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Recent content by kamahl

  1. K

    Sex before marriage

    Eph: Other things that would strengthen the family are irrelevant to this topic. You have stated that sex before marriage was prohibited to preserve inheritance by preserving marriage. This can only be the case if sex before marriage weakens it. All I am doing is pointing out that your...
  2. K

    Sex before marriage

    Seebs: (I have dealt with both statements about inheritance here, for convenience) Whether your contention that the ruling in the OT was only in relation to inheritance is clear and sufficient or not, that in no way establishes sex before marriage was not a sin. Even if you are correct, the...
  3. K

    Sex before marriage

    Seebs: That inheritance was the only reason for marriage is only your opinion. And even if inheritance was one reason for marriage, that in no way negates the teaching that sex outside of marriage is a sin. That Jews believed that women (around 1st century and before) were property does not...
  4. K

    Sex before marriage

    Seebs: The OT speaks of the importance of marriage, not the least of which in the Ten commandments. Marriage is important. Remember also that in the society in which Jesus taught, marriage was incredibly important. Scholars say a lot of things. They aren't all trustworthy. God has...
  5. K

    Sex before marriage

    seebs: Yet Jesus attended marriage ceremonies, and the entire Bible continually speaks of marriages. He also spoke of a man leaving his parents and uniting with his wife. How do you know the way the Greek documents from the early period used the term? The fact that tradition is added on...
  6. K

    Sex before marriage

    seebs: Orthodox tradition is based on the Bible, on the untranslated version of the NT. That marriages were not formalised early on by the Church is irrelevant. The fact remains that there were marriage ceremonies, and it was expected that sex be limited to within the marriage relationship...
  7. K

    Sex before marriage

    Seebs: The scripture is not silent on premarital sex. The meaning of porneia includes it. As stated before, your argument that it is a mistranslation is clearly wrong, for those who have not based their theology on a translation (Greek Orthodox) still believe that pre-marital sex is a sin...
  8. K

    Sex before marriage

    Apenman: Example given by Eph does not establish that sex before marriage was divinely appointed in the OT. That example shows that God can take a terrible situation where people are sinning and still use it to bring about a good result for His people. If you want to look to what God...
  9. K

    Sex before marriage

    apenman: NT was written originally in Alexandrian Greek, and in particular the Greek Orthodox Church, working from those documents, has always maintained that sex before marriage was wrong. So have the Roman Catholics. However, the Jews agree that sex before marriage is wrong, and they are...
  10. K

    The United Federation of Planets Fellowship

    Is agreement to disagree enough? Is private faith enough? There would be no Christians today if those of previous generations had kept their faith private.
  11. K

    Sex before marriage

    apenman: Those who have not translated the Bible but worked from original Alexandrian Greek (Greek Orthodox) agree that sex before marriage is a sin. In addition to that, the translation produces the word fornicate in English, which according to the Oxford dictionary (an authority on the...
  12. K

    Sex before marriage

    apenman: The reason I used the Oxford Dictionary is so that I wasn't making up definitions. Seebs: you suggest that it is mistranslation that has produced the word 'fornication'. How do you explain that the Greek Orthodox church, who do not use translations but rather continue to work from...
  13. K

    Sex before marriage

    Seebs: Nothing that you have said suggests that sex before marriage is not a sin. Apenman: Depends whether you accept definitions of words or just make up whatever you think is right.
  14. K

    Sex before marriage

    To quote Oxford Dictionary: 'fornicate' = people not married to each other having sexual intercourse. Seebs (?): Bible Commentary that I read said that Greek word in those verses did mean fornication.
  15. K

    Sex before marriage

    The reference to 'sexual immorality' in Mark 7:21 is a translation of an Alexandrian Greek word that is better translated as 'fornication'. The definition of fornication is 'sex between people who are not married to each other'. Jesus therefore defined stated that any sex that is not between...
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