Originally posted by seebs
Welcome to the church, we love you, God loves you, here's this book, try to be good.
I see. Is this what your church says to you?
So all of the same opportunities of straight members should be afforded to a practicing homosexual? For instance, when Paul said:
1 Cor 7:8,9
But I say to the unmarried and to the widows: It is good for them if they remain even as I am; but if they cannot exercise self-control, let them marry. For it is better to marry than to burn with passion.
He was talking to everyone? Is the church just being intolerant when they don't extend this covenant to a homosexual couple?
Do we kick people out of church if, every Sunday morning, they grumble about having to get up early? Do we kick them out of church for resenting the successes of their friends? Why don't we see people on TV blaming terrorist attacks on the *majority* of Christians who never minister to the sick?
This is sinning, not living a lifestyle of sin, and further, living it with no remorse or feeling that it is even wrong.
We're very good at actively pursuing sins that bug us, while politely ignoring the sins we engage in.
Or the sins committed by those we love.
If you want to discuss this point further, I recommend we take it to the "Homosexuality in the Bible" thread over in General Apologetics. There's plenty of existing discussion on this issue, and there are other people who have participated.
No thanks. I personally think that the point of the thread gets lost in the quagmire of a 257+ post thread. At that point it is the same people saying the same things or new people saying the same things because they have neglected (understandably so) to read all the previous posts.
I will say that I agree with you to the extent that homosexuality is no worse than any other sin, in that it can be forgiven. However, the one engaged in any type of sinful behavior must recognize it as wrong and turn from it. Most homosexuals see it as something they were "born with." Which, for the record, is more or less true in that homosexuals were born with a fallen, depraved nature, as was all mankind, and homosexuality is one of the byproducts, for some people, of that depraved nature.
In the end, Christ's commandment to us is that we care *especially* for the sinners, for the lost, for the outcast.
I agree. However, this doesn't always mean a pat on the back saying, "Well, the important thing is that you're trying." Sometimes, as any parent knows, correction comes in many forms, and it's not always a hug. I would never stop loving my child if they told me they were gay, but, I would not allow them to parade an immoral lifestyle in my face. I would tell my child I love them but will not be involved in that part of their life. And, most importantly, I would pray that God would rescue them from their sinful lifestyle. Just as a side note: If my straight child was involved in a relationship that involved have sex outside of marriage I would tell them they needed to stop just as quickly.
They are the ones he came for; they are the ones who *MUST* be welcomed into the church, whether or not they have been convinced in their hearts that a particular action is sin.
WHAT?!!! We can't compare the healing work that Christ did with being tolerant of sin. He was never tolerant of sin. He rescued people from their afflictions. He didn't say, "Come on in and try and change." You speak of being an outcast because of a deviant lifestyle as if it's something they should be proud of. How strange. I agree that we should love our neighbors. That does not mean that we shouldn't rebuke their sinful lifestyle.
Before railing at them about that, how about we let them know up front that *all* people are sinful, and that their sins, whatever they are, are no more of a barrier to Christ's love than ours are.
I actually agree with this. However, we show ourselves approved of God by conducting ourselves in a manner worhthy of the Gospel (Phil 1:27). If someone suffering from the affliction of homosexuality continued on that path they would show their disregard for God's sovereignty in their lives.
Unless, of course, you're suggesting that straight people don't sin.
Never thought that so I would never suggest it.
God accepts me; I don't see any possible way to conclude that He'd accept me with my history of pride and anger, but He'd reject me if I had a boyfriend.
God does not save someone based on their past righteousness, of which there is none. Everyone God saves is a sinner. It's for His purpose, not in consideration of the severity of someone's sin.
God bless.
