , before his fierce anger. "

Jeremiah was speaking of the power of God's ability to judge in the past that he was made able to see in his prophetic trance. At that time, Israel was involved with horrific Satanic cultic activity. They were about to be severly judged by God. While in his prophetic muse, Jeremiah peers back into prehistoric times. Moses was able to do the same. That is how he was able to see the Genesis creation account. That is how Job was able to see the angels celebrating at the creation of the earth! The prophetic spirit not only predicted things of the future, they also saw things that preceded known history!

Jeremiah in speaking of God's power to judge Israel's rebellion, had spoke of God's power's ability to do so, with this vision of a previous world's destruction of all humanoids and animals. (That is where we get out dinosaur fossils from and the "so called" cave men bones.)

Anything brought out into the open like this must be attacked. After all. If it were clearly understood. Many more believers would be able to begin to understand the entire plan of God, and what the angels are doing at this time in God's vindication of judging Satan and his angels to Hell.

Remember! Hell was not created for man. It was created for Satan and his angels! Hell was created before man was created. There is a lot more going on than meets the eye. And, those who are the cynics and nay sayers, sad to say, want to keep it that way.

Matthew 25:41 niv

"Then he will say to those on his left, 'Depart from me, you who are cursed, into the eternal fire prepared for the devil and his angels."

The lake of Fire was not prepared originally for man. When it was prepared there were only angels. Just as Adam was given dominion over this creation, Satan was given dominion over the prior creation. There were humanoids in that creation, but they had not been created in the image of God. Adam was the first man in God's image (Adam is the word used for man).

This is always a bit much for those seeing it the first time, so I will stop here for now...

Grace and peace, GeneZ

The lake of Fire was not prepared originally for man. When it was prepared there were only angels. Just as Adam was given dominion over this creation, Satan was given dominion over the prior creation. There were humanoids in that creation, but they had not been created in the image of God. Adam was the first man in God's image (Adam is the word used for man).

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When you say "not created in the image of God" are you inferring they were created in another image or simply stating they were no different to animals but with a humanoid appearance?

I ask because the Jeremiah passage you quoted talked about "all it's towns lay in ruins". (v.26)

Which suggests "intelligent" beings of some description. Of course it doesn't necessarily mean towns in "bricks and mortar" complexes I guess.

Being curious.

sawdust said:

When you say "not created in the image of God" are you inferring they were created in another image or simply stating they were no different to animals but with a humanoid appearance?

I ask because the Jeremiah passage you quoted talked about "all it's towns lay in ruins". (v.26)

Which suggests "intelligent" beings of some description. Of course it doesn't necessarily mean towns in "bricks and mortar" complexes I guess.

Being curious.

Click to expand...

We can only guess. We see birds having nests. Bears have dens, etc. Ants have intricate colonies. Bees have complex hives. These humanoids were (my guess) the highest form of intelligent creature, had cities.

Professor Stan Ashby, said that he saw in the Hebrew where it says... "Let us make man in our image, that it could indicate that God was saying, " this time it was now God's turn to do the job." In other words, " You angels had your chance and blew it. Now, Let us make man in our image." He believed (he said never to get dogmatic about this) that it was possible that God had assigned the angels to be messengers to bring about the proper growth in these humanoids, and be used by God to show them how to become in God's image. He had created into this humanoids a very high level to imitate what they were shown. God wanted the angels to pass along their ability to reflect God. (God wished to teach the angels more about Himself via this process, as well). Today we even hear the term, "monkey see, monkey do!" Take that ability in a creature and place it on a very high level, and his theory may be possible.

This may sound like UFO theory stuff , so I usually keep clear of it. But, Stan Ashby said that the Hebrew could appear to be saying that.

"Now, let us make man in our image" (since you angels failed). But, like he said. Never to be dogmatic about this. Its just a possible explanation. Yet, we find cavemen skeletons that appear removed in many ways from the intelligent lifeform we now are. Professor Ashby believed that the hunched over appearance of these creatures was the result of Satan's oppressiveness in his rulership.

Since these humanoids were creatures not possessing any more everlasting life in their souls than the rest of the animal kingdom, that when God judged Satan and his angels rebelliousness, God simply wiped out this entire creation. Then replaced it with something more advanced. US!

I never heard any other scholar give this theory. But, apparently, it is one that has stuck. I call it my small book of spiritual science fiction. This one we will only know after being in Heaven. But, this we can know. These humanoids were highly advanced and had cities. Looking at how a bee hive is set up, I see no problem seeing God creating a creature with such abilities.

I try to stay away from such speculation. But, since I made it clear it is only speculation... that's my answer.

Grace and peace, GeneZ

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http://www.christiananswers.net

RadBrad said:

Heres an interesting question to look into: Before Adam, did angels or other people exist? i want to come up with a good biblical answer by the next discipleship meeting my friends and me are having. It would be awesome to hear other people's answers on this, and would help me out. So what do you all think?

Click to expand...

There's not a whole lot of basis for it other than conjecture. There is a Scriptural basis for a gap between earth's creation and the population of earth. But, PreAdamite man is pure conjecture based on trying to guess what the purpose of this gap was. I am not saying this from an anti-Gap stance. I thnk this theory is the best one and it accomodates the hard scientific finds that some misguided people turned into the theory of evolution.

Curt said:

God created heaven first day, and there is no record of have many days God walked with Adan, and Eve in the garden before they blew it but we do know they blew it after satan did.

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What we do know is that Cain was born after the fall. We also know that Seth was born when Adam was 130 years old. This puts the time that God walked with Adam and Eve somewhere between 2 days and (128 years).