So, the latest allegations against Trump are pretty bad...

KWCrazy · Oct 25, 2016

rambot said:
It looks like someone did tell that to Juanita Broaddrick. In fact, it looks like many people tried to tell her "Hey! Bill Clinton raped you right?

These three stages (of adjustment) are:

1. Shock: During this phase the victim may suffer from acute anxiety, fear, and guilt, and observable reactions can vary from hysteria to numbness.

2. Denial: During this stage the victim attempts to "forget the whole thing." She will probably discuss the incident very little, will deny any strong feelings of hurt or anger, and will attempt to return to her daily routine.

3. Integration: Despite attempts to return to "business as usual," many rape victims realize that the attack has played a more important role in their lives than they had realized. Recurring nightmares, uneasiness about the environment and difficulties with personal relationships often continues to plague them. Prolonged effects of the attack may force a woman into a healthy reevaluation of the incident and it's impact on her life. source

So most rape victims deny it before coming to deal with it.

But... what did she have to fear?

rambot · Oct 25, 2016

KWCrazy said:
These three stages (of adjustment) are:

1. Shock: During this phase the victim may suffer from acute anxiety, fear, and guilt, and observable reactions can vary from hysteria to numbness.

2. Denial: During this stage the victim attempts to "forget the whole thing." She will probably discuss the incident very little, will deny any strong feelings of hurt or anger, and will attempt to return to her daily routine.

3. Integration: Despite attempts to return to "business as usual," many rape victims realize that the attack has played a more important role in their lives than they had realized. Recurring nightmares, uneasiness about the environment and difficulties with personal relationships often continues to plague them. Prolonged effects of the attack may force a woman into a healthy reevaluation of the incident and it's impact on her life. source

So most rape victims deny it before coming to deal with it.

But... what did she have to fear?

1) Your whole post here is still based on the assumption that she WAS raped. Not only is there not an "unfounded allegation of rape", the "victim" indicates to the court there has NOT BEEN A RAPE.
And if the victim herself is saying there wasn't a rape, why do you keep posting under the assumption that she WAS raped?

Lastly, it's pretty difficult (though admittedly not impossible) to live in the stage of denial for about 15-20 years as this lady would have done. Also, you will note that the denial THIS is talking about is not the "denial" that it occurred. It's a denial that the even has had any impact on the victim's life.

KWCrazy · Oct 25, 2016

rambot said:
Not only is there not an "unfounded allegation of rape", the "victim" indicates to the court there has NOT BEEN A RAPE.

That victim, whose word you are willing to take as fact, says she was raped.
Do you only believe rape victims when they help ease your conscience for supporting the Clintons?

squirrel123 · Oct 25, 2016

KWCrazy said:
Tell that to Juanita Broderick.
Oh, wait. It's okay for the Clintons to rape people and then threaten them, right?

Absolutely not.

What on earth makes you ask that, and how is it in relevant to this thread?

Blondepudding · Oct 25, 2016

britebore said:
These 'allegations' are in a civil lawsuit, not a criminal complaint. In this heated election they are not to be believed. Imho. Why would anyone wait 22 years if this was true?

Every accusation against Trump is ancient history at this stage is it not?

Hank77 · Oct 25, 2016

rambot said:
And if the victim herself is saying there wasn't a rape, why do you keep posting under the assumption that she WAS raped?

Because years later she did a taped interview describing what she says happened all those years ago.
Basically she says she lied in that affidavit.

KWCrazy said:
But... what did she have to fear?

She is still alive even though she did an taped interview back in 1999 and
just recently did another one with Breitbart.

Blondepudding · Oct 25, 2016

squirrel123 said:
Absolutely not.

What on earth makes you ask that, and how is it in relevant to this thread?

I'm no Christian but I'd venture to say that story about those without sin cast the first stone?

And, for the others among us, not Christian, the old saying, what's good for the goose is good for the gander.
These accusations against Trump can't be qualifiers when the rape baggage attends the husband of the candidate seeking office.

