Is incest always immoral?

Is incest always immoral?

  • Yes

    Votes: 13 68.4%
  • No

    Votes: 6 31.6%

  • Total voters
    19

Apex

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I'm not sure what you mean by divine law.
Adam and Eve had many sons and daughters.
There is no mention of other people for the kids to get to know.

I just mean what God desires from us—behavior wise. Concerning Adam and Eve, I believe their children had incestuous marriages. I also believe God approved of their behavior.
 
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RGW00

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This question can be broken down into three parts:

1. Was incest immoral before the Mosaic Law?
2. Was incest immoral under the Mosaic Law?
3. Is incest immoral under the New Covenant?
It was never immoral until God said in the Old Testament at a certain point that it was immoral (AKA Mosaic Law)
 
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buzuxi02

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Consanguinity has always been regulated within certain degrees of kin. Government sanctiona and revise's within how many degrees based on population concerns.
Smaller insular groups are more likely to intermarry with 2nd cousins such as remote tribes living in jungles, amish, and royal families of old. The Rothschild women are known to seduce their male relatives as the trusts and all that money can only be passed down to the male heirs.
Incest between parent and biological child has always been forbidden. this latter case is the easiest to condemn as it's clear that a man leaves his parents to be joined to his wife, not joins in with his mother. Siblings incest has always been condemned with the only exception being the creation stories of the very first human generation.
 
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RDKirk

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I disagree. Why would God command us to love one another if we could not respond in a concrete way? John proclaims that "God is love". To say love is indeterminable means we can't know God.

I think your confusion comes from the idea that love is not an action. Love is a motive or intention. It is the quality of an action. Love is not situational, actions are.

I have no confusion. I said "love" is no more determinable than the will of God, and the will of God is no less determinable than love.

You are the one who claims the will of God can't be determined.

Love is, indeed, action. Jesus said explicitly:

If you love me, keep my commands.

Therefore, love is the same thing as doing the will of God.

If--as you assert--it's impossible to determine the will of God for our actions, then it's impossible to love as God wants us to love.

But I quoted Romans 12 to point out that it is possible to know the will of God.
 
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RDKirk

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So, you believe Christians are under the Mosaic Law?

What "law" do you think they are under (presuming they're even Christians)?

What does the law of love--which you've claimed to follow--say they should do?

What if they have children?
 
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SkyWriting

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I'd prefer not to go down the semantic rabbit hole.

Do you think an adult Christian man living in Portugal (where incest is legal) can marry his adult Christian sister? And for the sake of argument, lets say she is sterile and both are mentally stable.

It's rather unfair that such a sister is wasted on the brother given that they
are so close, being together since birth. Marriage is not supposed to be so easy
that you get to marry in your family. God would give such guidelines as" Marry
your sister as she is so fair."
 
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AlexDTX

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I'd prefer not to go down the semantic rabbit hole.

Do you think an adult Christian man living in Portugal (where incest is legal) can marry his adult Christian sister? And for the sake of argument, lets say she is sterile and both are mentally stable.
You assume that because I pointed out the semantics that I endorsed incest. I do not, and prefer not to get into the argument.
 
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Apex

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It was forbidden because our DNA is decrassing and many bad things can happen if you have child with somebody in your family now .

This argument has been made a few times already. Can you show me with Scripture that the reason God prohibited most incestuous relationships under the Mosaic Law was due to concerns about birth defects? Sounds like pure speculation to me.
 
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Apex

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I have no confusion. I said "love" is no more determinable than the will of God, and the will of God is no less determinable than love.

You are the one who claims the will of God can't be determined.

Love is, indeed, action. Jesus said explicitly:

If you love me, keep my commands.

Therefore, love is the same thing as doing the will of God.

If--as you assert--it's impossible to determine the will of God for our actions, then it's impossible to love as God wants us to love.

But I quoted Romans 12 to point out that it is possible to know the will of God.

If love was an action, how could God be love? "Apage" love isn't even a feeling. Allow me to explain.

Love, as set forth by Jesus, is the keynote of the new kingdom. With the exception of the word 'life' - 'love' is the most important abstract term in the whole of Scripture. God's love, the basis for His dealing with humans in the OT, climaxes in the NT in the incarnation and death of Jesus Christ. It is the key word in the Christian summary of biblical revelation (Matthew 22:37; John 3:16; Romans 13:9; Galatians 5:14; James 2:8;1 John 3:23).

