Need help on Rev 22:1-5

hraedisc

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Revelation 22, NKJV
1 And he showed me a pure river of water of life, clear as crystal, proceeding from the throne of God and of the Lamb.
2 In the middle of its street, and on either side of the river, was the tree of life, which bore twelve fruits, each tree yielding its fruit every month. The leaves of the tree were for the healing of the nations.
3 And there shall be no more curse, but the throne of God and of the Lamb shall be in it, and His servants shall serve Him.
4 They shall see His face, and His name shall be on their foreheads.
5 There shall be no night there: They need no lamp nor light of the sun, for the Lord God gives them light. And they shall reign forever and ever.

Q1
Is "the reign" of Rev 22:1-5 before or after God says "Behold, I make all things new" in Rev 21:5?

Q2
Is "the reign" of Rev 22:1-5 before or after "They went up on the breadth of the earth and surrounded the camp of the saints and the beloved city. And fire came down from God out of heaven and devoured them" Rev 20:9?

Q3
Who are they in verse 5?
 

layne

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Actually, now that I read it again, it's either that, or they is referring to his servants. But by they I don't mean that God is they. I would think it is referring to God as God and Jesus as the Lamb, meaning they, two seperate entities. If they were two in one, it would say He wouldn't it? So, in no way it would imply anything about the Trinity, if that is the point of your post...

There are many things in Revelation I've read that I don't feel click with the Trinity, and this is definately one example. Why would a 3 in 1 God need those two thrones?
 
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Apologist

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Originally posted by layne
Actually, now that I read it again, it's either that, or they is referring to his servants. But by they I don't mean that God is they. I would think it is referring to God as God and Jesus as the Lamb, meaning they, two seperate entities. If they were two in one, it would say He wouldn't it? So, in no way it would imply anything about the Trinity, if that is the point of your post...

There are many things in Revelation I've read that I don't feel click with the Trinity, and this is definately one example. Why would a 3 in 1 God need those two thrones?

The "they" of verse 5 is talking about the saints.

God's throne refers to God's rule over all and not to a literal throne.
This is symbolic wording. God is spirit and does not literally sit on a throne. ;)

God Bless
 
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LightBearer

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The "They" refered to in verse 5 are those refered to in verse 4 as having the name of there God on their foreheads.

They are also refered to here in chapt 14

Revelation 14:1-5 "And I saw, and, look! the Lamb standing upon the Mount Zion, and with him a hundred and forty-four thousand having his name and the name of his Father written on their foreheads. And I heard a sound out of heaven as the sound of many waters and as the sound of loud thunder; and the sound that I heard was as of singers who accompany themselves on the harp playing on their harps. And they are singing as if a new song before the throne and before the four living creatures and the elders; and no one was able to master that song but the hundred and forty-four thousand, who have been bought from the earth. These are the ones that did not defile themselves with women; in fact, they are virgins. These are the ones that keep following the Lamb no matter where he goes. These were bought from among mankind as firstfruits to God and to the Lamb, and no falsehood was found in their mouths; they are without blemish.

In chapter Revelation Chapter 5 verses 9 and 10 it says of them. "And they sing a new song, saying: "You are worthy to take the scroll and open its seals, because you were slaughtered and with your blood you bought persons for God out of every tribe and tongue and people and nation, and you made them to be a kingdom and priests to our God, and they are to rule as kings over the earth." Rev 5:9,10. 

So the "They" are the joint heirs with Christ and will rule with him over the earth for a thousand years.

Romans 8:17 "If, then, we are children, we are also heirs: heirs indeed of God, but joint heirs with Christ, provided we suffer together that we may also be glorified together.

Ephesians 3:5-6 "In other generations this [secret] was not made known to the sons of men as it has now been revealed to his holy apostles and prophets by spirit, namely, that people of the nations should be joint heirs and fellow members of the body and partakers with us of the promise in union with Christ Jesus through the good news".

Revelation 20:4 "And I saw thrones, and there were those who sat down on them, and power of judging was given them. Yes, I saw the souls of those executed with the ax for the witness they bore to Jesus and for speaking about God, and those who had worshiped neither the wild beast nor its image and who had not received the mark upon their forehead and upon their hand. And they came to life and ruled as kings with the Christ for a thousand years".

In other words "They" are the "kingdom (Government) of God" who will rule over the earth for a thousand years and restore obedient Mankind back to perfection and the earth to the Edenic conditions God originally purposed for it. Then the long time prayer will finally be answered.

"Let you Kingdom come. Let your will take place, as in heaven also upon earth. Matt 6:10 
 
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layne

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There, Lightbearer said it all.
If you will note, I did say "Now that I read it again"!! they is referring to his servants. And if you read LightBearer's post, the servants are the annointed ones, who will rule as kings over the earth with Jesus for his 1000 year reign.

Yes, the throne(s) are symbolic, but it mentions GOD and the Lamb seperately, does it not!? I guess Jesus can sit on Gods lap then!
 
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parousia70

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Originally posted by LightBearer
In chapter Revelation Chapter 5 verses 9 and 10 it says of them. "And they sing a new song, saying: "You are worthy to take the scroll and open its seals, because you were slaughtered and with your blood you bought persons for God out of every tribe and tongue and people and nation, and you made them to be a kingdom and priests to our God, and they are to rule as kings over the earth." Rev 5:9,10. 

So the "They" are the joint heirs with Christ and will rule with him over the earth for a thousand years.

Actually, the "They" in Rev. 5:9-10 referr only to the 4 living creatures and 24 elders. thats it.

In other words "They" are the "kingdom (Government) of God" who will rule over the earth for a thousand years and restore obedient Mankind back to perfection and the earth to the Edenic conditions God originally purposed for it. Then the long time prayer will finally be answered.

"Let you Kingdom come. Let your will take place, as in heaven also upon earth. Matt 6:10

Anyone else find it odd how people often answer a question about what it will be like in the "New heavens and earth" by describing what it will be like during the so called "Millenium" (a period that takes place BEFORE the New Heavens and earth arrive)??

 :scratch: :scratch:
 
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