If a story came out that Trump's wife use to work as an escort, that would be relevant to some people. All the stuff I've read about Melania hasn't been brought into discussion here?

squirrel123 · Oct 25, 2016

Blondepudding said:
I'm no Christian but I'd venture to say that story about those without sin cast the first stone?

And, for the others among us, not Christian, the old saying, what's good for the goose is good for the gander.
These accusations against Trump can't be qualifiers when the rape baggage attends the husband of the candidate seeking office.

If a story came out that Trump's wife use to work as an escort, that would be relevant to some people. All the stuff I've read about Melania hasn't been brought into discussion here?

I'm confused.

There seems to be an assumption that criticism of Trump implies approval of either or both Clintons. This is a baseless assumption.

Secondly, it appears that Bill Clinton's transgressions somehow means that Trump is entitled to do the same without criticism. I fail to see how another person's sins can make Trump's sins any more palatable. It's a bit like arguing that I should be allowed to rob banks because others have also done so...

Thirdly, there appears to be a significant number of people who would rather have a rapist for a president than a rapist's wife. This makes no sense to me whatsoever.

Jack of Spades · Oct 25, 2016

squirrel123 said:
I'm confused.

There seems to be an assumption that criticism of Trump implies approval of either or both Clintons. This is a baseless assumption.

Secondly, it appears that Bill Clinton's transgressions somehow means that Trump is entitled to do the same without criticism. I fail to see how another person's sins can make Trump's sins any more palatable. It's a bit like arguing that I should be allowed to rob banks because others have also done so...

Thirdly, there appears to be a significant number of people who would rather have a rapist for a president than a rapist's wife. This makes no sense to me whatsoever.

Thank you for saving my optimism towards human capability for any kind of objective reasoning for the next 20 minutes. Seriously, you hit about all of the major problems in this "Trump vs Bill" - deadlock.

It's almost poetic how this election, which will likely end up electing the first female president of the US, has turned out to center around basically all the issues related to sexism/feminism in a very brutal manner. Like, is it OK to talk about women as if they were decoration items or is it just "boy stuff" to grab women without consent. etc. and lastly, the discussion about the attitude towards rape victims.

It's as if the Republican party has done it's uttermost best and bit more to be remembered as the gang who was on the wrong side of history.

chevyontheriver · Oct 25, 2016

Jack of Spades said:
As an outsider, to me it seems largely like Hillary Clinton's unpopularity is as much a product of decades of active rightist campaigning against her, as it is actually deserved. Yeah, she is not charismatic speaker and doesn't come off as particularly likable person, but it's not like she's something off the grid - evil either.

Trump on the other hand, has had only short time to build up his political infame and has already built one greater than that of Clintons, who's unpopularity has been in the making for 30 years.

We can only imagine how loved figure Trump would be, if he stayed in politics for 30 years. To dislike Trump, all I gotta do is to go through the youtube clips of him talking trash, but the case of why I should dislike HRC is far more unclear.

My view is they are both bad candidates and would make bad presidents, but for different reasons.

Trump is a boorish narcissist, with all that entails. He's claiming to be all conservative, but not long ago he wasn't. What he will be next year is anyone's guess. Not fit to be president.

Hillary is predictable.So a lot of it comes down to policies. Her abortion policy, and the policy of her party, is a dealbreaker for me. Her economic policy would mean going farther down the path to socialism. Her views on religious liberty are scary, with her saying that beliefs will have to change so that women can have free contraception and abortion. She plans to end the Hyde amendment, which prevented taxpayer funding for abortion.

Then there is her truth impairment problem. Not really trusted to tell the truth. Not an honest broker. Trump makes things up but Hillary tells a well constructed mistruth. Wikileaks is revealing a bit of it, but it's mostly lost in the media hype over Trump.

She has anger problems too, notoriously so, and I feel a bit uncomfortable trusting her as commander in chief of the most powerful military on the planet. She is not a cool head in a crisis. She is a known hothead that throws things when irritated. Not fit to be president.

