Does anyone else in our forum discern-sift doctrines of men in this way?

[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]Hi all[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]and Hi again Interplanner,[/FONT]

[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]It is a shame that most American Evangelical churches dogmatically teach the scriptures in such a way that it promotes strong political pressures to NOT think very deeply concerning other interpretations that could become “more” eternally fruitful than what is already being taught. [/FONT]

[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]So that each generation could be taught to resist evil OR to flee from the presence of obviously prideful or carnal men, so that newly converting believers might then more easily grow in their grace and knowledge of the Lord and in their holiness+ towards Him and all others.[/FONT]

[FONT=Arial, sans-serif][+: Holiness defined via scripture is - - "set apart for service" to "all" of mankind, and the Trinity does this without favoritism so that eventually 1 John 3:8b would be fulfilled in the earth as more "believers" would become "Holy" disciples of Jesus.][/FONT]

[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]Since in my view most evangelicals, such as myself, have rarely been taught to rightly-divide or discern that the scriptures are “meant” to be interpreted and then taught by His converted Saints to (1) save souls by giving them “hope” and to (2) then disciple their lives to a godly saintly walk, not because of one's fear towards God that dogmatic men would teach to a novice, but from the logical, wisdom and prudence that the scriptures should promote when ably taught by a converted-converting and loving teacher-mentor.[/FONT]

[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]So it is sad that as a consequence of not being able to ever consider another point of view without a fear of being excommunicated (e.g. similar to M.Servetus and J.Calvins disagreements over each others dogma) that Matthew's words in chapter 24 are much more “difficult” for many Evangelicals to acknowledge and teach as two (2) separate events.[/FONT]

[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]Which were firstly the holocaust of 70AD, and lastly the return of the Lord and the taking-up of His chosen bride that has yet to occur.[/FONT]

[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]Thanks for all you posts, I pray a few of us are learning and growing as a result of your tireless efforts.[/FONT]

[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]God Bless.

In Jesus' love - we should all put our trust eternally,
AJCServant
John 10 & 15 & 17 & Revelation 21
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AJCServant said:

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[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]Hi all,[/FONT]

[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]I felt compelled to write this post today so here are my best efforts to explain what I have been taught a Pan-Trib believer believes, i.e. a &#8220;Panarama&#8221;-Tribulationist believer. And to also elaborate that the primary purpose for this thread was to encourage us all to always &#8220;only&#8221; mentor and become salt and light into another's life.[/FONT]

[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]My goal for this thread was to &#8220;encourage&#8221; some whose hearts are good to remain thankful, be worshipful, and to become holy+ as the Trinity of God is holy in their loving service to others.
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[+: Holiness defined via scripture is - - "set apart for service" to "all" of mankind, and the Trinity does this without favoritism so that eventually 1John 3:8b++ would be fulfilled in the earth as more "believers" would become "Holy" disciples of Jesus.]

What I had been taught many seasons ago before I myself became a Panorama-Tribulationist i.e Pan-Trib believer, is that holding to a Pan-Trib view means that it is a view that our God will forever be "sovereign" with how He will "use" the scriptures to glorify Himself. And that because of His ongoing omniscient wisdom in the warfare He is fighting in our behalf against the Devil Beelzebub on a moment by moment person by person basis, He could "rapture" any of His Saints home at any time throughout the entire &#8220;panorama&#8221; of any tribulation periods that might ever occur for each of us, whenever He would feel we were then "ready" for that glorification of our soul.

This could happen in any way He wishes or as happened millennia ago whenever He sent fiery chariots and one of His prophets was taken-up, or as Jesus mentioned in the gospels could occur in a way that one would leave ones body behind, albeit ultimately God will forever be &#8220;sovereign&#8221; in how and when He takes anyone to His home in Heaven above.

Some people feel that many martyrs were taken-up just &#8220;before&#8221; they would have &#8220;felt&#8221; the flames, or even while the flames were occurring but they did not ever &#8220;feel&#8221; them, or were taken-up just before they would have &#8220;felt&#8221; a lion's teeth.

Our God is able and our God is sovereign and our God only desires to "mentor" into others [/FONT][FONT=Arial, sans-serif][FONT=Arial, sans-serif]throughout the earth [/FONT]faith-full and faith-filled character and virtue and good works via the lifelong efforts of all of His Saints in training.

