jessedance said:
Bekah: well there is much evedince that they did tamper with matth. 28:19. If interested go to this site
I have about 20 or so different bibles I use. I rely mostly on the Rotherham version which is a vry literal translation. for beauty of language none surpase the kjv in my estimation. There are many good translations but none of them are totally reliable in every instance. sometimes even a poor translation, such as Darbys will be right when the better translations, such as niv or rotherham or asv are wrong.
[size=+1]I visited the site. Let me preface my remarks with this, just because something is posted on some website or written in a book, does NOT make it true. I saw no evidence whatosever of scholarship. All I saw were unsupported assertions that this or that was false, changed, etc. Just because some anti-Trinitarian says this or that was changed means diddly. Here is how Bible scholarship works.
If you do not read Greek how do you know which translation(s) are correct and which ones are not correct? What is your standard for deciding which of the versions is true to the original Greek?
Manuscripts are examined by experts and the material is dated using various scientific tests. The writing material, ink is also examined. Its composition can help date it. The writing style is compared to the styles of different periods. And all these factors help establish a date. Then the older manuscripts (mss.) are compared to the newer mss., any differences are usually decided in the favor of the older mss. Another source of dating are the writings of the early church. It has been stated that approximately 90% of the NT can be recreated from the quotes in the ECF. I saw nothing like this at your pet website.
When did the "Catholic church" supposedly mess with the gospel according to Matthew or any other book of the Bible? News flash, what we know as the Catholic church did not exist until about 1100 AD. So they could not have changed anything in the early centuries. Here are some quotes of Matt. 28:19, from the early church. The dates are given, ALL before the Nicaean council. The ECF can be verified at this link.
http://www.ccel.org/fathers2/
All the church fathers who mention Baptism unanimously agree, in the name of the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit. None of the church fathers write of any other Baptismal formula.[/size]
70 AD The Didache "After the foregoing instructions, baptize in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Spirit, in living [running] water. If you have no living water, then baptize in other water, and if you are not able in cold, then in warm. If you have neither, pour water three times on the head, in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Spirit. Before baptism, let the one baptizing and the one to be baptized fast, as also any others who are able. Command the one who is to be baptized to fast beforehand for one or two days" (Didache 7:1).
110-165 AD Martyr "As many as are persuaded and believe that what we teach and say is true, and undertake to be able to live accordingly, are instructed to pray and to entreat God with fasting, for the remission of their sins that are past, we praying and fasting with them. Then they are brought by us where there is water, and are regenerated in the same manner in which we were ourselves regenerated. For, in the name of God, the Father and Lord of the universe, and of our Savior Jesus Christ, and of the Holy Spirit, they then receive the washing with water. For Christ also said, 'Except ye be born again, ye shall not enter into the kingdom of heaven.' Now, that it is impossible for those who have once been born to enter into their mothers' wombs, is manifest to all... And for this we have learned from the apostles this reason. Since at our birth we were born without our own knowledge or choice, by our parents coming together, and were brought up in bad habits and wicked training; in order that we may not remain the children of necessity and of ignorance, but may become the children of choice and knowledge, and may obtain in the water the remission of sins formerly committed, there is pronounced over him who chooses to be born again, and has repented of his sins, the name of God the Father and Lord of the universe." (Justin Martyr, "First Apology," Ante-Nicene Fathers, vol. 1, pg. 183)
110-165AD Justin Martyr "Those who are convinced that what we teach is true and who desire to live accordingly are instructed to fast and to pray to God for the remission of all their past sins. We also pray and fast with them. Then we bring them to a place where there is water, and they are regenerated in the same manner in which we ourselves were regenerated. They then receive the washing with water in the name of God (the Father and Lord of the universe) and of our Savior Jesus Christ, and of the Holy Spirit. For Christ said, 'Unless you are born again, you shall not enter into the kingdom of heaven"' [John 3:5]. (Justin First Apology chant 61)
150-200 AD CLEMENT "For thus hath the true prophet testified to us with an oath: 'Verily I say to you, That unless a man is born again of water, he shall not enter into the kingdom of heaven.' Therefore make haste; for there is in these waters a certain power of mercy which was borne upon them at the beginning, and acknowledges those who are baptized under the name of the threefold sacrament, and rescues them from future punishments, presenting as a gift to God the souls that are consecrated by baptism. Betake yourselves therefore to these waters, for they alone can quench the violence of the future fire; and he who delays to approach to them, it is evident that the idol of unbelief remains in him, and by it he is prevented from hastening to the waters which confer salvation." (Clement, "Recognitions of Clement," Ante-Nicene Fathers, vol. 8, pg. 155)
170 AD Tatian the Syrian "Then said Jesus unto them, I have been given all authority in heaven and earth; and as my Father has sent me, so I also send you. Go now into all the world, and preach my gospel in all the creation; and teach all the peoples, and baptize them in the name of the Father and the Son and the Holy Spirit; and teach them to keep all whatsoever I commanded you: and lo, I am with you all the days, unto the end of the world" (The Diatesseron 55).
200-258 AD CYPRIAN "Wherefore baptism cannot be common to us and to heretics, to whom neither God the Father, nor Christ the Son, nor the Holy Ghost, nor the faith, nor the Church itself, is common. And therefore it behooves those to be baptized who come from heresy to the Church, that so they who are prepared, in the lawful, and true, and only baptism of the holy Church, by divine regeneration, for the kingdom of God, may be born of both sacraments, because it is written, 'Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.'" (Cyprian, "The Epistles of Cyprian," Ante-Nicene Fathers, vol. 5, pg. 384)
211 AD Tertullian "After His resurrection He promises in a pledge to His disciples that He will send them the promise of His Father; and lastly, He commands them to baptize into the Father and the Son and the Holy Ghost, NOT into a unipersonal God. And indeed it is not once only, but three times, that we are immersed into the Three Persons, at each several mention of Their names" (Against Praxeas 26).
215 AD Hippolytus "When the one being baptized goes down into the water, the one baptizing him shall put his hand on him and speak thus: `Do you believe in God, the Father Almighty?' And he that is being baptized shall say: `I believe.' Then, having his hand imposed upon the head of the one to be baptized, he shall baptize him once. Then he shall say: `Do you believe in Christ Jesus . . . ?' And when he says: `I believe,' he is baptized again. Again shall he say: `Do you believe in the Holy Spirit and the holy Church and the resurrection of the flesh?' The one being baptized then says: `I believe.' And so he is baptized a third time" (The Apostolic Tradition 21).
248 AD Origen "Why, when the Lord himself told his disciples that they should baptize all peoples in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, does this apostle employ the name of Christ alone in baptism, saying, `We who have been baptized into Christ'; for indeed, legitimate baptism is had only in the name of the Trinity" (Commentary on Romans 5:8).