Let's Play Hardball----

AliOgg · May 15, 2007

GregKerr said:
I am not a religious person, I am a follower of the Christ of the scriptures. I don't pull punches and I deal in truth to help and encourage those that are His and at the same time making many waves among those who are religious but do not and are not interested in knowing the Master. Consider this understanding...Jesus said basically if we would believe on Him according to the scriptures(not tradition or religion) everything He could do we can do. Turn this statement around...if we can't do what He could do we are not believing on Him according to the scriptures. Consider this...God is a God of Healing and Miracles. If you attend an assembly and there are not healings and miracles there every time you meet its because He's not there...If you are under a man or woman of God who has no supernatural power from God to heal or do miracles what makes you think they can get you to heaven... I encourage all who desire to be used by God on the highest of levels to understand that at this very moment God is looking for believers just like you. Believers that will say in their heart, no matter which direction every one else goes in I will follow you Lord. No matter how high the price use me God. Even if all those I know, all those I love abandon me because of my desire for You, I will follow You. You are my life, You are the only life I have ever known, my life for You....Now God begins to use you the way He used others 2000 years go in signs and wonders, healings and miracles, powerfully teaching just exactly what Jesus taught and now it comes, they begin hating you without a cause, they call you a false prophet they say it can't be their god because miracles follow you and their god doesn't do miracles. Are you willing to walk this narrow path, are you willing to pay this price.....do it.....just do it.....it will cost you everything.....but do it

I have often wondered about these things and why they do not occur more often, I know I can't do them because I'm a worthless piece of dross who lacks the faith to go there but I have one question....
....what is hardball?

And God Bless All His Peoples.

fishon · May 15, 2007

I am betting we will not be hearing a coherent responce from Greg or floatingaxe. In fact, I bet they have moved on hoping to find others who fall for out of context teachings and defence.
fishon
Hey, come on back and reason together fellows.

TransformedByGrace · May 15, 2007

fishon said:
I am betting we will not be hearing a coherent responce from Greg or floatingaxe. In fact, I bet they have moved on hoping to find others who fall for out of context teachings and defence.
fishon
Hey, come on back and reason together fellows.

That's how every debate ends when one side has firm Scripture to back their beliefs and the other "heard it at church" and believes that the pastor is always right, therefore needs no Bible verse to back up what they say.
It's also how every 'new slightly skewed religion' has begun.

tulc · May 15, 2007

Hey, come on back and reason together fellows.

uhmmm because you sound like you so want to "reason together"? :scratch:

I am betting we will not be hearing a coherent responce from Greg or floatingaxe. In fact, I bet they have moved on hoping to find others who fall for out of context teachings and defence.

Oh yeah that sounds like you're interested in what they think. :sigh:

tulc(looking for more coffee)

tulc · May 15, 2007

That's how every debate ends when one side has firm Scripture to back their beliefs and the other "heard it at church" and believes that the pastor is always right, therefore needs no Bible verse to back up what they say.

I'm curious how you got that from Gregs posts?

It's also how every 'new slightly skewed religion' has begun.

New religion? :scratch:

I thought we were a bunch of Christians here. What new religion are you talking about?
tulc(just curious)

Floatingaxe · May 15, 2007

I am betting we will not be hearing a coherent responce from Greg or floatingaxe. In fact, I bet they have moved on hoping to find others who fall for out of context teachings and defence.

Excuse me? I have been otherwise occupied.

I believe that you have insulted me. I do believe God has blessed me with coherency. My beliefs are always in line with scripture.

After more of our friend Greg's posts I have begun to realize that we do not believe the same thing about a Spirit-filled assembly. I know that He moves in every gathering, but He doesn't necessarily make a showy display of power as Greg has mentioned.

Does that make me more likeable now?

fishon · May 15, 2007

tulc said:
[/size][/color][/font]I'm curious how you got that from Gregs posts?

New religion? I thought we were a bunch of Christians here. What new religion are you talking about?
tulc(just curious)

Did you cheek out the website that Greg gave? Follow it through to what reese fuller has to write about his interview with Greg.
fishon

fishon · May 15, 2007

Floatingaxe said:
Excuse me? I have been otherwise occupied.

I believe that you have insulted me. I do believe God has blessed me with coherency. My beliefs are always in line with scripture.

After more of our friend Greg's posts I have begun to realize that we do not believe the same thing about a Spirit-filled assembly. I know that He moves in every gathering, but He doesn't necessarily make a showy display of power as Greg has mentioned.

Does that make me more likeable now?

floatingaxe,
I sincerly apologize for insulting you. First, for not being patience in giving you time to respond. Second, for the uncoherent dig. I was wrong.

