Are Transgender Children for Real?

scraparcs said:

Is it even possible to explain gender and sex to someone who has no experience with any separation between the two? Or am I better off just learning that if someone identifies as a woman, use pronoun she and if someone identifies as a man, use pronoun he?

Click to expand...

You could start a Tumblr account and listen to long, intricate, and self-serving rants about it.

Or not.

CaDan said:

You could start a Tumblr account and listen to long, intricate, and self-serving rants about it.

Or not.

Click to expand...

I think I have selected my option. Don't understand it all, but just tell me the proper pronoun and I can use it.

Paradoxum said:

It must be particular confusing if a trans person is gay according to their mental identity.

Click to expand...

Depends.

If the transsexual is seen by an observer as what they were born as, it might be a bit confusing. However, if they are viewed as their authentic gender, there wouldn't be any confusion at all. And that goes whether they are gay or not.

Not all professionals in the psychiatric field define sexuality in transsexuals as some in society do. Most do not. Some define sexuality in terms of the authentic gender of the person. Some define it in terms of the current genitals. Few define it in genetic terms, which is probably the most common determination made by the average person in society. For instance, I've noticed that many, if not most, of the people on this forum define sexuality as it relates to the person's genotype. So, if a post-op male to female transsexual has a relationship with a natal man, they view it as homosexuality. Few psychiatrists would agree with that.

What I find interesting is that those who would refer to that as homosexuality still would not approve of a post-op male to female transsexual in a relationship with a natal woman. That seems disingenuous to me. If they call one homosexual, how could they possibly NOT call the other as heterosexual?

But, every male to female transsexual I've ever come across that was attracted to natal women refers to themselves as lesbian, as would I if I were in such a relationship. Especially after surgery.

It is with an eye towards the controversy that would be caused for other Christians regardless with whom I was to have a relationship that I decided to remain celibate. It isn't Christ-like to knowingly do anything that can cause a weak brother or sister to offend. And since regardless of who I paired with there would almost certainly be somebody incited to be judgmental of my freedom in Christ, it is better to refrain. At my age, and with my history, abstinence isn't that much of a big deal to me anyway.

scraparcs said:

Is it even possible to explain gender and sex to someone who has no experience with any separation between the two? Or am I better off just learning that if someone identifies as a woman, use pronoun she and if someone identifies as a man, use pronoun he?

Click to expand...

It is possible with some people. I've had some success with it by using analogies and storytelling to put the listener into a different frame of mind and allow them to see it from a bit of a different perspective.

As far as what pronoun to use. Your choice would depend on whether you wanted to be strict in your own determination, or be kind and polite to the person.

I prefer to be referred to as "she". I know of almost no transsexual that does not wish to be referred to as their felt gender. Whenever anyone refers to me as "he", I take it as either ignorance or an insult, depending on what I know of them. I transitioned while still in the same job that I've had. So, most of the people there still remember me as a male. Old habits die hard. Very few of them are sensitive to my gender, and they still generally refer to me as "he", regardless of the obvious changes in appearance. I don't like it, but neither do I like being unemployed. And getting another job wouldn't be easy in this economy, especially in my circumstance. I figure, that for the most part, I am tolerated. I might as well be tolerant too.

I do believe that there are children who are transgender but they shouldn't be allowed to have T (for FtM) or estrogen (for MtF) until 18. That is just my view but there is nothing stopping from dressing as their true gender.

UnmaskedHearts said:

I do believe that there are children who are transgender but they shouldn't be allowed to have T (for FtM) or estrogen (for MtF) until 18. That is just my view but there is nothing stopping from dressing as their true gender.

Click to expand...

Most do NOT get hormones until 18. Some might get them from 16 on, but few. I've never heard of anyone under 16 getting hormones. Until they do reach that age, hormones aren't given. They can get hormone blockers to prevent puberty from affecting their growth. The blockers do nothing permanent to the body, and if they later decide to not transition they can simply cease taking the blockers and things return to the growth directions dictated by their birth sex.

scraparcs said:

Is it even possible to explain gender and sex to someone who has no experience with any separation between the two?

Click to expand...

It is possible to explain to an opened mind. However, it is a difficult concept to understand. Even therapists, who are doing their best to help us, have only an academic understanding of the issue. They have no idea what the experience is like, nor the dysphoria.

Or am I better off just learning that if someone identifies as a woman, use pronoun she and if someone identifies as a man, use pronoun he?

Click to expand...

I would say, to be polite to the person you meet, if you can tell what gender they are expressing, to use appropriate pronouns. If they correct you, listen and do the best you can to comply. If you don't know and need to interact with that person, you can ask what pronouns they prefer.