I have been taught that [/FONT][FONT=Arial, sans-serif][FONT=Arial, sans-serif]as a consequence of God's omniscience [/FONT]a Pan-Tribulationist would conclude that our God will be &#8220;sovereign&#8221; and will not "bind" Himself by any &#8220;prophecies&#8221; or teachings of "fallible" men, even when they wrote as best as they were "compelled" by the spirit to do at the time of their writings.

All men and teachers since Adam's fall have always been fallible at many times throughout their walk; i.e. their own righteousness has continually been filthy rags compared to what our God's righteousness is, and their own understandings have always been through a cloudy glass compared to God's understandings, and His ways have always been much higher than our ways.

BUT the Holy Spirit comforter teacher who would teach us about the writings-of and the teachings-of men is "never" fallible in how He would teach good-hearted Saints to apply those writings.

Even so, because of their inadequate understanding of the purpose of &#8220;all&#8221; the holy scriptures many many people continually &#8220;wrest&#8221; [#] difficult passages out of context as God has always desired them to be used, for their own purposes to justify their own hard hearted sins or bigotries towards other cultures or towards other sinners. And would ultimately be "allowed" to become "seduced" to become self-destructive in their life choices as occurred in 70 AD; And occurs today with s.t.d's or poor nutritional choices etc etc, in order to fulfill what Paul taught concerning turning one over to the Angel Satan for the destruction of their flesh that their soul would be "eternally" saved. If anyone could prayerfully reflect on this important point, we have all been taught via The Book of Job and via our own life experiences that [/FONT][/FONT][FONT=Arial, sans-serif][FONT=Arial, sans-serif]this inevitable consequence for ones sins invariably occurs when some souls "choose" to remain unholy towards their Creator God AND towards their neighbors in our world.

[/FONT][/FONT]Ultimately either via Satan and His angels who would sift God's leaders- in- training OR via Beelzebub and his minions whose goal is to only steal, kill and destroy, "every"
[*] soul who has ever been created into this world since Adam and Eve will have been sifted, chastened, "taught" and continually reminded in the eternity to come of the "importance" of James 4:7 that says: Submit [humble] yourselves then to God. resist the devil, and he will flee from you. [Leviticus 16:10 & 2 Peter 2:10 & Jude 1:8]
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[#: 2Peter 3:16 - - As also in all his [Paul's] epistles, speaking in them of these things; in which are some things hard to be understood, which they that are unlearned and unstable wrest, as they do also the other scriptures, unto their own destruction.]

Ultimately our Creator God's [/FONT][FONT=Arial, sans-serif][FONT=Arial, sans-serif]eternal goal will be to &#8220;use&#8221; all scripture so that the following two scriptures would be fulfilled and so that His children would (1) not be ashamed on their final day, and (2) that we each, (as we have been gifted), would become trained via the holy scriptures to do every good work that would come our way to the best of our ability.

Point 1:

2Timothy 2:15 - - Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth.

and continuing with

Point 2:

2Timothy 3:16-17 - - (16) All [holy] scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness. (17) That the man of God may be perfect, thoroughly furnished unto all good works.

What I have been taught by other good souls via the Holy Spirit is just do your best and our eternally loving and Holy God will do the rest.

Our Creator God has always been infinitely good and infinitely loving and His plans are super super long term way beyond our short lifetimes of learning experiences in this veil-of-tears we are all in, within this present age in our decaying mortal bodies.

So no matter what "fallible" men would say or teach or the devil would attempt to influence you to believe, just know that the Trinity of God loves each of us intensely and immeasurably without favoritism since this is their nature and character as eternal souls with an eternal vision that will- be accomplished. We are their inheritances and the apex of their efforts beginning from eternity past.

To further help in the understanding of some good-hearted believers, I will relate that I have also been taught that some people have continually felt God's loving holy "presence" during worship times at their own church gatherings when they communaly entered into heartfelt worship of their Lord and Savior. From these times I have been taught that this is what the purity of Heaven will "feel" like when we will "all"
[*] be there. [*: [/FONT]Colossians 1:20[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]]

So I encourage you to "worship" God with your life and He will make His presence known in a deeper more relational and covenantal way every day you will be in His service during your short sojourn here.