Armoured · Oct 25, 2016

voices that carry said:
You can say that over and over again but it never matters. It never matters because the typical conservative response to anything confronting the behavior of Trump is to immediately deflect with attacks against Clinton and her husband.

Typical response HERE maybe. Not all conservatives, though

chevyontheriver · Oct 25, 2016

Jack of Spades said:
It's as if the Republican party has done it's uttermost best and bit more to be remembered as the gang who was on the wrong side of history.

Many of us Republicans tried hard to avoid all of this. Some of us still cannot vote for Trump. He calls us 'disloyal Republicans' for standing on principle rather than gushing on about how wonderful he is. It's Trump's party now, but we'll see if he hasn't killed it.

SnowyMacie · Oct 25, 2016

chevyontheriver said:
Who cares? It's Trump. He can shoot somebody and not lose a single vote. Said so himself.

To be honest, he's probably right about that.

Shiloh Raven · Oct 25, 2016

Armoured said:
Typical response HERE maybe. Not all conservatives, though

Agreed. I should have been more specific. My apologies.

Jack of Spades · Oct 25, 2016

chevyontheriver said:
Many of us Republicans tried hard to avoid all of this. Some of us still cannot vote for Trump. He calls us 'disloyal Republicans' for standing on principle rather than gushing on about how wonderful he is. It's Trump's party now, but we'll see if he hasn't killed it.

I take my hat off for that group of Republicans, especially ones who had their own career at stake. It's not an easy call to reject ones own nominee, given the stakes.

But I think we have by now seen why it might have been the right call, from the point of view considering if conservatives wish to have some other political future than merging together with the alt-right.

chevyontheriver said:
Hillary is predictable.So a lot of it comes down to policies. Her abortion policy, and the policy of her party, is a dealbreaker for me. Her economic policy would mean going farther down the path to socialism. Her views on religious liberty are scary, with her saying that beliefs will have to change so that women can have free contraception and abortion. She plans to end the Hyde amendment, which prevented taxpayer funding for abortion.

Then there is her truth impairment problem. Not really trusted to tell the truth. Not an honest broker. Trump makes things up but Hillary tells a well constructed mistruth. Wikileaks is revealing a bit of it, but it's mostly lost in the media hype over Trump.

Sounds to me like half of it comes down to dislike for her policy positions, rather than her being an outstandingly bad candidate, if compared to any other leftist candidate with similar views.

TX_Matt said:
To be honest, he's probably right about that.

This is probably the worst cult of personality in modern history of Western politics. I can't think of any equivalents in my lifetime in the west.

For some reason, it always takes an outstandingly messed up person to get that level of worship. I dunno why it's that way.

Blondepudding · Oct 25, 2016

squirrel123 said:
Thirdly, there appears to be a significant number of people who would rather have a rapist for a president than a rapist's wife. This makes no sense to me whatsoever.

Since your remarks there were to me I omitted all but the last due to its content.

What's your presidential preference in that twofer?

Belk · Oct 25, 2016

chevyontheriver said:
Many of us Republicans tried hard to avoid all of this. Some of us still cannot vote for Trump. He calls us 'disloyal Republicans' for standing on principle rather than gushing on about how wonderful he is. It's Trump's party now, but we'll see if he hasn't killed it.

Many people were predicting an alteration of the party structure after the last election. I think this is the birth pangs of a new alliance that will form both republicans and democrats have people who feel they are not represented by the current parties.

J Cord · Oct 25, 2016

LivingWordUnity said:
We know from the leaked emails how dirty the Hillary Clinton campaign is.

So you know for a fact that the emails are 100% accurate, not altered in any way?

LovebirdsFlying · Oct 26, 2016

MOD HAT ON

Wooooooaaaah, Nellie.
There's a little too much mud in here to go through and clean it all up, so staff has decided to go ahead and close this thread.

MOD HAT OFF

So, the latest allegations against Trump are pretty bad...

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