Most people are more interested in people making an effort than always getting it right. It's hard to make a sudden and complete shift in how you refer to someone, so we understand that it takes time, well, most of us do. Mistakes are human. As long as you are being respectful, that's what we value most.

ihavefoundgod951 said:

Just because someone has had a sex change does'nt necessary mean he is a girl in the eyes of God.

Click to expand...

On the other hand, it doesn't necessarily mean she isn't a girl in the eyes of God.

ihavefoundgod951 said:

The person who is transsexual may not be gay, but because they are dressed as a woman/guy they are tempting same sex people to look at them in a homosexual way.

Click to expand...

Because the person lusting is never the one sinning. Right.

No, when a man lusts for anyone other than his wife, he is sinning regardless of the gender of the object of his desire.

Yoder, I just want to make sure, because your last couple posts are worded indistinctly, are you equating homosexuality and transgender?

Yoder777 said:

Homosexuality and transgenderism are both part of the LGBT community.

Click to expand...

Yes.

The rights of gay people are linked with the rights of transgender people.

Click to expand...

To an extent, however there are some needs which are not the same.

And I should also add that transgenderism, like homosexuality, may have a biological cause that is beyond the control of the individual gay or transgender person.

Click to expand...

That is true. I have seen a lot of people here state that transgender people are just a more extreme form of gay and I wanted to make sure that you weren't arguing the same thing, even though you have been very respectful (and informative!)

Yoder777 said:

Please keep in mind that I didn't start this thread to bash transgenders, who I believe deserve the same rights as everyone else. My only question is whether small children are old enough to decide that they are the opposite sex to what they were born. I honestly don't think that they are old enough to understand their own gender, let alone want to be the opposite gender. I consider it irresponsible parenting to let your child undergo hormone therapy or whatever other medical solution that only an informed adult should undertake.

Click to expand...

Studies by psychologists say around 4 it's pretty solid, but let's put that aside for a moment.

Children don't undergo hormone therapy. Cross sex hormones, or hormone replacement therapy, except maybe in rare cases, doesn't happen in the US until you are 18. Some 16 year olds have gotten to start HRT, but most minors don't get anything except puberty blockers, which is not the same thing.

It doesn't seem to sink in.

Cute Tink said:

Children don't undergo hormone therapy. Cross sex hormones, or hormone replacement therapy, except maybe in rare cases, doesn't happen in the US until you are 18. Some 16 year olds have gotten to start HRT, but most minors don't get anything except puberty blockers, which is not the same thing.

Click to expand...

Cute Tink said:

I don't think you understand how the process works.

Children don't get cross sex hormones.
Children don't get sex reassignment surgery (in the US).
Children can get puberty blockers at the onset of puberty that only block their bodies' hormones. They don't promote cross sex development. Once stopped, puberty will resume as normal.

Studies show children have a solid understanding of gender by around the age of 4.

Being transgender has nothing to do with who you are attracted to.

Click to expand...

trunks2k said:

You don't perform gender reassignment surgery on children, nor do you even give them hormones. What we do is that as a child who claims to be transgendered (and we're not talking about just throwing tantrums here) approaches puberty is give them hormone blockers.

Click to expand...

Cute Tink said:

I do not advocate for giving children hormones.

I actually already stated that, in the US, children do not get hormones at all, let alone surgery. It doesn't need to be made illegal, because it is not done. At 18 is when medical treatment starts.

Giving children hormone blockers at the onset of puberty is not the same as giving them hormones.

Click to expand...

StephanieSomer said:

BTW, children are NEVER given gender changing drugs. That's just another of your uneducated opinions thrown in the fire.

Click to expand...

StephanieSomer said:

Most do NOT get hormones until 18. Some might get them from 16 on, but few. I've never heard of anyone under 16 getting hormones. Until they do reach that age, hormones aren't given. They can get hormone blockers to prevent puberty from affecting their growth. The blockers do nothing permanent to the body, and if they later decide to not transition they can simply cease taking the blockers and things return to the growth directions dictated by their birth sex.

Click to expand...

Yoder777 said:

I know it's not politically correct to ask this, but is this child genuinely transgendered or are his/her parents just plain irresponsible? I am going to try to reserve judgment until I've learned more about this. http://vimeo.com/15346778

Click to expand...

I was curious. Your OP inferred that you intended to learn more about the issue. The logical assumption is that you planned on reading some of the research. How's that going?

Yoder777 said:

I've changed my opinion in the sense that I would now be accepting of a child who believes that he or she is transgendered, but I still reject the idea of anyone under 18 undergoing medical treatment to become the opposite gender, including treatments that delay puberty.

Click to expand...

Why are you against delaying puberty again?