Did you check out Acts 17:11?
fishon

Floatingaxe · May 15, 2007

Acts 17:11...
And the people of Berea were more open-minded than those in Thessalonica, and they listened eagerly to Pauls message. They searched the Scriptures day after day to see if Paul and Silas were teaching the truth.

Yes I have read it. Of course this is the pattern of learning we must take, when being taught by our leaders. Not to catch them in an error, but rather for reinforcement that the truth we have heard from reliable men and women of God has been God-given.

GregKerr · May 16, 2007

TransformedByGrace said:
You're directly contradicting Scripture.
Matthew 18:20
"For where two or three have gathered together in My name, I am there in their midst."
This is an assembly where miracles and healings are not present, yet God says he is there.

Because performing miracles and healing has no relation whatsoever to salvation or heaven. Salvation is not earned by any means, especially miracles. As God states plainly here:
Matthew 7:21-22

21"Not everyone who says to me, 'Lord, Lord,' will enter the kingdom of heaven, but only he who does the will of my Father who is in heaven. 22Many will say to me on that day, 'Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name, and in your name drive out demons and perform many miracles?'

It's not a difficult topic to understand.
God sent His son as a sacrifice for the sins of the world, and His blood was sufficient to atone for any person that accepts His Son. The end.

Don't miss the point of this thread. There is more to being a believer in Christ than what most believers are settling for. The God of the Scriptures is a God of power and His servants should have spiritual power just like those 2000 years ago and if they don't they should not stop until they do. Everything that was available to Peter, James and John is available to us....

GregKerr · May 16, 2007

fishon said:
GregKerr said:

I am not a religious person, I am a follower of the Christ of the scriptures. I don't pull punches and I deal in truth to help and encourage those that are His and at the same time making many waves among those who are religious but do not and are not interested in knowing the Master. Consider this understanding...Jesus said basically if we would believe on Him according to the scriptures(not tradition or religion) everything He could do we can do.

As a pastor and preacher of the gospel of Christ, I too "pull no punches." You said, Jesus said basically if we would believe on Him according to the scriptures(not tradition or religion) everything He could do we can do. When was the last time you raised someone from the dead?

I don't need big talk, and a lot of take my word for it, because the Bible says to "test the spirits." So, who have you raised? What are their names? When and where did the raising take place?

And I sceptical, you bet. Too many false teachers and preachers in the World. TV is full of them.

If you haven't raised anyone from the dead, then your preaching and admonition to us on the forum is phony. If you will not supply proof and you do just like all the other false teachers and say, "I can't supply names, places, and dates, just believe me on faith," then you are a phony. No punches pull here.
fishon

Click to expand...

Lets pull no punches... if you can't get the majority of lets say people that come to you with pain healed, the chances are you are not quite where God needs you to be to teach. I haven't had a meeting since 1997 where at least 90% of the people with pain have not been healed. I have seen almost every kind of problem healed These statements are a boast of the power of the anointing of the Holy spirit. I have never attempted to raise a dead person.....

GregKerr · May 16, 2007

fishon said:
I am betting we will not be hearing a coherent responce from Greg or floatingaxe. In fact, I bet they have moved on hoping to find others who fall for out of context teachings and defence.
fishon
Hey, come on back and reason together fellows.

Wrong again ......I said if a man canno't get at least the majority of people with pain healed at any given meeting not to mention other problems which are things that all the followers of Christ could do, what makes people believe he can get them to heaven he should not teach....

andross77 · May 16, 2007

GregKerr said:
Wrong again ......I said if a man canno't get at least the majority of people with pain healed at any given meeting not to mention other problems which are things that all the followers of Christ could do, what makes people believe he can get them to heaven he should not teach....

i'm confused :scratch:

. are you saying you, or at least someone that can heal most of the people in a church meeting, are the only ones able to correctly direct someone to Jesus the Saviour? Or are you saying that only someone that can heal can get into heaven? or are you saying that if someone doesn't have the ability of healing, they are not a Christian?

If it's any of those 3, i would say you are wrong and the Bible would disagree with you completely. So hopefully it's a 4th option i haven't considered.

Lightcreated · May 16, 2007

The bible saids that Jesus spoke in parabal and without a parabal He did not speak.
And who is the author of the bible? Jesus is, it's His word, so the whole bible is a parabal.What is a parabal? a true earthly story with a heavenly meaning.So when God, was healing the sick like the blind man, that was Him saying when He saves us He opens our spiritual eyes, and when He healed the cripple/lame man He was saying when He saved us we are made whole, we are to walk in Him.All the miracles Jesus did in the bible was telling us spiritual things about Him and His salvation plan for all He's came to save.Let's face it He didn't come to save every1 that would ever live,if He did then there would be no Hell.That's why He said jacob i loved but esau i hate.Jacob wa a picture of all those that the Lord has come to save (he was also a picture of the Lord as well) but there's no room to go it to that.And esau is a picture of all the unsave.

fishon · May 16, 2007

GregKerr said:
fishon said:

Lets pull no punches... if you can't get the majority of lets say people that come to you with pain healed, the chances are you are not quite where God needs you to be to teach. I haven't had a meeting since 1997 where at least 90% of the people with pain have not been healed. I have seen almost every kind of problem healed These statements are a boast of the power of the anointing of the Holy spirit. I have never attempted to raise a dead person.....