I hope I have encouraged some of you a little today and whoever might someday read this post in the future.

God bless.

Into Jesus' love - we should "all" put our trust eternally,
AJCServant
John 10 & 15 & 17 & Revelation 21
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[/FONT][*: Colossians 1:20 - - And, having made peace through the blood of His cross, by Him to reconcile all things unto Himself; by Him, I say, whether they be things in earth, OR things in heaven.]


[FONT=Arial, sans-serif][++: 1John 3:8b - - [/FONT][FONT=Arial, sans-serif]For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that He might destroy the works of the devil.]
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Marana tha, INSHALLAH, Amen.[/FONT]

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Interplanner said:

I don't know if too much of that can ever be resolved without people realizing the historic part. But we can resolve the "doctrine of men" in Judaism's replacement theology in Gal 3:18. The belief that the Law / Judaism replaces the promises to the nations via Abraham is overthrown by Paul. He shows in Gal 3 that the promise (all of them are referred to collectively as a unit) always was to the nations, and Israel is one of them. The Scriptures foresaw and announced this in advance (v8). It was Judaism that tried to 'set aside' or 'make void' the promise of the Gospel.

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Hi all,
and Hi again Interplanner,

It should be seen that the same evil spirits that controlled Judaism in 70 AD to make their scribe theologians so arrogant towards being ambassador - missionaries to the nations of the good-news-gospel concerning the "purity" and "goodness" of God revealed through Moses, is predominant today amongst most modern-times theologians. Who invest none or little of their efforts being ambassadors to the "nations" such as Russia to proclaim our God's "goodness" to them, so they might be "encouraged" to "learn" to resist all evils.

Thank you for tirelessly posting your insights.

I pray and am encouraged that &#8220;all&#8221; of our efforts are for Jesus and for Jesus' inheritances sakes. And so I know that "many" in CF are working towards mentoring others in their understanding of God's eternal "vision" for us "all" as Colossians 1:20 defines "all", and mentoring others in their holiness+ towards God and "all" others to the "best" of our "current" abilities and efforts.

God bless you and everyone here in CF greatly for your efforts to mentor others in &#8220;the-way-of-holiness&#8221;+.

Into Jesus' Love - we should all put our trust eternally
AJCServant
John 10 & 15 & 17 & Revelation 21
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[FONT=Arial, sans-serif][+: Holiness defined via scripture is - - "set apart for service" to "all" of mankind, and the Trinity does this without favoritism so that eventually 1John 3:8b++ would be fulfilled in the earth as more "believers" would become "Holy" disciples of Jesus.]

[/FONT][FONT=Arial, sans-serif][++: 1John 3:8b - - [FONT=Arial, sans-serif]For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that He might destroy the works of the devil.][/FONT][/FONT]

Interplanner said:

ACJS,
there are nearly 10 separate-topic lines here. Could you say one thing please?

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Hi all,
and Hi again IP,

I made the post above that reiterated that because so few American Christians spend so little time or efforts to minister out to the nations like Russia, that arrogant theologies have become predominant, and have become relatively fruitless, and oftentimes much much worse that fruitless, in comparison to the prosperity and blessings America has been entrusted to "steward". So sad that America's "spiritual" coverings and blessings will likely be "given" to other nations who will use them to glorify God throughout the great tribulations that are knocking at the door, unless more repent and would pray and would obey, and become fruitful with their lives.

God bless you and everyone here in CF greatly for your efforts to mentor others in “the-way-of-holiness”+.

Into Jesus' Love - we should all put our trust eternally
AJCServant
John 10 & 15 & 17 & Revelation 21
<><> <><

[FONT=Arial, sans-serif][+: Holiness defined via scripture is - - "set apart for service" to "all" of mankind, and the Trinity does this without favoritism so that eventually 1John 3:8b++ would be fulfilled in the earth as more "believers" would become "Holy" disciples of Jesus.]

[/FONT][FONT=Arial, sans-serif][++: 1John 3:8b - - [FONT=Arial, sans-serif]For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that He might destroy the works of the devil.][/FONT][/FONT]