Love is selfless. Jesus is the premier example of how to love. Paul's description of love in action includes liberality, acts of mercy, hospitality, avoidance of revenge, sympathy, rejoicing with others, sharing of need, and edifying others; the list is almost endless. More generally, love is revealed as a quality of activity and of thinking. In brief, love does no harm.

Love is, for Paul, "the law of Christ," supreme and sufficient (Galatians 5:14; Galatians 6:2), and Paul neatly defines what alone avails in Christianity as "faith working through love" (Galatians 5:6). He insists that the supreme manifestation of the Spirit that Christians should covet is "the more excellent way" of love (1 Corinthians 12:27 - 13:13; Romans 5:5; Galatians 5:22). Here, too, he contrasts love with five other expressions of religious zeal much prized at Corinth in order to show that each is profitless without love (1 Corinthians 13:1-3). He ends the chapter by comparing love with faith and hope, the other enduring elements of religious experience, and declares love to be the greatest.

When I use the definition above for "love", I believe all loving acts are moral acts. I like to ask the question, will this action harm my relationship with either God or my neighbor?
 
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Apex

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Love is, indeed, action. Jesus said explicitly:

If you love me, keep my commands.

Therefore, love is the same thing as doing the will of God.

Along with my above definition of love.

John specifically spells out what Jesus' commandments are:

1 John 3:21-24
Beloved, if our heart does not condemn us, we have confidence before God; and whatever we ask we receive from him, because we keep his commandments and do what pleases him. And this is his commandment, that we believe in the name of his Son Jesus Christ and love one another, just as he has commanded us. Whoever keeps his commandments abides in God, and God in him. And by this we know that he abides in us, by the Spirit whom he has given us.
 
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samir

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This question can be broken down into three parts:

1. Was incest immoral before the Mosaic Law?
2. Was incest immoral under the Mosaic Law?
3. Is incest immoral under the New Covenant?

Your pool question is in the present tense so it only addresses #3. The answer to that is Yes. To ask about all 3 you should ask, "Has incest always been immoral?" The answer to that is obviously No as it was the only way for the earliest people to reproduce. I've found that not understanding basic grammar (such as verb tenses) is one reason some peopole are unable to self-interpret scripture.
 
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Apex

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Your pool question is in the present tense so it only addresses #3. The answer to that is Yes. To ask about all 3 you should ask, "Has incest always been immoral?" The answer to that is obviously No as it was the only way for the earliest people to reproduce. I've found that not understanding basic grammar (such as verb tenses) is one reason some peopole are unable to self-interpret scripture.

My question is fine. I'm referring to incest within three contexts: before the Mosaic Law, under the Mosaic Law, and under the New Covenant. So, is incest always immoral or does the context in which it occurs change this?
 
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samir

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My question is fine. I'm referring to incest within three contexts: before the Mosaic Law, under the Mosaic Law, and under the New Covenant. So, is incest always immoral or does the context in which it occurs change this?

Is incest always immoral? Yes, it's always immoral.
Was incest immoral before the Mosaic Law? No, not always.
 
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Cuddles333

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I'm not sure if I understand your position, but it sounds like you think Leviticus 18 is addressed to priests only. I did a quick word study on קרב and you are right that it can mean "to present as an act of worship, often in the form of a sacrifice". However, this isn't true in all contexts. For example, in Genesis 37:18 it just means "to move near". And in Deuteronomy 22:14, it has the meaning of sexual advance. However, I'd be interested in hearing you flesh out your interpretation of this passage further.
Since Leviticus chapters 18 & 20 are not referring to the Israelite people's private sexual sins, nor the Levitical Priests private sexual sins (since the end of these chapters say that the Israelites did not commit such) then that leaves just one class of 'worship leaders' left.
 
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Apex

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Since Leviticus chapters 18 & 20 are not referring to the Israelite people's private sexual sins, nor the Levitical Priests private sexual sins (since the end of these chapters say that the Israelites did not commit such) then that leaves just one class of 'worship leaders' left.

I'm sorry, but this still doesn't clear things up for me. Can you identify these "worship leaders"? It's best to be explicit in these types of discussions to prevent confusion.

Leviticus 18:1
Then the LORD spoke to Moses, saying, "Speak to the children of Israel, and say to them:

Leviticus 18:6
None of you shall approach anyone who is near of kin to him, to uncover his nakedness: I am the LORD.

Are you saying the "you" in verse 6 is not referring to the "children of Israel" in verse 1?
 
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