Click to expand...

Greg,
You write: I have never attempted to raise a dead person.....

Why not?

I refer you to your 1st post:
...if we can't do what He could do we are not believing on Him according to the scriptures. So, you can raise the dead, but you don't?? Is that it? Or maybe, just maybe, you can not raise the dead. It has got to be one of the two because your above statement.

And what is this 90% success rate at healing? Jesus had a success rate of 100%.
fishon

OldChurchGuy · May 20, 2007

GregKerr said:
I meet people almost every day that tell me they would like to be used by God on a much higher level. The purpose for many of the threads that I write is to encourage believers to understand that the God of the Bible does not change. If the followers of Christ 2000 years ago had spiritual power the followers of Christ today should have spiritual power, and if they will follow Jesus the way believers did 2000 years ago they will have the same power....concerning myself, I haven't had an assembly since Sept. 9, 1997 where people haven't been healed (the vast majority of the people needing healing at any healing service having instant results) and over the years I have cast out a number of demons....(do not take this as a boast of myself, take it as a boast of the Power Of The Anointing Of The Holy Spirit).....

Definitely a person of great faith. Congratulations on having the gift of healing and recognizing that gift and of putting it to use.

Changing the subject entirely, perhaps you can help me with a question that arises from time to time. That is, if Jesus was God on earth, and since God is eternal, can God ever be killed? If not, then how is the crucifixion explained? If yes, then how can God be eternal?

Curiously,

OldChurchGuy

FreeinChrist · May 20, 2007

GregKerr said:
Wrong again ......I said if a man canno't get at least the majority of people with pain healed at any given meeting not to mention other problems which are things that all the followers of Christ could do, what makes people believe he can get them to heaven he should not teach....

I haven't seen any post here that claims their preacher/pastor/teacher can get them to heaven. You are offering a strawman.

If we are followers of Jesus Christ, then yes, we are under someone who can get us to heaven - He succeeded in that on the cross.

GregKerr · May 20, 2007

OldChurchGuy said:
Definitely a person of great faith. Congratulations on having the gift of healing and recognizing that gift and of putting it to use.

Changing the subject entirely, perhaps you can help me with a question that arises from time to time. That is, if Jesus was God on earth, and since God is eternal, can God ever be killed? If not, then how is the crucifixion explained? If yes, then how can God be eternal?

Curiously,

OldChurchGuy

Gospel of John...John called Jesus the Word...In the beginning was Jesus and Jesus was with God and Jesus was God and all things were created through Jesus and withouth Jesus nothing was made that was made(spirit being) and Jesus became flesh and lived here amongst us(flesh)....Jesus is called the son, doesn't the son always procede out of the Father. Jesus was a manisestation of the Father in the flesh for the purpose of dying. All flesh dies, spirit is eternal....Father-Son-Holy Spirit are Manifestations of the One and only God...This Jesus (flesh) came into being when the Holy Spirit overshadowed Mary, this Jesus was second Adam(without sin), was empowered by the Holy Spirit also callled the Spirit of Christ, also called the spirit of the Father...One God who for a short period of time manifested in the flesh to be crucified to bail us out....

Everlastinglife · May 20, 2007

GregKerr said:
I meet people almost every day that tell me they would like to be used by God on a much higher level. The purpose for many of the threads that I write is to encourage believers to understand that the God of the Bible does not change. If the followers of Christ 2000 years ago had spiritual power the followers of Christ today should have spiritual power, and if they will follow Jesus the way believers did 2000 years ago they will have the same power....concerning myself, I haven't had an assembly since Sept. 9, 1997 where people haven't been healed (the vast majority of the people needing healing at any healing service having instant results) and over the years I have cast out a number of demons....(do not take this as a boast of myself, take it as a boast of the Power Of The Anointing Of The Holy Spirit).....

People enjoy arguing and boosting there own agendas not Gods. Your message was clear brother.

fishon · May 20, 2007

Gregkerr,
YOU ARE STILL DUCKING MY QUESTION. You wrote in your first post: ...if we can't do what He could do we are not believing on Him according to the scriptures.WHY HAVE YOU NOT THEN RAISED SOMEONE FROM THE DEAD? I didn't make the above statement, you did.
fishon

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